Decent surgical prelim programs

[hourockets786]

Hello Everyone,

I'm applying IR this year and was looking for a surgical prelim that has friendly faculty and decent hours. The program doesn't have to have a lot of OR time. I won't be doing surgery for a career but I will be dealing with surgical patients so I welcome learning about perioperative management. Again, for me key is friendly faculty and decent hours. I'm looking for something a little similar to what is described in the thread below but given the thread was posted ~12 years ago I would really appreciate any input on which programs to look into (especially in the midwest).

Thank you all in advance!

(Relatively easy prelim surgery programs)

I know a lot of people may advocate for a TY year. I will be applying TY as well but just wanted to know what options I had on the surgery front.

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[doc05]

No such thing

 

[VincentAdultman]

I was a nondesignated prelim once and I kind of feel like "decent hours" is antithetical to the whole concept of a prelim year....or surgical internship in general.

Just do a TY man.

 

[surgonc2017]

If you want decent hours - surgery prelim isn't for you. Unless you consider averaging 80 a week decent.


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[kemper6036]

usually when folks ask about good prelim programs, its in regards to getting an advanced GS position or OR time. with your specified question, I would urge you to search elsewhere

 

[Traitor Kaepernick]

Hello Everyone,

I'm applying IR this year and was looking for a surgical prelim that has friendly faculty and decent hours. The program doesn't have to have a lot of OR time. I won't be doing surgery for a career but I will be dealing with surgical patients so I welcome learning about perioperative management. Again, for me key is friendly faculty and decent hours. I'm looking for something a little similar to what is described in the thread below but given the thread was posted ~12 years ago I would really appreciate any input on which programs to look into (especially in the midwest).

Thank you all in advance!

(Relatively easy prelim surgery programs)

I know a lot of people may advocate for a TY year. I will be applying TY as well but just wanted to know what options I had on the surgery front.

Have yet to hear about surgery and decent hours being associated with each other. I just hope it ends up being 80 per week and not more.

 

[hourockets786]

Thanks everyone for the replies.

How about a program that abides by the 80hr per week rule and has friendly faculty. Is there any program like that?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Wordead]

Thanks everyone for the replies.

How about a program that abides by the 80hr per week rule and has friendly faculty. Is there any program like that?

Thanks in advance!

Most of the programs Ive seen do seem to abide by it since they have night float and generally sign out on time. When I was on gen surg as an intern I never broke duty hours. I broke it on plastics and I still break duty hours constantly on ENT.

 

[kemper6036]

Thanks everyone for the replies.

How about a program that abides by the 80hr per week rule and has friendly faculty. Is there any program like that?

Thanks in advance!

I would say most follow the 80 hour rule. There's such a thing as the ACGME survey and I don't think a prelim would have much to lose by letting it rip......

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

I really enjoyed my intern year. Pleasant faculty. Relaxed colleagues.
Dartmouth Hitchcock in NH

 

[deleted804629]

.

 

[TraumaLlamaMD]

Kaweah Delta in Visalia, CA. Pleasant, very benign and friendly program. Prelims treated the same as the categoricals. Surgery interns do 60-70 hrs/week average. This is because scut work is limited due to the newness of the the program and ancillary support does a lot of the scut/dispo stuff residents traditionally do. This also allows interns to operate more than other programs.

It's also in a beautiful area of the country, FWIW!

 

[Winged Scapula]

It's also in a beautiful area of the country, FWIW!

LOL....have you been to Visalia?

 

[kemper6036]

LOL....have you been to Visalia?

it'll grow on you, like a tumor

 

[hourockets786]

Great, thanks so much for the advice everyone!

 

[Winged Scapula]

it'll grow on you, like a tumor

Ha ha...well I've managed to keep my central SJV tumor in remission!

 

[VincentAdultman]

Spectacular.

 

[Traitor Kaepernick]

I really enjoyed my intern year. Pleasant faculty. Relaxed colleagues.
Dartmouth Hitchcock in NH

I hope i can say that after my first year.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

I hope i can say that after my first year.

Further away from the experience the better..but it wasn't bad. Lot of ancillary services like PICC team and Iv team to make life easier. Generally pleasant and supportive faculty. Treated fairly.

 

[droliver]

I think you (and several commenters) have your priorities wrong. If you're going into IR, you actually want to embrace a very intense surgical experience in an intern year, not the equivalent of a "gap year". The whole point of that year is to lay the foundation for a lifetime of clinical surgical and peri-operative care, an experience that's traditionally lacking in IR.

As clinical faculty in a community surgery program which has had a number of anesthesia, ophthalmology, rad-onc, and occasional radiology residents come through in a prelim year, I can tell you there is a self selecting population of people that choose that path. They have all been really strong residents with fantastic work ethics, and I think to a person none of them regretted their decision as they felt it prepared them well. OTOH, the prelim surgery residents who ended up scrambling there because they didn't get the wasted transitional year they wanted are uniformly miserable people that while often bright, are HORRIBLE residents who often don't appreciate the privilege of being a doctor.

Long story short, I think the prelim surgery intern year program at the Baptist Health System in Birmingham, AL is a good option for this. You get the same schedule as categoricals, and the attendings are pretty benign. It's a good prep year for another procedural specialty like IR, and they've tailored that year for people to do some electives they're interested in (radiology, anesthesia, plastics). It's also been a very fair shake for people who didn't match in surgery to be rewarded with a categorical spot (has happened 8-9 times over the last decade). One of our categoricals this year is actually the younger brother of one of the anesthesia staff at one of the hospitals they work at and who did a prelim surgery year (and rotated on my services) with us 8-9 years ago and was an all-time great intern. It speaks well that he wanted his brother to do surgery there I think.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

Fwiw I never said my intern year was easy. It was just well staffed with ancillary services and good group of residents and faculty. Scut was kept to a minimum. Beautiful facility in beautiful part of the country helped too..