Chances?

[Conducive]

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Had a tragedy in the family my sophomore year which brought down my GPA a lot (not an excuse), finished my last semester with a 3.475 semester, 2.7cGPA, 2.5sGPA BS Bio 😱. Retook two classes and moved my cGPA to 2.82. Did a second degree in Neuroscience and got my cGPA to 3.01 with 3 semesters of 4.0. I'm debating doing a two-year thesis masters program (I will be published at least once) and then applying to medical school. 32Q MCAT.

EC:
2 summers in two different research labs at a medical school
1 semester in a research lab
750+ Volunteer hours through emergency medicine student group
Vice President of that group
100+ direct-patient care contacts on ambulance service
1 summer in local hospital ED
4 Strong LOR (one from my pediatric cardiologist)

Should I even bother applying to allopathic schools at this point? The only concern with applying to osteopathic schools is a) none instate ($$$) and b) MD surgical residency possibilities (virtually impossible)

I'm not even sure how competitive I'd be at osteopathic schools at this point, but I am determined to go to med school somewhere. Any help, advice?

Thanks in advance 👍

 

[DbDan]

FWIW, I have a similar MCAT and slightly lower cGPA and sGPA (assuming your sGPA is >3.0 too?) and have 2 DO interviews scheduled for this year with the majority of schools still having not begun handing out interviews. IMO, you are moderately competitive for DO with your ECs and MCAT. Your only thing holding you back would be your GPA. It is also much easier to raise your GPA with DO schools since they replace grades, try calculating your GPA that way and see what you come up with. If you wish to apply DO you are also going to have to get some DO shadowing experience and a DO LOR.

You also have a strong upward trend which works in your favor. If you are set on MD, you may need an SMP and it will help you significantly but can also cost you quite a bit of money. If you have any desire to go DO, I think you would stand a shot as is.

As for the MD surgical residencies, some DOs still do match, although it is much more difficult. Getting into the surgical subspecialties is even more difficult. However, there is DO residencies as well which still prepare you to perform your duties as a surgeon (many are in MI) Good luck

 

[Catalystik]

What is your state of residence? Depending on the answer, your 1.5 semester 4.0 GPA postbac (getting the second degree) might be considered to have redeemed your low cGPA, since you are probably of nontraditional age, and meets the usual 1.5-2.0 years of excellent academic work redemptive goal (if the 4.0 was the last three semesters). In this case, you might try applying, or at least call and ask for a counseling appointment at the med school dean's office and see what they thing of your chances and what you'd need to do to be competitive.

Are you referring to a Special Masters Program or a traditional masters? It might be more productive to apply to a state med school and a few others, and also apply to some SMPs as a back up plan if you don't get in.

What is your DO med school cGPA and sGPA, considering that they only count the most recent grade if you retake a course? Surely you retook some of the classes you bombed your sophomore year at the second school? You did know that AMCAS does include all grades, even if your school had a forgiveness policy?

 

[Conducive]

What is your state of residence? Depending on the answer, your 1.5 semester 4.0 GPA postbac (getting the second degree) might be considered to have redeemed your low cGPA, since you are probably of nontraditional age, and meets the usual 1.5-2.0 years of excellent academic work redemptive goal (if the 4.0 was the last three semesters). In this case, you might try applying, or at least call and ask for a counseling appointment at the med school dean's office and see what they thing of your chances and what you'd need to do to be competitive.

Are you referring to a Special Masters Program or a traditional masters? It might be more productive to apply to a state med school and a few others, and also apply to some SMPs as a back up plan if you don't get in.

What is your DO med school cGPA and sGPA, considering that they only count the most recent grade if you retake a course? Surely you retook some of the classes you bombed your sophomore year at the second school? You did know that AMCAS does include all grades, even if your school had a forgiveness policy?

Indiana. Would love to go to IUSM, but I'm starting to feel that's out of the question. I'm 23, so I'm not sure about the age portion.

I was referring to a traditional masters program, I figured getting published and demonstrating academic excellence for 2 more years would be better in the long run for allopathic schools. Do you think it would be better to apply to an SMP program?

My DO gpa is 3.3 cGPA, 3.0 sGPA with 3 classes retaken (all sophomore year). I am aware that AMCAS counts all grades (works against me greatly), so that is the biggest thing holding me back from applying to the only med school in my state.

Thanks for the reply 😎

 

[Catalystik]

As a generalization, excellent performance in an SMP is more likely to get you into med school. Few med schools will consider the grad work GPA (though all of them love to see research and teaching, for which you'd likely get opportunities). I've only heard that there are 4 that look at grad BCPMs, and Indiana isn't one, to my knowledge. But calling and making a phone appointment with a dean, and asking how they would view each type of repair effort, could help you make a solid plan. I'd love to hear what they tell you. And maybe they'll encourage you to apply with what you have, considering how solid your recent performance has been (and due to your slightly higher age and the presumed additional maturity that comes with it). Average age of matriculants is 24 years, BTW.

 

[Conducive]

As a generalization, excellent performance in an SMP is more likely to get you into med school. Few med schools will consider the grad work GPA (though all of them love to see research and teaching, for which you'd likely get opportunities). I've only heard that there are 4 that look at grad BCPMs, and Indiana isn't one, to my knowledge. But calling and making a phone appointment with a dean, and asking how they would view each type of repair effort, could help you make a solid plan. I'd love to hear what they tell you. And maybe they'll encourage you to apply with what you have, considering how solid your recent performance has been (and due to your slightly higher age and the presumed additional maturity that comes with it). Average age of matriculants is 24 years, BTW.

Can you tell me what 4 schools look at post-bacc cGPAs? There are two SMP programs I've heard of: BU and Georgetown? I'm not sure the strict requirements of either. What I have heard are that both programs are expensive. With that being said, if they are the most likely path to medical school that seems to be the best route to take. I will apply to the SMP programs through the AMCAS application, correct? I'll give IUSM a call tomorrow to see what they say in terms of applying. I think I'd give a kidney to go there.

Thanks for the help 😉

 

[Catalystik]

There are lots more SMPs. All the SMPs are listed with pertinent information in SDN's Postbaccalaureate Programs Forum. Yes they are expensive, and are considered high risk, high reward. Without excellent academic work (GPA > 3.5), they are a waste of money.

All med schools consider the GPA from undergrad postbac work.

The ones I've heard of that will consider the traditional hard-science masters BCPM GPA are UCentral Florida, Arizona, UMinnesota, and UColorado. Only the UCF info came straight from a dean, and the rest is from SDN Member report.

 

[Conducive]

Would you recommend applying to SMP programs now (for matriculation in the Fall '11)? I'm not sure the chances I have at any of these schools and obviously have a lot of reading/fact finding to do. It sounds like a great way to get into an MD program though. I will post here what I find out from IUSM.

Thank you for the replies and help!! Hopefully I can make up my horrible year

 

[Catalystik]

I don't think there's a rush to apply immediately. I recall some getting accepted with spring applications. Of course, this isn't my area of expertise, and I'm sure the recommended application times and deadlines vary widely. You need to do your reading, but at least a huge amount of the important stuff can be found in one place on SDN. And I think your chances of an acceptance to an SMP are terrific, with the strong MCAT, decent ECs-though no shadowing is mentioned, and recent upward grade trend, with GPA > 3.0.

I look forward to hearing your report about the dean contact.

 

[Conducive]

I don't think there's a rush to apply immediately. I recall some getting accepted with spring applications. Of course, this isn't my area of expertise, and I'm sure the recommended application times and deadlines vary widely. You need to do your reading, but at least a huge amount of the important stuff can be found in one place on SDN. And I think your chances of an acceptance to an SMP are terrific, with the strong MCAT, decent ECs-though no shadowing is mentioned, and recent upward grade trend, with GPA > 3.0.

I look forward to hearing your report about the dean contact.

Only shadowing was 2-weeks with pediatric cardiologist (and LOR from it).

Thanks for the confidence boost!! I'm more determined than ever

 

[Catalystik]

I'm happy to help.

 

[Conducive]

Quick question:

I called today to set up a counseling appointment with the Dean's office. I'm wondering about applying through AMCAS next fall. I will be applying to an SMP associated with IUSM in January, however was wondering how I would indicate I would be doing that program on the AMCAS application? Is there an section of the application related to SMP's where you could elaborate further? I'm most surely going to be rejected without the SMP, so I would want to make it clear to the med schools that I was doing such a program.

Thanks in advance

 

[DbDan]

You put the SMP as another institution and list the degree you will be obtaining. Put the courses (normally there is a structured course outline for SMPs) as future coursework. They don't require a transcript for doing this if you have not completed coursework yet. You can then talk about the SMP either through a letter to the schools you are applying to, through your personal statement (maybe a line or two) or on the secondary applications.

 

[Catalystik]

Also, after each term of the SMP, you would typically send a formal transcript from the program to each of your schools. I understand that it wouldn't be unusual to have schools hold off on interview invitations until the first transcript shows you're performing well.

 

[Conducive]

Sweet! The plan as of now is to take a few classes in the fall and apply in early spring for the SMP for fall '11 admission. Hopefully luck will be on my side the next few years, and if I bust my butt for a 4.0 throughout the SMP I'll have a real shot at IUSM. Thanks so much for the all the replies, it's held immensely! I'll update this thread as I learn more on the process.