Concerns about how schools view undergrad grades

[abc22]

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I went to a huge publIC university with a very good reputation, but all of my science professors graded on a bell curve and all of my classes of 300+ students were filled with freaks. This screwed me over because of all the damn pre-med gunners with their buckets of Adderall and mountains of cocaine. Not to mention the sad fact that these &@$! gunners cheated all the damn time and ask their other dweebtastic friends who are TAs to point out answers DURING exams. Jesus. I know a girl who never filled out a single lab report/copied all assignments/cheated on most of her exams while she spent all her time volunteering and studying for the MCAT. She got a 44.......

Anyway, I thought that my GPA was okay considering that the average graduate from my university has a 3.01, but seeing as how everyone else has a 3.99, I'm starting to freak out. How do some schools not even consider undergraduate reputation as an admissions factor?! Really???!

 

[LivestockDoc]

Whiner.

 

[Leanne]

Whiner.

👍

They don't consider these supposed reputations because if you could handle upper-level science classes like the ones you'll be taking in vet school, you'd be doing okay in the class regardless of the curve.

 

[Museum Nerd]

I went to a huge publIC university with a very good reputation, but all of my science professors graded on a bell curve and all of my classes of 300+ students were filled with freaks. This screwed me over because of all the damn pre-med gunners with their buckets of Adderall and mountains of cocaine. Not to mention the sad fact that these &@$! gunners cheated all the damn time and ask their other dweebtastic friends who are TAs to point out answers DURING exams. Jesus. I know a girl who never filled out a single lab report/copied all assignments/cheated on most of her exams while she spent all her time volunteering and studying for the MCAT. She got a 44.......

Anyway, I thought that my GPA was okay considering that the average graduate from my university has a 3.01, but seeing as how everyone else has a 3.99, I'm starting to freak out. How do some schools not even consider undergraduate reputation as an admissions factor?! Really???!

Cornell, Tufts, and Penn use to have 5 points (out of 100) for Rigor of Undergrad studies...which Tufts told me was basically a ranking of your undergrad college, and if you took honor courses etc... however 5 points wont help much if your GPA is around the average

 

[Trematode]

I went to an undergrad that never curved. My average for vet school is around yours. I take responsibility for that.

I find rigor varies too based on prof. Nothing really you can do about it except to ask around and avoid the profs that "suck".

 

[LetItSnow]

I went to a huge publIC university with a very good reputation, but all of my science professors graded on a bell curve and all of my classes of 300+ students were filled with freaks. This screwed me over because of all the damn pre-med gunners with their buckets of Adderall and mountains of cocaine. Not to mention the sad fact that these &@$! gunners cheated all the damn time and ask their other dweebtastic friends who are TAs to point out answers DURING exams. Jesus. I know a girl who never filled out a single lab report/copied all assignments/cheated on most of her exams while she spent all her time volunteering and studying for the MCAT. She got a 44.......

:troll:

 

[DVMDream]

:troll:

I was thinking the same thing.... 👍

 

[abc22]

...how am I a troll? I never said anything to incite anger or to offend anyone. You guys have a whole ranting thread where much worse has been said. God forbid that someone new complains about anything. I was just asking a legitimate question. I am (was) proud of my grades and I know that I'm capable, since I have taken almost 20 upper division biology courses with great grades. My lower level classes, where they pack us in like sardines, were the ones that I had issues with.

Basically, the rest of you attacked me while one person addressed my question. Thanks.

 

[DVMDream]

...how am I a troll? I never said anything to incite anger or to offend anyone. You guys have a whole ranting thread where much worse has been said. God forbid that someone new complains about anything. I was just asking a legitimate question. I am (was) proud of my grades and I know that I'm capable, since I have taken almost 20 upper division biology courses with great grades. My lower level classes, where they pack us in like sardines, were the ones that I had issues with.

Basically, the rest of you attacked me while one person addressed my question. Thanks.

Go re-read your post. You basically came up with a huge whiny rant about how the "drugged up pre-meds" messed up the curve in your undergrad classes and that they were "always cheating" and that you feel it is ridiculous schools don't take that into consideration. You didn't really even ask a question at all... it was like a big, huge whiny rant about how the pre-meds screwed you over... get over it and move on.

 

[bunnity]

1. Some vet schools do take undergrad into account.

2. You are going to be up against the best of the best in vet school. My classmates are smart as hell, although they don't do any cocaine that I'm aware of.

3. If people are actually cheating you should follow your school's honor code policy.

4. Otherwise quit worrying about other people and quit making excuses.

 

[Trematode]

I know a pharm student who cheated in undergrad.

But who cares about pharmacy anyway 😛

 

[tropictuco]

I would like to say that I know what you mean, since I graduated from the number 1 public university, but I can't. I never saw anyone else cheating or behaving inappropriately in my lower division classes. I'll admit I was lucky since I took all my lower-divisions besides Ochem II and both Physics courses at community college (let's hear it for transfers!), but let me tell you it was not a cakewalk to get A's in all those courses at my university (which I did). I was also lucky in my professor for Ochem (my best friend had the misfortune to get the one who literally flunked half the class), but I did receive a legitimate A, even without the curve. I have never taken adderall or cocaine. I can't even handle coffee.

I'm not saying this to talk about how wonderful I am--believe me there are other factors in my application I am very worried about. I just think my experience is very similar to yours and I wanted to tell you there are ways to succeed without being a druggie. And that's not to say you can't still succeed--my best friend referenced above worked her ass off at community college after graduation (and rejection from vet school for two cycles), received straight A's, and is now at Michigan State vet school.

I would simply suggest that if you don't get into vet school the round you want to, you need to be looking at yourself rather than the admissions process. Sure you might not like the way the game is played, and maybe it isn't fair, but if you want to play, you have to play by their rules. I might not consider it fair that even though I have countless hours performing vet-type procedures, they don't count as vet hours because they weren't under a vet. That doesn't mean I begrudge the people who have a ton of vet hours--obviously they got those legitimately and why would I even think otherwise? One thing I do know is that if I don't get in this round, I won't be sitting around complaining about it, I will be out there getting a crapton of vet hours to round out my application.

 

[kernel]

This screwed me over because of all the damn pre-med gunners with their buckets of Adderall and mountains of cocaine!

Listen to yourself.

I went to a large public university for the first 3 years of undergrad where the intro science classes were filled with pre-professional students. Sure, a handful of them abused psychostimulants, but the truth is that the majority of them were extremely driven and hardworking. I didn't understand it at first. I finally bucked up and learned that you get out what you put in.

Worry about yourself, not others. Making excuses isn't going to get you anywhere. 👎

 

[nyanko]

I get you. I often think a lot of the same things about grades and people who value them highly, but it's pretty uncouth to actually voice it because you and I are in the minority and our culture needs to have numbers to judge people by at every level, whether that number is a GPA or test score or income or whatever.

That said, the answer isn't really to be pissed at the schools. It's kind of a thing that you have to just accept and deal with, and you have to make yourself stand out some other way. Be the person who PROVES that grades are a stupid measure of learning. Learn *something* really well so you can roll your eyes at people who point out your C in general chemistry as a weakness. Learn the concepts of the material that are important and then do something better with the time you're not spending memorizing and regurgitating BS to get a 100% on the exam. It's not worth it to compare yourself.

 

[nyanko]

2. You are going to be up against the best of the best in vet school. My classmates are smart as hell, although they don't do any cocaine that I'm aware of.

the problem in a nutshell IMO is that we have to say "against" here.

 

[LetItSnow]

...how am I a troll? I never said anything to incite anger or to offend anyone. You guys have a whole ranting thread where much worse has been said. God forbid that someone new complains about anything. I was just asking a legitimate question. I am (was) proud of my grades and I know that I'm capable, since I have taken almost 20 upper division biology courses with great grades. My lower level classes, where they pack us in like sardines, were the ones that I had issues with.

Basically, the rest of you attacked me while one person addressed my question. Thanks.

Hahahahaha. You're attacking us after you ranted about a bunch of other students, attacking them and assigning responsibility to them for your grades, all the while implying that med students are somehow higher-accomplishing students than vet students?

Awesome. Nicely done, troll.

 

[bunnity]

the problem in a nutshell IMO is that we have to say "against" here.

OP sure seems to think of it that way.

 

[nyanko]

OP sure seems to think of it that way.

It doesn't matter as much to me in undergrad. Most of the people I was in lower division classes with were quite honestly toolbags and when you're actually applying to school you are being judged against other people. But you say "vet students" as in when you're already in.

I don't think it's unjustified to be frustrated and a bit angry about the way things are, it's just in how and where you express and direct that anger/frustration.

 

[abc22]

Uh...when did I ever imply that people on here were my "competition" in a negative sense?
I have nothing but respect for all of you who are in veterinary school and never once did I imply that any of you were inferior to pre-meds. I never intended to undermine your accomplishments or efforts. I'm not sure how you inferred that from my post, but I apologize if I offended you. It's just....if you have ever met the extreme cases of pre-meds with whom I have had the pleasure of taking courses, you would understand. These batsh-t crazies would sell their own parents to get into Harvard Med.

I didn't get bad grades in my lower divs... I received mostly Bs. Those would be adequate grades in other situations, but they also translate into an overall 3.1, which seems to be the kiss of death for veterinary admissions.

Anyway, I understand that it comes off as whining, but when the average Biochemistry major from UCLA graduates with a 2.89, how is it that this isn't taken into consideration at all? I really am just frustrated with this situation, not with any of you.

 

[wolfspeaker]

I'm trying to understand why having a bell curve 'screwed you over'. You never get a worse grade than you would have without a bell curve. On the contrary, your grade usually goes up, unless you were at the top already. Without the curve, your grades would have been worse. Please explain this further.

If you are complaining about gunners in Undergrad, you are in for a surprise in Vet School . There are still gunners there. Some are competing for Residencies.

You are ultimately responsible for you grades. The other students, pre-med or not, can not be blamed for the grades YOU received.

 

[olegovna]

Abc22, I just want to say that a 3.1 is not the kiss of death; don't let your GPA discourage you. You can balance out your GPA with awesome GRE scores and varied experience. Remember that every applicant is different. Make yourself stand out in other ways. As far as undergrad reputations go, all I know is that many IVYs have a notorious reputation for grade inflations. In these cases, it affects average applicants from those schools negatively. This doesn't apply to you, just throwing that out there. I also know that at my undergrad (which has a vet school) if you do poorly in a class (especially organic) and retake it at another college to get an "A," this often reflects badly on your application. So there is some consideration for rigor, not sure how much though. You haven't offended me, and I think your concerns are legitimate. Just don't let the competition get to you, or you will end up bitter. Everyone has different a path to vet school. For some this mean 4 rounds and for others, it means 1 round--the path doesn't make anyone better or worse! Keep a positive attitude.

 

[anotherbusybee]

I understand you, too. I come from the same situation, and I hate the grades conundrum, as well. But, on the other hand, my undergrad institution is also one of the leading research institutions in the world, and I've been given chances to pursue incredible opportunities that would NEVER happen at a community college. I took classes from AMAZING faculty - people who truly change their academic fields. The faculty carry on research that changes our understanding of the scientific and social world. They carry Nobel prizes, NSF Career Awards, Rhodes scholars, Fulbright scholarships, etc. These are folks that some other students would give their right arms just to be able to speak to them. BE PROUD OF THIS! You're at a great university because you earned your way there, and you're being rewarded in ways beyond just grades. It's more than grades. You're developing a new, more mature, more global way of seeing the world. You will be the change that we need. Grades are just numbers, and, if an admissions committee refuses to look beyond a trio of digits, then it may be best for you to NOT attend that grad/med/vet school, anyways.

They don't consider these supposed reputations because if you could handle upper-level science classes like the ones you'll be taking in vet school, you'd be doing okay in the class regardless of the curve.

Yes, but doing "okay" is not sufficient to get into grad/med/vet school. Doing better than everyone else is what gets you into vet school (hence, curves), and therein lies the crux of the OP's argument - that everyone around her appeared to be stronger competitors and that it's unfair that the strength of your competition is not acknowledged. It's an understandable frustration.

 

[Emiloo4]

If you are complaining about gunners in Undergrad, you are in for a surprise in Vet School . There are still gunners there. Some are competing for Residencies.

There are still cheaters as well 🙄

 

[kakurubird]

And if, as you say, you've done much better in your upper-level bio classes (which you presumably took later), then just apply smart. There are many schools that consider last 45 GPA just as much (or more or instead of) your cumulative GPA. Look into those and apply to them preferentially.

 

[abc22]

I know a pharm student who cheated in undergrad.

But who cares about pharmacy anyway 😛

I'm trying to understand why having a bell curve 'screwed you over'. You never get a worse grade than you would have without a bell curve. On the contrary, your grade usually goes up, unless you were at the top already. Without the curve, your grades would have been worse. Please explain this further.

If you are complaining about gunners in Undergrad, you are in for a surprise in Vet School . There are still gunners there. Some are competing for Residencies.

You are ultimately responsible for you grades. The other students, pre-med or not, can not be blamed for the grades YOU received.

A bell curve is only fair when the grades are normally distributed according to people's actual efforts. I don't know about everyone else's institutions, but cheating was rampant at mine. Everyone was so cutthroat....leave-notes-in-your-pocket-or-toilet-seat-cover-holder-and-go-to-the-bathroom, soda bottle label, written equations on their legs underneath their shorts, using fake IDs or switching exams before turning in to have others take their exams for them, etc. You don't know how many times I have sat down to a desk covered in penciled equations. How can a professor keep tabs on 350 kids?! Nor did it feel like they even gave a crap. I just hate the fact that my morals are a partial reason for my less-than-stellar GPA.

 

[DVMDream]

A bell curve is only fair when the grades are normally distributed according to people's actual efforts. I don't know about everyone else's institutions, but cheating was rampant at mine. Everyone was so cutthroat....leave-notes-in-your-pocket-or-toilet-seat-cover-holder-and-go-to-the-bathroom, soda bottle label, written equations on their legs underneath their shorts, using fake IDs or switching exams before turning in to have others take their exams for them, etc. You don't know how many times I have sat down to a desk covered in penciled equations. How can a professor keep tabs on 350 kids?! Nor did it feel like they even gave a crap. I just hate the fact that my morals are a partial reason for my less-than-stellar GPA.

And how many times did you speak up and say something to a professor, advisor or dean (if no one else would listen)? Look up the school's honor code, there are ways for dealing with cheating and steps you can take to report it. Instead after you are finally done with said degree and are now trying to get into a professional school it is all of the cheaters faults that your grade is lower, wait they aren't just cheaters they are "drug-addicted cheaters". I haven't met too many drug addicts that would have the focus to pass a class, even with cheating.

Even if you do have a lower GPA, it doesn't knock you out of the game, it just makes the game harder. You are just going to have to have a rather solid application in other areas (GRE, experiences, LOR). Yes, I get that it is frustrating that people cheat and get good grades and get into professional school, I personally know people who have done this, they tend to struggle once in professional school. Worry about yourself now and not what happened in the past. If asked about your low GPA at an interview you can't say "All the drug-addicted gunner pre-meds cheated and effed up the bell curve."

 

[LetItSnow]

I just hate the fact that my morals are a partial reason for my less-than-stellar GPA.

If your "morals" didn't include reporting this incredible amount of cheating you observed, then they aren't all that impressive.....

I'm still with my original assessment. You didn't do so hot, and now you've decided it couldn't have been YOUR fault - it had to be the fault of all those drug-addled pre-med students, darn them. Yeah. That excuse is going to fly with an admissions committee.

 

[Trematode]

I never took a class that had a bell-curve. I did about the same as you. I'm paying for it now.

I ranted about how unfair it is... but ranting isn't going to get me into vet school. I had to reflect upon the courses I did poorly in and come up with a plan to make it better.

 

[abc22]

........................so anyway, the original question that I had was about how schools can consider a grade of B in a GChem course at UCLA to signify less intellectual capability than an A earned in an "equivalent" course at another school that is known to be less rigorous.

It's disheartening that a B in Quantum Chemistry is deemed as not "so hot" when I worked my ass off in that class.

I get the whole deal with demonstrating ability through upper division division coursework blahblahblah but the sad truth is that some of us may not even make the cut to get to that point. It's just really irritating.

 

[dyachei]

........................so anyway, the original question that I had was about how schools can consider a grade of B in a GChem course at UCLA to signify less intellectual capability than an A earned in an "equivalent" course at another school that is known to be less rigorous.

It's disheartening that a B in Quantum Chemistry is deemed as not "so hot" when I worked my ass off in that class.

I get the whole deal with demonstrating ability through upper division division coursework blahblahblah but the sad truth is that some of us may not even make the cut to get to that point. It's just really irritating.

Some schools do entertain the notion of academic rigor. But it is hard to quantify.

I get that it sucks. I went to a private school and worked my butt off for my grades. If I had gone to some of the cheaper state schools, I would have been a lot better off grade-wise. But you made the decision to go to your school just like I did for mine. You can always apply elsewhere for a second bachelor's and do upper level coursework to show that you have the stuff.

 

[Lissarae06]

........................so anyway, the original question that I had was about how schools can consider a grade of B in a GChem course at UCLA to signify less intellectual capability than an A earned in an "equivalent" course at another school that is known to be less rigorous.

It's disheartening that a B in Quantum Chemistry is deemed as not "so hot" when I worked my ass off in that class.

I get the whole deal with demonstrating ability through upper division division coursework blahblahblah but the sad truth is that some of us may not even make the cut to get to that point. It's just really irritating.

Maybe you should have gone to an easier school.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Everyone at some point will have things stacked against them. How you deal with it is this issue.

What about those students working multiple jobs during college in order to pay for school?

Or those whose parents couldn't afford to send them to high-level schools?

Or those with learning disorders?

Or those with family illnesses?

Or those with families to balance in addition to the workload?

EVERYONE has problems that can hold them back. And yes, it's not fair. But that's how it is. It wasn't fair that I had to work part-time jobs all through veterinary school to help pay my bills because I couldn't get enough student loans. Not my fault that I didn't have notes and study materials passed down to me because I had few friends. Not my fault that I'm was going through major bouts of depression and eating disorders all through college. But my answer was to work HARDER, even though yes, it was "unfair".

If you really feel like your evidently toxic scholastic environment is something that held you back, talk about it in your personal statement like the rest of us, and describe how you managed to bounce back from it and succeed.

 

[PetPony]

If you really feel like your evidently toxic scholastic environment is something that held you back, talk about it in your personal statement like the rest of us, and describe how you managed to bounce back from it and succeed.

Think about changing the wording though.. 😉

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Think about changing the wording though.. 😉

Indeed.

 

[psilovethomas]

Some schools have a formula to decide who will get interviews or acceptances (if they don't interview). Ex- MSU uses sGPA, last 45, GRE, and whether or not you have a bachelors (not from where) to create a score. Then 2 people look at your file and can add points for things such as socioeconomic hardship, animal experience, vet experience, research experience, etc, but not where you went to school.
Grades are important, but it doesn't have to be what gets you into veterinary or medical school. Make other parts of your application stand out and explain how the rigor of your undergrad will prepare you for the rigor of professional school. But don't complain about how hard you had it because no one will take you seriously..

 

[LetItSnow]

........................so anyway, the original question that I had was about how schools can consider a grade of B in a GChem course at UCLA to signify less intellectual capability than an A earned in an "equivalent" course at another school that is known to be less rigorous.

Two points:

1) What's the alternative? They subjectively make a guess at which one they think is harder and then modify the 'value' they attach your grade to give you more credit for being in a course that you claim must be harder than another school you didn't go to?

How's that in any way fair? Can't you imagine all the people who would scream bloody murder because they felt they had gotten cheated by having their grade devalued?

2) Ultimately, you had complete control. You could have gone to a different school. You could have worked harder in the class to get a better grade. You could have chosen different classes. In the end, other people can impact your grade, but you are the single largest factor.

In pretty much every post you keep saying in one way or another that basically things aren't your fault. It's those pesky pre-med students. It's the unfair evaluation that doesn't give you credit for being at a harder school.

Your grades are your grades. Deal with it and quit whining about it.

 

[LetItSnow]

Then 2 people look at your file and can add points for things such as socioeconomic hardship, animal experience, vet experience, research experience, etc, but not where you went to school.

That's a nifty way to do it. I suppose it's similar to the way UMN does it (first hurdle is academic, but then all the 'subjective' measures are thrown in before finalizing the list of interviewees), but it sounds like they don't auto-cut people because of academics first. I like it.

 

[Megascops Asio]

........................so anyway, the original question that I had was about how schools can consider a grade of B in a GChem course at UCLA to signify less intellectual capability than an A earned in an "equivalent" course at another school that is known to be less rigorous.

The only thing I'm finding to signify less intellectual capability is the offensive arrogance of this statement.

I am proud of the GPA and large handful of As I have earned while taking my prereqs at my local community college. And why did I take these classes at a community college? Was it because I'm not as intelligent? No. Was it because I can't handle the rigor of a "harder" school? No.

No no, I've been working my butt off, 7 days a week, for the last 2 years in order to a) obtain necessary experience in the field, and b) be able to afford the necessary prereqs. As a non traditional student who already has an undergraduate degree, I'm not eligible for financial aid so that I can take more undergrad level classes. And even though I've been working like a lunatic, community college tuition is all I could afford.

Veterinary schools are institutes of higher learning. And they are full of people who understand that not everyone is going to be privileged enough to afford to attend these ivy league schools where they'll be competing against all these drugged-up pre meds. So, they're not all going to give special consideration to those more financially privileged.

I understand the need to rant about things that frustrate you. But I'd watch your tone when you do it. If there's one thing to learn from everyone's responses on this thread, its this: if you decide to pull the "I went to ivy league school, it was hard, waaaaah" approach on your application (which is exactly what you sound like here), the adcoms are going to laugh at you. Ivy League schools might be difficult, but there are people who earn As in their classes there. So, what's your answer going to be as to why you weren't one of them?

 

[hai1983]

Ivy League schools might be difficult, but there are people who earn As in their classes there. So, what's your answer going to be as to why you weren't one of them?

I think the OP went to UCLA, not an Ivy. Regardless, I agree with your general point.

 

[Emiloo4]

Make other parts of your application stand out and explain how the rigor of your undergrad will prepare you for the rigor of professional school. But don't complain about how hard you had it because no one will take you seriously..

👍 This is really great advice. And hopefully it won't be the only advice you take from this thread 🙄

 

[Museum Nerd]

Some schools do entertain the notion of academic rigor. But it is hard to quantify.

I get that it sucks. I went to a private school and worked my butt off for my grades. If I had gone to some of the cheaper state schools, I would have been a lot better off grade-wise. But you made the decision to go to your school just like I did for mine. You can always apply elsewhere for a second bachelor's and do upper level coursework to show that you have the stuff.

abc22
i understand that you think it is not fair....welcome to the real world. As my mom always told me when i was growing up and said "that's not fair" she would reply it well that depends on your perspective-whats fair to me may not be fair to you. The real question is what you are going to do about it. Ultimately you picked the school and the degree you pursued. So use those towards your advantage when you write your personal statement. I have no idea when you decided you wanted to be a vet and why you picked biochem as a major; do you have future plans to use those? If so say that. You may need to pursue a second degre either bachelor or masters in order to get a "higher gpa" but your grades are your grades. You never mentioned your GRE scores but there are schools that a high GRE will get you noticed. Admissiond comitteess are not stupid people if you have a high GRE and vet experience and a great last 45 hrs then look for schools that focus on that. They are looking for students that will succeed in vet school which means you need to show them you are capable of doing that. You need to come up with a plan that works with your grades.

 

[abc22]

Thanks for all of the great comments/advice guys. I do realize that I came off as [very] whiny. I already applied and actually didn't address any of my concerns in my ps/supplemental essays, but thanks for the tips anyway.

Please do not lecture me on the financial aspect of higher education. I worked part-time all throughout high school as well as throughout college to save money/pay rent and tuition. I actually JUST paid off the last cent of my student loans by myself.

AGAIN, I didn't mean to offend anyone. The quotes around the word equivalent were not placed there with any malice/arrogance/attitude. I placed them there to indicate that the schools themselves consider so-and-so course to be "equivalent" to so-and-so course.

I was not targeting community colleges AT ALL. The actual example that was on my mind when I typed that was that of a course/series equivalency decided by UCD from UCLA. UCD requires, for its Orgo requirement, CHEM 8A + 8B, which are lower division Orgo classes that only make up 6 units. I know for a fact that UCD has Chem 118 series, which is an Orgo series for bio majors and is upper division. None of the other UCs have lower division Orgos. For some weird reason, they consider the entire series of CHEM 30A + 30AL + 30B + 30BL + 30C to be equivalent to this 6-unit lower division Orgo series. HOW 19 units are considered equivalent to 6 units is mind-boggling to me. I suffered through Orgo for hundreds of hours, so that is really frustrating for me to accept.

There was no tone that I was trying to give off. Please don't take my words in the wrong way. I wasn't trying to offend anyone. Once again, I apologize if the message came off as sounding arrogant, but I guess that's what happens when messages are written on online forums.

 

[LMMS]

Perhaps it's because I'm in a foul mood; but I feel the need to chime in here.

Yes, it sucks to be you. You were able to attend a very good university and receive a top notch education. You were able to then take your degree and find a good paying job that has allowed you to pay off the debt you incured obtaining said top notch education. This has also apparently allowed you to find a way to finance any remaining courses and has allowed you to move forward in your pursuit of a veterinary education. Yes, yes, it sucks to be you.

As an individal who takes Adderall, never cheated, delt with the first four issues listed by WTF and worked their rear end off for much of their 30s only to be saddled with a mountain of debt with nothing to show for it in the end, I feel badly for you. Why? Because you can't see the good in what you have.

I'm going to kindly ask that when you do receive entrance to the program of your choice that you appreciate all you've been given and all you will receive. Also please try to remember that there are those of us who had our problems and don't blame the fact that we never got the chance to follow our dreams on others nor the factors we simply couldn't control. Sometimes life simply sucks and there's nothing that can be done about it.

 

[RagtimeWillie]

Perhaps it's because I'm in a foul mood; but I feel the need to chime in here.

Yes, it sucks to be you. You were able to attend a very good university and receive a top notch education. You were able to then take your degree and find a good paying job that has allowed you to pay off the debt you incured obtaining said top notch education. This has also apparently allowed you to find a way to finance any remaining courses and has allowed you to move forward in your pursuit of a veterinary education. Yes, yes, it sucks to be you.

As an individal who takes Adderall, never cheated, delt with the first four issues listed by WTF and worked their rear end off for much of their 30s only to be saddled with a mountain of debt with nothing to show for it in the end, I feel badly for you. Why? Because you can't see the good in what you have.

I'm going to kindly ask that when you do receive entrance to the program of your choice that you appreciate all you've been given and all you will receive. Also please try to remember that there are those of us who had our problems and don't blame the fact that we never got the chance to follow our dreams on others nor the factors we simply couldn't control. Sometimes life simply sucks and there's nothing that can be done about it.

Anyway, I too was an underachiever as an undergraduate. Doesn't mean ****! We change and evolve constantly as human beings, and adcoms know this. As much as we'd like to think how pressured we are to be perfect (or seem to be), or perform to high standards, we're just on this ride for a short time. There are no mistakes and hopefully no regrets. If you want, consider those as opportunities for personal growth. Look at the positive in everything, and concentrate on the present to ensure your future. You'll soon find out there is no time to dwell on the past when you're doing your best.

Good luck to everyone on their endeavors!

 

[abc22]

Anyway, I too was an underachiever as an undergraduate. Doesn't mean ****! We change and evolve constantly as human beings, and adcoms know this. As much as we'd like to think how pressured we are to be perfect (or seem to be), or perform to high standards, we're just on this ride for a short time. There are no mistakes and hopefully no regrets. If you want, consider those as opportunities for personal growth. Look at the positive in everything, and concentrate on the present to ensure your future. You'll soon find out there is no time to dwell on the past when you're doing your best.

Good luck to everyone on their endeavors!

Right?!

 

[bunnity]

Anyway, I too was an underachiever as an undergraduate. Doesn't mean ****! We change and evolve constantly as human beings, and adcoms know this. As much as we'd like to think how pressured we are to be perfect (or seem to be), or perform to high standards, we're just on this ride for a short time. There are no mistakes and hopefully no regrets. If you want, consider those as opportunities for personal growth. Look at the positive in everything, and concentrate on the present to ensure your future. You'll soon find out there is no time to dwell on the past when you're doing your best.

Good luck to everyone on their endeavors!

Of course there are mistakes.

 

[deli]

Right?!

You expected people to have sympathy for you, but it appears you have none yourself.

I attended a large UC, just like you, and have only myself to blame for my lower than average cGPA. Knowing this, I rocked the GRE, got great experience, recommendations, and took upper division science courses to have an upward trend. I tried to tailor my application to discuss my strengths, not my excuses/reasons for my lower than average grades. We'll see if it works.

 

[RagtimeWillie]

Of course there are mistakes.

let me clarify. mistakes are a negative connotation to what an optimist calls a learning opportunity. for example, every mistake i ever made in life has led me to the juncture of vet med.

well, i do regress with regards to matters external to ourselves. i hope you see the point i'm trying to make 🙂

 

[bunnity]

let me clarify. mistakes are a negative connotation to what an optimist calls a learning opportunity. for example, every mistake i ever made in life has led me to the juncture of vet med. nuff said!

When I had my first rabbit as a teenager I had her live outside and she got fly strike and died. While I "learned" from the situation, it was a mistake and my rabbit suffered because of it. You can't put an optimist jingle on everything. Trying to learn from mistakes after they happen is not the same as saying you should never regret something.

 

[RagtimeWillie]

When I had my first rabbit as a teenager I had her live outside and she got fly strike and died. While I "learned" from the situation, it was a mistake and my rabbit suffered because of it. You can't put an optimist jingle on everything. Trying to learn from mistakes after they happen is not the same as saying you should never regret something.

I do have one regret, and that is commenting in this thread!

or is that a mistake?🙄