Classes a la carte or Official Post-Bac?

[hopefool]

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Hello everyone,

I am a college graudate, (Cornell University) since May 2006. I graduated with a low gpa of 2.5, due to some difficulties early on in college. My grades have shown an upward trend towards the end of my time there but with a 2.5 gpa I am still limited in options right now in the pursuit of further medical education.

I am wondering whether I should enroll in an official post-bac program, that accepts low gpa'ers right now, meaning the summer time, or take classes here and there to raise my gpa somewhat and show a continued upward trend and THEN apply to a more renowned post-bac program? I am leaning towards applying to Stony Brook, Hunter college, or even Harvard's Extension school, all of whom accept low gpa's, from what I understand, and taking a good 30 credits worth of science classes, some of which I have never taken before. Seems that if I do well in those I may be able to gain admission to an SMP in another year or so.

Might it be a good idea to apply to a Master's program after taking the core sciences? and then applying to an SMP?

PS, I know my gpa is low but it really does not concern me very much. I am concerned with making the best decisions now in terms of further education and any help anyone can give is GREATLY appreciated.

THANKS VERY MUCH

 

[DrMidlife]

Allrighty, here's my $.02. You do need to care about your GPA. You'll need a lot of coursework, at a 4.0, to get that 2.5 up to a 3.0, and that's really as high as you can go, and that's a real limitation. (My numbers: 180 quarter units at a 2.5 plus 90 units at a 4.0 = 3.0). Undergrad GPA matters much more than graduate GPA. Assume you'll need to do two years full time, mostly science. Assume that you'll need to compensate for your GPA, which realistically will be under 3.0, with your science GPA (which can be well above a 3.0) and ECs and LORs and your MCAT score. And go for it.

Since you just graduated, and you have an upward trend, but you had trouble within the last 3 years (?) I think a structured program is going to be better for you. When you DIY you can easily get isolated; a structured program with committee support is probably going to be more successful. (Personally if I could do it again I would have tried hard for Bennington instead of DIY.)

AND I hope you will hold off for a little bit. Do something to demonstrate that you're serious about your ambition. Please consider the Peace Corps. Too much? Please consider AmeriCorps or Teach for America or working as an EMT. Spend a year or two out there in the world, being an adult, in service, maybe learning another language. If you're going to get onto the premed track, differentiation is critical, particularly with a low GPA. Seriously, think about the Peace Corps.

I'm not excited about a masters/SMP for you, because it adds years after your prereqs, and because you CAN improve your undergrad GPA, and the masters/SMP is going to be less impressive than other things you can do in your situation, for less money. If you find yourself still needing an SMP after your prereqs and MCAT are done, then, sure.

Best of luck to you.

 

[Instatewaiter]

It sounds like you are thinking this through which is good. I also agree that a DIY may be a more difficult route compared to the support you get from a formal program. It is also easier to be around people in similar circumstances when trying to pull yourself out of a hole. I second the formal program as your first course of action.

After you are finished with the formal program might as well test the waters and apply to med school. While you are in the application process for med school, apply to some SMPs as back-ups in case you don't get in to med school. I personally feel people get more milage out of SMPs than traditional masters, not to mention the 1 year as oposed to 2 thing. After the post-bac, though, you may not need an SMP

 

[hopefool]

Allrighty, here's my $.02. You do need to care about your GPA. You'll need a lot of coursework, at a 4.0, to get that 2.5 up to a 3.0, and that's really as high as you can go, and that's a real limitation. (My numbers: 180 quarter units at a 2.5 plus 90 units at a 4.0 = 3.0). Undergrad GPA matters much more than graduate GPA. Assume you'll need to do two years full time, mostly science. Assume that you'll need to compensate for your GPA, which realistically will be under 3.0, with your science GPA (which can be well above a 3.0) and ECs and LORs and your MCAT score. And go for it.

Since you just graduated, and you have an upward trend, but you had trouble within the last 3 years (?) I think a structured program is going to be better for you. When you DIY you can easily get isolated; a structured program with committee support is probably going to be more successful. (Personally if I could do it again I would have tried hard for Bennington instead of DIY.)

AND I hope you will hold off for a little bit. Do something to demonstrate that you're serious about your ambition. Please consider the Peace Corps. Too much? Please consider AmeriCorps or Teach for America or working as an EMT. Spend a year or two out there in the world, being an adult, in service, maybe learning another language. If you're going to get onto the premed track, differentiation is critical, particularly with a low GPA. Seriously, think about the Peace Corps.

I'm not excited about a masters/SMP for you, because it adds years after your prereqs, and because you CAN improve your undergrad GPA, and the masters/SMP is going to be less impressive than other things you can do in your situation, for less money. If you find yourself still needing an SMP after your prereqs and MCAT are done, then, sure.

Best of luck to you.

I considered the Peace Corps. The waiting time to be sent somewhere seems like it would be very long plus the 2 years that you need to devote to it. That would be almost 3 years where I could not be doing any or very little coursework. I am concerned about my gpa but not with the thought of bringing it up to snuff. I feel that I can do that with some hard work and determination, Im just not sure what you mean by quarter units and, 180 and 90..that whole part of your post. If I were to do nearly 120 additional credits in a post-bac program, masters, SMP etc at 4.0 I could bring my gpa past a 3.0. I am currently volunteering in the emergency room at a very reputable hospital and have done some research for a nursing service interviewing patients and their caregivers about the physical therapy and medical attention they are and have received.

 

[DrMidlife]

Just going to kick the GPA issue around some more here, because I think you've been misled.

Only undergrad courses are counted in your undergrad GPA, and this is what med schools typically screen by. Masters and SMP don't help bring this number up. Grad GPA is kept completely separate - it goes in a separate form on the AMCAS app. Is grad work irrelevant? No. But it doesn't count for anything until subjective human eyes look at it, which is after the auto-screen applicants get their auto-interviews.

The way AMCAS presents you to a med school (in easy numbers to plug into a system) is your overall undergrad GPA and your undergrad science GPA (bio, chem, physics, math). You have the opportunity now to make that BCPM GPA really, really good.

However, getting a 4.0 across the prereqs is a tall order. Go for it, but you might not want to assume it. I'm one of a ton of people who got spanked and surprised by a C in o-chem, coming off a ~3.5 in other hard classes. 4.0-ing a full time courseload of science for two years is rare.

With respect to the limit on how high your GPA can go, assuming you took 4 years of full time study to get a 2.5, and your postbac is 4.0, here's a quarter/semester agnostic way to look at it. This is algebra, nothing fancy going on.

X = number of units in a 4 year degree (GPA = 2.5)
X/2 = number of units in a 2 year post-bac (GPA = 4.0)
-------------------------------------------------
3*X/2 = total number of undergrad units after post-bac

( (2.5 * X) + (4.0 * X/2) ) / (3*X/2) = ...drumroll, the X's are going to cancel out... 3.0

A 3rd year of undergrad postbac at a 4.0 buys you about a 3.1. 2 years of postbac at a still-stellar 3.7 buys you a 2.9.

I'm in the same inert GPA boat. If I weren't 40, I'd be doing the Peace Corps.

Sorry to be all pissy about the details.

 

[braluk]

To the OP- I would lay off the peacecorp or anything non-academically related if your goal is to matriculate soon. Reason being, you'll need a few years to pull your application back on track. Granted being a non-trad and doing things such as Teach for America, or Americorp are all very honorable things that med schools will desire in their candidates- but only if your grades are up to snuff. So you will need to decide how you want to plan the next few years because in the end, you still need to address your grades, and nothing else you do aside from coursework will address it. If you can find an official postbac that is structured, and perhaps may include a linkage that would serve your application well. If you can pull it up in a year and then perhaps enroll in an SMP that have lower GPA/MCAT requirements, that may also be helpful as well.