Coming back from an injury, need help getting app ready for '10

[notadryet]

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Hello Guys,
First off all I would like to thank everyone on here who has posted great information, just by lurking I have been learning a lot. My stats are not good enough, even with a good MCAT score, to get in an American school. I have considered Ross, etc. but I have decided to put in an extra year and do my best to get in to a school here in the US.

Grades
Pasadena City College: 3.3 overall GPA
UCSD: 3.2 overall GPA BS Biochemistry/Chemistry June 08
My exact grades are attached to the post, in case you guys are going to recommend retaking any courses or taking any additional courses.


E/C
Wasn’t able to do much E/C due to a severe back injury but did my best while working so this is what I have so far.
-- 1.5year- Tutoring experience at a JC (GChem, OChem, Physics, Algebra, Calc )
-- 1year- Research in a biochemistry lab, didn’t get published however, learned a lot of new techniques.
-- 1year- Member of “The Symposium,” a discussion group for various present issues. The Symposium also started a small publication in which I wrote three articles.
-- 2months-present- Medical Office Assistant, basically take care of stuff in the front office, do a little of everything. Trying to see if I can get a couple of hours in the back room, observing the Dr. and the patient.

MCAT
Princeton review from June-Aug, MCAT in Sept 09. This will also give me time to retake the test if I have too. I am certainly going to try my best the first time.

My plan from now (Mar ’09) till application time in ’10 (~ June’10).
-Continue my part time job as a [front] medical office assistant, will try to get some hours in the back
-Study hard for the MCAT and do my best to nail the first time.
-Obtain a volunteer position at a hospital or two.
--------------------------------------------------------
So I have given you guys almost all my info, let me know if there is anything else I can answer which can assist you in guiding/helping me.
I would really appreciate input from you fellows exactly what can I do from now, Mar’09 to June’10 to raise my chances of getting into a US med school (at least 1).

MPH? Take more classes and retake some classes to raise my GPA?

Thank you

 

[Brown8472]

The competition is going to be tough even with a good mcat score. I do not have all the answers but you will have to bring something else to the table. It could be a competitive mcat score plus an increase in your gpa, a post-bac or master's, research and some of volunteering/shadowing. It is not the schools that will select you out it is the competition that will bury with the rest of the crowd. So get together with your premed advisor and setup a plan of action in order to luster your profile. 🙂😳

 

[notadryet]

thanks, any other suggestions.

 

[BluntSurgeon]

Your GPA will keep you out of just about every single US allopathic school and no EC, MCAT score, or any other factor can change that (save for being a URM). I hate to say this but your best bet is to get into an SMP program or something similar and bring that GPA into the 3.4+ range. I am not sure about your DO options so hopefully somebody can shed some light.

edit: also I graduated from UCSD and I can say with absolute 100% certainty that every single advisor in the college career center will steer you far far away from where you need to be. They are totally useless when it comes to real information about what you need to get into medical school. Especially Bill.

 

[notadryet]

Thanks blunt surgeon. I am searching around and it seems there aren't any SMP in CA. I am Pakistani, but I am not sure if that is URM in this field.

How about MPH, would that bring my chances up?

I can retake some of the courses, how is the GPA calculated are med schools going to disregard my first grade or are they going to take an average?

 

[notadryet]

Your GPA will keep you out of just about every single US allopathic school and no EC, MCAT score, or any other factor can change that (save for being a URM). I hate to say this but your best bet is to get into an SMP program or something similar and bring that GPA into the 3.4+ range. I am not sure about your DO options so hopefully somebody can shed some light.

edit: also I graduated from UCSD and I can say with absolute 100% certainty that every single advisor in the college career center will steer you far far away from where you need to be. They are totally useless when it comes to real information about what you need to get into medical school. Especially Bill.

Hey bud, i am actually back in LA (diamond bar) and I am not sure where to find a pre-med advisor. I am contacting the community colleges, but they don't have one.

Any suggestions on where I can find a pre med advisor that could help me out a bit.

 

[BluntSurgeon]

You don't need a premed advisor. Everything you could ever need is here on SDN. All the posters here are about a thousand times more informed on the process than anybody I have met so just feel free to ask your questions here. This website is how I figured things out and it has served me very well.

I too am from LA (redondo beach). Also, you are pakistani which is an overrepresented minority in medical school. I am indian and (this is a personal opinion) I feel like I had to achieve MUCH MORE than what is required to gain acceptances at many of these schools. Again, I will probably get flak for this, but any URM with my stats would be getting scholarships across the board to every single school they apply to. It's just how the system works and you have to play the game. But whatever, lets not turn this into that kind of discussion.

Med schools will take averages of your grades, so If you get a C in Chem 140B and then retake it to receive an A, then your overall grade is basically a B. Bummer, I know.

I hate to say this brother, but you really really really need to find a program that will let you bring your GPA up. I am not an expert on this since I haven't had to do it (there are many others on this board though that would love to point you in the right direction). Also I am pretty damn sure there are programs in california that will let you do this, I don't think you've looked hard enough.

Don't waste your time with an MPH, another degree isn't going to help your chances with your 3.2 Like I said man, that is the biggest obstacle you have right now and all your effort should be put into fixing that.

Oh yea, like you had planned, you better kill the MCAT.

 

[notadryet]

You don't need a premed advisor. Everything you could ever need is here on SDN. All the posters here are about a thousand times more informed on the process than anybody I have met so just feel free to ask your questions here. This website is how I figured things out and it has served me very well.

I too am from LA (redondo beach). Also, you are pakistani which is an overrepresented minority in medical school. I am indian and (this is a personal opinion) I feel like I had to achieve MUCH MORE than what is required to gain acceptances at many of these schools. Again, I will probably get flak for this, but any URM with my stats would be getting scholarships across the board to every single school they apply to. It's just how the system works and you have to play the game. But whatever, lets not turn this into that kind of discussion.

Med schools will take averages of your grades, so If you get a C in Chem 140B and then retake it to receive an A, then your overall grade is basically a B. Bummer, I know.

I hate to say this brother, but you really really really need to find a program that will let you bring your GPA up. I am not an expert on this since I haven't had to do it (there are many others on this board though that would love to point you in the right direction). Also I am pretty damn sure there are programs in california that will let you do this, I don't think you've looked hard enough.

Don't waste your time with an MPH, another degree isn't going to help your chances with your 3.2 Like I said man, that is the biggest obstacle you have right now and all your effort should be put into fixing that.

Oh yea, like you had planned, you better kill the MCAT.

Thanks blunt, so basically i need to figure out how to get my GPA. Besides retaking courses along with additional courses, is there any other way i could bring my GPA up.

 

[BluntSurgeon]

Short of hacking your school's "mainframe" and changing it yourself, no.

 

[notadryet]

Short of hacking your school's "mainframe" and changing it yourself, no.

lol it will probably take less time to do that, seeing that we are desi folk.

 

[notadryet]

Besides retaking the courses I didn't do that well in, what additional courses can I take.

 

[soisauce]

i'd say go for DO. if you want to stay in the US, DO is probably your best shot. You can have an average mcat score and still get into DO with your stats. definitely consider it... it isnt so bad 😀

 

[GoSpursGo]

Besides retaking the courses I didn't do that well in, what additional courses can I take.

There's no point in retaking classes you didn't do well in unless you're going for osteopathic. Even if your school changes your GPA by replacing the old grade in the GPA calculations, AMCAS will still see it and recalculate your GPA anyways by averaging the old grade with the new grade (i.e. C on the first time+A on the second time=B). And since the schools will see you re-took those classes, they won't be as impressed as if you'd just taken more upper-division classes and aced them the first time through. So if you're going to take more undergrad classes, make them in topics you haven't taken yet; as others have said, an MPH will not help you as your undergrad GPA will still be given more weight than your MPH GPA.

 

[notadryet]

i'd say go for DO. if you want to stay in the US, DO is probably your best shot. You can have an average mcat score and still get into DO with your stats. definitely consider it... it isnt so bad 😀

Man, too many decisions. I am not sure if it would be worth going overseas for the MD title versus just doing a DO here. I am interested in psychiatry, should that impact my decision as far as the degree goes.

 

[notadryet]

There's no point in retaking classes you didn't do well in unless you're going for osteopathic. Even if your school changes your GPA by replacing the old grade in the GPA calculations, AMCAS will still see it and recalculate your GPA anyways by averaging the old grade with the new grade (i.e. C on the first time+A on the second time=B). And since the schools will see you re-took those classes, they won't be as impressed as if you'd just taken more upper-division classes and aced them the first time through. So if you're going to take more undergrad classes, make them in topics you haven't taken yet; as others have said, an MPH will not help you as your undergrad GPA will still be given more weight than your MPH GPA.

Thank you for your input, i understand everything you said. I went to school in san diego, and after graduation I moved back to LA (diamond bar). Where can I go to take upper div courses. Would this be considered something like an extension? I would like to stay in LA if I can.



Thank you very much everyone, i am so grateful for all your input.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Man, too many decisions. I am not sure if it would be worth going overseas for the MD title versus just doing a DO here. I am interested in psychiatry, should that impact my decision as far as the degree goes.

You can do whatever you want as a DO just like you can as an MD. However, the difference is that you're going to have your own residencies set aside as a DO, whereas as a foreign MD student you're going to have to duke it out with US MD students but be at a disadvantage because residencies tend to see foreign MD students as a step below the US MD students. So basically, you're really gonna have to ace your step scores in order to get a residency that you want. Furthermore, there is a staggering attrition rate at foreign MD schools, where lots of students find their instruction to not be sufficient to pass the Steps.

This is a complex issue. Many words have been spilled on the foreign MD vs. DO debate before, and I strongly suggest you try and find some of the past debates by using the search function.

 

[notadryet]

You can do whatever you want as a DO just like you can as an MD. However, the difference is that you're going to have your own residencies set aside as a DO, whereas as a foreign MD student you're going to have to duke it out with US MD students but be at a disadvantage because residencies tend to see foreign MD students as a step below the US MD students. So basically, you're really gonna have to ace your step scores in order to get a residency that you want. Furthermore, there is a staggering attrition rate at foreign MD schools, where lots of students find their instruction to not be sufficient to pass the Steps.

This is a complex issue. Many words have been spilled on the foreign MD vs. DO debate before, and I strongly suggest you try and find some of the past debates by using the search function.

Thank you bud, as you were typing this I was running the search you suggested.

Part of me likes the idea of going to a secluded island for 1.5 years.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Thank you for your input, i understand everything you said. I went to school in san diego, and after graduation I moved back to LA (diamond bar). Where can I go to take upper div courses. Would this be considered something like an extension? I would like to stay in LA if I can.



Thank you very much everyone, i am so grateful for all your input.

I'm honestly not personally familiar with options that are available to you in the LA or SoCal area. The best advice I can give you is to poke around some of the websites for the schools in LA and see what they can offer you in terms of taking some upper division classes. Some schools offer informal post-bacc programs specifically to help students take the pre-reqs or get in some advanced classes to boost your undergrad GPA, but I honestly have no clue what's available in your area. You can probably find this info at the schools' websites if you dig hard enough, or perhaps someone from the area could chime in.

 

[notadryet]

I did a search and found some useful info but i would like to ask if anyone here might have been a similar situation as me, who was also around the same location.

I am in LA, California and there aren't any SMP here for Pakistani folks at least thats what i have been told here. So my only option is to raise my GPA.

I posted some details about me in this thread

These are the schools I will be calling tomorrow morning, to find out if I could take some upper division courses there.

Cal Poly Pomona
Cal State Fullerton
UC Irvine
Chapman Univ

One problem i can see right away for raising my GPA at a university is cost🙁

If i cannot get any courses at a university, would retaking some classes at least the ones i got C in and take a few additional science courses at a junior college (Mt. SAC) not be helpful at all?

Any suggestions on what route to take would be very helpful. I have a reasonable explanation for my bad grade (back injury), however i doubt that any med school is going to care that much so if anyone has any info that could help me accomplish my dream I would appreciate it. I have attached my transcript if u need more info.

 

[notadryet]

I'm honestly not personally familiar with options that are available to you in the LA or SoCal area. The best advice I can give you is to poke around some of the websites for the schools in LA and see what they can offer you in terms of taking some upper division classes. Some schools offer informal post-bacc programs specifically to help students take the pre-reqs or get in some advanced classes to boost your undergrad GPA, but I honestly have no clue what's available in your area. You can probably find this info at the schools' websites if you dig hard enough, or perhaps someone from the area could chime in.

thanks buddy, been researching on school sites today, wrote down all the numbers, will call the schools tomorrow to check my options. i am very determined, hopefully with all your guys help i can achieve my goal.

 

[FlowLimited]

You already started a thread about this. You even linked to it. Hilarious.

 

[halekulani]

SMP if you want to go MD

MPH won't do jack for you.

most likely DO unless you have a stellar mcat score >34, then maybe you'll have a slight chance. it'll help if you have some sort of awesome experience like saving african babies or something aka something paul farmer would do.

 

[Baller MD]

It is going to be hard to increase your GPA with the amount of classes you've already took.

Have you considered DO?

 

[notadryet]

SMP if you want to go MD

MPH won't do jack for you.

most likely DO unless you have a stellar mcat score >34, then maybe you'll have a slight chance. it'll help if you have some sort of awesome experience like saving african babies or something aka something paul farmer would do.

since no SMP is available in so cal and gpa is gonna be too hard to raise.
even with a score greater than 34 and perhaps some very good volunteer experience, do I have some chance of getting into US school. not ignoring the fact that i do have a reasonable explanation for bad gpa (my sciatic nerve was literally crushed due to a disc leakage, i had to resort to surgery and even so its was still bad). for right now however i am trying not to think about my explanation at all, it will hopefully be something that at least some med schools might understand, that is if i pull off a good mcat i guess.

 

[notadryet]

You already started a thread about this. You even linked to it. Hilarious.

sorry if it wasn't necessary

 

[notadryet]

It is going to be hard to increase your GPA with the amount of classes you've already took.

Have you considered DO?

really want an MD, might consider ross or sgu if us don't workout but i guess i will give it my best shot.

 

[Pghboy18]

I did a search and found some useful info but i would like to ask if anyone here might have been a similar situation as me, who was also around the same location.

I am in LA, California and there aren't any SMP here for Pakistani folks at least thats what i have been told here. So my only option is to raise my GPA.

I posted some details about me in this thread

These are the schools I will be calling tomorrow morning, to find out if I could take some upper division courses there.

Cal Poly Pomona
Cal State Fullerton
UC Irvine
Chapman Univ

One problem i can see right away for raising my GPA at a university is cost🙁

If i cannot get any courses at a university, would retaking some classes at least the ones i got C in and take a few additional science courses at a junior college (Mt. SAC) not be helpful at all?

Any suggestions on what route to take would be very helpful. I have a reasonable explanation for my bad grade (back injury), however i doubt that any med school is going to care that much so if anyone has any info that could help me accomplish my dream I would appreciate it. I have attached my transcript if u need more info.

You probably don't want to make a habit of posting personal documents online.

 

[halekulani]

since no SMP is available in so cal and gpa is gonna be too hard to raise.
even with a score greater than 34 and perhaps some very good volunteer experience, do I have some chance of getting into US school. not ignoring the fact that i do have a reasonable explanation for bad gpa (my sciatic nerve was literally crushed due to a disc leakage, i had to resort to surgery and even so its was still bad). for right now however i am trying not to think about my explanation at all, it will hopefully be something that at least some med schools might understand, that is if i pull off a good mcat i guess.

i don't get why you're so unwilling to leave so cal for an SMP, which is only 1 year but willing to go anywhere in the US for med school

 

[Baller MD]

really want an MD, might consider ross or sgu if us don't workout but i guess i will give it my best shot.

Does your 3.2 gpa include classes from CC?

You should calculate your total undergrad GPA to see where you're really at.

 

[GoSpursGo]

since no SMP is available in so cal and gpa is gonna be too hard to raise.
even with a score greater than 34 and perhaps some very good volunteer experience, do I have some chance of getting into US school. not ignoring the fact that i do have a reasonable explanation for bad gpa (my sciatic nerve was literally crushed due to a disc leakage, i had to resort to surgery and even so its was still bad). for right now however i am trying not to think about my explanation at all, it will hopefully be something that at least some med schools might understand, that is if i pull off a good mcat i guess.

I'm not sure how your GPA is "too hard to raise." You can probably get it up to 3.4-3.5 with a semester or two of straight A's (easier said than done, yes, but doable if you set your mind to it. Your GPA still will be the weak point of your applications, but it won't be an outright deal-breaker anymore if you get a good MCAT.

Worry about the big picture later; this whole process gets too stressful if you start looking too far ahead and realize EVERYTHING you're gonna have to do. Take it one step at a time. Step 1 is find out where and how you're going to work on your UG GPA. Once you do that, there will be plenty of time to actually figure out how to ace those classes, rock the MCAT, and write your personal statement; but none of that matters until you take care of step 1. Stay focussed on the present

 

[notadryet]

i don't get why you're so unwilling to leave so cal for an SMP, which is only 1 year but willing to go anywhere in the US for med school

you raise a good point, the only reason is to try to save money. I have family in the east coast (Maryland, Dundalk and Virginia). I can try to find out exactly where my family is so I can go stay with them and do an SMP. As far as admission to SMP goes how difficult would it be. Any suggestion on good programs that are in my range for admission. I will do a search right now on this aswell.

I am planning on taking my MCAT in Aug/Sept, how would this fit in going for SMP. Would I be able to finish the SMP in time for applications in 2010?

 

[notadryet]

I'm not sure how your GPA is "too hard to raise." You can probably get it up to 3.4-3.5 with a semester or two of straight A's (easier said than done, yes, but doable if you set your mind to it. Your GPA still will be the weak point of your applications, but it won't be an outright deal-breaker anymore if you get a good MCAT.

Worry about the big picture later; this whole process gets too stressful if you start looking too far ahead and realize EVERYTHING you're gonna have to do. Take it one step at a time. Step 1 is find out where and how you're going to work on your UG GPA. Once you do that, there will be plenty of time to actually figure out how to ace those classes, rock the MCAT, and write your personal statement; but none of that matters until you take care of step 1. Stay focussed on the present

I will find out tomorrow what the deal is for taking upper division courses at universities around. Do you think 2-3 terms of solid A's at a community college would do any good.

 

[notadryet]

You probably don't want to make a habit of posting personal documents online.

thank you for your concern, i will keep it in mind for the future.

 

[NotAndrew]

I did a search and found some useful info but i would like to ask if anyone here might have been a similar situation as me, who was also around the same location.

I am in LA, California and there aren't any SMP here for Pakistani folks at least thats what i have been told here. So my only option is to raise my GPA.

I posted some details about me in this thread

These are the schools I will be calling tomorrow morning, to find out if I could take some upper division courses there.

Cal Poly Pomona
Cal State Fullerton
UC Irvine
Chapman Univ

One problem i can see right away for raising my GPA at a university is cost🙁

If i cannot get any courses at a university, would retaking some classes at least the ones i got C in and take a few additional science courses at a junior college (Mt. SAC) not be helpful at all?

Any suggestions on what route to take would be very helpful. I have a reasonable explanation for my bad grade (back injury), however i doubt that any med school is going to care that much so if anyone has any info that could help me accomplish my dream I would appreciate it. I have attached my transcript if u need more info.

LA doesn't have any Masters Programs? I find that hard to believe.

You already started a thread about this. You even linked to it. Hilarious.

I know, dude is clearly completely out of control. You don't need multiple threads about yourself.

 

[135892]

really want an MD, might consider ross or sgu if us don't workout but i guess i will give it my best shot.

Are you saying that you would go caribbean before DO? You'll have a much tougher time getting a US residency coming out of the caribbean than you would coming out of a DO program. Going Caribbean should be the absolute last resort...

 

[GoSpursGo]

I decided to merge the "Ways to raise GPA" thread with this one. Please do not post multiple threads asking essentially the same question, as otherwise posters may be confused as to where they should post responses to you. Also, though it is your prerogative, I will also point out that it may be unwise to post so much personal information, such as a full college transcript.

 

[notadryet]

I decided to merge the "Ways to raise GPA" thread with this one. Please do not post multiple threads asking essentially the same question, as otherwise posters may be confused as to where they should post responses to you. Also, though it is your prerogative, I will also point out that it may be unwise to post so much personal information, such as a full college transcript.

thanks

 

[Wants2give]

Your GPA will keep you out of just about every single US allopathic school and no EC, MCAT score, or any other factor can change that (save for being a URM). I hate to say this but your best bet is to get into an SMP program or something similar and bring that GPA into the 3.4+ range. I am not sure about your DO options so hopefully somebody can shed some light.

edit: also I graduated from UCSD and I can say with absolute 100% certainty that every single advisor in the college career center will steer you far far away from where you need to be. They are totally useless when it comes to real information about what you need to get into medical school. Especially Bill.

Ok.. im no expert on the matter as Im still a little premed, but this statement is false. false false.

Upon research done and checking out applications on mdapplicants.com you gpa with a >39 MCAT score has gotten people into medical school on multiple occasions

Examples of such
http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=410
http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=1971
(this person is hispanic however did not register URM)
http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=4643
http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=462

Thats only a few amongst many more.
On top of that, for those of you whom are familiar with stanfords med schools admissions process, students have are apart of the process as well. A buddy of mine whom graduates this year informed me that MCAT scores and EC's can make a worlds difference..

Some words he shared with me are, in extra curricular activities, do something interesting that gives back to your community that expresses who YOU are.

Dont give up hope and DON'T listen to people like the person quoted whom clearly have no clue what they are talking about!

Good luck!

 

[Wants2give]

Are you saying that you would go caribbean before DO? You'll have a much tougher time getting a US residency coming out of the caribbean than you would coming out of a DO program. Going Caribbean should be the absolute last resort...

This is very true, I have been curious to the answer of this question as well and it is almost certain that the order of of ease of getting a residency in the US is.
1. US Allopathic school
2. US Osteopathic School
3. Foreign Allopathic school ( such as europe or canada)
4. Carribean Allopathic school.

There is nothing wrong with osteopathic school! If you are worried about being looked down upon because of the DO,Dont! For anyone who knows what they are talking about, if they find out your MD came from carribean, you will be wishing you had that DO.

 

[enjoydrywax]

Ok.. im no expert on the matter as Im still a little premed, but this statement is false. false false.

Upon research done and checking out applications on mdapplicants.com you gpa with a >39 MCAT score has gotten people into medical school on multiple occasions

Examples of such
http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=410
http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=1971
(this person is hispanic however did not register URM)
http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=4643
http://www.mdapplicants.com/viewprofile.php?id=462

Thats only a few amongst many more.
On top of that, for those of you whom are familiar with stanfords med schools admissions process, students have are apart of the process as well. A buddy of mine whom graduates this year informed me that MCAT scores and EC's can make a worlds difference..

Some words he shared with me are, in extra curricular activities, do something interesting that gives back to your community that expresses who YOU are.

Dont give up hope and DON'T listen to people like the person quoted whom clearly have no clue what they are talking about!

Good luck!

Notadryet, please don't listen to this clown. Understand that he has lost all touch with reality and let me explain to you why. While his evidence basically disproves BluntSurgeon's post, I'd still say BluntSurgeon's post is more congruent with reality.

To quote want2give: "[your] gpa with a >39 MCAT score has gotten people into medical school on multiple occasions"

He is perscribing that all you have to do is "simply" get a 40 or above on your MCAT... yea good one wat2give, do you realize what a 40 MCAT score means? That's greater than 99.9% percentile. Shooting for a score like that should be everybody's goal, but EXPECTING a score like that (much less absolutely needing it, which is what want2give is advocating) is downright stupid.

Listen to BluntSurgeon and find an SMP. While I wish you every ounce of luck in obtaining a >40 mcat, simply based on how the distribution works, the chances of doing this are very very slim, at best.