crna making 120000 to 180000

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Here's the article...

<a href="http://careers.usatoday.com/service/sct/local/content/news/switching/2002-05-14-nurse-anesthetists" target="_blank">http://careers.usatoday.com/service/sct/local/content/news/switching/2002-05-14-nurse-anesthetists</a>

It's a shame that it has gotten this far.

Interesting quote by the CRNA in Maine.

-TRG
 
thanks for posting that article, does anybody else feel that anesthesiologists are going to see their salary fall even lower?
 
in the recent US news and world report issue for best graduate schools, they state that anesthesiology is one of the three hottest specialties to go into. the reason being that people made lots of money in the stock market during the 90s and are electing to have more cosmetic procedures done thus increasing the need for anesthesiologists. i think as the number of surgeries increase in the US the demand for anesthesiologists will increase and so too their salaries. crna's provide a valuable service but i don't think they can make anesthesiologists obsolete. as a physician you always will have more training than a nurse and a better understanding of the inner workings of body which will help in providing better care for your patients.
 
wow, sure hate to have emergency surgery in some rural area in Iowa, Nebraska, Idaho, or Minnesota!
 
I have a close friend who just graduated from cRNA school. He is, literally, competing with MDAs for jobs and - surprise! He just landed a job in Kansas City making $140K/year with $25K/year being put away in retirement for him.

I'm not saying that MDAs are going to be losing jobs in the near future, BUT finding good jobs in urban areas is going to get tougher and tougher. Period.
 
I guess I'm just an idiot for spending nine years of my life and a small fortune on my education.
 
its simply ridiculous, CRNAs in a little town where my uncle is an internist make over 200K....more than the FPs, peds, psychs and internists. and all they have is a couple of years of graduate education. And go look around on the websites of CRNA schools, they spend most of the time in theory.....learn pharm physio etc. during the CRNA courses!!! Compare that to a MDAs 4 years of clinical work and his sound background in the basic scienses and intermal medicine. CRNAs donno anything and they are avoided when it involves complicated procedure. U penn has established that mortality is higher if CRNAs work unsupervise...not suprised, nurses doono enough pham, micro and internal med.

Besides CRNAs were supposed to drive down the cost of healthcare...not become competition to physician salaries. These guys are so rotten they do not want the training of anesthesia assistants so that they can keep making their money......and have no concern for quality of patient care. Most are in it for money and now becoming a CRNA is nice shortcut to make a physicians salary without medical school.

Funny...even Canada does not have CRNA....god save america from the attack of the para medicals. Soon we will have people taking 2 years masters to become primary care physicians( like the greedy NPs want to ).
 
I would put myself up against any anesthesiologist in the country," says nurse anesthetist Roman Dashawetz

Comments like this are exactly the type that cause alot of dissent among physicians. crna certainly has a big role, but there are simply not as trained as a physician.

I am personally offended to hear a nurse talking like that and am sure that a CA-2 can better manage any anesthesia problem better than any type of nurse "practicioner"

sounds like this guy has med school envy
 
•••quote:•••Originally posted by ESU_MD:
•I would put myself up against any anesthesiologist in the country," says nurse anesthetist Roman Dashawetz

Comments like this are exactly the type that cause alot of dissent among physicians. crna certainly has a big role, but there are simply not as trained as a physician.

I am personally offended to hear a nurse talking like that and am sure that a CA-2 can better manage any anesthesia problem better than any type of nurse "practicioner"

sounds like this guy has med school envy•••••I think that this guy is probably an exception, and there is no need to have a fit over it. MDA's still make a lot of money, and always will. There will always be enough jobs - too many in fact, which is why small towns need CRNA's to fill the gap.
 
I've run into a fair share of cocky CRNAs. Yeah some of them are good, b/c they've done a procedure 300 times. It's situations that are 1 in 5,000 that i'm worried about. Situations where unexpected things happen....

I've even had one tell me that I was wasting my time going to med school. 😡

A lot of anesthesiologists are sell-outs too. I had one tell me that he never plans on doing a case all by himself b/c he'll just have his CRNA (MAN-BITCH) do it for him. What's up with that??
 
•••quote:•••Originally posted by drfeelgood:
•
I had one tell me that he never plans on doing a case all by himself b/c he'll just have his CRNA (MAN-BITCH) do it for him. What's up with that??•••••It is exactly that same attitude that got us where we currently are.

Just wondering, but how much do AA's make? (Anesthessia assistants)....They serve the exact same purpose as a CRNA in the majority of situations. My guess is not as much as CRNA's make....why is that? They're doing the exact same thing...

-TRG
 
I for one think it would be great to monitor 2-3 CRNA's doing healthy cases while picking up 1 complex case a day. They can earn me as much as they want!
 
Why do people get so offended that a nurse specialty is making more than some doctor specialties? Some lawyers make much more than doctors with a similar amount of schooling time to CRNA's. Bill Gates is raking in the dough without even doing college.

I think all specialties should be paid more, including doctors. However, many of the other health care professions really have gotten the short end of the stick salary-wise for a long time. They deserve just compensation too. I don't begrudge someone making good money "just because they didn't go to school as long as a doctor". Fact is some specialties get paid a lot more. I thought people weren't going into this for the money, but because of their love of the profession?

Flame suit on..
 
Yeah, I just get mad when they can provide more to their children and spouses.

It seems like the #1 graduate from HMS in his fourth year of residency will make less then a common crna. THAT is wrong.
 
•••quote:•••Originally posted by johnM:
•MDA's still make a lot of money, and always will. There will always be enough jobs - too many in fact, which is why small towns need CRNA's to fill the gap.•••••See below
 
KIMYA.... (Hope you got your Asbestos Suit on cuz here it comes!!!!)

It's not all about money. It's about the way Americans have settled for the CHEAPER ALTERNATIVE. we're being invaded by middle-men. I heard Kaiser is now starting Nurse Endoscopy school...So watch out all you budding GI DOCS. What next??? Residency training for the primary-care PA??? There are plenty of jobs that pay more than Medicine, I'm not arguing that. I get pissed of when wannabes try to play doctor.

Why not fly on a plane flown by an Certified Pilots Assistant????? Hell...anyone can land an aircraft. Wouldn't that be cheaper??? I'm glad the ASA is finally fighting back against the CRNA lobby. :clap: :clap:
 
•••quote:•••Originally posted by PainMan:
•I for one think it would be great to monitor 2-3 CRNA's doing healthy cases while picking up 1 complex case a day. They can earn me as much as they want!•••••I am suprised at these two very uninformed and illogical comments. The advent and rise of the CRNA is inarguably a BAD thing for anesthesiologists. It's basic economics people... if demand for CRNAs goes up (and it will/is b/c they are still "cheaper" than MDs) while their supply stays the same, their salaries (i.e. their "price" in economic terms) will go up. Period. It's an economic certainty.
Now let's analyze PainMan's comment... while he covers that ONE complex case and simultaneously monitors 3 CRNAs doing 3 other cases, 3 MDs are out of a job! Back to Economics 101... this results in demand for Anesthesiologists going down... so if their supply were to the stay the same...??? See where I'm heading with this people? Either Anesthesiologists #s will stay the same and their salaries will go down, OR, they will have to cut back on available positions to keep the salaries at their present level. If this trend continues, it's just a matter of time...
This article is VERY disturbing to me. Enough so that although I have until now been giving serious consideration to Anesthesia for next year for myself, I'm going to have to follow this trend closely and may ulimately be disuaded from it. Damn RNs.
 
It's people like PAINMAN who are selling our profession out!!!!

My stupid Family Doc just hired 3 PAs to man his three clinics. (freakin sellout)
 
•••quote:•••Originally posted by drfeelgood:
•It's people like PAINMAN who are selling our profession out!!!!

My stupid Family Doc just hired 3 PAs to man his three clinics. (freakin sellout)•••••It's really not about "selling out." It is, as many things are, basically a matter of money. If CRNAs can indeed perform just as well as MDs in most situations and their salaries are less, it's only logical that the powers that be would prefer their services in those situations... and I doubt that that money being saved is going to the Make-A-Wish Foundation either.
 
I think part of the resentment is that nothing about the profession of medicine seems sacred anymore. CRNA's are NOT part of the medical profession, yet in essence, are practicing medicine. Same goes for PA's and nurse practioners. Ultimately, the public is going to get used to this para-medical care, which IS sub-standard no matter what the circumstances. A CRNA argues, 'I would put myself up against any anesthesiologist in the country', but that simple statement is ignorant, in that a vocational course could ever equal the rigours and training of 7+ years of university and many more years of residency! While you're at it, you might as well say goodbye to FP's and peds as your primary care provider. You'll be taking your kids to see their NP (who'll prescribe anything he/she pleases) with LITTLE understanding about the pharmacology or pathophysiological processes involved. Unbelievable...
 
Look for nurse surgeons in the future. Heh heh
 
Nurses are dumb period. They probably have lesser GPA and stuff than people going into pure scineces, computers, humanities etc. let alone be in comparision with doctors , dentists and lawyers. And they go about saying crap like they can match anyone....then why dont those smartasses come up with ground breaking research. The reason anesthesia became safer in the last 20 years is not because of some stupid CRNAs but because more MDs entered anesth from 60 onwards. The groundbreaking work has been done MDA. CRNAs are the OR scutmonkeys who now wanna ape their creators. Theyinfact have the guts go about doing proganada that nurses were the first to do anesthesia when medical historians clearly give that credit to dentists and docs. Well I guarentee you their infinitely inferior IQs will not survive against MDA......the docs will emerge successful. The US has a tendency to be reactive instead of proactive. When they become the butt of ridicule of the rest of the world for letting para professionals take over they will do something about it. The ass of a CRNA who said he could be as good as say some pioneers of anesthesia, soem of the guys who have done amazing research in say cardiac an, pain etc. is a fool to the core. He talks crap. The guys at Hopkins, Wash U etc. in the research dept. of anesth are sterling. They are geniuses ( many of them are MD, Phds) and a lowly nurse with 2 years of grad education( and I bet they only know the pharm of anesthesia, these guys dont have an idea of many commmon microorganisms, let alone complex physio and path)says he is as good. Well thats free speech ( sounds like saddam saying he can finish the US). Well the ASA wants to make a slight oversupply of MDA...cos shortage means a firmer footing for CRNAs. All medical professionals must join to rid the medical profession of wannabes.
 
I don't know. They may be stupid, but at least they have enough common sense to unionize.

It kind of stupid that a 30 year old crna can be making more then a fellowship doctor of the same age. But the fault like with those who believe they should be brutalized. Those meds who suffer from some sort of battered wives syndrome.

So, no, nurses aren't stupid. They seem to have more common sense then some young doctors.
 
So, no, nurses aren't stupid. They seem to have more common sense then some young doctors.

As said by RYO OHKI

Well doctors are sensible enough to spend a decent amount of time to learn their stuff. To be competent. Docs do not believe in taking the back door to practice med( thats why we became docs.). Docs do not go into medicine cos they were rejected in nursing school( as it is soemtimes the other way). If all the physicians no matter what their field get together and work at keeping these half doctors from takin over we can keep quality of care better here. Or soon we are gonna have midwives instead of OBG, NPs for primary( imagine our insurance carriers saying we have to get clearance from a PNP instead of PCP for a referral!!) and god forbid nurse cardiologists and OR nurse surgeons.
 
Coming from a paramedical professional, you guys are absolutely right!!!!! That is why I have left the PA profession and 6 figure salary to head back to school to become a physician. PA's were really the first paramedical profession to compete with or shall I say do the job that only physicians previously did. The PA concept was superb. It was meant to train a person to go work like a physician in a place where physicians would not work. And the CRNA thing was created to do the same thing. However, legislation got out of control, and now you see the vast majority of CRNA's and PA's, NP's working right where physicians would normally work, but for lesser money. The physicians that use PA's love them because they are competent and make them tons of money. I made about 100K per year and brought in about 400K a year. What phycisian would want to pay a physician to do this when he can make this kind of money off a PA? The creation of the professions like PA's and CRNA's was justifiable, but as always, while physicians slept, these people came in and put their lobbying power together to relax their practice rights. What is important to know is that these groups of paramedicals do provide a valuable service in areas where they are NEEDED(like in the military and in rural areas). The reality of it though is that most of them don't work where they are needed. The lesson to be learned here physicians is that when you give one solitary inch to non-physicians, they will take a mile. Physicians can't take back what they have already given away, but they can keep other groups from canabalizing their entire practice rights. Stop the pharmacists now before they decide to be practicing medicine at K-Mart, and stop psychologists from prescribing. Don't give another inch.
 
I wholeheartedly agree, and coming from an allied-health profession, I know the desire is strong to expand one's professional role and profile. When practicing pharmacy, the greatest passtime was saying 'this doctor was crap or that guy doesn't what he's doing.' Fact of the matter was, we didn't know what the hell we were talking about. I learned to be a pharmacist in pharmacy school, not a doctor. I'm learning to be a doctor now, and ONLY medical school can do that.
 
Yes, nurses are smarter then these residents/med students who enjoy or say they will enjoy getting brutalized with 80 hour work weeks and slave wages. How else can you explain the fact that a MD(!) 4th year resident earns about as much as an RN. Whose services are worth more? Pure naivety on the part of some young docs.

I think we're arguing differents points.

Nurse brain surgeons. I would personally like to see that.
 
The reason that we got into this situation in the first place is because the old slow docs believed that they were invinsible and that no one would ever dream of stepping up and doing the job that they did without a medical license. Now, the younger generation of docs is paying for their laziness...and they think that we've got it easy...maybe they should share their savings account
 
I am not really sure how it works, but I bet that these nurses and PA's would be less inclined to practice if they they had to shell out for malpractice insurance to cover themselves. As of right now, most of these allied health professionals are the responsibility of the supervising physician. We need to all be smart when we get out of med school and protect ourselves. For some reason or another, medicine has been targeted, and we must react appropriately. How? I am not sure, but I am all ears. 😡
 
I just want to say that I agree with all that is being said - particularly with you Halothane. As in incoming medical student I am already wary of these issues and won't forget s I continue on through my career. We all need to see to it that this sort of crap doesn't go too far, if it hasn't already. 🙁 😡
 
I've been following this topic and find it very interesting. Now that we are on the issue of malpractice insurance (hot-topic lately) I was wondering why these paramed folks don't have to pay even heftier premiums?

read: less knowledge/experience = higher risk ? no? 😕

Just curious
 
drfeelgood-
there are already residency programs for p.a.'s and have been for over 20 years. residencies are in surgery,ortho, emergency medicine, psych, peds/neonatology, derm, IM, etc. most are 2 years with a few 1 yr programs out there. most programs are at major medical centers(hopkins, yale etc.) and have the pa doing the same curriculum as the pgy1 and pgy2 residents.
see this site for the american academy of postgrad p.a. programs for a list:
<a href="http://www.appap.org/index1.html" target="_blank">http://www.appap.org/index1.html</a>
 
Ryo-Ohki,

Unionizing has absolutely nothing to do with "common sense". But then, if you knew anything about the practice of MEDICINE, you'd know that! The purpose of unions is to gain bargaining power by using the ultimate threat of strike. Physicians haven't unionized because we won't strike. How would you feel if you or a loved one needed urgent care but the doc said, "sorry, I'm on strike"! Our oath (committment to humanity) prevents us from withholding care for the sake of money. Nurses, on the other hand CAN strike since there are always physicians available to handle care if necessary.
 
First off, halothane, since nurses are stupid, why do we have them??j\w Answer that one for me. Because I'm pretty sure you "Residents" aren't going to go to the floor and wipe butts are you? Another thing, why do you guys keep brining this debate up anyway? All you do is make yourselves look stupid b\c your are arguing.

If you come around my area and look for a MD to do your anesthesias you are SOL,b\c there aren't many. They've all quite becuase their salaries were dropping, aww poor thing, can't afford their BMWs anymore 🙄 CRNAs have the market around here. Starting salaries are around 200K + benefits and malpractice is paid by the anesthesia group. Soudns pretty good for somebody "Who doesnt know anything"

And it also seems that the residents on this board and in other places are the ones that keep firing up the discussion on this issue, for the most part out there in the real world, it's not as big of an issue as you guys make it out to be.

AA's do not get paid as much b\c there's not a demand for them. They can only work in 13 states, and must be underdirect supervision of the anesthesia doc. AA's aren't required to have previous medical work either. Pre-med reqs and the MCAT is all that's required. They have no experience in the monotoring required for this type of work.

If you want something to debate, how about you guys debate the MDA and AA issue? B\c the MDAs don't have to do anything with AAs and they are still getting paid. It's nothing but politics. And that's really sad, but that's part of Healthcare.
 
Striking is not the primary characteristic of a union. The primary characteristic of a union is collective bargaining.

There are unions in vital professions, like the police, that does not, nor should, strike. A resident union would be along with the same lines.

No, unionizing has nothing to do with common sense. Recognizing that a resident system that brutalizes its "beneficiaries" with an unhealthy number of work hours as well as financially exploiting them is wrong is common sense.
 
A nurse recently on Tonight NBC was asked on Jay Walk as to what body fluid could be passed out everyday in the quantity 1L-20L per day and duh she said blood!!! I can swear never will I ever see a medical student say that let alone a physician. Nurses know stuff by practice but often have gaping holes in their fundamentals....I mean there is really a large gap in their knowledge, they know bits and pieces. If they should be allowed to take over physician roles...let authorities mandate a prerequisite no. of years of training similar to docs. not let them crashcourse their way into medical practice. SAd state of affairs for a developed nation like ours.

My friends who have MBAs and PHDs from ivy leagues barely make 120K and it so ridiculous to see nurses( who probably are the bottom of the academic hierarchy compared to lawyers, MBAs and docs with far fewer years of training)raking in 200K. Stupid, Stupid and anyone who thinks it is right is just a wannabe doc. We do not unionise cause we take a HIpp.Oath. If we drive BMWs its cos we have years of sacrifice and hard work behindus. If we do not strike its only cos we care for our patients and are not in this only for $$ unlike CRNAs who are a bunch of greedy doc. wannabes.
 
you can tell intelligence by the way fokker (mean draggon) spelled his bright response 🙂 awwwww
 
For all of you who are bashing the CRNAs, did you ever stop to think that NURSES were the FIRST people to give anesthesia in this country? Maybe you should check up on your history some.
 
Erm...ether (a form of anesthesia) was first used by Dr. Crawford Long.

What exactly have they been teaching you at those nursing schools?
 
•••quote:•••Originally posted by meandragonbrett:
•For all of you who are bashing the CRNAs, did you ever stop to think that NURSES were the FIRST people to give anesthesia in this country? Maybe you should check up on your history some.•••••So? I'm supposed to believe that without the influence of physician anesthesiologists, anesthesia still would have evolved into the form that it is today under the guidance of NURSES?

Dream on, pal.

Nurses and medical students were the first administrators of anesthesia because it didn't take much brains to put a mask on and turn on the ether vaporizer. Sure, the complication rate from anesthesia then was roughly 1 in 20 under the loving hands of nurses, but who's keeping score?

If the CRNAs want to play in the big leagues and administer anesthesia independently, they should be forced to take the oral and written MD anesthesiology boards and pay equivalent liability premiums or keep quiet.
 
The truth is that nurses simply have some of the most steadfast and organized lobbying efforts of any organization in the country. As a PA, I could not have even been granted the ability to practice in the state of Mississippi until last year because of the fact that nurses blocked all legislative bills calling for a PA practice act. Even though the state continuously ranked dead last in their healthcare of all 50 states, rural towns could not use the services of a PA (who is trained much more highly than an NP) simply because of a truf war. NP's put up signs at the state legislature stating "Do you want your prescription signed by someone who might now hold a college degree?". This was targeted toward the 1% of PA's who were certified years ago when some of the programs were certificate programs, hence they manipulated their wording through the use of lobbyists. PA's were finally granted the right to practice there only after agreeing that only a PA with a Master's degree could practice there. What is funny about this is that PA education in roughly 4 times the number of hours of NP education, but they didn't have that on their billboard. Nurses simply know how to stick together because they genrally have only a few select and large organizations representing them. Physicians on the other hand are splintered by the fact that many do not join the AMA, and simply choose to have their small specialty organization compete with these larger paramedical groups. And the issue on malpractice insurance is true. I used to see the same number of patients as all the docs in my practice, yet my insurance was 1000 bucks a year while theirs was 8000 bucks a year.
 
This message is directed to Meandragonbrett:

Brett, it is obvious you are a nurse or nurse anesthetist. I have to admit that on the technical aspect of ASA 1 or 2 patients, anyone with half a brain could give them anesthesia without killing them. But the problem is that most nurse anesthetists really have no idea what is going on with their patients. Yes, they know how to react to hypotension by giving neosynephrine or ephedrine, but physiologically, most dont have a clue what they are doing. Most CRNAs dont have the training to know the indications and contraindications of giving certain kinds of anesthesia. They just wanna do General or MAC on everyone. But most have no insight to the disease process that the patient is under which is important when you're taking care of them in the OR. It's funny how we let CRNAs float PA catheters but they have no idea how to interpret the data. If you put a CRNA up against a physician on a medical knowledge exam, you'll see who really knows what they are talking about and who just pretends to know. I work with lots of nurse anesthetists who are fine as technicians... but when things go south, you really see how different the level of training is. Yes, you can put in a tube, give muscle relaxant, and sit on your butt for the rest of the case. But that 1% of times when things go wrong, they all go screaming for the anesthesiolgist to fix things. It's funny how when things go right, you guys take credit for it, but when there is a bad outcome, you blame the anesthesiologist. Makes me sick really. Everytime you push a drug or turn on sevoflurane you are practicing medicine. You need a medical license to do that. That license represents your adequate level of training and intellectual ability that puts you at the same level as all other physicians. Until you guys get that license, you will never get the respect that you are looking for. You have to remember, you are still a nurse. No RN with a couple of extra letters will ever equal an MD or DO. If you want that kind of respect, you're gonna have to go to medical school. There is no way around that. And that crap you stated about CRNA school being way more competitive than medical school in an earlier post, I think you've been using the ketamine that you're supposed to be giving your patients. Why is it that MDs arent scrambling to get in there then? The only reason that there are so many CRNAs working now is because of the shortage of anesthesiologists. But guess what, the demand is rising and therefore the number of graduating anesthesiologists is also rising. Once there are enough anesthesiologists out there, your job may be in jeapardy too.
 
Why don't you all grow up. Eveyone knows that MDAs have better training and, hence, make more money.

It's the fault of the MDAs for giving up so much power.

Of course cRNAs can do *many* of the cases MDAs can......so they will.

Period.

Now can we quit the name calling?
 
Seriously, this degenerated into a childish tantrum quickly. Halothane: Keep the emotions in check, generalised name-calling only makes you look dumb, not the nursing profession.
 
Hey there pill guy down under, I really donno if these issues affect you. But let me tell you it pisses us off here. Maybe you should visit a few CRNA websites and see how blasphemously they make statements regarding everything concerning anesthesia. They claim to be pioneers when medical history gives that credit to doctors and dentists. They claim to be equicompetent when their exams like someone said is like a quiz( and they are proud that all of them are certified unlike MDA who are only certified 50% of time....like comparing high school diploma to a PHD). They dispute credible reports that show that mortality is higher with CRNAs alone. They use dirty politics to further their cause ( Clintons and Ventura moms were CRNAs). They study most of their basic sciences in their masters course ( CRNA school) and say they are as good....any doc. who is worth his salt will stand up for physician rights. The right to have the privilige to be a physician when you work hard for nearly a decade for it. And ours is the right to defend that privilige. And some idiot wants to do a spell check on my post....looks like you are not even fit to be nurse...a secretary's job will be appropriate!! for you to be soo thrilled at spotting trivial syntax errors.
 
We can bitch and moan about CRNA's all we want, but isn't it the physicians that have created this beast. Is it not because anesthesiologists did not want to practice in ghost towns like Broken Bow, Nebraska that the door was opened for CRNAs to move in (and now 4 states allow for unsupervised CRNAs just to fill demand in these small towns)? Is it not the anesthesiology groups that found it more economical to hire 2-3 CRNAs vs hiring 1 additional anesthesiologist? Is it not the physicians that continually fail to organize themselves as well as the nursing lobbies? CRNAs/NPs/PAs fill the health care void created by physicians, and then we complain about their training/knowledge/ability? We can argue all we want about level of intelligence and length of training, but does it really matter? After two months of anesthesiology rotations, I can honestly say that I saw no difference in the level of proficiency between the CRNAs and the MDAs. If we didn't want them to take a foot, we shouldn't have given them an inch.
 
I've been talking to a lot of old Docs about unionizing and they seem to think that it will never work. Where as the younger generation of people in med school and people who are pre med are starting to see the value of organizing. I was just wondering what your thoughts were on this topic? It seems to me that someone has to start fighting for doctors rights.
 
This discussion is comical. Anyone who really believes that a CRNA is as knowledgeable or skilled as an MDA is a *****. Period. And I don't think it's fair to place all the blame on the complacency of physicians for these disturbing trends. You can attribute much of their power, compensation, etc. to William Jefferson Clinton. On his LAST day in office, Clinton approved a change in government regulations allowing CRNA's to provide anesthesia -- without a doctor's supervision -- to Medicare and Medicaid patients. Apparently, Clinton made this decision because he PRESUMED that this would be safe, given the OVERALL improvement of anesthesia safety. It amazes me how illogical that is. I don't know where the bill stands now, but I do know that Bush immediately placed a hold on this bill once he became President. I hate to make this political, but the fact is that Bill Clinton made many decisions while in office to strip power and autonomy (and compensation) away from physicians.
 
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