Chances for Ortho as US IMG?

[zc9191]

Looking for advice as to my chances of matching into an ortho residency. I'm a US IMG.

My credentials are as follows:
Step 1: 251 (Step 2 score is anticipated to be around the same if not more)
Honors and High passes in all of my 3rd year clerkships
1 publication in Ophtho (I was considering this field for a while) and another accepted abstract examining medical student education, but none in ortho (I was told by many that this is absolutely necessary if I want to go into orthopedics)
Author for ScholarRx (the company that writes First Aid)
Associate editor for my school's peer reviewed medical journal
Numerous volunteer activities and president of the Save a Child's Heart program

Given the fact that third-year is coming to a close and that I won't be able to publish any ortho research in time for the application due date, I was wondering how likely my chances would be at securing a residency position? Is it a feasible goal as an IMG? I am also considering gen surg, but have had my sight set on ortho for quite a while. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

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[FutureDoc1088]

You will need to crush step 2, plan to take 2+ years of productive research (pump out as many papers as possible) at a place that has a history of matching IMG research fellows (SUNY Downstate is one example), make a great impression on everyone you meet and make yourself indispensable. Then you’ll need some luck on top of that. Oh and I assume you’ll need to graduate medical school prior to doing the above. Hate to say it but it’s an uphill, messy battle and you’ve got to be all in.

 

[LebronManning]

What school?

 

[zc9191]

What school?

Im at Sackler (in Israel)

 

[zc9191]

You will need to crush step 2, plan to take 2+ years of productive research (pump out as many papers as possible) at a place that has a history of matching IMG research fellows (SUNY Downstate is one example), make a great impression on everyone you meet and make yourself indispensable. Then you’ll need some luck on top of that. Oh and I assume you’ll need to graduate medical school prior to doing the above. Hate to say it but it’s an uphill, messy battle and you’ve got to be all in.

I've heard mixed advice from program directors. Some of them tell me to go ahead and apply as my application is strong, while others advise a year off mostly for the networking opportunities and letter of rec

 

[LebronManning]

I think you have a shot though you may need to do a research year or two. Your best resource will be looking at past Sackler match lists and finding people who matched into ortho or other competitive surgical subs and asking them for advice.

 

[mcat_taker]

Looking for advice as to my chances of matching into an ortho residency. I'm a US IMG.

My credentials are as follows:
Step 1: 251 (Step 2 score is anticipated to be around the same if not more)
Honors and High passes in all of my 3rd year clerkships
1 publication in Ophtho (I was considering this field for a while) and another accepted abstract examining medical student education, but none in ortho (I was told by many that this is absolutely necessary if I want to go into orthopedics)
Author for ScholarRx (the company that writes First Aid)
Associate editor for my school's peer reviewed medical journal
Numerous volunteer activities and president of the Save a Child's Heart program

Given the fact that third-year is coming to a close and that I won't be able to publish any ortho research in time for the application due date, I was wondering how likely my chances would be at securing a residency position? Is it a feasible goal as an IMG? I am also considering gen surg, but have had my sight set on ortho for quite a while. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Apply for gen surg and then do a fellowship in ortho afterwards.

 

[LebronManning]

Apply for gen surg and then do a fellowship in ortho afterwards.

Pretty sure this isn’t a thing. Only way to orthopedic surgery is an integrated residency.

 

[TheOther]

Apply for gen surg and then do a fellowship in ortho afterwards.

This 100% doesn’t exist.

 

[mcat_taker]

This 100% doesn’t exist.

You can 100 percent do a hand fellowship after GS residency. Then just do hand surgeries as an orthopedic surgeon.

But yea I guess I misspoke, didn't realize you couldn't do anything else besides hand. I know for example you can do a plastics fellowship after GS residency if you don't get into an integrated plastics program.

Same with cardiothoracic fellowship after general surgery residency (which I believe is more commonly done than integrated CT programs anyway).

 

[frappalino16]

You can 100 percent do a hand fellowship after GS residency. Then just do hand surgeries as an orthopedic surgeon.

But yea I guess I misspoke, didn't realize you couldn't do anything else besides hand. I know for example you can do a plastics fellowship after GS residency if you don't get into an integrated plastics program.

Same with cardiothoracic fellowship after general surgery residency (which I believe is more commonly done than integrated CT programs anyway).

you can do a hand fellowship, but that doesn't make you an orthopedic surgeon.

 

[mcat_taker]

you can do a hand fellowship, but that doesn't make you an orthopedic surgeon.

Look, OP was asking about his chances of matching ortho- slim as an IMG but not impossible. If he really wants to do something related to ortho and can't see himself doing anything else this is the only pathway I can think of that seems realistic. Hand fellowship after GS residency and then just do ortho hand procedures just like an orthopedic surgeon who only operates on hands. Hand fellowship can be done after either GS, plastics, or ortho residencies.

 

[augeremt]

Look, OP was asking about his chances of matching ortho- slim as an IMG but not impossible. If he really wants to do something related to ortho and can't see himself doing anything else this is the only pathway I can think of that seems realistic. Hand fellowship after GS residency and then just do ortho hand procedures just like an orthopedic surgeon who only operates on hands. Hand fellowship can be done after either GS, plastics, or ortho residencies.

There isn't really a market for GS-trained hand surgeons so while you can do the fellowship, it'll be hard to get a job. Ortho practices won't want you because you can't take ortho call with them and same goes for plastics. Most GS people do a hand fellowship as a way to get into plastics eventually. GS -> hand is not a realistic way to get into ortho.

Source: I read a paper on this recently but can't seem to find it right now.

 

[mcat_taker]

There isn't really a market for GS-trained hand surgeons so while you can do the fellowship, it'll be hard to get a job. Ortho practices won't want you because you can't take ortho call with them and same goes for plastics. Most GS people do a hand fellowship as a way to get into plastics eventually. GS -> hand is not a realistic way to get into ortho.

Source: I read a paper on this recently but can't seem to find it right now.

This is wrong. Every ortho surgeon ends up specializing in a region just because the anatomy becomes too complex trying to do everything otherwise. No one is a general ortho surgeon anymore. So just like you have hip, hand, shoulder, knee ortho surgeons they all take call regardless. Hand fellowship after GS is a valid pathway IMO

source: talking to an ortho surgeon

 

[Chillbo Baggins]

This is wrong. Every ortho surgeon ends up specializing in a region just because the anatomy becomes too complex trying to do everything otherwise. No one is a general ortho surgeon anymore. So just like you have hip, hand, shoulder, knee ortho surgeons they all take call regardless. Hand fellowship after GS is a valid pathway IMO

source: talking to an ortho surgeon

General ortho definitely exists outside of urban areas. And no one I know only does "one region," they operate within the scope of their subspecialty.

I'm aware of one GS->hand doc and they are only allowed to operate up to the elbow on ortho cases. They can still take GS call, however.

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

This is wrong. Every ortho surgeon ends up specializing in a region just because the anatomy becomes too complex trying to do everything otherwise. No one is a general ortho surgeon anymore. So just like you have hip, hand, shoulder, knee ortho surgeons they all take call regardless. Hand fellowship after GS is a valid pathway IMO

source: talking to an ortho surgeon

I’m an orthopaedic surgeon. This is 100% incorrect. There are plenty of generalists, I work with a few of them. And no one hires plastics or GS trained hand people unless they are super desperate. Working on hands does not make you an orthopaedic surgeon. Also, we don’t work on “regions.” We operate on everything, everywhere, that’s why call exists. (except spine which hospitals don’t grant privileges for unless you’ve done a spine fellowship)


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[mcat_taker]

I’m an orthopaedic surgeon. This is 100% incorrect. There are plenty of generalists, I work with a few of them. And no one hires plastics or GS trained hand people unless they are super desperate. Working on hands does not make you an orthopaedic surgeon. Also, we don’t work on “regions.” We operate on everything, everywhere, that’s why call exists. (except spine which hospitals don’t grant privileges for unless you’ve done a spine fellowship)


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Thanks for clarifying this issue

 

[vernhart]

You can 100 percent do a hand fellowship after GS residency. Then just do hand surgeries as an orthopedic surgeon.

But yea I guess I misspoke, didn't realize you couldn't do anything else besides hand. I know for example you can do a plastics fellowship after GS residency if you don't get into an integrated plastics program.

Same with cardiothoracic fellowship after general surgery residency (which I believe is more commonly done than integrated CT programs anyway).

This is wrong. Every ortho surgeon ends up specializing in a region just because the anatomy becomes too complex trying to do everything otherwise. No one is a general ortho surgeon anymore. So just like you have hip, hand, shoulder, knee ortho surgeons they all take call regardless. Hand fellowship after GS is a valid pathway IMO

source: talking to an ortho surgeon

I honestly can't tell if the bolded was meant to be a smart alec response bc each respective post had said 100% and "source:" but even if not...a little humility would go a long way. Looks like you took the mcat in 2015 so are likely just now starting third year (per your MS3 status). I'm at the same stage...so I can honestly say...we know nothing. Anything you think you know about the way the medical field and specialties work is based on hearsay or VERY limited experience in *most cases (*I know there are some NP's, PA's, nurses, etc in med school). If you think you know something and want to contribute, great, but try not to be so brash in your approach as it may spread misinformation if a bigger fish doesn't bite on the thread and set things straight. It's okay to be wrong/unsure sometimes, compensating with overconfidence does no one favors in this field.

 

[mcat_taker]

I honestly can't tell if the bolded was meant to be a smart alec response bc each respective post had said 100% and "source:" but even if not...a little humility would go a long way. Looks like you took the mcat in 2015 so are likely just now starting third year (per your MS3 status). I'm at the same stage...so I can honestly say...we know nothing. Anything you think you know about the way the medical field and specialties work is based on hearsay or VERY limited experience in *most cases (*I know there are some NP's, PA's, nurses, etc in med school). If you think you know something and want to contribute, great, but try not to be so brash in your approach as it may spread misinformation if a bigger fish doesn't bite on the thread and set things straight. It's okay to be wrong/unsure sometimes, compensating with overconfidence does no one favors in this field.

Agreed. I misspoke based on anecdotes of hand fellowship after GS I had heard of happening (in order to help OP but probably not the majority). Apologies. Glad orthotrauma was able to chime in with more accurate info here.