Clinical Research

[embracethepain]

Hi everyone,

Need a bit of advice on my gap year (2 years) plans. I was planning on picking up a clinical research position (I have 3.5 years of research assistant experience, including publications). I don't know if more clinical research will add anything to my application. I also was planning on volunteering at a hospital and TA'ing during this time. After 1 year, I want to enroll in an MS program (Because I would go crazy without any school/academic learning for 2 whole years). This might sound really annoying, but I am looking at research hospitals that are only affiliated with Top 5 (maybe top 10) universities. Mostly because I don't know if it matters if I do research at a lower tiered university or if brand name matters. Additionally, I am looking to pick up some more publications and another strong LOR.

My concerns/q's:
-Does it make a difference to adcoms if you do clinical research at a top university hospital vs lower tiered hospital? What sorts of benefits (as far as publications/edge in med school apps) do top tiered hospitals offer that lower tiered ones don't?
-I don't even know if clinical research is a good move financially...avg salaries are so low I'm terrified I'm not going to have food to eat. Is there a higher "position" I could apply for since I already have so much research experience? Would I get paid more because of my experience?
-Do my gap year plans sound like good ideas? criticism?

I am doing all this to get into a top med school. All the schools I am slightly obsessed with are ranked really high. I would have gotten into a med school with my current stats if I applied this cycle, but I am waiting to boost my chances of getting into a top 20 (if possible top 10) school. So any advice with this in mind would be greatly appreciated. Sorry if I sound brand name obsessed. I'm really not....but it comes off that way in this post.


On the flip side, I would LOVE to work for a nonprofit that reflects my passions in healthcare for a year while doing the volunteering/tutoring thing. I just don't know if it's better to stay in the academic scene or to go for the nonprofit. I don't know if adcoms will take me seriously with more nonprofit work....

My head is overheating not knowing what to do to improve my chances.

Also-I need to make this decision in a couple days due to financial reasons. So any advice would be appreciated!

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[darkjedi]

Hi everyone,

Need a bit of advice on my gap year (2 years) plans. I was planning on picking up a clinical research position (I have 3.5 years of research assistant experience, including publications). I don't know if more clinical research will add anything to my application. I also was planning on volunteering at a hospital and TA'ing during this time. After 1 year, I want to enroll in an MS program (Because I would go crazy without any school/academic learning for 2 whole years). This might sound really annoying, but I am looking at research hospitals that are only affiliated with Top 5 (maybe top 10) universities. Mostly because I don't know if it matters if I do research at a lower tiered university or if brand name matters. Additionally, I am looking to pick up some more publications and another strong LOR.

My concerns/q's:
-Does it make a difference to adcoms if you do clinical research at a top university hospital vs lower tiered hospital? What sorts of benefits (as far as publications/edge in med school apps) do top tiered hospitals offer that lower tiered ones don't?
-I don't even know if clinical research is a good move financially...avg salaries are so low I'm terrified I'm not going to have food to eat. Is there a higher "position" I could apply for since I already have so much research experience? Would I get paid more because of my experience?
-Do my gap year plans sound like good ideas? criticism?

I am doing all this to get into a top med school. All the schools I am slightly obsessed with are ranked really high. I would have gotten into a med school with my current stats if I applied this cycle, but I am waiting to boost my chances of getting into a top 20 (if possible top 10) school. So any advice with this in mind would be greatly appreciated. Sorry if I sound brand name obsessed. I'm really not....but it comes off that way in this post.


On the flip side, I would LOVE to work for a nonprofit that reflects my passions in healthcare for a year while doing the volunteering/tutoring thing. I just don't know if it's better to stay in the academic scene or to go for the nonprofit. I don't know if adcoms will take me seriously with more nonprofit work....

My head is overheating not knowing what to do to improve my chances.

Also-I need to make this decision in a couple days due to financial reasons. So any advice would be appreciated!

If you already have pubs from research experiences, there really is limited benefit to continuing to do research. Consider adding more unique things to your application. All the top tier med schools really like students who are well-rounded in the sense that they have EC's and interests outside of medicine.

Additionally, just because you have the stats for the top tier schools, it doesn't mean very much. There are thousands of applicants likely with similar or better stats than you, but when adcoms begin to filter out who they want to interview and eventually matriculate, they look for those who they believe are interesting and unique.

Take these gap years to set yourself apart from the normal generic med school applicant. Do something abroad or take up those non-profit gigs. The research part of your application is already well and checked.

 

[embracethepain]

If you already have pubs from research experiences, there really is limited benefit to continuing to do research. Consider adding more unique things to your application. All the top tier med schools really like students who are well-rounded in the sense that they have EC's and interests outside of medicine.

Additionally, just because you have the stats for the top tier schools, it doesn't mean very much. There are thousands of applicants likely with similar or better stats than you, but when adcoms begin to filter out who they want to interview and eventually matriculate, they look for those who they believe are interesting and unique.

Take these gap years to set yourself apart from the normal generic med school applicant. Do something abroad or take up those non-profit gigs. The research part of your application is already well and checked.

I definitely agree with you. I'm looking to set myself apart...and i'm not sure more research is the way to do it. I have a lot of experience abroad, so that may not be it. I will definitely look into nonprofit (in America). I wasn't sure if it was looked favorably upon.

I think it's safe to say that I'm very confused and have no idea what I'm doing at this point. Everything I can think of doing has been done before or seems cliche. 🙁

Also not sure if a postbac is a good idea since 3.6 gpa is very low for a top school. I just feel a postbac is pointless because I won't learn anything new and I don't want to be stuck in a rinse and repeat of old subject cycle when I could be learning/doing things that actually matter.

 

[PingPongPro]

3.6 + not elite mcat score (based on this thread http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=942272) does not bode well for your top 20 ambitions.

Admissions into a top school is hard because there are so many qualified applicants and its pretty hard to do remarkable activities to set yourself apart from others.

From your posts, you seem like your desperately trying to do everything that would help improve your application. You should instead pursue what you are interested in/passionate about instead of trying to complete a checklist. This will help set you apart and give you something meaningful to talk about.

At the end of the day, you will need to explain why you decided to take 2 gap years. If all you do during that time is research and volunteer (things you already did in undergrad) it might look odd. If you are truly passionate about becoming a doctor, why take 2 years off and procrastinate on pursuing your dream? You said you are doing all this to get into a top 20. This tells me that you are more passionate about prestige than health care.

 

[embracethepain]

3.6 + not elite mcat score (based on this thread http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=942272) does not bode well for your top 20 ambitions.

Admissions into a top school is hard because there are so many qualified applicants and its pretty hard to do remarkable activities to set yourself apart from others.

From your posts, you seem like your desperately trying to do everything that would help improve your application. You should instead pursue what you are interested in/passionate about instead of trying to complete a checklist. This will help set you apart and give you something meaningful to talk about.

At the end of the day, you will need to explain why you decided to take 2 gap years. If all you do during that time is research and volunteer (things you already did in undergrad) it might look odd. If you are truly passionate about becoming a doctor, why take 2 years off and procrastinate on pursuing your dream? You said you are doing all this to get into a top 20. This tells me that you are more passionate about prestige than health care.

Like I said, it comes off that way in my post. I do care about going to a good school, but I also haven't taken my mcat yet. The reason for this is to make sure I'm at my target score before I take it. So I'm hoping the mcat will put me back in the game. Many of my friends ended up at elite schools with 3.6 gpa's and average mcats, so it's not unthinkable. I just don't know if they are outliers. I have personal reasons for taking 2 years off. I think the main issue is I don't quite know if I should do what I want to do (what I'm passionate about) or if I should stick to the research + volunteering route. I don't want to look like I have wasted my time. And yes, I am desperately trying to improve my application-taking 2 years off was a huge step for me and I don't want to waste the time. From what everyone is saying, I am leaning towards going ahead with the nonprofit work I've been wanting to do for a while now. I would feel more useful that way to other people and also get something more valuable out of it.

So was that a yes for a post bac? Gpa too low to aim for top 20 at this point?

 

[LizzyM]

A great MCAT score (>10 in each section and a score of >35) and a great passion x 2 yrs f/t will put you way ahead of the pack for top 20 schools even with a gpa of 3.6.

Think about being somewhere 1-2 years from now and asked at interview, "tell me about yourself". Which storyline will be most interesting?

 

[embracethepain]

A great MCAT score (>10 in each section and a score of >35) and a great passion x 2 yrs f/t will put you way ahead of the pack for top 20 schools even with a gpa of 3.6.

Think about being somewhere 1-2 years from now and asked at interview, "tell me about yourself". Which storyline will be most interesting?

That's very true. Nonprofit would give me more to talk about and would be a more natural step for me in my application. More research wont really give me anything new to talk about. I would like to continue volunteering in the hospital because I really like the environment.

With the gpa, I am most worried about being screened out before my application is really given a shot. I keep hearing on this forum that gpas above 3.5 (I'm assuming that includes gpas that round up to 3.5) are somewhat decent and won't break the application to a top 20 if all other factors are in good shape (as in high mcat, great EC's, demonstrated passion). Is there any validity to this?

 

[Narmerguy]

Moving to WAMC.

And yeah, it may not break your application, but it certainly doesn't help. Remember that these schools have 3.7-3.8 median GPAs for a reason.

 

[moothecow]

this is kind of similar to my sitch. what are you planning on doing? nonprofit?

 

[darkjedi]

At the end of the day, you will need to explain why you decided to take 2 gap years. If all you do during that time is research and volunteer (things you already did in undergrad) it might look odd. If you are truly passionate about becoming a doctor, why take 2 years off and procrastinate on pursuing your dream? You said you are doing all this to get into a top 20. This tells me that you are more passionate about prestige than health care.

This is so not true, I was 2 years out when I even began by postbac, as was most of my classmates. While the application cycle was rough, there was no question that the extra gap years I took was a boon to my application. You just have to do interesting things during those years.

With the gpa, I am most worried about being screened out before my application is really given a shot. I keep hearing on this forum that gpas above 3.5 (I'm assuming that includes gpas that round up to 3.5) are somewhat decent and won't break the application to a top 20 if all other factors are in good shape (as in high mcat, great EC's, demonstrated passion). Is there any validity to this?

I managed to squeak into a top tier school with a 3.5 ugradGPA and 3.6cGPA, it's definitely possible, but definitely an uphill battle.

 

[moothecow]

This is so not true, I was 2 years out when I even began by postbac, as was most of my classmates. While the application cycle was rough, there was no question that the extra gap years I took was a boon to my application. You just have to do interesting things during those years.




I managed to squeak into a top tier school with a 3.5 ugradGPA and 3.6cGPA, it's definitely possible, but definitely an uphill battle.

For those who are almost at a 3.5 (aka in my case a 3.46), do you suggest postbacs? Also similar to embracethepain, is the suggestion to do whatever you are really into (even if it is not in the clinical research dept publishing) and say to admission committees "hey, i took two years off because I absolutely love doing this, this is why i want to go into medicine, this is what I want to do with the rest of my life" or to stick to cliche premed things?

just looked at LizzyM and she leans more towards whatever people are passionate about, but what if what people are passionate about was inspired by what they researched in the past but isn't in the lab anymore? if that makes sense...

darkjedi, can I ask how you used your two years? also how are postbacs looked at during admissions? do committees think oh this person did a postbac that's great or "oh this person is annoying they repeated the same set of classes again?"

 

[darkjedi]

For those who are almost at a 3.5 (aka in my case a 3.46), do you suggest postbacs? Also similar to embracethepain, is the suggestion to do whatever you are really into (even if it is not in the clinical research dept publishing) and say to admission committees "hey, i took two years off because I absolutely love doing this, this is why i want to go into medicine, this is what I want to do with the rest of my life" or to stick to cliche premed things?

just looked at LizzyM and she leans more towards whatever people are passionate about, but what if what people are passionate about was inspired by what they researched in the past but isn't in the lab anymore? if that makes sense...

darkjedi, can I ask how you used your two years? also how are postbacs looked at during admissions? do committees think oh this person did a postbac that's great or "oh this person is annoying they repeated the same set of classes again?"

it depends on what type of postbac you're referring to. I did a career-changer that only gave me the pre-reqs I never took in college. I managed to do well in it and it boosted my cGPA. I would not advise doing a postbac if you already have a 3.5 and already took all your prereqs. If you do do a GPA-boosting postbac, you should be taking higher level science courses to prove you can handle a med school curriculum. This is definitely looked upon very favorably if you manage to do very well.

People who have taken a few years out of college are usually looked upon more favorably. As LizzyM has mentioned, these people generally have more interesting things to talk about and their resumes stand out more than a general cookie cutter pre-med. Definitely pursue what your passions are. If you've checked off those general EC boxes, then now is the time to set yourself apart. Do what you genuinely enjoy as it will come off positively in interviews and your application.

Since I was a career changer, I was originally doing finance, before starting my postbac. After my postbac I worked in a hospital doing research and published.

 

[moothecow]

A great MCAT score (>10 in each section and a score of >35) and a great passion x 2 yrs f/t will put you way ahead of the pack for top 20 schools even with a gpa of 3.6.

Think about being somewhere 1-2 years from now and asked at interview, "tell me about yourself". Which storyline will be most interesting?

LizzyM, what about a gpa of 3.46 (~3.5)? I expect it to be harder but still dependent on mcat, ECs, and gap year plans....but you're the boss...

 

[LizzyM]

LizzyM, what about a gpa of 3.46 (~3.5)? I expect it to be harder but still dependent on mcat, ECs, and gap year plans....but you're the boss...

The top tier schools have LizzyM scores of 72 or higher and tend to interview people with LizzyM scores of 70+... So with a gpa of 3.46 you'd need a MCAT of 36 or higher (top 1-3%) to have a good shot at a top 20. The gpa/MCAT are the cake and the ECs gap year etc are the icing. A lump of frosting is not a cupcake.

When I interview someone who has done something that really excites them, they light up and their joy in talking about their experience is infectious. That is the effect you should be going for in choosing how to spend your time.

 

[embracethepain]

A great MCAT score (>10 in each section and a score of >35) and a great passion x 2 yrs f/t will put you way ahead of the pack for top 20 schools even with a gpa of 3.6.

Think about being somewhere 1-2 years from now and asked at interview, "tell me about yourself". Which storyline will be most interesting?

Thanks LizzyM! I am currently looking into doing some clinical work to round out my application. I am also trying to find positions to do some of the things I've been wanting to do for awhile. It's actually been really hard finding positions when I already know exactly what I want to do! Is it ok, if we aren't able to find something that perfectly suits our interests, to do two or three separate activities (each filling some facet of what I want to do instead of one position that encompasses everything I want to do)? If this doesn't make sense I can reword it. It sounds funky to me too but I can't figure out how to say it without being specific.

I am actually getting really excited about my gap years now. It somehow feels like the whole world just opened up to me and I can do what I love the most (maybe it was always like that and I never saw it!).

Another question-when doing shadowing/clinical research, does the hospital matter? I am curious if it's ok to work at a local hospital (even if it isn't that greatly ranked). Better hospitals all require relocation and while I'm open to it, it seems to be much easier to stay put.

 

[LizzyM]

Thanks LizzyM! I am currently looking into doing some clinical work to round out my application. I am also trying to find positions to do some of the things I've been wanting to do for awhile. It's actually been really hard finding positions when I already know exactly what I want to do! Is it ok, if we aren't able to find something that perfectly suits our interests, to do two or three separate activities (each filling some facet of what I want to do instead of one position that encompasses everything I want to do)? If this doesn't make sense I can reword it. It sounds funky to me too but I can't figure out how to say it without being specific.

I am actually getting really excited about my gap years now. It somehow feels like the whole world just opened up to me and I can do what I love the most (maybe it was always like that and I never saw it!).

Another question-when doing shadowing/clinical research, does the hospital matter? I am curious if it's ok to work at a local hospital (even if it isn't that greatly ranked). Better hospitals all require relocation and while I'm open to it, it seems to be much easier to stay put.

I've never seen the specific hospital matter to adcoms