Clinical Psychology PhD -- is it worth it (for me)?

[priorities2]

Okay, I don't know how many of you have ever seen the movie The Ring, but ever since I was a kid, I wanted to have the job of the guy who does Samara's intake into the psych ward and asks her all those questions. I suppose he was probably a psychiatrist, but could a clinical psychologist work in a hospital setting like that? And a clinical psychologist can definitely teach at the university level, right? And engage in private practice? These positions are all ones that really interest me, so it seems like a PhD in clinical psychology is the perfect match for my interests. Though, I'm not sure whether doing research is something that interests me -- I'll be testing that out within the next couple months. I'm a rising sophomore in college, and I plan on graduating a year early, so it's as if I were a junior in terms of career-related decision-making. If I enjoy my summer research experience, I think that clinical psychology will probably become my goal. But first, I have a few questions and I would really appreciate any opinions that someone in the field could offer me.

(1) According to the Occupational Outlook Handbook, psychologists make around 70k per year on average. Do clinical psychologists graduating from fully funded PhD programs actually make that little? It seems like a long time to be in school for a 68k/year mid-career income.

(2) I have taken quite a few undergrad psych classes, and while I really liked reading the textbooks, I found the classes to be pretty boring and less interesting than my Chicano Studies, Family Studies, etc. classes. Has anyone else had the experience of not really liking their undergraduate psychology lectures but still wanting to go into the field, or is this a sign that I might want to pursue something else? I also have Human Resources in mind as a career choice.

(3) How awesome do you actually have to be to get into a fully-funded clinical psych PhD program? I realize it's got the most competitive admission standards, but would does that mean in practice? Let's say someone graduates with a 3.82 from a top 50 university in the Honors college, double major BS in Psych and BA in Spanish Studies, and a near-4.0 in Psych. This person has substantial research experience and meaningful, relevant work and internship experience. Would they need to have amazing GRE scores to stand a chance, and even then would it be a crapshoot?

(4) Let's say I have a specific (large, metropolitan) city where I want to live when I grow up. Will I get a job as a clinical psychologist there? Or is there a good chance I'll have to relocate to wherever I can find an opening?

Thanks so much for your insights. I have already learned a lot from this message board and really appreciate all of your thoughts!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[neuronic]

Hmm... Not sure where to start first, but welcome to the board. As for your general questions about where psychologists can work, yes, we can be employed in the settings you mentioned. However, most Ph.D. programs, especially the fully funded ones, will require a substantial amount of research. I would not suggest a Psy.D. due to lack of funding.

You mentioned being in college, but you may want to do some research on salaries in the workplace in general for multiple fields. 70k is more an entry level salary for a licensed psychologist. After 10 years in a VA you could make 100k per year. At an R1 research university doing research, which I know you mentioned you do not know if that is for you, you could start in the 70 range, but mid career near 90s and above if successful. Academic health centers would be 80s and above after you put in some time. There are quite a lot of positions that pay quite less and that is a risk you take, in any field.

Also, these positions are quite competitive, and you will need to go to an APA accredited program, APA internship, and likely post-doc to get one.

Question 2 seems the most concerning. I loved all my psych classes. I can't see how you would want to go to grad school if you don't really enjoy the courses. Yes, boring professors exist, but if you are that bored, maybe it is a sign of things to come.

Grad school admissions are highly competitive, and you will need GRE scores of 1300 to gauge interest, and likely higher to qualify for some fellowships.

But the good news is that there are a lot of positions in various settings open aroud the country. Go to usajobs.gov, type psychologist and see for yourself. However, these are highly competitive, requirements are strict, and only occur after a long grueling process!

If this field is for you, you should feel the passion and desire by intrinsic motivation. Good luck in your search these next few years!

 

[erg923]

Okay, I don't know how many of you have ever seen the movie The Ring, but ever since I was a kid, I wanted to have the job of the guy who does Samara's intake into the psych ward and asks her all those questions.

You dont need a ph.d (or an M.D.) to ask psych patients questions.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

In my admittedly-limited experience with inpatient psych (a year-long externship), coupled with what I've heard from individuals with a more vested interest in that setting, the typical responsibilities of a psychologist tend to include diagnostic clarification (which can sometimes include the initial intake, although usually seems to happen on more of a referral basis), psychological testing/assessment (both personality and cognitive), and occasionally treatment (short-term individual psychotherapy or, as was more often the case for me, group work such as social skills training).

As for your question about competitiveness: yeah, it's pretty competitive, although the numbers you listed would meet the standards of most programs.This is assuming that by "substantial research experience," you mean a couple years' worth of time spent in a lab along with, ideally, a couple poster presentations and/or a publication. Although yes, even with all that, you'd need a solid GRE to be considered at many programs. "Solid" in this case would mean >1100 to generally even have your app looked at and >1200 for more serious review. Although keep in mind these numbers are GROSS generalizations; people do get into fully-funded programs with GREs <1100, they just often "make up" for the score in other ways, such as research experience and/or having a master's.

Given your limited exposure to the field as a whole, I'd say your best bet at this point would be to see if you could shadow, or at least speak with, a few psychologists and psychiatrists so you can see/hear what their typical day entails.

 

[nessa34]

if you enjoyed Chicano/a and Family Studies, and decide you're not too into research, an MSW may be a better fit. It has more emphasis on social issues and you could still do therapy like a master's level psychologist. I agree that if you dislike all your psych classes, it may not be the best career choice, but I didn't enjoy all the requirement for my psych major. I did love all my mental health related coursework, which helped steer me to clinical psych.
Also, if you are looking at fully funded programs (which is smart) and will have <1 year of research under your belt, you may end up taking time to get more experience between undergrad and grad school. That will give you more time to explore and decide what you want to do.

 

[cara susanna]

I worked in an ER and I hated it. Just be aware that it's stressful and many of the staff members are cranky. I know someone who did psych evals in an ER (Masters-level clinician) and the nurses treated her really badly.

Edit: I should add that I was not working in any psychology-related field at this time

 

[snowcherries]

I personally was disappointed with some of my introductory/survey psych classes in college as compared to my humanities classes, but that was mostly because they were giant lecture classes without much room for inquiry and discussion. By the time I was a senior, however, I loved my seminar and special topics courses, in which we read journal articles and talked about them or listened to very cool guest speakers. These courses are most similar to the classes you'll have in a rigorous PhD program with small cohorts. I was also very intellectually stimulated by my research involvement in undergrad, so I'm glad you're pursuing research soon.

 

[Pragma]

(4) Let's say I have a specific (large, metropolitan) city where I want to live when I grow up. Will I get a job as a clinical psychologist there? Or is there a good chance I'll have to relocate to wherever I can find an opening?

Complicated question but a good one (and one I wish I had asked before going to grad school). The answer is it depends. Depends what type of job you want at that time (private practice where you consult at hospitals? At an AMC with a psych unit? etc., etc...).

What I have found is that generally speaking, the people who seem to be the most happy in this field are the ones who are willing to move. Not only during training, but also ones who are perfectly happy to move to an area of the country where there is a need for the services they provide. They find a good job/salary fit and remain flexible about location. Now there is tons of variability here, but for me that has been a hard thing to be flexible about (enjoying a large, metro area and not wanting to move my family...my wife's got a great job and isn't interested in moving).

If you have a specific city in mind (large metro area), chances are that you'll have to make some sort of sacrifice in order to stay there if the economy remains as it is. That could be with the type of work that you do, salary, or having to take multiple part time options to create a full time gig. If you keep your CV stellar, that helps, but it is still no guarantee when you are location-bound. The local networking can definitely help if you are looking for work in the same city that you went to grad school.

Now, I got into this field in part because I liked the flexibility of career options (clinical, teaching, research). I'll be able to make staying in the city I love work, but I have to be flexible. I am trying to have my cake and eat it to with the type of jobs I am interviewing for, but they are super competitive. I may have to take something for less money or doing something I don't like as much to make it work in the short term.

If that isn't acceptable to you and you want a guarantee about a particular city, I'd go into a profession with a higher demand and less encroachment. As others have mentioned here, the person doing the intake at an inpatient psych unit is probably going to be an RN or a social worker. Some inpatient psych units don't even employ psychologists full time, and just have them contract to do testing on an as-needed basis. If they do have psychologists on staff, aside from testing they probably run the same groups over and over. That was my experience as someone who worked a year in inpatient psych.

 

[roubs]

Agree w/Pragma. Our DCT's opinion is that if you are tied to a particular location you are giving up both your ideal job setting and your ideal salary. You're going to have to take what you can get. For the large metro area my program is located in that seems to be how it works.

 

[erg923]

Agree w/Pragma. Our DCT's opinion is that if you are tied to a particular location you are giving up both your ideal job setting and your ideal salary. You're going to have to take what you can get. For the large metro area my program is located in that seems to be how it works.

I suppose I agree. However, I have been sucessful in lining up great opps in my home city (mid-size city), but it has taken ALOT of work. Emails, calls, emails, etc. Really working it. It has paid off now, but it took alot of investigating and alot of phone conversations to get it all to come together. NEVER thought I would have to work so hard to get a good entry-level job in this profession in my desired area.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I suppose I agree. However, I have been sucessful in lining up great opps in my home city (mid-size city), but it has taken ALOT of work. Emails, calls, emails, etc. Really working it. It has paid off now, but it took alot of investigating and alot of phone conversations to get it all to come together. NEVER thought I would have to work so hard to get a good entry-level job in this profession in my desired area.

I don't think you're at all alone in that, erg. Other than those who were able to line something up during grad school/internship (generally through some combination of luck, good timing, persistence, and wanting to stick around in an underserved locale), this experience seems to be about par for the course in many parts of the US when one is looking to actually avoid moving for once.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

I NEVER thought I would have to work so hard to get a good entry-level job in this profession in my desired area.

if your desired area is in the South or Midwest (not Chicago), then it sometimes isn't as bad. If you want to live in a major city that has multiple large programs like NYC/SF/LA/CHI...then good luck, because you will need it.

 

[roubs]

Right, it is somewhat of an oversimplification. How much/well you network and chance will still play role.

 

[Pragma]

I suppose I agree. However, I have been sucessful in lining up great opps in my home city (mid-size city), but it has taken ALOT of work. Emails, calls, emails, etc. Really working it. It has paid off now, but it took alot of investigating and alot of phone conversations to get it all to come together. NEVER thought I would have to work so hard to get a good entry-level job in this profession in my desired area.

Agreed - it can be done, but there is no guarantee that you will do it. I managed, but tons of work/networking/luck were involved in me staying in one city. Also, most of your mentors will be annoyed that you are limiting yourself.