Considering Osteopathic School

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Would you turn down a M.D. seat for a D.O. seat?

  • Total voters
    103
There are actually TONS of threads on this topic so you should try using the search bar.
 
I would consider it if the price in schools were significantly different and it was a good DO school. Say 40k difference per year or something...
 
I only applied to a few state schools (one being DO) and am taking the DO acceptance because my #1 goal was to stay in Texas where tuition is cheap. Had I applied out of state to a bunch of MD schools, I may have been able to get an acceptance with my stats but was fine with going DO. Stats for DO schools are lower right now for several reasons (you can search SDN to learn more about this) but the established school's stats are approaching those of MD schools because of increasing competition. Ultimately though, if you don't care about the letters and put in the work, you have the opportunity to match pretty much whatever you want.
 
I heard a guy in my class turned down a top10 school just because he likes my DO school location.
 
I would turn down a MD acceptance if I receive a very generous scholarship at one of the two DO schools I am applying to (DMU is known for some descent scholarships). For your other question are we talking radiation oncology or medical oncology. Unless I'm wrong medical oncology should be relatively DO friendly since its only a moderately competitive IM fellowship (I myself am interested in oncology). Radiation oncology is a huge reach for MD and near 0 chance for DO.
 
I would take DO (at least the school I'll attend) over MD. However, I'm not interested in a real competitive specialty. That would be my one draw to MD over DO, was if I was wanting to pursue dermatology, urology... etc. Being a DO will better help me reach my personal career goals.
 
radkat101 said:
I only applied to a few state schools (one being DO) and am taking the DO acceptance because my #1 goal was to stay in Texas where tuition is cheap. Had I applied out of state to a bunch of MD schools, I may have been able to get an acceptance with my stats but was fine with going DO. Stats for DO schools are lower right now for several reasons (you can search SDN to learn more about this) but the established school's stats are approaching those of MD schools because of increasing competition. Ultimately though, if you don't care about the letters and put in the work, you have the opportunity to match pretty much whatever you want.
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I understand your decision there. Texas tuition is like $12000 compared to $40000-$60000 some where else. I am a little bit jealous 🙂
 
Just ONE example. I had a student who turned down Northwestern for us. She just liked the DO philosophy better.

Worry about getting into medical school first, then specialties.

Plenty of my grads get into competitive residencies. The mindset of " I am also wondering if going to a D.O. school will make me less competitive for an oncology residency?" will soon be a thing of the past too, with the AOA/ACGME merger.



Would anybody ever take a D.O. seat over a M.D. seat and why?

I am considering applying to some osteopathic schools this upcoming cycle, but I am certain I will get an acceptance from a M.D. school. So I would appreciate some feedback from others who know more about the D.O. experience and if it would be worth turning down a M.D. seat for a D.O. seat?

Because DO programs are more willing to believe that good doctors and medical students don't need both high MCAT scores AND high GPAs to succeed. We're also more willing to reward reinvention. A number of DO programs have acceptee stats equal to or better than some state MD or low-tier private schools.

I keep hearing over and over that both schools make you a qualified doctor, but why do D.O. schools have such lower acceptance stats?

I am not trying to ruffle any feathers, I am just a pre-med trying to figure it all out. Thanks for your help.[/quote]
 
Goro said:
Would anybody ever take a D.O. seat over a M.D. seat and why?

I am considering applying to some osteopathic schools this upcoming cycle, but I am certain I will get an acceptance from a M.D. school. So I would appreciate some feedback from others who know more about the D.O. experience and if it would be worth turning down a M.D. seat for a D.O. seat?

Because DO programs are more willing to believe that good doctors and medical students don't need both high MCAT scores AND high GPAs to succeed. We're also more willing to reward reinvention. A number of DO programs have acceptee stats equal to or better than some state MD or low-tier private schools.

I keep hearing over and over that both schools make you a qualified doctor, but why do D.O. schools have such lower acceptance stats?

I am not trying to ruffle any feathers, I am just a pre-med trying to figure it all out. Thanks for your help.
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[/quote]

Thank you! Underrated reason that I wish pre-med were more aware of just so they were more informed on there whole decision making process.
 
I voted yes because I would stay in California DO over MD schools in certain cities/states. I would have taken an MD spot in California over DO, except for Loma Linda.
 
I'm happy with my medical education and my residency placement, but I'd pick an MD school over a DO school if I could do it again.

Being a DO is a totally fine career choice and being a DO is not nearly as bad as SDN makes it seem.
 
I'm happy with my medical education and my residency placement, but I'd pick an MD school over a DO school if I could do it again.

Being a DO is totally fine career choice and being a DO is not nearly as bad as SDN makes it seem.
 
cliquesh said:
I'm happy with my medical education and my residency placement, but I'd pick an MD school over a DO school if I could do it again.

Being a DO is totally fine career choice and being a DO is not nearly as bad as SDN makes it seem.
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Why would you pick an MD school?
 
Preference for the DO philosophy

Location (school closer to family, easier for spouse /partner to get a job)

Cheaper

Had someone they know who went there and loved it
 
My old school MD father was previously against DO. With a bit of education and time, his bias evaporated. Now, he prefers that I attend my DO school over the MD program because of it's location, cost of attendance (for me, it's a HUGE difference), and the residency options are not that different!
 
Not to derail, but is the 'DO philosophy' people keep referring to the 'treat the whole patient' thing? Isn't that pretty just the 'physician philosophy' that's emphasized at both MD and DO schools?

I think the only downside to going DO is having to deal with the AOA. But, I have a feeling that won't be such an issue in the years to come.
 
I agree with pretty much everything everyone above mentioned. At the end of the day it comes down to the individual. It may be more difficult to get into the more competitive specialties or to match at top tier institutions, but who cares, you're still going to do what you love at the end of the day and be compensated the same amount. I had classmates who matched MD surgical sub-specialties who were told that it was impossible. Obviously it wasn't. Just look at the Match list for this year at some of the osteopathic schools
 
Probably, but she also had no regrets, did very well in our program and went on to a decent residency too. But, that is just one story. I've also had a good number of students who were very competitive for MD schools, even without AACOMAS' grade replacement, who had the classic encounters with the poorer side of allopathic medicine, and then discovered DOs and liked what they found immensely.

mcloaf said:
Whether it was cost, location, or family ties, there is more to that story.
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superdoc2.0 said:
Would anybody ever take a D.O. seat over a M.D. seat and why?

I am considering applying to some osteopathic schools this upcoming cycle, but I am certain I will get an acceptance from a M.D. school. So I would appreciate some feedback from others who know more about the D.O. experience and if it would be worth turning down a M.D. seat for a D.O. seat?

I keep hearing over and over that both schools make you a qualified doctor, but why do D.O. schools have such lower acceptance stats?

I am also wondering if going to a D.O. school will make me less competitive for an oncology residency?

I am not trying to ruffle any feathers, I am just a pre-med trying to figure it all out. Thanks for your help.
Click to expand...


Here's the story, you don't match to an Oncology residency per-se. If medical oncology is your ultimate goal (chemo, dealing with blood disorders etc) then you'll be trying to match to an internal medicine residency, then after 3 years of IM, you'll hopefully get into a 3 year Hematology/Oncology fellowship. Of course, you'll have to re-apply to the HemeOnc fellowship during residency and hope you get in. Who knows, by then you may change your interests and decide to become a Cardiologist, Nephrologist, Pulmonologist, Rheumatologist, Gastroenterologist etc. Or more likely, you'll decide that you can't take 3+ more years of GME and cut loose at the end of IM residency and work as a hospitalist or in an outpatient Primary Care setting.

As for your question about Radiation Oncology. It is competitive because it gives it's doc's a great lifestyle, with excellent pay, and they get to do interesting (though at times horrible) things. I remember during my surgery rotation, I spent an afternoon with the radiation oncologist . I was placing a temporary appliance into a woman's cervix so that she could go down to the Radiation clinic and get treatment. The procedure itself was nothing interesting, not a lot different than placing an IUD, but the idea that they could use a metal appliance to direct ionizing radiation to the site of her cancer was really amazing to me. I've had friends match RadOnc, they were all very smart people. They will have great career opportunities when all is said and done, with essentially 9-5 hours with no call, and incomes that probably average in the neighborhood of $0.5 million per year. That being said, radiation can be a horrible treatment modality, it can lead to some pretty severe side effects, even potentially causing new malignancies. I've met women in my HemeOnc rotations who've undergone breast radiation and have come down with non-healing wounds in the area. Sometimes these wounds don't even show up until years later. It's

As for me, I'm in your boat. I'm interested in Hematology/Oncology. I've done rotations in it and I have thoroughly enjoyed every moment. What I like about it is that while you do give people some horrible medications; and a lot of your patients don't survive their diseases. You also get to spend your days interacting with some amazing patients, many of whom are at a point in their life where they've had to face some sobering realities. I am always impressed how pleasant and easygoing many of them are. I suppose that when you get word that you have cancer, perhaps hear that your outlook isn't that great; you quickly learn to focus on what's important with the time you have left, and perhaps it gets easier to leave the small stuff behind? Some of the most legitimately positive and happy people I've met were either cancer patients, or people who had beaten cancer and were in for their surveilance visits. I found that energizing, and combined with the fact that I love Hematology and Cancer biology I think I've found my niche.

Anyway, as a DO graduate. If you do well in school and get a respectable score on your board exams you shouldn't have trouble matching into a decent IM program. From there you will start all over, needing to do well in residency etc. to be maximally competitive for HemeOnc fellowship. I've seen DO's in just about every HemeOnc fellowship I've looked at (I'm searching for University IM residencies that have HemeOnc fellowships in-house and a track record of matching DO's); and it is my understanding that chances are high of matching into fellowship after IM residency regardless (somewhere above 70% overall based on what I've seen).
 
Sublimazing said:
Why the loma linda hate?
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I wouldn't want to adhere to the religious code or feel comfortable in an environment overly-Christian. This is entirely personal preference. The university's curriculum itself is not a problem at all. Neither is the student outcomes.
 
SLC said:
Here's the story, you don't match to an Oncology residency per-se. If medical oncology is your ultimate goal (chemo, dealing with blood disorders etc) then you'll be trying to match to an internal medicine residency, then after 3 years of IM, you'll hopefully get into a 3 year Hematology/Oncology fellowship. Of course, you'll have to re-apply to the HemeOnc fellowship during residency and hope you get in. Who knows, by then you may change your interests and decide to become a Cardiologist, Nephrologist, Pulmonologist, Rheumatologist, Gastroenterologist etc. Or more likely, you'll decide that you can't take 3+ more years of GME and cut loose at the end of IM residency and work as a hospitalist or in an outpatient Primary Care setting.

As for your question about Radiation Oncology. It is competitive because it gives it's doc's a great lifestyle, with excellent pay, and they get to do interesting (though at times horrible) things. I remember during my surgery rotation, I spent an afternoon with the radiation oncologist . I was placing a temporary appliance into a woman's cervix so that she could go down to the Radiation clinic and get treatment. The procedure itself was nothing interesting, not a lot different than placing an IUD, but the idea that they could use a metal appliance to direct ionizing radiation to the site of her cancer was really amazing to me. I've had friends match RadOnc, they were all very smart people. They will have great career opportunities when all is said and done, with essentially 9-5 hours with no call, and incomes that probably average in the neighborhood of $0.5 million per year. That being said, radiation can be a horrible treatment modality, it can lead to some pretty severe side effects, even potentially causing new malignancies. I've met women in my HemeOnc rotations who've undergone breast radiation and have come down with non-healing wounds in the area. Sometimes these wounds don't even show up until years later. It's

As for me, I'm in your boat. I'm interested in Hematology/Oncology. I've done rotations in it and I have thoroughly enjoyed every moment. What I like about it is that while you do give people some horrible medications; and a lot of your patients don't survive their diseases. You also get to spend your days interacting with some amazing patients, many of whom are at a point in their life where they've had to face some sobering realities. I am always impressed how pleasant and easygoing many of them are. I suppose that when you get word that you have cancer, perhaps hear that your outlook isn't that great; you quickly learn to focus on what's important with the time you have left, and perhaps it gets easier to leave the small stuff behind? Some of the most legitimately positive and happy people I've met were either cancer patients, or people who had beaten cancer and were in for their surveilance visits. I found that energizing, and combined with the fact that I love Hematology and Cancer biology I think I've found my niche.

Anyway, as a DO graduate. If you do well in school and get a respectable score on your board exams you shouldn't have trouble matching into a decent IM program. From there you will start all over, needing to do well in residency etc. to be maximally competitive for HemeOnc fellowship. I've seen DO's in just about every HemeOnc fellowship I've looked at (I'm searching for University IM residencies that have HemeOnc fellowships in-house and a track record of matching DO's); and it is my understanding that chances are high of matching into fellowship after IM residency regardless (somewhere above 70% overall based on what I've seen).
Click to expand...

Thanks for the very imformative and helpful post!
 
I'm curious, superdoc, why are you so sure that you'll get into an MD school next year? I hope you're not about to be humbled.

With that said, I voted no. It's very circumstantial, though. Would I pay $30k extra per year to attend an MD school over a DO school? Probably not, but maybe. That's not to say that I'm not very proud of the school I chose to attend or the path I'm going down. It's just an easier road.
 
Mehd School said:
I'm curious, superdoc, why are you so sure that you'll get into an MD school next year? I hope you're not about to be humbled.

With that said, I voted no. It's very circumstantial, though. Would I pay $30k extra per year to attend an MD school over a DO school? Probably not, but maybe. That's not to say that I'm not very proud of the school I chose to attend or the path I'm going down. It's just an easier road.
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superdoc2.0 said:
I have good grades with a strong finish. I haven't taken the MCAT yet, but all my practice tests bode well. I have outstanding extracurriculars, a great story, a decent personality, and I will be applying to a lot of schools. You could be right, I might not be accepted. But, I am very confident in my chances.

I am curious why you think I will get humbled without knowing anything about me?
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I thought my personal statement was compelling. Then I found two actual personal statements on the internet that were used by applicants and they were exactly the same as mine. Studied/worked abroad? Check. Had a parent pass away from a long drawn out terminal illness? Check.

Look at all the upward trend threads, too. Most of us have upward trends.

PS - Oops. I may have confused you with another user who posted their stats in another thread that were decent but not MD material on the surface of it.
 
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superdoc2.0 said:
I have good grades with a strong finish. I haven't taken the MCAT yet, but all my practice tests bode well. I have outstanding extracurriculars, a great story, a decent personality, and I will be applying to a lot of schools. You could be right, I might not be accepted. But, I am very confident in my chances.

I am curious why you think I will get humbled without knowing anything about me?
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First off, I said i hope you aren't humbled, not that I think you will be. Good luck on your VR section.

Don't carry that entitled attitude with you on the interview trail. You've checked a lot of boxes, but that only gets you in the door. Good luck.
 
superdoc2.0 said:
Hey if you want to compare VR scores be my guest. Before I even started my MCAT studying I was getting 10-11's on VR.

Maybe you mistook my confidence for arrogance? I have not decided that I deserve an acceptance and I am not an arrogant person. I have studied the process thoroughly and I am confident in my chances. I am under the impression that medical schools want applicants with confidence, so if anything my confidence works in my favor.

I guess what touched me off about your post is that you assumed that I was some arrogant prick. For all you know I could be the secret son of Linus Pauling and Mother Teresa. It would have made more sense to me if you had asked me what me stats were and then made a judgement.
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OP, 60% of MD applicants (and DO applicants for that matter) don't get in and most have great ECs, compelling stories, and an upward trend.

Mehd School wasn't assuming you wouldn't get in, he was just pointing out the very real possibility, something that happens to tens of thousands of people per year, that you might not. Don't assume anything. There are people with 3.7 GPAs and 38 MCATs that don't get in - if you don't believe me, check the allo threads. Its not an insult, nor is it something for you to get ultra defensive about or make VR score comparisons about.

By the way, since you opened the door to comparing scores, yeah, so did I (so did a million others). I was also scoring that and above in all subjects on my FLs from the get-go. Most people in med school (MD & DO) are superstars. Apply (or I guess first take the MCAT), and see where you get in, then make your decisions.

As far as your question about picking MD vs DO: most people who pick DO over MD do it based on things like location, cost of living, etc. I doubt most people would rather go to a DO school in their state that costs double (or more) than what their state MD school costs, because in terms of distinctiveness there isn't a huge difference in curriculum. That said, I know many people that have chosen a DO school over an MD to stay close to home or be close to their sick parents, etc.

If you want a competitive residency and have the choice go MD, because it will be an easier road. If there's any other factors (i.e. cost, location, etc.), only you can make that decision.
 
superdoc2.0 said:
Hey if you want to compare VR scores be my guest. Before I even started my MCAT studying I was getting 10-11's on VR.

Maybe you mistook my confidence for arrogance? I have not decided that I deserve an acceptance and I am not an arrogant person. I have studied the process thoroughly and I am confident in my chances. I am under the impression that medical schools want applicants with confidence, so if anything my confidence works in my favor.

I guess what touched me off about your post is that you assumed that I was some arrogant prick. For all you know I could be the secret son of Linus Pauling and Mother Teresa. It would have made more sense to me if you had asked me what me stats were and then made a judgement.
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FWIW I did think that you came off as confident, which is important in the process, but I think Mehd had a good point in that admissions are sometimes rather unpredictable and confidence can be viewed as arrogance by some people.
 
superdoc2.0 said:
Hey if you want to compare VR scores be my guest. Before I even started my MCAT studying I was getting 10-11's on VR.

Maybe you mistook my confidence for arrogance? I have not decided that I deserve an acceptance and I am not an arrogant person. I have studied the process thoroughly and I am confident in my chances. I am under the impression that medical schools want applicants with confidence, so if anything my confidence works in my favor.

I guess what touched me off about your post is that you assumed that I was some arrogant prick. For all you know I could be the secret son of Linus Pauling and Mother Teresa. It would have made more sense to me if you had asked me what me stats were and then made a judgement.
Click to expand...

Yeah don't invest everything in practice exams. I took all the AAMC exams as well as some others and averaged high 30s and scored a 40 on one. Come test day I scored a 30 which was my lowest score on a FL. I ran with it btw, because I'm one of those who could have probably gotten into a MD program but had planned on DO all along.

At the end of the day there are a lot of variables with the actual test day that practice exams may not prepare you well for. It's good to be confident, but don't make future plans with a nonexistent MCAT score.
 
superdoc2.0 said:
Would anybody ever take a D.O. seat over a M.D. seat and why?

I am considering applying to some osteopathic schools this upcoming cycle, but I am certain I will get an acceptance from a M.D. school. So I would appreciate some feedback from others who know more about the D.O. experience and if it would be worth turning down a M.D. seat for a D.O. seat?

I keep hearing over and over that both schools make you a qualified doctor, but why do D.O. schools have such lower acceptance stats?

I am also wondering if going to a D.O. school will make me less competitive for an oncology residency?

I am not trying to ruffle any feathers, I am just a pre-med trying to figure it all out. Thanks for your help.
Click to expand...


I'm pretty sure there are not any "oncology residencies" anyway. You would do an IM residency then do a oncology fellowship. IM residency is not competitive. You will be fine as a DO
 
Top tier IM is out of reach for DOs. Approximately 2/3s of DOs who apply for acgme hem/onc match.
 
cliquesh said:
Top tier IM is out of reach for DOs. Approximately 2/3s of DOs who apply for acgme hem/onc match.
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How many AOA positions are there? Now that it'll be ACGME, it is a very viable way to get into medical oncology.
 
This would be a much different thread if it were posted in pre-allo. This thread is bleeding bias.
 
superdoc2.0 said:
Well I guess I should read the rules more closely. My bad.
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1396241385345.jpg
 
I don't think that any applicant should be confident about their chances to MD OR DO before taking the MCAT. It really just depends on how you do that one day that you are setting in the prometric seat and push the start button.

I imagine that you should not go into medical school with your mind set on one specialty, especially a sub-specialty. It seems to me that it is similar to choosing an undergrad major even though you think you will go to medical school. If you don't make it to medical school then you should at least be happy with your major and the post-grad opportunities with it. Likewise, hopefully you enjoy medicine and longterm treatment if you go into IM in the unfortunate situation that you don't get into the fellowship you think you might enjoy.
 
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