Contract questions

[creek]

Hi, I have some questions about contract. I am looking for lawyer to review, but want to see if anyone has insight...

- The term said all bonus collections will cease after termination. Is this normal? Usually billing is lagging behind, especially with PI cases, I will lose a lot of collection this way.

- liquidated damages. basically I need to pay the cost of revenue loss and recruitment fee for new physician if i quit. Is this fair? t

A lot of pitfalls for signing contract, any opinion is appreciated, thanks!

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[lobelsteve]

Sounds like a double screw job. I wouldn’t sign that. Hey, wanna buy a time share?

 

[90dayMD]

Hi, I have some questions about contract. I am looking for lawyer to review, but want to see if anyone has insight...

- The term said all bonus collections will cease after termination. Is this normal? Usually billing is lagging behind, especially with PI cases, I will lose a lot of collection this way.

- liquidated damages. basically I need to pay the cost of revenue loss and recruitment fee for new physician if i quit. Is this fair? t

A lot of pitfalls for signing contract, any opinion is appreciated, thanks!

"- liquidated damages. basically I need to pay the cost of revenue loss and recruitment fee for new physician if i quit. Is this fair? t"
That is a massive red flag. You really don't know what kind of "damages" they can ask for, and for how long? and who knows how much recruitment fees for a new physican are. Recruiters can at times get like 20k plus for a new physician.
Sounds like a douche group.

Do they say if in how long you quit you'd be responsible? Sometimes they want you to stay for a 1-2 years because it's expensive to recruit. But still seems like douche. If it's a good group most people would want to stay so that clause seems super douche to me.

The first clause also seems douchey. What is collections lag behind several months? You will be losing out on a ton of $$.

I'd see if they can take that out, if not, I'd keep looking.

 

[geauxg8rs]

"- liquidated damages. basically I need to pay the cost of revenue loss and recruitment fee for new physician if i quit. Is this fair? t"
That is a massive red flag. You really don't know what kind of "damages" they can ask for, and for how long? and who knows how much recruitment fees for a new physican are. Recruiters can at times get like 20k plus for a new physician.
Sounds like a douche group.

Do they say if in how long you quit you'd be responsible? Sometimes they want you to stay for a 1-2 years because it's expensive to recruit. But still seems like douche. If it's a good group most people would want to stay so that clause seems super douche to me.

The first clause also seems douchey. What is collections lag behind several months? You will be losing out on a ton of $$.

I'd see if they can take that out, if not, I'd keep looking.

Avoid. They are already going in with the thought that you are leaving. Likely because they will treat you like crap and you will want to leave. Avoid. I wouldn’t even try and negotiate. You can’t change their stripes

 

[cowboydoc]

"- liquidated damages. basically I need to pay the cost of revenue loss and recruitment fee for new physician if i quit. Is this fair? t"
That is a massive red flag. You really don't know what kind of "damages" they can ask for, and for how long? and who knows how much recruitment fees for a new physican are. Recruiters can at times get like 20k plus for a new physician.
Sounds like a douche group.

Do they say if in how long you quit you'd be responsible? Sometimes they want you to stay for a 1-2 years because it's expensive to recruit. But still seems like douche. If it's a good group most people would want to stay so that clause seems super douche to me.

The first clause also seems douchey. What is collections lag behind several months? You will be losing out on a ton of $$.

I'd see if they can take that out, if not, I'd keep looking.

I’ve never a lawyer refer to a contract terms as douche , let alone 3 times, but I think it seems a reasonable summary of the terms posted.

 

[creek]

Thanks everyone!

No, it didn't mention after how long i should pay the liquidated damage

Another weird thing is the contract does not cover Tail insurance...

Also, Non compete says x miles of ALL their offices. As this practice has so many offices, this will practically put me out of work if i quit. Is this re-en forcible? I hate all these non-compete. The IT engineers can work anywhere, why medical professionals have to comply with this ???

 

[soccrwz]

ask for PI payments as these will be delayed, that would only be fair
primary site only for noncompete
Tail often not covered
Cover cost for your replacement... thats insane
ask for relocation costs if you leave

 

[creek]

Thank you all, everyone is awesome

 

[AdminPatient]

ask for PI payments as these will be delayed, that would only be fair
primary site only for noncompete
Tail often not covered
Cover cost for your replacement... thats insane
ask for relocation costs if you leave

This is good advice

Agree with primary site- Also push for waiver if terminated without cause. What they are proposing isn’t enforceable but would be a headache for you to fight back/future employers in the broad catchment radius may be reluctant to hire you to avoid a cease and desist letter from your former employer

Absolutely have an attorney review. I’ve never heard of liquidated damages. We typically ask physicians to repay a prorata portion of their sign on/relocation stipend or tail payment (if we covered it for the physician) if they leave within two years, but you should not be responsible for foregone revenue if you leave.
You could also try to negotiate a post termination cutoff date for calculating productivity (eg cutoff for measuring your collections is 60 days post departure to account for accounts receivable lag).

Also be sure to ask about tail costs. If they provide a cheap policy the tail could be significant. In my opinion, asking this question doesn’t make you look like you are looking ahead to your next job, it makes you look business minded (unless whoever is hiring you is short sighted)

 

[geauxg8rs]

Thank you all, everyone is awesome

I would only agree to the non compete for one office that you primarily work for 3 days a week. If it is a different office every day let them pick one office. But i already think this group knows any logical person will not stay. I think you should look elsewhere

 

[deleted880510]

is it normal to still being paid a percentage of collections 6-12mos. after one leaves a job? i also am in a similar situation and do a lot of auto/PI. sometimes we dont collect for a year later

 

[soccrwz]

They had contract review for some big national society and mentioned this, Seems logical you should collect for the work you did. Also given covid, be aware of any force majeur/act of god clauses

 

[creek]

Thanks again everyone

 

[90dayMD]

I’ve never a lawyer refer to a contract terms as douche , let alone 3 times, but I think it seems a reasonable summary of the terms posted.

Lol, my frankness is both my strength and my weakness! Technically 4 times if you count "douchey."
As someone working on setting up a concierge type group in a different specialty, and crunching numbers in order to pay physicians I will hire fairly, I can never understand why some physicians feel it's ok to screw over other physicians. As cheesy as it may sound, shouldn't we all be in this together? Don't groups want to pay a fair rate, so that other physicians stay in the group and there isn't massive turnover? What do I know, but that's how I will be doing things.

 

[90dayMD]

Thanks everyone!

No, it didn't mention after how long i should pay the liquidated damage

Another weird thing is the contract does not cover Tail insurance...

Also, Non compete says x miles of ALL their offices. As this practice has so many offices, this will practically put me out of work if i quit. Is this re-en forcible? I hate all these non-compete. The IT engineers can work anywhere, why medical professionals have to comply with this ???

Non-competes are enforceable depending on the state. Some are, some are not. But if it's a multi office group, unless it's a big state/city, you might run into problems if you quit. I know of an Anesthesiologist whose group got sold and he didn't like the new terms, either quit or got fired, and couldn't find employment due to his non compete.

Tail insurance not being covered is not that unusual unfortunately.

 

[90dayMD]

This. I used to work for a multi office/hospital/facility type group, and I asked my non compete to only involve the main sites that I covered frequently, and to not include sites that I never worked at or rarely covered. They were ok with that.