Combining Pharmacy/Law School Career Options?

[josh6718]

I've been doing some searches on this forum as well as the internet and haven't really found a whole lot of information about the what a PharmD/JD degree exactly entails outside patent law.

Has anyone gone this route or know of people who have and know about the starting/long-term salary, career opportunities or job demand?

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[prevacid]

i thought bout this route, also took the lsats

but from the people i talked to, the pharmd wouldnt give u a leg up on the rest in the law field...hence i didnt go that route

 

[shelle]

Having a pharmD absolutely gives you a leg up for multiple reasons:

1. You can get hired as a staff pharmacist by a company/firm and then have them financial provide for the law education in exchange for a contract to represent them for X amount of years.

2. More simply, you will win more cases because you are more knowledgeable, which leads to a better career.

3. From all the Patent and Pharmaceutical Lawyers I have met, contacted and heard of- I would say about 60% have their pharmD and all seem to be in a better position than those who don't.

There are a lot more PharmD/JDs out there than you would expect- so obviously it is not a waste.

As far as salary, it strongly depends on your ability and subsequently your job placement. I know some PharmD/JDs in academia (probably not the salary you are looking for) and some with the corner office flying around the world constantly, living the dream. So, it varies. Any job in Pharma typically starts lower than retail/hospital PharmD jobs (about 70k) but has so much more potential to increase than the conventional PharmD route, especially considering the decreasing shortage of pharmacists among us, the salaries may stay where they are for quite some time or worse.

My best advice for you is: If you love pharmacy but feel like you want to do more with it than retail or hospital- not just because of the salary issue- then take your LSAT and see how you do. If you get above a 160 and have a solid GPA from Pharm school, apply to law schools and see what you get into because the reality of it is: your future in law is a lot brighter if you get into a good law school.

Let me know if you want more advice about this in the future. I am a pre-law pharmD student who will be following this path and I am constantly learning about it myself. I am currently talking to/emailing 5 pharmD/JDs that I made connections with at the annual APhA convention and will be attending the annual American Society of Pharmacy Law convention in November, so if you would like me to keep you informed if I learn any new facts- let me know I would be happy to help because I am going through the same thing as you right now.

 

[prevacid]

Having a pharmD absolutely gives you a leg up for multiple reasons:

1. You can get hired as a staff pharmacist by a company/firm and then have them financial provide for the law education in exchange for a contract to represent them for X amount of years.

2. More simply, you will win more cases because you are more knowledgeable, which leads to a better career.

3. From all the Patent and Pharmaceutical Lawyers I have met, contacted and heard of- I would say about 60% have their pharmD and all seem to be in a better position than those who don't.

There are a lot more PharmD/JDs out there than you would expect- so obviously it is not a waste.

As far as salary, it strongly depends on your ability and subsequently your job placement. I know some PharmD/JDs in academia (probably not the salary you are looking for) and some with the corner office flying around the world constantly, living the dream. So, it varies. Any job in Pharma typically starts lower than retail/hospital PharmD jobs (about 70k) but has so much more potential to increase than the conventional PharmD route, especially considering the decreasing shortage of pharmacists among us, the salaries may stay where they are for quite some time or worse.

-i agree you can get CHILL jobs in academia
-i dont know what company right now would send you for your law degree, i mean big pharma is going thru a down time right now
-most hopitals dont like to go to trial and prefer to settle out of court, and regardless, during the case, when you interview those involved, you get a good understanding of what happened and whether its worth to fight the suit or settle out of court

also, most ambulance chaser lawyers do not have a medical background yet stilll make hundreds of thousands


patent law, when you work on a drug, getting rights and wat not, its not that hard to read up on that drug

like i said, im sure there are great oppurtunities there, but i didnt think it was worth it for after doing the research in the field(and i took the lsat and got 160)

 

[shelle]

-i dont know what company right now would send you for your law degree, i mean big pharma is going thru a down time right now
-most hopitals dont like to go to trial and prefer to settle out of court, and regardless, during the case, when you interview those involved, you get a good understanding of what happened and whether its worth to fight the suit or settle out of court

also, most ambulance chaser lawyers do not have a medical background yet stilll make hundreds of thousands


patent law, when you work on a drug, getting rights and wat not, its not that hard to read up on that drug

Pharma cuts research first (unfortunately) they keep their investment in representation pretty high priority and consistent.

When I say that you will have a better understanding and do better in court, I'm not strictly talking about hospitals at all, to the contrary actually. Pharmaceutical lawyers (Pfizer being the biggest in house pharmaceutical law firm) represents the company in cases when they are being prosecuted for any number of things their drug (and even sometimes the generic form of their drug) is being blamed for. Maybe that's why you thought it wasn't worth while, because health-care law (representing hospitals, clinics etc) really wouldn't give pharmD's too much of a leg-up, but other forms of law really work with the duel degree.

So, even if you wanted to be an "ambulance chase lawyer"- yeah you wasted 6 years of pharm school but you would still be hitting a pharmacist's salary out of the park (if that's what your in it for)

Patent law is probably the most important to have a thorough understanding of all drugs. Just "reading up on the drug" you are working on is the root of a lot of the non-innovative tendencies in the industry right now. A drug should not be patented if a therapeutically identical stereoisomer of the drug molecule is already on the market or in the pipeline. If you were a patent lawyer who only knew about the drug you were working on and didn't realize that something similar was already out there because you didn't have the education behind your degree- you would think that drug was worthy of patent- big problem.

Not to be confrontational (or too lawyer-esque) but I just don't want people getting the wrong information. Of course, it is important for everyone to do their own research on their own future and deduce what you will- it's just important for us all as pharmacy students to respect that retail and hospital is not the only way to go. The people who will excel in retail and hospital- should be there and counsel and immunize those patients, without there being a surplus of pharmacists who should really be spreading their wings in other fields like law, medical writing, research, academia, etc. We've picked a career path that is easily diversified and we should take advantage!

 

[prevacid]

Patent law is probably the most important to have a thorough understanding of all drugs. Just "reading up on the drug" you are working on is the root of a lot of the non-innovative tendencies in the industry right now. A drug should not be patented if a therapeutically identical stereoisomer of the drug molecule is already on the market or in the pipeline. If you were a patent lawyer who only knew about the drug you were working on and didn't realize that something similar was already out there because you didn't have the education behind your degree- you would think that drug was worthy of patent- big problem.

a simple google search could answer that question for anyone

i never said retail or hospital is the only way to go

i was just of the opinion that if law is your thing, youre better off skipping the 6 yrs of pharm and going straight to law after BS degree

 

[carvalho]

hey shelle,

i realize that it is now 2012 three years after this thread was posted and well imagine that you are into your career years! would be very very happy if your offer still stands about conatcting you re questions/advice about Patent pharmaceutical law. I have a BPharm and in final year LLB. i know for sure that the traditional retail, hospital pharmacy practice is NOT for me.

Patent/Pharma law is where i would like to go.... and as an alternate area, the regulatory/ policy formulation aspect of tat field.

I am hungry for guidance, info, advice, mentorship-type relationships...and i dont think anything beats a connection with persons working in the field. I would be eternally grateful if you would opt to help.

thanks much.

Having a pharmD absolutely gives you a leg up for multiple reasons:

1. You can get hired as a staff pharmacist by a company/firm and then have them financial provide for the law education in exchange for a contract to represent them for X amount of years.

2. More simply, you will win more cases because you are more knowledgeable, which leads to a better career.

3. From all the Patent and Pharmaceutical Lawyers I have met, contacted and heard of- I would say about 60% have their pharmD and all seem to be in a better position than those who don't.

There are a lot more PharmD/JDs out there than you would expect- so obviously it is not a waste.

As far as salary, it strongly depends on your ability and subsequently your job placement. I know some PharmD/JDs in academia (probably not the salary you are looking for) and some with the corner office flying around the world constantly, living the dream. So, it varies. Any job in Pharma typically starts lower than retail/hospital PharmD jobs (about 70k) but has so much more potential to increase than the conventional PharmD route, especially considering the decreasing shortage of pharmacists among us, the salaries may stay where they are for quite some time or worse.

My best advice for you is: If you love pharmacy but feel like you want to do more with it than retail or hospital- not just because of the salary issue- then take your LSAT and see how you do. If you get above a 160 and have a solid GPA from Pharm school, apply to law schools and see what you get into because the reality of it is: your future in law is a lot brighter if you get into a good law school.

Let me know if you want more advice about this in the future. I am a pre-law pharmD student who will be following this path and I am constantly learning about it myself. I am currently talking to/emailing 5 pharmD/JDs that I made connections with at the annual APhA convention and will be attending the annual American Society of Pharmacy Law convention in November, so if you would like me to keep you informed if I learn any new facts- let me know I would be happy to help because I am going through the same thing as you right now.

 

[moolman]

Wow, old thread. Law school right now is worse than pharm school, it's where all of us headed if we don't stop the flood of new schools opening up or maybe we're already past the tipping point. Students graduate with tons of debt and can find only jobs that pay little to their education. For law school where you graduate from matters for job prospects. As someone who has a pharmD you're at an advantage over others.

I took the LSAT myself and considered going into law, the finances made no sense after pharm school. You would need to have some kind of job lined up beforehand to make it worthwhile. You would take on another 200k of debt and money wise you would get paid the same as a pharmacist. There's no big law firm out there actively seeking pharmD/JDs that will pay high salaries. The patent lawyer thing, you'd need a phd in the subject not a pharmD. Think about what we learn compared to a phd and hence a phd is the way to go. If you look up patent lawyers the second degree they have is a phd. Just like anything it is what you make of it but another $200k in debt with dismal job prospects that would pay more and it's not looking good. I ended up doing a residency in managed care cause I knew hospital and retail was not for me. I would suggest the same to you.

 

[moolman]

It gives you a leg up in the sense that you'll have a pharmacy job that pays well compared to law students who are working at Starbucks, it's pretty bad out there for law unless you come out of a top program and even then you better be top of your class. Also, in a mild sense at least you'll know some pharmacy law. Unless you got something lined up beforehand the JD is a bad choice.

 

[confettiflyer]

Anyone here ever think of just doing the correspondence school + take the bar thing in California? Debating just doing the self-taught thing, obviously would affect job prospects if you're trying to get into a big firm/pharma/etc...

(FYI California = you do not need a JD to take the bar and practice law, you can be self-taught via a correspondence school and/or be taken on as an "apprentice" for a few years)

 

[pharm B]

I actually looked at the online law school idea, until I saw that California was the only state where you could practice. For me, I'd just like to expand my skillset and I figured it would better enable me to get involved with cases as a consultant.

 

[moolman]

So in CA, you can go to CA bar accreditted schools, these school are only accreditted for CA and you can only practice in CA. I believe after 5 years, some states will take you but only a few. So yes, in CA you can just study on your own and take the bar. I'm real hesitant to do this because it's kinda pointless. I know plenty of people that can pass the Naplex by studying the RXPrep material, having never gone to pharmacy school. You need the experience to actually make that knowledge practical. I think of back when I took the PTCB for my pharm tech certification. I studied for the test, I passed, I had no clue about anything still.

Also, most people give up on the online courses, unless you have a buddy to do it with to keep you accountable. So confettiflyer, let's get this started..haha..

 

[confettiflyer]

So in CA, you can go to CA bar accreditted schools, these school are only accreditted for CA and you can only practice in CA. I believe after 5 years, some states will take you but only a few. So yes, in CA you can just study on your own and take the bar. I'm real hesitant to do this because it's kinda pointless. I know plenty of people that can pass the Naplex by studying the RXPrep material, having never gone to pharmacy school. You need the experience to actually make that knowledge practical. I think of back when I took the PTCB for my pharm tech certification. I studied for the test, I passed, I had no clue about anything still.

Also, most people give up on the online courses, unless you have a buddy to do it with to keep you accountable. So confettiflyer, let's get this started..haha..

Haha yeah, when the cost is so low part of the motivation to pass goes out the window. The only reason I would want to go this route is to be able to:

a) do my own real estate transactions in CA (lawyers can bypass real estate brokers/agents in filing papers...obviously MLS listing would be an issue but i know enough RE agents that would help me out on that end)

b) scare off people with legitimate cease/desist orders...you'd be surprised how many people/entities play nice when they see attorneys get involved.

c) help family/friends do random low-level things as a favor

If I really need legit legal advice I'd probably hire a real attorney.