Considering Neurosurgury. One thing

[Logic101]

Hello, members of SDN forums! Greetings from Maryland, which unfortunately had no snow whatsoever this year.
My name is "Logic101", and I've posted one thread before this, which was very similar because it also addressed my desire to become a doctor. That was a few months ago, and I'd like to thank everyone for the replies I recieved.
Now I'm a freshman in high school, and things have changed. I'm no longer the Straight A student I once was, and I found myself struggling to maintain an A in Chemistry, reeling in a dreadful B(+) during first quarter. Now I'm starting to lean in Pre-Calculus, which is unfortunate. But the dream of becoming a doctor in me has never faltered. I can't imagine myself as being anything else. Not IT, not engineering, and definitely not working in a fast food restaurant, but if I need it to fund my expenses, then f*** yes I'll take that opportunity. (Although my dad says that a career in Life Biology will make me eat these words.)
So I want to be prepared. I need to know exactly what I can do to become the doctor I want to see myself be in ~20 years. I know, this is making me sound like a wannabe fake doctor who doesn't have the willpower to do s***, but honestly I need the advice, experience, and encouragement of the people who came before me. We live in a competitive world, and I don't want to fall behind. I'll become a doctor if it kills me. I like it when other people smile. So I'm going to save people.
Once again, any advice is appreciated. If you want some info about me and my life, here you go:
-I'm a freshman in a very competitive high school, where, if you don't have straight A's and not the president of a few clubs, you're falling behind. Seriously. We even have a pre-med club; it was formed days ago.
-I have horrible grades Here are the courses I'm taking this year: Music Theory AP, Spanish 1 Honors (no GT in our school), Wind Ensemble, Pre-Calculus, Health/Physical Education, English 9, and Chemistry.
-I procrastinate a lot. As break is ending today; I feel the overwhelming force of all the things I didn't do, like study for things I could've improved upon, etc.
-I'm willing to try hard for the rest of my life if it means I can become a neurosurgeon. I'm immune to things that are hard and painstaking when I know that it will all pay off in the future.
-I don't have many talents. I play the piano and flute, and I'm not very good. I'm Chinese (lol) so I can speak Chinese quite well. I'm in student council, but I don't hold any positions.
Are there any colleges out there
I hope that you can aid me in my journey to be as successful as you all are. Please be as critical as possible; and don't be afraid to call me a dumba**.

Happy New Years from Logic101 ^_^

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[spiffysteve]

Here are some thoughts, in no particular order.

1. You're not a *******.
2. You clearly have the drive to be a doctor, but maybe try thinking shorter term for a while. This may help with feeling overwhelmed by responsibilities. Focus on getting good grades this semester. That is your job right now. The whole "becoming a neurosurgeon" thing is still years away. It will not help you at all to whittle away at your sanity by worrying about it at this point in time.
3. Figure out the procrastination issue. This could actually become a problem.
4. You don't need to be the president of the Pre-med club or the Key club to get into medical school. As long as you can get into a college and do well there, you're fine.
5. You're in student council, you play two instruments, and can speak Chinese. That's more than I and many others on here did in high school. They also qualify as "talents."
6. You're not a *******.

Based solely on this post and not knowing you at all in real life, you seem highly motivated and very smart, and thus very stressed. If you're worried about how you're doing in school, talk to your teachers (or a counselor at your high school) and figure out how to fix any problems.

EDIT: Also, unless you're trying to apply to a joint bachelors/MD program, medical schools will not really care if you got a 4.0 or a 3.0 in high school.

 

[WedgeDawg]

Your high school grades will have no direct relevance on whether or not you can become a neurosurgeon. It's a very long path to becoming one, so the best way to go about it is one step at a time. First get into a 4 year college. Your local state school is fine.

What you should do now is figure out why you might not be performing at the level you may want and take steps to correct that. Don't compare yourself to others. If you're planning on going into neurosurgery (even if you are probably about 10 years or so out from matching), you're going to have a really really bad time if you derive your self worth from how you stack up against other people.

There are people like you who dream of doing things like this, but the reality is that it is hard and many people end up finding things they like better, and that's great because then they won't be miserable. However, in the paraphrased words of an obscure neurosurgeon, "if it was easy, then everyone would do it".

Take life one step at a time and see how you can maneuver each part towards your goal. For you right now, that means keeping your head down and getting into a 4 year college.

@onceawolverine any additional thoughts?

 

[cyang55]

Here are a few things to consider:

Your grades and achievements in high school just needs to be good enough for your to get to your choice of college. Med school doesn't see or care about your high school accomplishments. HOWEVER, it could give you an insight to how well you will do in college. So if you are struggling now...you might not have an easy time in college. From my personal experience, I never studied in high school and got great grades, but I did have to study in college (which was a big change for me), but I took some time adjusting to the new challenges and ended up doing fine. But I knew people who couldn't handle the change and struggled getting good grades.

When you apply to med school, you're going to have to list your involvement in activities and clubs in and out of school. Unless you are planning on being in a band or be involved in an activity where you get to use your piano and flute skills..then you can't really list them, and they won't matter. So focus on things that you can put on your application such as involvement in specific clubs on campus or in the community. Volunteering is also VERY important, especially in the medical field. This will give you exposure and will show the medical school that you have seen what doctors do and are not turned off by their busy schedules, or the patients that they see, etc. By volunteering at hospitals or clinics, you will also have something to write about for your application.

Don't worry so much right now, you are only in high school. Just know that your grades and your activities in college is what matters. Use your high school science classes to help you gauge if you even like science or if you can do well in science classes. It seems like you have the determination to become a doctor. I would also recommend you be more open minded with your medical specialty. I'm not sure exactly why you want to be a Neurosurgeon in particular, but it is good to explore many medical fields.

 

[onceawolverine]

Hey Logic,

Everyone has posted really good advice for you here so far, but let me emphasize and reiterate a few things.
1) The student you are now is not the student you will be in the future. That's just a fact. As we go through different schooling systems with differing amounts of rigor and emphasis on different ideas, we evolve and adapt. So don't worry about not being the "straight A student you once were," because you need to adapt to your newer, more rigorous system.
2) Your grades in highschool have absolutely no bearing on your life the instant you're accepted to a 4-year college. Keep your nose to the grindstone and ensure that you get into (a decent-to-good) college.
3) Procrastination can be a very effective motivator for some people, but it sounds to me like it's not working out for you. Start practicing ways of eliminating procrastination from your life, and let's see if that helps pick your grades up.
4) With respect to ECs (I bring this up because of your comment about how your classmates are all prezzies of something), don't worry about what people around you are doing. Do you. Do what you're passionate about. When you find yourself intensely interested in something, follow that instinct, whether it's research, sports, outdoor activities, or whatever. Don't be the president of something just to be the president of something. Be able to rave about your ECs.

I'm willing to continue offering advice, but I'm about to hop on a plane. @Logic101 , do you have any more specific questions about some of these comments?

 

[da8s0859q]

I can only hope you save this thread and look back on it in a few years. And then again in a few more years. Not just for the overly anxious aspect of it, but also to see how much your neurosurgery plans change.

You're jumping so far ahead of yourself. Relax. One thing at a time. You will be fine.

 

[ValPak00per]

Let's start with spelling 'neurosurgury' right!

 

[Logic101]

Let's start with spelling 'neurosurgury' right!

I spelled it wrong. Sorry for my ignorance

 

[AlteredScale]

I'm gunna break it to you now op. Trying hard doesn't get you to neurosurgery. Being smart, diligent, and sacrificing a ton of time away from what you really want to do (go out to dinner with your friends, see your wife and kids, sleep, relax, binge of netflix) can help get you towards that goal. As others of have said above, you shouldn't let high school be the factor to sway you to the extent where you're about to say "I give up because I can't do it". High school is not representative of college and it seems to me that drive you have now because of the extreme competitive nature of your school now should stick with you in college.

You need to learn from your own study habits and you'll do it one way or another because the stakes are higher in college. You also will need the time in college to really hone in on your reasons for becoming a doctor because seeing people smile and saving people wouldn't fly with admissions. Obv the next three four years will be the time for you to develop your story.

Also try and keep your Chinese speaking skills on point.

Good luck op!

 

[DrMikeP]

You must make yourself as competitive as humanly possible or be ready to have an even harder time overcoming future obstacles. Neuro is one of the hardest specialties to get into. One or two years in highschool of struggle potentially won't keep you out of a top university but a poor Junior and Senior year will definitely. It's not too late, but it will be if you don't turn it around. Yes you could get into a top med school after attending a no name bottom ranked university but it will make chances even harder so don't!

Start preparing yourself to get into a major university that has a reputation for creating premeds who get into top med schools. That means talk to your hs counselor and see what those major universities require. If you have what smarts it takes for neuro you will be able to figure out the best universities to attend for premed with a bit of online searching.

Your ultimate goal is like climbing Mount Everest so prep is the key IF you have inate ability. As others advised focus on what you need to do now to prepare for getting into a top university and the rest will fall into place.

Best of luck

 

[Law2Doc]

...
Your ultimate goal is like climbing Mount Everest ...

This is a good analogy because neurosurgery, like climbing Everest sounds pretty cool when you are far away, but when you actually get closer to that decision point and the lifestyle costs and time involved most say "$&@& that!"

 

[WedgeDawg]

This is a good analogy because neurosurgery, like climbing Everest sounds pretty cool when you are far away, but when you actually get closer to that decision point and the lifestyle costs and time involved most say "$&@& that!"

And if you happen to get ensnared anyway, well, have fun

OP, highly recommend reading "When the Air Hits Your Brain" by Frank Vertosick. Great account of neurosurgery residency and the mentality behind the specialty. And one of my favorite books.

 

[DrMikeP]

Another good read: Another Day in the Frontal Lobe: A Brain Surgeon Exposes Life On The Inside by Katrina Firlik

 

[WedgeDawg]

Another good read: Another Day in the Frontal Lobe: A Brain Surgeon Exposes Life On The Inside by Katrina Firlik

I've read this one too, but it doesn't have the panache of When the Air Hits Your Brain. I would also recommend Do No Harm by Henry Marsh, but IMO, the overall impression of the three is WTAHYB >> DNH >>> Frontal Lobe.

If you're interested in neurosurgery, all three provide solid perspectives and are interesting reads, but I personally think they are of different quality.

 

[AlteredScale]

I've read this one too, but it doesn't have the panache of When the Air Hits Your Brain. I would also recommend Do No Harm by Henry Marsh, but IMO, the overall impression of the three is WTAHYB >> DNH >>> Frontal Lobe.

If you're interested in neurosurgery, all three provide solid perspectives and are interesting reads, but I personally think they are of different quality.

WTAHYB was the book that got me interested in medicine in the first place. Nothing has topped it IMO. There's a rawness to the writing that isn't there with a lot of other books.

Have you read Frank Vertosicks other books?

 

[WedgeDawg]

WTAHYB was the book that got me interested in medicine in the first place. Nothing has topped it IMO. There's a rawness to the writing that isn't there with a lot of other books.

Have you read Frank Vertosicks other books?

HE HAS OTHER BOOKS???

Edit: Just googled him... I had no idea. Definitely on my reading list now

 

[DrMikeP]

I've read this one too, but it doesn't have the panache of When the Air Hits Your Brain. I would also recommend Do No Harm by Henry Marsh, but IMO, the overall impression of the three is WTAHYB >> DNH >>> Frontal Lobe.

If you're interested in neurosurgery, all three provide solid perspectives and are interesting reads, but I personally think they are of different quality.

Totally agree!

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

 

[onceawolverine]

HE HAS OTHER BOOKS???

Edit: Just googled him... I had no idea. Definitely on my reading list now

Off topic. Reported to mods for further action.

 

[toothdriller2k17]

i usually don't post on hSDN but this definitely caught my attention

honestly man, just let your life play out. you can have all of these visions of grandeur in your mind, but life will take you in so many different directions. when i was in high school, i wanted to be a cardiothoracic surgeon. i shadowed anyone i could, volunteered at a hospital, did a mini-med school program, applied to combined ba/md programs (almost went to one). fast forward......13 years from when i was a freshman (good god) and i'm a 3rd year dental student. so, clearly i had a lot of things which swayed my opinions and a lot of changes happened.

not to say that you won't be a neurosurgeon one day of course, but my advice is to not take life so seriously and just let things play out. continue to do well in school and just see what happens. go to college, get a job, see if medicine is what you want to do. i had so many friends drop out of pre-med in college it's not even funny. if it gets to the 2nd or 3rd year in college and you're like, ''yup i can definitely see myself doing this and nothing else'' then by all means go for it. but, for now...just enjoy your youth, get your drivers license, get a beer (when you're old enough to drink) and just take it all in.

 

[DubVille]

i usually don't post on hSDN but this definitely caught my attention

honestly man, just let your life play out. you can have all of these visions of grandeur in your mind, but life will take you in so many different directions. when i was in high school, i wanted to be a cardiothoracic surgeon. i shadowed anyone i could, volunteered at a hospital, did a mini-med school program, applied to combined ba/md programs (almost went to one). fast forward......13 years from when i was a freshman (good god) and i'm a 3rd year dental student. so, clearly i had a lot of things which swayed my opinions and a lot of changes happened.

not to say that you won't be a neurosurgeon one day of course, but my advice is to not take life so seriously and just let things play out. continue to do well in school and just see what happens. go to college, get a job, see if medicine is what you want to do. i had so many friends drop out of pre-med in college it's not even funny. if it gets to the 2nd or 3rd year in college and you're like, ''yup i can definitely see myself doing this and nothing else'' then by all means go for it. but, for now...just enjoy your youth, get your drivers license, get a beer (when you're old enough to drink) and just take it all in.

Totally agree with this. Be a kid, give decent effort in school. Not trying to be an a****ole, but chances are you wont become a physician, let alone a neurosurgeon. Not because you will fail to achieve it, but because you will change your mind, or life will pull you somewhere else. You are a freshman in High School!!! I'd write a very similar response to a freshman in college or even a 1st year med student fixated on a certain specialty (ex. Neurosurgery). Enjoy life, hang out, don't commit any felonies. Play sports/music, kiss a boy/girl, you are only a kid once. I was a slacker in high school, got decent (about half As, half Bs, occasional Cs) took no advanced classes, etc. It had no bearing on where I am today and those are very fond memories. I played video games, hung out, dated, played sports, partied (fairly responsibly) and don't regret it for a second. I'd be an absolute mess if I was a robot since middle school. When I was your age I still wanted to be a professional golfer or basketball player (I'm 5'9" btw, was less then ).

Now I'm nearing the end of residency, life is nice. I'm a doctor and about to make some money and have completed most of the big hurdles and honestly about half of the time I'd trade places with my 16 year old self in a heartbeat. YOLO.

Edit: Sounds like you may have some cultural/parental differences than me. Obviously you shouldn't intentionally stir the pot at home, but I stand by my post.

 

[PhillyMed777]

Good advice being given on the thread. Just an important addition I think is necessary. OP, there are only about 200 neurosurgery spots in the entire country each year for incoming trainees. In the recent 3-4 years, it has become quite competitive too. I'm not saying you won't be able to do it. But you really need to take it a step at a time. Many equate getting into medical school (which is not easy itself) as getting any specialty they want before they start med school. It is far from that. good luck.