Clinic Experience Survey

[janygb143]

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When will you actually start seeing your *own* patients on clinic? I.E. At LL, our class will be the first to start having an active patient 'family' as of Winter quarter (January) of our 2nd year.

Are other schools in the country starting at about the same time?

Note: I'm not including clinical observing/assisting (which is very helpful, but is lightyears from actually having your own teeth to drill on...)... but fyi, we started that our first week of school.

Also, when it comes to removable pros, are any other schools using live patients for their first dentures (vs. on a typodont)?

 

[HuyetKiem]

When will you actually start seeing your *own* patients on clinic? I.E. At LL, our class will be the first to start having an active patient 'family' as of Winter quarter (January) of our 2nd year.

Are other schools in the country starting at about the same time?

Note: I'm not including clinical observing/assisting (which is very helpful, but is lightyears from actually having your own teeth to drill on...)... but fyi, we started that our first week of school.

Also, when it comes to removable pros, are any other schools using live patients for their first dentures (vs. on a typodont)?

We started placing sealant on children at the end of first semester of first year. Perio clinic was started on the second semester of first year. 🙂 🙂 🙂 I'm at Case dental school.

 

[ItsGavinC]

We started placing sealant on children at the end of first semester of first year. Perio clinic was started on the second semester of first year. 🙂 🙂 🙂 I'm at Case dental school.

Sealants don't count (anymore than brushing your own teeth counts as clinical contact) and perio is nothing more than scraping teeth.

My idea of actual clinical work on your own patients is when you develop a tx. plan, and then implement it. In my opinion, neither of those above examples qualify.

 

[HuyetKiem]

Sealants don't count (anymore than brushing your own teeth counts as clinical contact) and perio is nothing more than scraping teeth.

.

hm.. why most of dentists out there are charging around $25-30 or more/sealant/tooth and >$150/cleaning or SCRP ? They don't actually do any actual clinical work on these patient anyway. Why not offering them free! 😎 😎 😎 I'm confused.

 

[Geezer99]

Sealants don't count (anymore than brushing your own teeth counts as clinical contact) and perio is nothing more than scraping teeth.

Properly done, these procedures are just as (if not more) technique sensitive than any class I, II, III (whatever) restorative. Of course if you don't consider these to be real clinical situations, then you can just glob on a bunch of sealant (dooming the tooth to RCT in about 5 yrs), and leave a bunch of calculus (thereby honestly just ripping the patient off).

Although I do agree that sometimes the treatment plan can be the most difficult part, be careful about what you say(and think) about perio. Take a look at any state board's disciplinary actions (all public record), and you'll see that the majority of dentists getting nailed are those misdiagnosing, and mismanaging periodontal disease.

 

[UNLV OMS GUNNABE]

Properly done, these procedures are just as (if not more) technique sensitive than any class I, II, III (whatever) restorative. Of course if you don't consider these to be real clinical situations, then you can just glob on a bunch of sealant (dooming the tooth to RCT in about 5 yrs), and leave a bunch of calculus (thereby honestly just ripping the patient off).

Oh please, don't be ******ed. SRP more technique sensitive than a class 2? Sounds like a hygienist. I can SRP with my eyes closed, it's about the easiest (and most boring) thing to do in clinic. Sealants...just don't be a *****. This time I actually agree with Gavin (no offense Gavin, it just doesn't happen very often).

 

[ItsGavinC]

This time I actually agree with Gavin (no offense Gavin, it just doesn't happen very often).

Ouch!
😀

 

[DDSSlave]

I guess it depends on how you interpret the question. I'd have to agree with this -

My idea of actual clinical work on your own patients is when you develop a tx. plan, and then implement it.

While cleanings and sealants are important procedures, they don't completely add up to what I would call clinic (a pretty comprehensive term) in dental school.

It's an interesting poll, but I think it should be narrowed down to define clinic as at least tx planning your own patients and doing operative if not endo, OS, prosth, etc. Otherwise there's no basis of comparison for the poll.

 

[HuyetKiem]

Is this considered a Tx. planning ? This is what we're doing at Case. I'm sure it is just a baby step for us newbies.

Review and update of medical, dental and medication history

Extra/intraoral exam/Vital signs

Dental exam (missiing teeth, condition of restorations, caries, tooth mobility, tooth position, occlusal relationships, parafunctional habits and pulpal status )

Periodontal exam

Radiographic exam
Assessment
Perio treatment
Referral to Resident or upper classmen for any supicious lesion
Treatment planning
then follow-up

We did pretty much same steps during Sealant program.

 

[Geezer99]

Oh please, don't be ******ed. SRP more technique sensitive than a class 2? Sounds like a hygienist. I can SRP with my eyes closed, it's about the easiest (and most boring) thing to do in clinic. Sealants...just don't be a *****. This time I actually agree with Gavin (no offense Gavin, it just doesn't happen very often).

Sorry, I sometimes forget who reads these posts. In a couple of years I guarantee, even if you ARE ******ed, you will be able to do any standard operative procedure with your eyes closed...and in about 1/10 of the time that it would take you to do one quadrant of a regular prophy.

Don't forget, when you are doing restorative, you are treating a disease that the patient's own actions have caused. When you are doing a sealant, you are treating a disease free tooth in an innocent child, and if it leaks YOU just gave that kid his first cavity.

I'd rather f#*! up a molar root canal and have to pull, than screw up a sealant....from an ethics point of view (first do no harm). Think about it.

 

[UNLV OMS GUNNABE]

You're right, I take it all back. Sealants are tough. And yes, occlusal pit caries are way worse than an extraction.

 

[Geezer99]

You're right, I take it all back. Sealants are tough. And yes, occlusal pit caries are way worse than an extraction.

I sense sarcasm...that's OK. Study hard, your personality is perfect for OMS, cocky and don't care about your patients. Don't forget about the gym as well, you'll have to rely on your looks for referrals.

 

[aphistis]

Sorry, I sometimes forget who reads these posts. In a couple of years I guarantee, even if you ARE ******ed, you will be able to do any standard operative procedure with your eyes closed...and in about 1/10 of the time that it would take you to do one quadrant of a regular prophy.

Don't forget, when you are doing restorative, you are treating a disease that the patient's own actions have caused. When you are doing a sealant, you are treating a disease free tooth in an innocent child, and if it leaks YOU just gave that kid his first cavity.

I'd rather f#*! up a molar root canal and have to pull, than screw up a sealant....from an ethics point of view (first do no harm). Think about it.

Funny, I'd rather screw up the sealant, then fix it with a quick enameloplasty, re-seal, or in the worst case a conservative occlusal restoration when I notice incipient caries at six month recall.

Y'know, from a practical real-world patient care point of view.

 

[Geezer99]

Funny, I'd rather screw up the sealant, then fix it with a quick enameloplasty, re-seal, or in the worst case a conservative occlusal restoration when I notice incipient caries at six month recall.

Y'know, from a practical real-world patient care point of view.

True, the example was probably a little too extreme...point is, poorly placed sealants that leak are causing disease...not exactly what we are trying to do. Perforating while doing a RCT to save a tooth that without treatment would surely be lost, is far less tragic in my opinion.

 

[drhobie7]

I completely agree that treating your 'own' patients in clinic consists of being assigned a patient, treatment planning that patient (going through all the necessary work up and consults), and then providing treatment (on your own). Doing a prophy on a patient being treated by a 3rd or 4th year is not treating your own patient. Once the patient is your problem, then he/she is your patient. When you're the one they call and whine about payment to, then you have your own patient.

And that business about scaling, sealants, and whatnot is just ridiculous. Working with a high speed handpiece is more technique sensitive than gracey curettes because you are doing something irreversible and far more detailed. If you mess up the tooth can become an endo. Give a monkey a gracey and enough time and he'll get all the calculus off.

 

[shopaholic]

I'm trying to figure out if you guys have ever done any ops on a real pt. Maybe you think it's so hard because you've never done it. It must be, because if you have done it, you'd realize that ops procedures are easy compared to SRP. Prophys are a different story, but an SRP is hard since you never really know if you actually did anything. Thank goodness for hygienists. It's obviously different for everyone, but if you're having so much trouble with ops, then maybe you should think about specializing.

 

[HuyetKiem]

. Give a monkey a gracey and enough time and he'll get all the calculus off.

I have to agree with this statement. 😀 😀 Dental school could train any monkey to do dentistry. We, pre-med losers, should reapply to medical school and become REAL doctors. 🙂 🙂 😉 😉

 

[DcS]

at UNC:

Summer 1st Year: We start seeing recalls/prophies.

Fall 2nd Year: Assigned our own patients, responsible for coming up with the treatment plan. At this point we can do operative, sc/rp.

Spring 2nd Year: we can do fixed, and summer 2nd year we can do endo/removable. We take oral surgery fall of 3rd year so can do ext after that.

 

[ItsGavinC]

Give a monkey a gracey and enough time and he'll get all the calculus off.

LOL. Stop calling me a monkey.

 

[janygb143]

I'm sad that this thread went so horribly awry because I failed to specify what "your own patients" actually meant (though by inserting the phrase, "your *own* patients," I thought everyone would catch on...I guess every patient you see could potentially be your own... damn you English!).

So let's start over. Can we erase the votes?

Seeing your own patients = Having several (more than 5) patients with actual charts, which you must meet with, assess, and treatment plan for = Being responsible for health history/radiographs/referrals/scheduling appointments/discussing options with patient = Actually handling (to your current ability) the proper care and feeding of patients [this is a joke. you do NOT actually have to feed your patients. it's a spoof of a book by... never mind.]

Does NOT include dental work that is performed because it's so easy any numb-nut can do it, NOR can it include dental work that is sloughed off to you by upperclassmen or instructors because "you're in dental school now!" NOR can it include dental work that you've done in another country, for poor people, or for dead people.

Any other suggestions on how to make this question any more clear?