Chief Resident Poll

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Patrick O

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I am an incoming chief for next July and I was wondering about the setup in other programs in regard to AP and CP responsibilities....ie. how many are there in your program (chiefs that is), is the job split (one resident for AP, another for CP), etc. I will be one of 2 chiefs for next year...... and the department wants me to split responsibility with my fellow chief....6 mos AP and 6 mos CP. Thanks for your input in advance.

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Our program is one person, AP/CP, for the whole year. There is also an assistant chief who then assumes chief resident position the following year.
 
we had two chiefs we shared everything
we go from april to april to give people a break during boards time

we were responsible for teaching the first years as much grossing and autopsy as we can for two months
we did all resident related schedules and acted as a general venting portal for various issues

it was busier than i thought it would be

unless your CP is quite busy chiefdom seems to be AP heavy so i thin

i think it would be unfair to have only one person doing all this AP teaching at the beginning of the year

and while i am very glad i did it its usually not one of those jobs where everyone is stepping on each other to sing your praises ....i mean the schedule always bums someone out

good luck!!:thumbup:
 
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I think what yaah said is probably what I would prefer the situation to be. Some places I visited have a system where "everybody gets a turn" to be chief for some months. I am not really sure what the purpose of that would be. It sounds kind of like "everybody's special!" but I don't know, maybe it makes sense in context.

Also I visited some programs where there are separate AP and CP chiefs, usually with the CP chiefs being 3rd years and the AP being 4th or vice versa. At the program I am going to, I am not sure. I think it is only one 4th year.
 
Probably the main reason to have multiple people is to share the work. It can be pretty hectic, depending on the program.
 
Probably the main reason to have multiple people is to share the work. It can be pretty hectic, depending on the program.

I guess, but then you shouldn't really call it being chief. It's just part of the job if everybody shares the work. They made it sound like they all put "Chief Resident" on their resumes.
 
there are 2 of us for the entire year (with a total of 33 residents) and we decide between ourselves how to divide the work. we do most everything together.

i do not see how you can divide and classify the work as AP only or CP only.
 
I guess, but then you shouldn't really call it being chief. It's just part of the job if everybody shares the work. They made it sound like they all put "Chief Resident" on their resumes.

A lot of surgical residency programs I have seen, every final year resident is called chief resident. It's basically automatic unless you drop out.
 
A lot of surgical residency programs I have seen, every final year resident is called chief resident. It's basically automatic unless you drop out.

Yes, in many programs chief is basically synonymous with the last year of residency in the same way that intern is synonymous with first year. I believe this is actually the case with my home Path program, although there were only 2 this year. Maybe if there are more they specify certain individuals.

At my home surgery program the final year residents are all called chiefs (or chieves), but actually only one does extra work of scheduling etc. Actually for call purposes the final 2 years of residency are called "chief call."

Medicine is the only field I have heard of an extra year.
 
At my residency, there were 3 separate chiefs, one for each of the 3 hospitals we covered. The position was also rotating, so each resident kind of got a turn. The chief could be anyone between 2nd-4th year & was primarily selected by the PD. It could be a 2nd year if that person was the most senior person at a particular hospital. Chief residents had both AP & CP duties.

Since we're on the subject, what kind of benefits do chief residents get at your program?


----- Antony
 
$50 extra dollars per month salary, a wooden chair carved with your name and "Chief Resident", a certificate, and everyone (residents, staff, and attendings) complaining to you all the time. Whoop-dee-doo. It was great.
 
Wow, no way...so there's no glory to being chief??? In internal medicine, being chief is a big deal. In fact, in some programs the chief is only someone who decides to stay an extra year to be chief! It's huge for their resumes and huge for applying for fellowships!

Hmmm, it sounds like in pathology you don't have that...interesting.
 
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Wow, no way...so there's no glory to being chief??? In internal medicine, being chief is a big deal. In fact, in some programs the chief is only someone who decides to stay an extra year to be chief! It's huge for their resumes and huge for applying for fellowships!

Hmmm, it sounds like in pathology you don't have that...interesting.

i remember the world also being so black and white for me when i was a med student ...aaahhh..the good old days
 
There is very little prestige at my program for being chief, and it probably holds true for many other Path programs as well. As others have said, you basically get dumped on all year and are in charge of the scheduling. Beyond that, there is little authority or respect.
 
Ahh... chiefing. After I rotated with last year's co-chief on surg path and they received 75 emails one day just regarding rotation scheduling (not to mention having to participate in "how to improve the program" discussions ad nauseum), I decided to take active steps to avoid becoming chief. I don't really handle being blamed for everything very well. I'm a pillar of society; I just don't want to be the fan the **** hits!

Probably the best part about being chief is that you get to give yourself whatever rotations you want. The thought about signing on to be chief, doing the rotation schedule and then resigning had briefly crossed my mind - but I let go of it, though not without a twinge of regret.

I also personally think chiefing can interfere a great deal with boards prep, especially for 4th year chiefs. I would almost say it makes better sense and gets you almost as much benefit to be good friends with and helpful to the chiefs than it is to be chief yourself. But YMMV.

Oh and re: the perks - I know they get a leetle extra each month (a distinctly disadvantageous cost-benefit ratio IMHO), and got to take the day off and go play tennis/golf with the other chiefs during the summer or fall.

Landing a fellowship has definitely loosened my tongue.
 
Ahh... chiefing. After I rotated with last year's co-chief on surg path and they received 75 emails one day just regarding rotation scheduling (not to mention having to participate in "how to improve the program" discussions ad nauseum), I decided to take active steps to avoid becoming chief. I don't really handle being blamed for everything very well. I'm a pillar of society; I just don't want to be the fan the **** hits!

Probably the best part about being chief is that you get to give yourself whatever rotations you want. The thought about signing on to be chief, doing the rotation schedule and then resigning had briefly crossed my mind - but I let go of it, though not without a twinge of regret.

I also personally think chiefing can interfere a great deal with boards prep, especially for 4th year chiefs. I would almost say it makes better sense and gets you almost as much benefit to be good friends with and helpful to the chiefs than it is to be chief yourself. But YMMV.

Oh and re: the perks - I know they get a leetle extra each month (a distinctly disadvantageous cost-benefit ratio IMHO), and got to take the day off and go play tennis/golf with the other chiefs during the summer or fall.

Landing a fellowship has definitely loosened my tongue.

I do know some places have their cheifs be 2nd or 3rd year residents... you can at least put it on your CV for applying to fellowship.

I think that idea should catch on a little more. I would think that more residents would be willing to put in the time this way...
 
Even if the timeline did work out for having chiefdom as an item on a CV, chief residency has a value approaching zero in terms of applying for fellowships and jobs (academic OR community practice). In fact, your phone number on the CV header is probably more important. Quality of CV items, not just quantity, is what counts.

Everyone has to do administrative stuff sooner or later; being chief doesn't necessarily prove that the particular individual is any better at it.

There are plenty of committees a pathology resident could sit on that would offer much more networking and educational opportunities (as well as help get that cherished fellowship), with a fraction of the scut that goes with a chief position. (See the College of American Pathologists website, for starters. Lobbying at a national level gives big-picture insight, as opposed to the narrow scope of a single residency program.)

Unless you are at an institution where:
(1) faculty are receptive to change, and
(2) you cannot say no to your top-shelf faculty because it would hurt your prospects (for internal fellowships or job recommendations), my unorthodox opinion as a senior resident is to avoid being chief.

Disclaimer: I do (honestly!) have great respect for the people who volunteer their time and energy to be chief residents ("someone has to do it"). I just feel like the motivations ("looks good on your CV", "gets you a fellowship" etc.) are not well thought out/based in reality. I don't know where the Myth of Apparent Chief Glory originates. Also, I do strongly feel that rather than throwing residents at every single problem, with adequate dedicated secretarial/support staff, a great deal of nonsensical chief duties could be cut out (e.g. clearing a conference room of leftover food after conference, setting up AV equipment for conference, scheduling talks, designing promotional pamphlets/posters, forwarding "job/fellowship opportunities" email notifications).

I cannot say this enough: For those who are not MD/PhDs and are looking to make the jump from okay residency to top-tier fellowship, timing, networking and publishing are the keys to getting an external fellowship.

Probably in that order.
 
I, too, will be one of 2 chiefs beginning in July. We share both AP and CP issues, as well as make the call schedule. We also make sure the didactic lecture series is in place for the year. Plus, the usual headaches that everyone says we're bound to share!! :D I think we get like $500 extra per year.

I'm a bit afraid of being known as the "chief", though. I think the assumption is that we're supposed to know how everything "should be". I don't think I do at this point!! Should be a fun year; ask me about it in a couple of months!
 
...a wooden chair carved with your name and "Chief Resident"...
LOL I just noticed this. Are you for real? Do you get to take the chair home?

Several mid-level residents were discussing the perks of being chief (woefully few) and how to encourage people to do it. One said giving the chiefs their own office would be nice. I said giving them a job in the locale of their choice starting at $200k straight out of residency would be nice.

Yes, I'm incorrigible.
 
The chair is totally for real. It probably (actually, almost certainly) costs more than the extra bit of salary we get paid to chief. It's a really nice chair. I'm sure the program pays at least $500 per chair. Come to think of it, it's probably one of the single most expensive pieces of furniture that we own.

I sit on it when I eat dinner at home and think of the glory days when I was chief. And, my son has dinged the crap out of it by banging his toys on the seat.
 
LOL I just noticed this. Are you for real? Do you get to take the chair home?

The chair is a lie
The chair is a lie
The chair is a lie
The chair is a lie

(hope that's not too obscure a reference...)

BH
 
The chair is a lie
The chair is a lie
The chair is a lie
The chair is a lie

(hope that's not too obscure a reference...)

BH

What about the cake?
 
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