Caught cheating and got an F

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cryingforevere

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Hi
So like the title says I got an F with cheating in chemistry and applied to med school while saying no to the question on Amcas. So yes I lied. Anyway, I know multiple people who have also done this and now they're fine in med school and they're eventually gonna be doctors. So I my mind, the lying was worth it because they got into the schools they wanted and a mistake they made hasn't stopped them from reaching their dreams. My question is if I get found out, what are the consequences and will I ever be able to reapply? Also how would they find out? And how likely will interviewers ask about my F?
 
"In my mind, lying was worth it because it helped people get things that they wouldn't have gotten had they told the truth."

If fear of being caught is the only thing holding you back from doing wrong, why stop with lying on an app?

Answer: You won't. You will find it worth lying again in the future, and possibly stealing, or cheating, or doing any other thing that is expedient to get what you want no matter whether you deserve it or not.

Seriously reconsider the thought processes that have brought you to this point. Setting aside questions of wrong and right, and just looking at the issue practically... If you continue these patterns, they will lead you to ruin. You only have so many tricks. You will get found out, either about this, or about some future lie. And it may cost you everything.

It can be hard to salvage your future when you have made a mistake. When you compound that error with a lie, you demonstrate that you don't deserve a second chance.
 
There are far greater challenges in medicine than your chemistry course you found it necessary to cheat in.
You seem to still think it was ok that you cheated so long as you are able to achieve your own dreams...I certainly hope you don't end up seeing my loved ones as your patients some day.
 
cryingforevere said:
Hi
So like the title says I got an F with cheating in chemistry and applied to med school while saying no to the question on Amcas. So yes I lied. Anyway, I know multiple people who have also done this and now they're fine in med school and they're eventually gonna be doctors. So I my mind, the lying was worth it because they got into the schools they wanted and a mistake they made hasn't stopped them from reaching their dreams. My question is if I get found out, what are the consequences and will I ever be able to reapply? Also how would they find out? And how likely will interviewers ask about my F?
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If the F is recorded on your trancript as resulting from academic dishonesty then you are done. And good riddance, yuck
 
My troll radar is up, but the teaching moment is worth it: Zeds is 100% accurate. Your IA means rejection, period. If, somehow, you got accepted and then it was found out that you lied on your app, then you can have your acceptance rescinded, or you could be expelled.

My clinical colleagues take professionalism very seriously, because they know that dishonest doctors start out as dishonest students.

ZedsDed said:
If the F is recorded on your trancript as resulting from academic dishonesty then you are done. And good riddance, yuck
Click to expand...
 
cryingforevere said:
Hi
So like the title says I got an F with cheating in chemistry and applied to med school while saying no to the question on Amcas. So yes I lied. Anyway, I know multiple people who have also done this and now they're fine in med school and they're eventually gonna be doctors. So I my mind, the lying was worth it because they got into the schools they wanted and a mistake they made hasn't stopped them from reaching their dreams. My question is if I get found out, what are the consequences and will I ever be able to reapply? Also how would they find out? And how likely will interviewers ask about my F?
Click to expand...
answering "no" would constitute a very serious violation of the application certification agreement, and potentially result in expulsion if discovered.

If you really want to go to medical school though, you may have a shot at some of the newer DO schools (if your post history is accurate).
 
I've been thinking about your problem.

I think there is maybe one, and only one, way for you to redeem yourself.

Withdraw your application promptly, so that it is seen by as few as possible. This means you get to wait an entire year to apply for the next cycle. At that time, you should disclose your IA on your application and hope for the best. Try to fill the time in the gap with great ECs and sincere reflection upon the character flaw that cost you a year. With a little luck, you MIGHT be able to convince some adcoms that it was a mistake and not a pattern of unethical behavior.
 
sb247 said:
May karma find you
Click to expand...

It always, always does.

It needn't work in any supernatural sense. Simple cause and effect is adequate. Even if this isn't the lie that leads to the fall, another one will be.

At the very least, the constitutionally wicked suffer a loss of opportunities that they never recognize. And they are cursed, again quite practically, with having to live with themselves. I'm not even saying that they will someday experience guilt and remorse. Even if someone fails to experience those redemptive emotions, maybe especially if, they still have to live in their own minds, with no escape possible.

That is a fate so terrible as to inspire compassion.
 
cryingforevere said:
Hi
So like the title says I got an F with cheating in chemistry and applied to med school while saying no to the question on Amcas. So yes I lied. Anyway, I know multiple people who have also done this and now they're fine in med school and they're eventually gonna be doctors. So I my mind, the lying was worth it because they got into the schools they wanted and a mistake they made hasn't stopped them from reaching their dreams. My question is if I get found out, what are the consequences and will I ever be able to reapply? Also how would they find out? And how likely will interviewers ask about my F?
Click to expand...

Your career is toast. Please find another career that stupid people are capable of.
 
cryingforevere said:
Hi
So like the title says I got an F with cheating in chemistry and applied to med school while saying no to the question on Amcas. So yes I lied. Anyway, I know multiple people who have also done this and now they're fine in med school and they're eventually gonna be doctors. So I my mind, the lying was worth it because they got into the schools they wanted and a mistake they made hasn't stopped them from reaching their dreams. My question is if I get found out, what are the consequences and will I ever be able to reapply? Also how would they find out? And how likely will interviewers ask about my F?
Click to expand...
If you get found out, typically the punishment is removal of your file from AMCAS and being banned from the service for a number of years (I believe 3 is most common, though some obtain bans for life). There is 100% chance your interviews will ask about your F.

Never lie on AMCAS. And lying about cheating is the worst thing you could do, aside from lying about a criminal offense. I genuinely would encourage you to not pursue a medical career, it is but the sort of field where your personality type will excel.
 
Last edited:
cryingforevere said:
My question is if I get found out, what are the consequences and will I ever be able to reapply? Also how would they find out? And how likely will interviewers ask about my F?
Click to expand...
If you get found out, AMCAS will ban you from using their service for a set number of years
There are a few ways they can find out, failures resulting from academic dishonesty are recorded differently on your transcript than a failure from low grades I believe.
The likelihood of interviews asking about your F is variable. Making it to the interview stage means someone has determined that you are academically proficient enough to go through medical school. Interviewers know this, and so are usually more interested in getting to know you as a person beyond that. However other interviewers may ask about it if they feel its worth talking about. Explaining it in your applications or secondaries may also decrease the chances that they ask about it since you've already explained it in the application.
 
I
cryingforevere said:
Hi
So like the title says I got an F with cheating in chemistry and applied to med school while saying no to the question on Amcas. So yes I lied. Anyway, I know multiple people who have also done this and now they're fine in med school and they're eventually gonna be doctors. So I my mind, the lying was worth it because they got into the schools they wanted and a mistake they made hasn't stopped them from reaching their dreams. My question is if I get found out, what are the consequences and will I ever be able to reapply? Also how would they find out? And how likely will interviewers ask about my F?
Click to expand...
its likely recorded as an XF on your official transcript along with an IA explaining it. Others have explained the consequences

And to reiterate, even if it was an F, no med school will admit you with failing a pre req

Keep bi-winning, Charlie Sheen. You got that tiger blood.
 
ComputerGuy365 said:
Scary to know that these people could end up being my doctors in the future. So much cheating/fraud on SDN lately.
Click to expand...
It's always been going on, people are just getting more bold about it. We're in the tech era of FB, Istagram, Twitter, etc. people think they're anonymous, but really they're not
 
Schools can also strip you of your diploma if the schools find out later that you lied on your application, and that lie was material to your admission.

So you could be a practicing doctor, and if somehow your school finds out (such as investigative journalism, your chem prof tips them, an ex seeking revenge), you could lose your degree. No degree, no medical license. But the student loan debt will still be there (you could be sued to pay any scholarship money/award based on fraud)

And high gpa won't make up for cheating ... You were caught cheating ... How do adcom know you didn't cheat your way to a high gpa the other times?
 
group_theory said:
Schools can also strip you of your diploma if the schools find out later that you lied on your application, and that lie was material to your admission.

So you could be a practicing doctor, and if somehow your school finds out (such as investigative journalism, your chem prof tips them, an ex seeking revenge), you could lose your degree. No degree, no medical license. But the student loan debt will still be there (you could be sued to pay any scholarship money/award based on fraud)

And high gpa won't make up for cheating ... You were caught cheating ... How do adcom know you didn't cheat your way to a high gpa the other times?
Click to expand...

this

OP, something you should know:

You cannot cheat your way through med school.
 
cryingforevere said:
Hi
So like the title says I got an F with cheating in chemistry and applied to med school while saying no to the question on Amcas. So yes I lied. Anyway, I know multiple people who have also done this and now they're fine in med school and they're eventually gonna be doctors. So I my mind, the lying was worth it because they got into the schools they wanted and a mistake they made hasn't stopped them from reaching their dreams. My question is if I get found out, what are the consequences and will I ever be able to reapply? Also how would they find out? And how likely will interviewers ask about my F?
Click to expand...

So they got an F's on their transcript and still got into medical school? How did they account for those F's during their interviews or on their application? These F's will ALWAYS appear on your transcript and cannot be erased.

If they got an IA for cheating, doesn't the transcript notate this?
 
mathnerd88 said:
So they got an F without an IA they had to explain on their transcript? How does that happen? These F's will ALWAYS appear on your transcript and cannot be erased.
Click to expand...

You don't understand. He got an F for cheating, and then when the AMCAS application asked if he had cheated or not, he said no. Nonetheless, no med school will accept him with an F in a basic pre-req.
 
ComputerGuy365 said:
You don't understand. He got an F for cheating, and then when the AMCAS application asked if he had cheated or not, he said no. Nonetheless, no med school will accept him with an F in a basic pre-req.
Click to expand...

No I understand. I thought IA's were noted on the transcript, so anything with an F for cheating should have an IA written next to it, or at least a "disciplinary failure."
 
mathnerd88 said:
No I understand. I thought IA's were noted on the transcript, so anything with an F for cheating should have an IA written next to it, or at least a "disciplinary failure."
Click to expand...

Is it possible he did not receive an IA for cheating, but only got an F?
 
ComputerGuy365 said:
Is it possible he did not receive an IA for cheating, but only got an F?
Click to expand...

Well, even if he gets an interview, he's going to have to explain that F. I wonder what excuse he'll come up with for that?

Also, I have never known anyone in allopathic med school that has gotten an F anyways. Unless they're a DO and do grade replacements.
 
mathnerd88 said:
Well, even if he gets an interview, he's going to have to explain that F. I wonder what excuse he'll come up with for that?

Also, I have never known anyone in allopathic med school that has gotten an F anyways. Unless they're a DO and do grade replacements.
Click to expand...

I really am interested to see what he would say as well, because this comment below just makes me lose all faith.

cryingforevere said:
Hi
Anyway, I know multiple people who have also done this and now they're fine in med school and they're eventually gonna be doctors.
Click to expand...
 
ComputerGuy365 said:
I really am interested to see what he would say as well, because this comment below just makes me lose all faith.
Click to expand...

I think the OP is trolling. This guy is insinuating that he knows a couple people who got F's and got into medical school? I don't know one person who got an F and got into medical school. Even C's are already red flags to some MD schools.
 
mathnerd88 said:
I think the OP is trolling. This guy is insinuating that he knows a couple people who got F's and got into medical school? I don't know one person who got an F and got into medical school.
Click to expand...

It's insanely competitive. Even podiatry and optometry school won't allow F's. It scares me because I've heard of people who have 4.0/35 and still get no interviews.
 
ComputerGuy365 said:
It's insanely competitive. Even podiatry and optometry school won't allow F's. It scares me because I've heard of people who have 4.0/35 and still get no interviews.
Click to expand...

Yeah I had a friend with a 4.0/35 and only got 1 interview and luckily got in.

I had another friend who had a 3.8/37 MCAT and took three cycles to get accepted.
 
mathnerd88 said:
Yeah I had a friend with a 4.0/35 and only got 1 interview and luckily got in.

I had another friend who had a 3.8/37 MCAT and took three cycles to get accepted.
Click to expand...

It's insane. I'm going to assume both of your friend's were applying very very top heavy. If the schools were mid/low tier I have lost all hope of becoming a physician.
 
Many people get F's and still get into med school, they just retake the course and do better.
Or are you talking about people with a no retake F on their transcript?
 
URMD said:
Many people get F's and still get into med school, they just retake the course and do better.
Or are you talking about people with a no retake F on their transcript?
Click to expand...
yus
Plenty of DO students retake and take advantage of the nice grade replacement system. I am talking about students who have an F in a core pre-req who did not retake.
 
ComputerGuy365 said:
yus
Plenty of DO students retake and take advantage of the nice grade replacement system. I am talking about students who have an F in a core pre-req who did not retake.
Click to expand...

You've stated with great confidence that it doesn't happen.

I am just as confident that it does, just not often. Yes, even at allopathic schools, if you have a really exceptional story and a lot of time and excellent performance between you and the F.

Just because OP is a terrible person who doesn't have a chance of getting in doesn't mean that you should scare people, including yourself, about how difficult it is to get into a school. Yes, it is really competitive and, yes, sometimes high stat applicants go without seats... but there is something more than just their stats to blame when that happens. Maybe their PS is shoddy, or their LORs are weak, or their ECs are cookie-cutter and look like box checking.

A single academic failure, even in a pre-req, is not certain death for a future in medicine. Certainly, the premise that a C is really an F for pre-meds is a bit excessive. That kind of thinking encourages cheating. If the stakes are so high, and if doing poorly, even once, is enough to completely destroy your app, cheating might look like a risk worth taking.
 
Promethean said:
You've stated with great confidence that it doesn't happen.

I am just as confident that it does, just not often. Yes, even at allopathic schools, if you have a really exceptional story and a lot of time and excellent performance between you and the F.

Just because OP is a terrible person who doesn't have a chance of getting in doesn't mean that you should scare people, including yourself, about how difficult it is to get into a school. Yes, it is really competitive and, yes, sometimes high stat applicants go without seats... but there is something more than just their stats to blame when that happens. Maybe their PS is shoddy, or their LORs are weak, or their ECs are cookie-cutter and look like box checking.

A single academic failure, even in a pre-req, is not certain death for a future in medicine. Certainly, the premise that a C is really an F for pre-meds is a bit excessive. That kind of thinking encourages cheating. If the stakes are so high, and if doing poorly, even once, is enough to completely destroy your app, cheating might look like a risk worth taking.
Click to expand...

I understand that. I understand that it takes more than numbers to get into medical school. The reason that medical schools want people with such high grades is not only because these people could be saving lives one day, but because you need to prove you can handle the coursework. If a guy cannot even pull a C in a pre-req, how is he supposed to handle challenging coursework, as well as the USMLE? I understand that getting into med school is more than just numbers, but this guy is clearly not cut out for it. Also, medical school is incredibly competitive. No point lying. What I simply said was the truth.
 
Hi again!
Thanks for responses (even the mean ones). I'm not pulling my application because I think it's worth the risk. If I get caught, I'm just gonna get a job with petroleum so I'm not too concerned. And then I'll just apply to schools again after the ban is removed no biggie. I just really wanted to know what I was up against. And the class was gen chem and it was my second semester of college, so my grades are a lot better since then and I learned my lesson early (since I just finished my senior year). Thanks again! I knew I could count on you guys 🙂
 
cryingforevere said:
Hi again!
Thanks for responses (even the mean ones). I'm not pulling my application because I think it's worth the risk. If I get caught, I'm just gonna get a job with petroleum so I'm not too concerned. And then I'll just apply to schools again after the ban is removed no biggie. I just really wanted to know what I was up against. And the class was gen chem and it was my second semester of college, so my grades are a lot better since then and I learned my lesson early (since I just finished my senior year). Thanks again! I knew I could count on you guys 🙂
Click to expand...

...
Wait, y0u did not get an IA?
Also why did you cheat in a class like Gen chem?
 
cryingforevere said:
Hi again!
Thanks for responses (even the mean ones). I'm not pulling my application because I think it's worth the risk. If I get caught, I'm just gonna get a job with petroleum so I'm not too concerned. And then I'll just apply to schools again after the ban is removed no biggie. I just really wanted to know what I was up against. And the class was gen chem and it was my second semester of college, so my grades are a lot better since then and I learned my lesson early (since I just finished my senior year). Thanks again! I knew I could count on you guys 🙂
Click to expand...
The ban is not removed my friend, you will be blacklisted for the foreseeable future. If by some miracle you get in without getting caught, you will be caught later on during one of the countless times your academic background is probed. In which case you'll either be kicked out of med school or your degree will be stripped from you. In either scenario your left hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt with nothing to show for it (which would be hilarious.) So please, don't withdraw your application and see what happens. I'll say again, good riddance.
 
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Here's good advice OP. Withdraw your application, and apply later once you understand what you just said.
 
You should withdraw your app, OP. You should also find out what is recorded on your transcript if you do plan on applying to some other sort of graduate school.

Cheating is ubiquitous. Even in medical school. It is unfortunate.
 
I'm getting the powerful whiff of one of these:

upload_2015-6-15_8-32-41.jpeg
images
images
images






cryingforevere said:
Hi again!
Thanks for responses (even the mean ones). I'm not pulling my application because I think it's worth the risk. If I get caught, I'm just gonna get a job with petroleum so I'm not too concerned. And then I'll just apply to schools again after the ban is removed no biggie. I just really wanted to know what I was up against. And the class was gen chem and it was my second semester of college, so my grades are a lot better since then and I learned my lesson early (since I just finished my senior year). Thanks again! I knew I could count on you guys 🙂
Click to expand...
 
cryingforevere said:
Hi again!
Thanks for responses (even the mean ones). I'm not pulling my application because I think it's worth the risk. If I get caught, I'm just gonna get a job with petroleum so I'm not too concerned. And then I'll just apply to schools again after the ban is removed no biggie. I just really wanted to know what I was up against. And the class was gen chem and it was my second semester of college, so my grades are a lot better since then and I learned my lesson early (since I just finished my senior year). Thanks again! I knew I could count on you guys 🙂
Click to expand...

What a clown
 
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