Chief Residents

[Venus21pam]

Hi all,

Could you please help me out a little - I would like to find out how the Chief Residents are elected in your program. Do the residents vote, do the faculty vote, do they get appointed from the top?

I am currently a CA-3 resident and would like to change the way Chiefs are elected in my program, because the current system is not fair to the residents and our group is unhappy about it.

Thanks for you help!

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[lord_jeebus]

Near the end of the year, one of the current chiefs collects votes from all residents via e-mail. There is no nomination process - all CA-2s can be voted for. The count is confirmed by the remaining chief residents (who are given access to the first chief's e-mail account), and the program director is informed of the final result only. The faculty have no veto power over the process. Elected residents have the right to decline the position.

 

[narcusprince]

Hi all,

Could you please help me out a little - I would like to find out how the Chief Residents are elected in your program. Do the residents vote, do the faculty vote, do they get appointed from the top?

I am currently a CA-3 resident and would like to change the way Chiefs are elected in my program, because the current system is not fair to the residents and our group is unhappy about it.

Thanks for you help!

So is your problem with the chief resident or the administration. Are your issues global IE probelm with residency, teaching, call structure?? Or focal, bad interaction with staff? Poor call schedule? For both I would recommend following the chain of command. IE the other chief resident, the residency director, academic director, program director.

 

[Venus21pam]

lord_jeebus - thanks for your answer.

narcusprince - to answer your quesion - the problem is mostly with Chief residents. Not that they are bad people, I like them actually, but they are just not folks that I would like to be my "leaders". Basically the chiefs are appointed from the top and no one really knows how the process works. They get called to the PD's office and offered a position, that's it. The rest of us finds out later, when it gets announced by the PD.
The chiefs in our program are historically folks that don't ever rock the boat - quiet, don't complain or try to change anything, just lay low and go with the flow. Nor are they residents that perform particularly well academically. Nor are they folks that the rest of the residents would have picked to be Chiefs - and that's really the problem we have with it. We would like our Chiefs to be true resident representatives, that's all.

 

[countingdays]

lord_jeebus - thanks for your answer.

narcusprince - to answer your quesion - the problem is mostly with Chief residents. Not that they are bad people, I like them actually, but they are just not folks that I would like to be my "leaders". Basically the chiefs are appointed from the top and no one really knows how the process works. They get called to the PD's office and offered a position, that's it. The rest of us finds out later, when it gets announced by the PD.
The chiefs in our program are historically folks that don't ever rock the boat - quiet, don't complain or try to change anything, just lay low and go with the flow. Nor are they residents that perform particularly well academically. Nor are they folks that the rest of the residents would have picked to be Chiefs - and that's really the problem we have with it. We would like our Chiefs to be true resident representatives, that's all.

That describes how our chiefs were chosen too. It's funny that being chief is viewed by many (ex-chiefs?) as a big positive, when it could really be the opposite depending on how they are picked.

 

[Narcotized]

That describes how our chiefs were chosen too. It's funny that being chief is viewed by many (ex-chiefs?) as a big positive, when it could really be the opposite depending on how they are picked.

Gypsy, your program sounds like mine. We had a Saddam-type free election process. Faculty told residents who they wanted and didn't want for chief, and then the residents had to sign their votes so that the ruling party could then behead any residents that didn't vote for the assigned chief during this free election process.

 

[deleted126335]

lord_jeebus - thanks for your answer.

narcusprince - to answer your quesion - the problem is mostly with Chief residents. Not that they are bad people, I like them actually, but they are just not folks that I would like to be my "leaders". Basically the chiefs are appointed from the top and no one really knows how the process works. They get called to the PD's office and offered a position, that's it. The rest of us finds out later, when it gets announced by the PD.
The chiefs in our program are historically folks that don't ever rock the boat - quiet, don't complain or try to change anything, just lay low and go with the flow. Nor are they residents that perform particularly well academically. Nor are they folks that the rest of the residents would have picked to be Chiefs - and that's really the problem we have with it. We would like our Chiefs to be true resident representatives, that's all.

That exactly describes how the chiefs were selected at my program 20 years ago.

 

[Mman]

At our program, all the residents voted for anybody they wanted. However, the PD and faculty had some input as well and I have no idea how much the resident's vote counted.

 

[countingdays]

At our program, all the residents voted for anybody they wanted. However, the PD and faculty had some input as well and I have no idea how much the resident's vote counted.

Ha ha. Sounds like they appointed your chief too but had the courtesy to pretend your opinions mattered.

I liked all our annointed chiefs actually, but I think only one during my three anesthesia years would have been chief if residents elected them.

To the OP I'd say, you are probably not going to change the way they pick chiefs since you're not in a bargaining position, but good luck.

 

[Gimlet]

I haven't experienced the chief-selection process in my program yet, but I'm pretty sure the residents vote to determine a short list of 5 or 6 nominees who then go through an interview process with whichever faculty are in charge of selecting the 2 chiefs. Works out OK, I think, although I have heard complaints about plenty of the past chiefs (not that any chief would be able escape all criticism, I suppose).

 

[PMPMD]

Hi all,

Could you please help me out a little - I would like to find out how the Chief Residents are elected in your program. Do the residents vote, do the faculty vote, do they get appointed from the top?

I am currently a CA-3 resident and would like to change the way Chiefs are elected in my program, because the current system is not fair to the residents and our group is unhappy about it.

Thanks for you help!

Each of the 2 PDs gets 1/3 of the vote and all the residents votes make up the other 1/3.

 

[cchoukal]

Where I trained, CA1s and CA2s (CA1's were a recent addition) voted for any of the eligible CA2s. The top 4 vote-getters were forwarded to the faculty who voted, and the top 2 were chosen. There were always rumors among the residents that some resident other than the top 4 somehow made Chief, implying that faculty could override the residents' votes, but I'm not sure how they would have evidence for that. Seemed like a fair method to me (I was not a chief).

 

[periopdoc]

We have a much better system at UW. Residents nominate whomever they want by emailing the current chiefs. Nominee's are informed and given the option of accepting or declining the nomination.

If a resident who is CLEARLY not chief material is nominated (personality or academic issues), the PD will meet with him privately to discuss whether he feels that he can overcome the issue(s), and be an effective chief. She is very good at setting up mechanisms to assist the resident with meeting his goals. At this point, the individual has the option of declining the nomination or continuing on as a candidate. This process is completely confidential and only the chiefs and the PD know who the nominees are prior to the final list being publicized.

Interestingly, it is quite rare that the PD needs to meet with any of the nominees. Most who are not chief material decline the nomination immediately.

Once the nominee list is finalized, it is emailed out to the residents. Votes are cast by email and the top three vote gatherers are named as chiefs.

I think that it is a great system as the residents choose their representatives and the PD has some input. Ultimately, the power is in the hands of the residents.

- pod

 

[Venus21pam]

thanks for your input everyone.
Looks like we are in the majority..?? Is resistance really futile?

A group of residents in my program is trying to get together and propose a change to the system. We'll see how that goes, wish us luck.

 

[Dogdaze]

At my program there was absolutely NO input from the residents. PD simply announced who the chief was for the next year. I assume there were behind-the-scene discussions with the newly annoited, but, who knows...

Agree with whoever stated that the chiefs tended to be "yes-men" who never rocked the boat and were not true advocates for the residents, but rather for the administration.

 

[Mista Suprane]

our residency assitant sends an email to all the CA-2s in november asking them to send an email to all the residents if they want to be chief (and cc her on the email)- over the years, sometimes people just say "i would like to be your chief", sometimes they type some sort of corny campaign statement, sometimes they do something humorous (one person sent a picture of his baby wearing a t-shirt that said "vote for my daddy for chief").

she then tallies all the people and makes up a survey, which asks people to vote for their top three choices amongst the people who would like to run - i believe we had 9 people run this past year. an identical survey is sent to the faculty as well as the residents.

finally, our PD picks three chiefs. how much she uses the data from the voting we don't know; most of us feel that a particularly low vote from either facutly or residents might knock you off the list. also, she does try to pick three people that she thinks will complement each other well and/or will work together well.

our system is also unique in that new chiefs take over in mid january of CA-2 year - two reasons for this: 1) this enables the CA-3 chiefs to be finished with chiefly duties and focus on locking down jobs/moving/studying for boards. 2) the ca-3 ex-chiefs are still around for several more months and can guide/help the new chiefs with any issues or questions and/or act as a resource if needed.