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Good question. I was on a leave of absence because one of my best friends passed and her death was severely affected my mental health, more than I was admitting. To the point that while I was making improvements, this situation derailed any progress I was making. I was not processing it properly and evidently, that was my fault. I was in a leave of absence for about 2 months to work on my personal concerns that may have been impeding progress. They suggested I take a leave of absence then or that due process would be triggered.
First, I’m sorry for your loss. With that period of LOA, it’s possible that the program would run into issues with you finishing on time. That, combined with the other concerns about your performance, could be enough to make the program faculty feel like you are not likely to reach the required competency benchmarks in a reasonable period of time. Did you get any treatment during your LOA or do anything else that can show you did something tangible to address the issues you were having?
 
if you were having car troubles, why wouldn’t you call the supervisor? I have a couple of flakier interns right now and they are always texting me that they are running late. It’s a an area of weakness that they need to work on and its a but annoying, but if they actually ghosted me,that’s a whole ‘nother level.
 
That was somewhat of a rhetorical question, no real need to answer. To answer your original question, I would think that it is important for you to recognize the importance of being a psychologist and the responsibilities of this profession. There is a reason for gatekeeping and it sounds like the psychologists at your site have decided that might need to be done. Trying to explain the reasons for the deficiencies will probably not go as far as owning up to them as being real concerns. In other words, validate the committee’s concerns and ask them for help on how you can reassure them that you understand the gravity of this and are looking for guidance on how to improve. That’s my two cents.
 
That was somewhat of a rhetorical question, no real need to answer. To answer your original question, I would think that it is important for you to recognize the importance of being a psychologist and the responsibilities of this profession. There is a reason for gatekeeping and it sounds like the psychologists at your site have decided that might need to be done. Trying to explain the reasons for the deficiencies will probably not go as far as owning up to them as being real concerns. In other words, validate the committee’s concerns and ask them for help on how you can reassure them that you understand the gravity of this and are looking for guidance on how to improve. That’s my two cents.
Agreed. Also, it sounds like there may be concerns that you were doing poorly, took an LOA for treatment, haven't completed that treatment, and at least look like you are still having similar issues.
 
Agreed. Also, it sounds like there may be concerns that you were doing poorly, took an LOA for treatment, haven't completed that treatment, and at least look like you are still having similar issues.
Also agreed. I think perhaps the biggest issue at this point, from the committee's perspective, is that they've taken multiple steps to address their concerns, but it doesn't seem to have resulted in resolution of those problems (i.e., there was a plan in place for timeliness, but there was then another episode of lateness without notice, or in other words, being AWOL). I don't say this to pile on; I say it to second what was mentioned above about there being very real concerns related to ways in which this might impact future functioning as a psychologist. If I had a psychologist working for me who'd been late in the past, and who then arrived late again without any attempt to contact me, I'd very likely fire them. And the closer you get to the end of internship, the closer you are to being held to the standards of a psychologist.

An appeal is certainly worth a try. I second/third smalltownpsych's suggestions about how to approach the committee. You could look into speaking to an attorney if you have the means, but I'd still say there appear to be underlying factors that need to be addressed even if successful. If the internship decides to move forward with dismissal and they are an APPIC member, APPIC may reach out to you as well.

Edit to add: I know this is very stressful from your standpoint, which sucks. I would add that no internship with which I've ever had contact or been affiliated has taken dismissing an intern lightly. We do not like to do it. Ever.
 
I think you are trying to translated the questions from English to "professor", when you should be translating from English to "employer".

English: "Tell us what happened here"
Professor: "Show your remorse, give me a sob story, and I'll probably change the work requirements if I like you."
Employer: "Don't tell me any excuses. Just tell me you're super duper sorry, then tell me you will fix it right now, and then make it doesn't happen again."
 
To give a brief overview, my car brakes failed on the highway while on my way to supervision. I did not immediately notify my supervisor and due process was triggered as I was already on a remediation plan for timeliness. I was also gone on a leave of absence and just returned a week prior. I am freaking out because I only have a few months left of internship. This is absolutely terrible and I feel extremely disappointed in myself. I am trying to get reacclimated to all the expectations and requirements as well. The review committee is recommending dismissal. I do have an opportunity to appeal it, but it feels almost hopeless. Does anyone have any experience with this? If so, any guidance would be immensely appreciated. I feel like during the meeting, it was just them going through the motions of what they have to do, but not necessarily hearing what I had to say because this is not the first time my chief supervisor has brought up resignation.
Is this an APA accredited internship? If so, there are most likely very strict due process guidelines that the program must follow.

Typically, programs will implement corrective actions and provide more assistance in order to address specific concerns that emerge. If those approaches are unsuccessful, then more serious disciplinary actions are likely to be imposed such as remediation and probation. If all other corrective actions and available remedies have been exhausted, dismissal will likely be recommended.

Did your program place you on a formal remediation or probation plan? If so, does this improvement plan emphasize that additional tardiness will lead to dismissal?

Are there any other performance deficiencies noted? Typically, internship programs are hesitant to dismiss a student at the tail end of the training year. It looks very bad. You would have had to have demonstrated serious performance deficiencies to be dismissed from internship.

Typically, internship program directors and supervisors will be able to detect serious issues with interns at the very beginning. It will be apparent that the student is at risk for dismissal ahead of time. As such, corrective actions will be implemented as early as feasible. Options for improvement and support will likely be exhausted within 6-months of program thereby, allowing dismissal to be considered.
 
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To give a brief overview, my car brakes failed on the highway while on my way to supervision. I did not immediately notify my supervisor and due process was triggered as I was already on a remediation plan for timeliness. I was also gone on a leave of absence and just returned a week prior. I am freaking out because I only have a few months left of internship. This is absolutely terrible and I feel extremely disappointed in myself. I am trying to get reacclimated to all the expectations and requirements as well. The review committee is recommending dismissal. I do have an opportunity to appeal it, but it feels almost hopeless. Does anyone have any experience with this? If so, any guidance would be immensely appreciated. I feel like during the meeting, it was just them going through the motions of what they have to do, but not necessarily hearing what I had to say because this is not the first time my chief supervisor has brought up resignation.
How late are we talking? Many internship programs will give students a 30-minute grace period. A lot of programs will include 30 mins-1 hour of admin time in the morning with no clinical training so that any unplanned lateness does not impact patient care.

How far do you live from the internship site? I’ll be honest, I struggle with timeliness. During internship, I made sure to find a place that was within a 10-minute radius of my internship site. I ended up living in walking distance from the program. There was a time where I did experience car issues. I just ran to the program and barely made it on time.

My program wasn’t tracking everyone strictly. The unspoken rule was to be there no later than 15 minutes of work day. If we occasionally were 30 mins late, nobody would say anything.

I have heard of programs where supervisors will tell support staff to watch and monitor interns. A friend of mine was reported to training director by a support staff member for leaving work 30 mins early so she could get to an appointment. Director docked 30 mins from her leave and issued a firm warning.

It sounds like your program might be very strict.
 
To give a brief overview, my car brakes failed on the highway while on my way to supervision. I did not immediately notify my supervisor and due process was triggered as I was already on a remediation plan for timeliness. I was also gone on a leave of absence and just returned a week prior. I am freaking out because I only have a few months left of internship. This is absolutely terrible and I feel extremely disappointed in myself. I am trying to get reacclimated to all the expectations and requirements as well. The review committee is recommending dismissal. I do have an opportunity to appeal it, but it feels almost hopeless. Does anyone have any experience with this? If so, any guidance would be immensely appreciated. I feel like during the meeting, it was just them going through the motions of what they have to do, but not necessarily hearing what I had to say because this is not the first time my chief supervisor has brought up resignation.
So, I personally think that if a committee is recommending dismissal, they are pretty set on that option. Yes, all APA internships must have some due process protocols in place. However, it’s highly unlikely that staff that are higher up will override what primary supervisors recommend.

When I was on internship, I was told that a student in the previous cohort was dismissed from the program. He appealed the dismissal all the way to the director of the hospital but ultimately the decision was affirmed.

I think when there is a question about competence and training, higher ups are unlikely to go against what is recommended by the supervisors as they are not familiar with the process and performance standards. This often is the case for students in med school and clinical psychology doctoral programs. Faculty members outside of the students department and field cannot really comment on matters unique to the training and program.
In this respect, clinical/counseling/school psychology students are at the mercy of program faculty and supervisors. The power differential is intense.
 
So, I personally think that if a committee is recommending dismissal, they are pretty set on that option. Yes, all APA internships must have some due process protocols in place. However, it’s highly unlikely that staff that are higher up will override what primary supervisors recommend.

When I was on internship, I was told that a student in the previous cohort was dismissed from the program. He appealed the dismissal all the way to the director of the hospital but ultimately the decision was affirmed.

I think when there is a question about competence and training, higher ups are unlikely to go against what is recommended by the supervisors as they are not familiar with the process and performance standards. This often is the case for students in med school and clinical psychology doctoral programs. Faculty members outside of the students department and field cannot really comment on matters unique to the training and program.
In this respect, clinical/counseling/school psychology students are at the mercy of program faculty and supervisors. The power differential is intense.
I'd actually say that although there's definitely a power differential (which is largely unavoidable, and not inherently a bad thing), trainees often have a fair amount of protection, particularly in VA (not sure if this specific internship is VA).

The only clarification I'd add is that primary supervisors may recommend dismissal, but it's ultimately the internship director who will make that call (and sometimes the directors will be the one to propose it directly). The director may agree with the primary supervisors and may not; I've seen it go both ways. But I 100% agree that facility-level (non-psychology) leadership, such as the hospital director, medical chief of staff, and/or director of medical and affiliated health training will typically go with what the internship director has decided, if it gets to that point.

Slight aside--odds are, those facility-level leadership folks, at least including the director of medical training, is or will be informed of the situation. There's typically a lot of communication that goes on behind the scenes when probation plans and potential dismissal are involved.
 
I haven't read all the replies, so perhaps this has already been mentioned. But if this is an APPIC internship, they offer an "informal problem consultation" service and you can request a discussion with one of their consultants through their website. Edited to add: if they are moving forward with dismissal, it's possible that they have also used this service to make decisions on their end. So it would be especially important to you to reach out and have a discussion about next steps.

 
To give a brief overview, my car brakes failed on the highway while on my way to supervision. I did not immediately notify my supervisor and due process was triggered as I was already on a remediation plan for timeliness. I was also gone on a leave of absence and just returned a week prior. I am freaking out because I only have a few months left of internship. This is absolutely terrible and I feel extremely disappointed in myself. I am trying to get reacclimated to all the expectations and requirements as well. The review committee is recommending dismissal. I do have an opportunity to appeal it, but it feels almost hopeless. Does anyone have any experience with this? If so, any guidance would be immensely appreciated. I feel like during the meeting, it was just them going through the motions of what they have to do, but not necessarily hearing what I had to say because this is not the first time my chief supervisor has brought up resignation.
I'm confused. Were the timeliness issues and remediation plan related to the leave of absence and the issues which caused it or were they independent?

Why didn't you call, text, email, or otherwise notify your supervisor when you had car problems and knew you wouldn't be on time? Whether this was part of your remediation plan or not, this likely is going to reflect poorly on you and your chances of not being dismissed from internship.
 
To give a brief overview, my car brakes failed on the highway while on my way to supervision. I did not immediately notify my supervisor and due process was triggered as I was already on a remediation plan for timeliness. I was also gone on a leave of absence and just returned a week prior. I am freaking out because I only have a few months left of internship. This is absolutely terrible and I feel extremely disappointed in myself. I am trying to get reacclimated to all the expectations and requirements as well. The review committee is recommending dismissal. I do have an opportunity to appeal it, but it feels almost hopeless. Does anyone have any experience with this? If so, any guidance would be immensely appreciated. I feel like during the meeting, it was just them going through the motions of what they have to do, but not necessarily hearing what I had to say because this is not the first time my chief supervisor has brought up resignation.

Why? This is super basic professional courtesy.

If basics like this aren't being attended to, I assume there is alot more going on/happened than you are telling us.
 
Is this an APA accredited internship? If so, there are most likely very strict due process guidelines that the program must follow.

Typically, programs will implement corrective actions and provide more assistance in order to address specific concerns that emerge. If those approaches are unsuccessful, then more serious disciplinary actions are likely to be imposed such as remediation and probation. If all other corrective actions and available remedies have been exhausted, dismissal will likely be recommended.

Did your program place you on a formal remediation or probation plan? If so, does this improvement plan emphasize that additional tardiness will lead to dismissal?

Are there any other performance deficiencies noted? Typically, internship programs are hesitant to dismiss a student at the tail end of the training year. It looks very bad. You would have had to have demonstrated serious performance deficiencies to be dismissed from internship.

Typically, internship program directors and supervisors will be able to detect serious issues with interns at the very beginning. It will be apparent that the student is at risk for dismissal ahead of time. As such, corrective actions will be implemented as early as feasible. Options for improvement and support will likely be exhausted within 6-months of program thereby, allowing dismissal to be considered.
Yes, it is an APA accredited internship. I appreciate the input. I was placed on a formal remediation plan, but not probation. The timeliness, before my LOA, extended to completing intake paperwork within a week sometimes. After I returned, I have been diligent about completing this on time and being up to date. Even before I left, I made a tracker to keep more up to date and timely, which was working, but was something noted as being of concern, but not on the formal remediation plan. It was conveyed to me during my meetings with my previous supervisor and was something we worked on.
 
So, I personally think that if a committee is recommending dismissal, they are pretty set on that option. Yes, all APA internships must have some due process protocols in place. However, it’s highly unlikely that staff that are higher up will override what primary supervisors recommend.

When I was on internship, I was told that a student in the previous cohort was dismissed from the program. He appealed the dismissal all the way to the director of the hospital but ultimately the decision was affirmed.

I think when there is a question about competence and training, higher ups are unlikely to go against what is recommended by the supervisors as they are not familiar with the process and performance standards. This often is the case for students in med school and clinical psychology doctoral programs. Faculty members outside of the students department and field cannot really comment on matters unique to the training and program.
In this respect, clinical/counseling/school psychology students are at the mercy of program faculty and supervisors. The power differential is intense.
I am hoping that they may reconsider but you are right in that there is not telling. I know that my supervisor, the new one, is discussing with me as though I will still meet with her next week, after the final review meeting, and that she is sure some students have appealed successfully, but not any she knows personally. That gives me some hope.
 
I haven't read all the replies, so perhaps this has already been mentioned. But if this is an APPIC internship, they offer an "informal problem consultation" service and you can request a discussion with one of their consultants through their website. Edited to add: if they are moving forward with dismissal, it's possible that they have also used this service to make decisions on their end. So it would be especially important to you to reach out and have a discussion about next steps.

Hi, thank you for this. I have spoken to them a few times already for an IPC and they have been immensely helpful.
 
To the point that while I was making improvements, this situation derailed any progress I was making. I was not processing it properly and evidently, that was my fault.
In hindsight, evidently, it is on me to ensure that I have access to her at all times.
Not sure if this is reflective of a weird writing quirk or your actual underlying thoughts about this situation. The latter would be bad.

I do agree w @docloufan that, as I think is typical when people bring these kinds of issues to this forum, there’s probably some important issues not covered in the description of the situations.
 
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OP, I am wondering if there were cultural factors. This line jumped out at me: "I am trying to get reacclimated to all the expectations and requirements as well." It sounds like you didn't understand the situation you were in, and in fact still might not fully understand what happened.

I'm sorry you are in this situation.
 
I would say they were independent, but I am unsure. They suggested I take a LOA for personal/medical reasons, stating that if I do not, due process would be triggered. So I guess, it was a bit of both? I did not text her because I panicked, as previously mentioned. My brakes failed on the highway, so it was not normally car troubles. Had they been normal car troubles, I do think I would been able to be more clearheaded and reached out to her sooner. It was an error not to in any case, panic or not, but it is not something I can change any longer. I have made the change to put her number as an icon on my home page so I can be reminded to call her as soon as an emergency arises. However, as soon as I received the email on my school email, I called, emailed, and texted her. She did not answer her call or text, but did answer her email. She was made aware, just later than she should have been.

Look man, you aren't "suggested" to resign from your internship program, and then later put a on plan to having that happen if you are 5 minutes late to things and took an approved LOA for legitimate health/mental health reasons. You aren't telling us everything. You don't have to of course, but at least admit to it.
 
I don't want to jump on the OP too much, as I'm sure it's a very difficult time and- as others have said- we don't have the whole story. However, for the benefit of other current and former trainees/early career employees, I do want to comment on timeliness. There were comments above about being on a "remediation plan for timeliness" and how "timeliness issues were improving." In my opinion, this a black and white issue- figure out how to be on time and make sure you that you are. It should not be something that is gradually improved, but immediately fixed! No "remediation plan" or gradual improvement.

It's on you (and I mean the general "you all" here- not specifically the OP) to leave earlier to account for traffic, road work, closures, weather, etc. There may be some situations where delays are unavoidable (e.g., accidents on the highway), but getting stuck in regular traffic (probably that your supervisors somehow successfully navigated themselves and were able to be on time) is something that should only really happen in the first days of the job. Plan for it and be early until you can figure out consistent minimum travel times. I'm about to start a new gig in a new place that's a lot different than where I am now (Urban vs. Rural: mostly highways vs. local roads; rush hour traffic existing vs. not: street signs in kilometers vs. miles). I will be driving between 5 different sites, across 4 different cities, with 67 KM between the furthest two sites. I'm not staring for several months, but have already practiced the drives and spoken with locals about best routes, times of day, etc. This has been a major consideration in where we end up living. I see timeliness as the "no brown M&Ms of clinical work'- if you can't consistently make it to where you need to be when you need to be there, how can I be confident that you're able to figure out some of the more important stuff?
 
Thank you for this clarification and information. What do I do if the internship director was noticed by other interns in my cohort to not exactly be too fond of me? She has mentioned/suggested resignation multiple times to me.
This likely isn't something that's actionable, or necessarily helpful for you to focus on. If resignation has been mentioned multiple times, it could be related to several factors, including: yes, that the DCT for some reason has it in for you; or alternatively, they've seen and/or heard of different issues that they're concerned may not be able to be satisfactorily addressed before the end of internship. Timeliness could fall into this category, as it's generally considered a fundamental component of professionalism and professional service delivery; if it's something that hasn't been addressed in grad school, that can worry supervisors.

This may not relate to your specific situation, but as an example, I've occasionally seen trainees present to internship with such a large skills deficit that almost from day 1, supervisors developed concerns that it could be insurmountable.
 
I don't want to jump on the OP too much, as I'm sure it's a very difficult time and- as others have said- we don't have the whole story. However, for the benefit of other current and former trainees/early career employees, I do want to comment on timeliness. There were comments above about being on a "remediation plan for timeliness" and how "timeliness issues were improving." In my opinion, this a black and white issue- figure out how to be on time and make sure you that you are. It should not be something that is gradually improved, but immediately fixed! No "remediation plan" or gradual improvement.

It's on you (and I mean the general "you all" here- not specifically the OP) to leave earlier to account for traffic, road work, closures, weather, etc. There may be some situations where delays are unavoidable (e.g., accidents on the highway), but getting stuck in regular traffic (probably that your supervisors somehow successfully navigated themselves and were able to be on time) is something that should only really happen in the first days of the job. Plan for it and be early until you can figure out consistent minimum travel times. I'm about to start a new gig in a new place that's a lot different than where I am now (Urban vs. Rural: mostly highways vs. local roads; rush hour traffic existing vs. not: street signs in kilometers vs. miles). I will be driving between 5 different sites, across 4 different cities, with 67 KM between the furthest two sites. I'm not staring for several months, but have already practiced the drives and spoken with locals about best routes, times of day, etc. This has been a major consideration in where we end up living. I see timeliness as the "no brown M&Ms of clinical work'- if you can't consistently make it to where you need to be when you need to be there, how can I be confident that you're able to figure out some of the more important stuff?
That is a very important question to ask and I appreciate you asking that. I will think over this question.
 
I want to reiterate that I appreciate all of your input, but I genuinely want to know more about the due process procedures and if anyone has experience with it. What was it like? Did the student resign? Were they dismissed? How did they process the situation? I understand how the situation reflects upon me and my lack of timeliness/prompt communication. However, I do not know the ins and outs of the outcomes of appeals. Additionally, I was on here initially for guidance, not to be repeatedly told it is my fault. I am not denying that it is, nor would I ever. I do not mean to come off as defensive and I apologize if it is, but the repetition is not helpful at the moment. Again, there is nothing I can do to change what I did in that situation, even if I wish there were. I am already in due process. I have already been recommended for dismissal and I have already sent an appeal letter. I need actual guidance about the actual process and what it means. I have consulted APPIC for an IPC multiple times but was hoping for additional guidance. I can give you all my entire appeal letter if that would be helpful.
In my experiences with probation plans, I've seen it work out both ways--successful resolution and dismissal, but more often the former. I have more limited experience with the appeals process; in the few situations I know of, the appeals I believe were ultimately dropped and the trainee resigned or was dismissed.

But you've started the process and you've reached out to APPIC, which are the main two recommendations I could think up.

As for my other post and your question about skills deficits, they've run the gamut, but probably most often (which still has been rare) related to lack of foundational clinical skills and knowledge.
 
In my experiences with probation plans, I've seen it work out both ways--successful resolution and dismissal, but more often the former. I have more limited experience with the appeals process; in the few situations I know of, the appeals I believe were ultimately dropped and the trainee resigned or was dismissed.

But you've started the process and you've reached out to APPIC, which are the main two recommendations I could think up.

As for my other post and your question about skills deficits, they've run the gamut, but probably most often (which still has been rare) related to lack of foundational clinical skills and knowledge.
Thank you, this was helpful to know. Can I ask if there were remediation plans before the probation plans or it was straight to probation plans at your site?
 
Thank you, this was helpful to know. Can I ask if there were remediation plans before the probation plans or it was straight to probation plans at your site?
IIRC, when remediation was required, a probationary plan was enacted. There were sometimes steps before this, such as verbal or written warnings, depending on the nature of the issue(s). I've heard of a small handful of instances at other training sites that, I believe, proceeded immediately to dismissal.
 
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My individual supervisor said to me, and I quote, "I know you are trying to get reacclimated to the system and expectations." I say that to highlight that my supervisor herself mentioned that I was trying to reintegrate into a system that has had numerous changes during my LOA and she understands that. Thank you, I appreciate it. The situation that happened I was already on a remediation plan where I was warned that if I were to be late at all, due process would be triggered. And although it was a potentially life-threatening situation, I did not inform her in a timely manner which was an idiotic decision on my part. There may be cultural factors, if I am being honest, but I do not know if that is something I can necessarily speak to in the next meeting.
Son, I do not for one second believe you are quoting someone "word-for-word" on here. Let me be very clear about that. Also, what's with all this "due process would be triggered" stuff??? I have probably heard that phrase strung together once in my whole life.... and you have said this a dozen times in as many posts. What is that about?

Look. Internship sites do not want to expel their interns, and avoid it all all costs. It creates labor/productivity/access problems in many cases. It's a black mark on the internship for APA and APPIC (they have to explain it). My impression is that you're ****ing up. Repeatedly. And...that its adversely impacting their operations/patient care. You need to address this and own it. And stop with all the splainin. I don't know what else you would expect us to say or advise here? Maybe there are indeed some "cultural factors" at play here (don't really know that means?) but its clear they want you gone at this point.
 
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I was suggested to resign after the remediation plan a few times, I apologize for the confusion that occurred. If you would like for me to detail everything, I can honestly post my entire appeal letter here, but it is a very lengthy appeal letter that my program director, not the internship director, said was very strong, considering the mitigating factors. However, I do not know if that would actually be helpful for anyone else to read. Mind you, I am not the one who initially thought my internship director was not fond of me, but it was brought to my attention by co-interns.
Don’t post your materials here.

The reason some of us are pushing on this is that your narrative sounds off, and like you are hiding info that would make you seem less sympathetic. We’ve been through training; it is not likely that some supervisor decides to have a bad attitude toward you and that’s why you’re having problems. It is logistically more likely that you have had more problems than you are letting on to, and the supervisor does have a bad attitude, because of the problems. Your peers likely wouldn’t know the extent of stuff, they’re not monitoring your coming and going.

Idk maybe you have a weird supervisor who is being overly punitive. In that case, look at your site remediation policy and see if it was violated.
 
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