Clinical Experience

[CoomassieBlueberry]

Hey! I'm new around here, but I've been reading posts and threads for a while. I have read the axiom, "if you can smell patients, it's clinical," but I recently realized that even then, there is a difference between shadowing and volunteering in a clinical setting; mainly, the former being passive, the latter being active. I have 70+ hours shadowing and zero hours volunteering in a clinical setting. On a side note, I have worked in a pharmacy as a pharmacy technician, but I am not sure if this fits the bill (as it was not in a hospital setting). I regrettably did not recognize the importance of this difference, and instead spent a lot of my time volunteering outside of a clinical setting (e.g., after school programs, working with people experiencing homelessness, etc.). Am I sunk?

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[LizzyM]

Pharmacy techs aren't dealing with "patients" so you can't really call that clinical by my definition.
You have had some clinical experience as a shadow and that's fine.
You have had some volunteer service to show that you like to help people out of the goodness of your heart, so that's good.
You have had work experience and that's good as it shows that someone is willing to pay you for your effort and that you have meet their expectations and been reliable.

So, you have no clinical volunteering and no clinical employment (EMT, scribe, patient care technician, etc). That is a major hole in your application and it might sink you.

 

[CoomassieBlueberry]

@LizzyM, thanks for your response. It somehow blanked my mind that I did go on a medical mission which would total 40 hours. What are my options from here on out? Would it be possible to fit in 60 hours of clinical volunteering before mid-June and still apply in this cycle? Could I submit my application early June and submit an update letter later in the process? I remember reading that it won't make a difference if you list that you "plan to do clinical volunteering" later in the summer, as you technically haven't done it yet, so I'm trying to think of all the options here.

I'm flustered because I have been excitedly preparing my application and believe the other aspects of it are primed and ready for this cycle.

 

[Goro]

@LizzyM, thanks for your response. It somehow blanked my mind that I did go on a medical mission which would total 40 hours. What are my options from here on out? Would it be possible to fit in 60 hours of clinical volunteering before mid-June and still apply in this cycle? Could I submit my application early June and submit an update letter later in the process? I remember reading that it won't make a difference if you list that you "plan to do clinical volunteering" later in the summer, as you technically haven't done it yet, so I'm trying to think of all the options here.

I'm flustered because I have been excitedly preparing my application for this cycle and believe the other aspects of my application are primed and ready for this cycle.

Take a gap year and do it right. The medical mission will be viewed as medical tourism.

Not all volunteering needs to be in a hospital. Think hospice, Planned Parenthood, nursing homes, rehab facilities, crisis hotlines, camps for sick children, or clinics.

Some types of volunteer activities are more appealing than others. Volunteering in a nice suburban hospital is all very well and good and all, but doesn't show that you're willing to dig in and get your hands dirty in the same way that working with the developmentally disabled (or homeless, the dying, or Alzheimers or mentally ill or elderly or ESL or domestic, rural impoverished) does. The uncomfortable situations are the ones that really demonstrate your altruism and get you 'brownie points'. Plus, they frankly teach you more -- they develop your compassion and humanity in ways comfortable situations can't.

 

[LizzyM]

You can try to apply this year but if you are sitting here a year from now with no offers, or just waitlists, you'll be kicking yourself for not waiting a year.

Jamming some experience into the next 4 weeks may work or it may be seen as too little, too late. The travel abroad may well be viewed as tourism. The question is, do you know what it is like to work/volunteer in a clinical setting and to be responsible as a member of the team?

 

[CoomassieBlueberry]

The question is, do you know what it is like to work/volunteer in a clinical setting and to be responsible as a member of the team?

A great point to consider, and it helps elucidate the importance of clinical and shadowing experiences. Thank you.

Suppose I decided to postpone my application and wait for next cycle (without applying this time around). Would it be acceptable to primarily use letters from this cycle (I assume, in this scenario, it would also be advisable to get a letter from the supervisor of the volunteer experience)?

 

[CoomassieBlueberry]

Take a gap year and do it right. The medical mission will be viewed as medical tourism.

Not all volunteering needs to be in a hospital. Think hospice, Planned Parenthood, nursing homes, rehab facilities, crisis hotlines, camps for sick children, or clinics.

Some types of volunteer activities are more appealing than others. Volunteering in a nice suburban hospital is all very well and good and all, but doesn't show that you're willing to dig in and get your hands dirty in the same way that working with the developmentally disabled (or homeless, the dying, or Alzheimers or mentally ill or elderly or ESL or domestic, rural impoverished) does. The uncomfortable situations are the ones that really demonstrate your altruism and get you 'brownie points'. Plus, they frankly teach you more -- they develop your compassion and humanity in ways comfortable situations can't.

Thank you for your input as well. It's helping me sort through how to best proceed.

 

[LizzyM]

A great point to consider, and it helps elucidate the importance of clinical and shadowing experiences. Thank you.

Suppose I decided to postpone my application and wait for next cycle (without applying this time around). Would it be acceptable to primarily use letters from this cycle (I assume, in this scenario, it would also be advisable to get a letter from the supervisor of the volunteer experience)?

You do not need a LOR from your volunteer experience. If you are graduating college soon, it might be understandable that you collected your letters prior to graduation. No one will think it odd to use them but you could ask your writers to update their letters this time next year. They will have to revisit the letter when they upload it anyway unless you used Interfolio.

 

[CoomassieBlueberry]

Thank you! I now have some thinking to do 🙂

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Thank you! I now have some thinking to do 🙂

Don’t let the prospect of waiting a year sway you. I know some reapplicants. It’s much better to get in the first time a year later than to be a reapplicant.

 

[CoomassieBlueberry]

Don’t let the prospect of waiting a year sway you. I know some reapplicants. It’s much better to get in the first time a year later than to be a reapplicant.

Thank you for your reassurance. Would you mind expanding on why it's better to take a gap year than to be a reapplicant? I'm not sure I am fully aware of the potential consequences, for lack of a better word, of being a reapplicant (besides, of course, having to go through the entire process twice).

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Thank you for your reassurance. Would you mind expanding on why it's better to take a gap year than to be a reapplicant? I'm not sure I am fully aware of the potential consequences, for lack of a better word, of being a reapplicant (besides, of course, having to go through the entire process twice).

Besides having to pay for everything twice, there is a stigma that comes with being a reapplicant that requires you to be even better than you’d otherwise have to be if you were a first-time applicant. Just from what I’ve seen.

 

[M1i]

Pharmacy techs aren't dealing with "patients" so you can't really call that clinical by my definition.
You have had some clinical experience as a shadow and that's fine.
You have had some volunteer service to show that you like to help people out of the goodness of your heart, so that's good.
You have had work experience and that's good as it shows that someone is willing to pay you for your effort and that you have meet their expectations and been reliable.

So, you have no clinical volunteering and no clinical employment (EMT, scribe, patient care technician, etc). That is a major hole in your application and it might sink you.

You mentioned having no clinical employement and no clinical volunteering as a “major hole” in the application. Is that to say the two combined is a major hole, or not having either one of the two.

In other words. I have five years of work experience for the same employer, including leadership and supervisor roles. However it was outside of the healthcare field. But I do have clinical volunteereing hours as well. With direct patient contact. I’m aware that a clinical job would have been far more beneficial in terms of my application. But would not having paid clinical employement still be considered a “major hole” in my application? Or would the combination of my employement history, coupled with clinical volunteering be suffice?

 

[LizzyM]

You mentioned having no clinical employement and no clinical volunteering as a “major hole” in the application. Is that to say the two combined is a major hole, or not having either one of the two.

In other words. I have five years of work experience for the same employer, including leadership and supervisor roles. However it was outside of the healthcare field. But I do have clinical volunteereing hours as well. With direct patient contact. I’m aware that a clinical job would have been far more beneficial in terms of my application. But would not having paid clinical employement still be considered a “major hole” in my application? Or would the combination of my employement history, coupled with clinical volunteering be suffice?

It is having neither clinical volunteering nor clinical employment that is the problem. Having one or the other fills the hole.

 

[kme243]

Pharmacy techs aren't dealing with "patients" so you can't really call that clinical by my definition.
You have had some clinical experience as a shadow and that's fine.
You have had some volunteer service to show that you like to help people out of the goodness of your heart, so that's good.
You have had work experience and that's good as it shows that someone is willing to pay you for your effort and that you have meet their expectations and been reliable.

So, you have no clinical volunteering and no clinical employment (EMT, scribe, patient care technician, etc). That is a major hole in your application and it might sink you.

I have a couple questions about what could be considered clinical experience in my application. I am just going to list them out. Could someone let me know what counts? Thanks!
1. 200 hours shadowing various physicians
2. 100 hours volunteering in the emergency department during college, I had 120 hours volunteering in the same hospital about 5-6 years ago. Should I group that as a repeated activity on my application and list both of them? I also got moved up to a leadership position and I now mentor and train new volunteers entering the department
3. I worked as a "student clerk" in the hospital for about 2 years (1000-1500hours). I would call patients pre op and post op to gather health information, send out surverys etc. Most of my interaction was over the phone. One of the doctors told me to log down the number of calls I made since that could be helpful down the line in my application and I called over 1000 patients. I made a lot of the paperwork given to patients when the visit and I also brought paperwork to the doctors/PAs when they saw patients in clinic. I shadowed the docs/PAs and observed the entire pre-op and post-op process that the patients go through. Does this count as clinical experience? I know that shadowing the team counts, but I'm just not sure if I could list that job as clinical experience. Oh also all the healthcare information pre and post op was used in a demographics study and lead to a publication that I got my name in.

Thank you! This is my first post so hopefully I can figure out how to find this thread again if I get a response 🙂

 

[LizzyM]

I have a couple questions about what could be considered clinical experience in my application. I am just going to list them out. Could someone let me know what counts? Thanks!
1. 200 hours shadowing various physicians
2. 100 hours volunteering in the emergency department during college, I had 120 hours volunteering in the same hospital about 5-6 years ago. Should I group that as a repeated activity on my application and list both of them? I also got moved up to a leadership position and I now mentor and train new volunteers entering the department
3. I worked as a "student clerk" in the hospital for about 2 years (1000-1500hours). I would call patients pre op and post op to gather health information, send out surverys etc. Most of my interaction was over the phone. One of the doctors told me to log down the number of calls I made since that could be helpful down the line in my application and I called over 1000 patients. I made a lot of the paperwork given to patients when the visit and I also brought paperwork to the doctors/PAs when they saw patients in clinic. I shadowed the docs/PAs and observed the entire pre-op and post-op process that the patients go through. Does this count as clinical experience? I know that shadowing the team counts, but I'm just not sure if I could list that job as clinical experience. Oh also all the healthcare information pre and post op was used in a demographics study and lead to a publication that I got my name in.

Thank you! This is my first post so hopefully I can figure out how to find this thread again if I get a response 🙂

1. shadowing has it's own tag in the listing of experiences on the AMCAS application. It is considered a low level of clinical experience.
2. Volunteering in the ED. List all of your experiences here and explain your up-graded leadership position. You can label this volunteer clinical. You can also carve out the mentor and training and tag it leadership but that's up to you. It might be more powerful folded into one experience.
3. Yes, being a student clerk in the hospital is a clinical position. You were entrusted with personal health information, you had responsibilities that the surgeons and anesthesiologists were counting on to have patients there and ready for surgery on schedule. You can call it employment, clinical.
4. You can carve out the time you actually spent in research rather than patient care and call it research. You could also skip that and just list the publication, particularly if the data was collected while you were working your regular job but used by others to test a hypothesis about the demographics of the patient population.