Dental school future

[Mark32]

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Hello, i been doing badly in school, i ended up with a 2.5 gpa, i immigrated to this country around 6 years ago, i started college and i did very bad, the language change was very hard for me, since i am a slow learner. I took the DAT last year and got a 16 and felt completely ashamed of myself, i felt completely overwhelmed and ended up guessing 40 to 50 percent of the test, mainly the sciences and math section. Now i would like to know if its possible for me to ever get into Dental school, i also took a massive amount of units since i wasn't sure what i wanted to be in the future, but now i am committed to being a dentist, i know that my scores speak for themselves but i really want this!, so know i am wondering what my next step should be i would really appreciate your responses.
Thanks for reading, sorry for my terrible grammar.

 

[dmdluffy]

Hello, i been doing badly in school, i ended up with a 2.5 gpa, i immigrated to this country around 6 years ago, i started college and i did very bad, the language change was very hard for me, since i am a slow learner. I took the DAT last year and got a 16 and felt completely ashamed of myself, i felt completely overwhelmed and ended up guessing 40 to 50 percent of the test, mainly the sciences and math section. Now i would like to know if its possible for me to ever get into Dental school, i also took a massive amount of units since i wasn't sure what i wanted to be in the future, but now i am committed to being a dentist, i know that my scores speak for themselves but i really want this!, so know i am wondering what my next step should be i would really appreciate your responses.
Thanks for reading, sorry for my terrible grammar.

Here is a brief outline of important steps you could take to improve your chances for future admissions.
1. If you're still in undergrad, take courses (preferably science courses) and 4.0 them. You need to raise your cumulative and science GPA's 3.0+
2. If you're out of undergrad, you could consider doing either a postbacc or Masters degree (Single year masters program). You'd have to see which would be suited to you. If your GPA can be heavily influenced with 48 credits of postbacc, you could go with that. If you have a lot of credits and a post bacc wouldn't make a dent in it, then masters would be the better route.
3. Take your DAT again. Study like you've never studied before. Shoot for a 20+ in all sections. Since English is not your native language, you may want to really emphasize prepping for RC since many schools place heavy importance.
4. When you do apply, apply broadly to many schools (and smartly!)

While nothing is impossible, you're in a tough situation. It'll likely take at the very least 1-2 years of tough work in which you need exceptional results. You'll also want to look into volunteering, researching, and shadowing to gain experience in the EC side of things.

Good luck!

 

[dentalWorks]

Hello, i been doing badly in school, i ended up with a 2.5 gpa, i immigrated to this country around 6 years ago, i started college and i did very bad, the language change was very hard for me, since i am a slow learner. I took the DAT last year and got a 16 and felt completely ashamed of myself, i felt completely overwhelmed and ended up guessing 40 to 50 percent of the test, mainly the sciences and math section. Now i would like to know if its possible for me to ever get into Dental school, i also took a massive amount of units since i wasn't sure what i wanted to be in the future, but now i am committed to being a dentist, i know that my scores speak for themselves but i really want this!, so know i am wondering what my next step should be i would really appreciate your responses.
Thanks for reading, sorry for my terrible grammar.

I am usually encouraging, but a 2.5 GPA (and who knows what science GPA there is) is next to impossible for admission. Like dmdluffy suggested, you will need to bring it to above 3.0.

THEN after done so, your not out of the waters yet, cause there is a strong chance you'll need to do a 1.5-2 year masters.

Its not impossible for you to get in, but you will spend the next 3-5 years fixing old habits, and spending in the upwards of 50-100k...

 

[archna]

Good Infromation........

 

[wizi]

Hello, i been doing badly in school, i ended up with a 2.5 gpa, i immigrated to this country around 6 years ago, i started college and i did very bad, the language change was very hard for me, since i am a slow learner. I took the DAT last year and got a 16 and felt completely ashamed of myself, i felt completely overwhelmed and ended up guessing 40 to 50 percent of the test, mainly the sciences and math section. .

First of all, don't feel bad about yourself. Keep your head up and never give up.

You should know one thing that the road to dentistry is very long and rough. You have to always be on top of your game in school (a B sucks, a A- is a bi*ch) + you have to do volunteering, shadowing... BUT if you really like dentistry and help people, you will find these things quite amazing and exciting. Its a long and painful process 🙂

You being here telling us that you are determined and willing to do whatever it takes to get in +++. You will be surprised of how many people aren't born in the US on SDN (including me lol). So dont feel like you are alone on this island.

Most schools don't care how long you have been in the country, how many languages you are speaking. They want to know if you will be a good dentist or not.

Start your journey today: bring up your GPA, retake DAT, look into SMP (special master program), add more ECs (activities).

 

[Mark32]

Thanks a lot for the information guys, i will heavily consider doing these things, i know that a University close to home offers a Masters program so i will look more into that, i will also try to be over prepared for the next time i take the DAT, thanks for this valuable information, i really do appreciate it.

 

[dmdluffy]

Thanks a lot for the information guys, i will heavily consider doing these things, i know that a University close to home offers a Masters program so i will look more into that, i will also try to be over prepared for the next time i take the DAT, thanks for this valuable information, i really do appreciate it.

One thing that I just thought that might be an issue. If you do a SMP without raising your undergraduate GPA might not help you at all. Consider that most schools have a minimum GPA cutoff of 2.7-3.0, being below that may mean they automatically toss out your app without seeing your masters work.

 

[wizi]

Thanks a lot for the information guys, i will heavily consider doing these things, i know that a University close to home offers a Masters program so i will look more into that, i will also try to be over prepared for the next time i take the DAT, thanks for this valuable information, i really do appreciate it.

If money is not a problem, you should find a SMP at a dental school such as UMDNJ, BU, Florida (nova has 1 i think) and do it over there but like dmdluffy said, bring your GPA up around 3.0 and do your master.

 

[AllahIsGreater]

if you are a minority (black or spanish) then with a 2.5 and 16 you can get in. contrary to what anyone else says.

 

[Pistorius]

if you are a minority (black or spanish) then with a 2.5 and 16 you can get in. contrary to what anyone else says.

The above quote may be misleading. I'm black, DAT score :17, sGPA 3.39, cGPA 3.59 and still no interviews. Currently on course to retaking the DAT. So take the above advice as you will.

 

[dmdluffy]

Agreed with the above poster. Just because you're an URM doesn't mean you get a ticket to just waltz into d school. For the OP, Howard has a minimum GPA of 2.7 and DAT scores of 17. Not sure about Meharry or Puerto Rico

 

[Pistorius]

Agreed with the above poster. Just because you're an URM doesn't mean you get a ticket to just waltz into d school. For the OP, Howard has a minimum GPA of 2.7 and DAT scores of 17. Not sure about Meharry or Puerto Rico

Even in the case of Howard....it was the only school that contacted me and suggested I retake the test. So they've placed my file on hold.

 

[Jackson-Ave-Dental]

if you are a minority (black or spanish) then with a 2.5 and 16 you can get in. Contrary to what anyone else says.

-1

 

[YoHomey]

Since you've been in this country for only 6 years, you'll need to score minimum 20 on RC section. This is very important component of DAT especially for non-native speakers. Your personal statement won't be valid as an indicator since schools assume foreigners use native speakers to edit/write their PS for them. Hence why there's always a writing sample on interview day. I would start pronto on improving this.

 

[YoHomey]

.

 

[deleted390966]

Since you've been in this country for only 6 years, you'll need to score minimum 20 on RC section.

Nah... I think it's the opposite, schools may be lenient on your less-than-stellar RC score because you're a non-native speaker, if your science scores are solid.

 

[YoHomey]

Nah... I think it's the opposite, schools may be lenient on your less-than-stellar RC score because you're a non-native speaker, if your science scores are solid.

Dude, what are you talking about?? Absolutely clueless. You're not using common sense. He's been in this country for only 6 years. Why would a school want to risk having a student fail out of dental school because he/she couldn't handle the required heavy duty analytical reading?? Here's some proof too:

View attachment DAT score chart1.jpg


As you can see, in terms of individual sections, RC is the most important. (These are responses by all dental schools except for LECOM and Midwestern-IL).



.

 

[deleted390966]

Dude, what are you talking about?? Absolutely clueless. You're not using common sense. He's been in this country for only 6 years. Why would a school want to risk having a student fail out of dental school because he/she couldn't handle the required heavy duty analytical reading?? Here's some proof too:
View attachment 18013

1/ This graph offers no insight on the correlation between the performance of native vs. non-native speakers on the RC section and admissions.

2/ You're making the assumption that RC score tremendously reflects dental school performance.
It's like back when med schools claimed Verbal score was the most important factor. It's absolutely ridiculous to compare RC with dental school success. Basically, it's equivalent to finding that people with white cats are more likely to have heart disease.

Since you've been in this country for only 6 years, you'll need to score minimum 20 on RC section.

Most schools do not require a 20 RC. Why do you think this is a minimum for anyone at all?!! What kind of reasoning is this?

 

[wizi]

Dude, what are you talking about?? Absolutely clueless. You're not using common sense. He's been in this country for only 6 years. Why would a school want to risk having a student fail out of dental school because he/she couldn't handle the required heavy duty analytical reading?? Here's some proof too:

As you can see, in terms of individual sections, RC is the most important. (These are responses by all dental schools except for LECOM and Midwestern-IL).



.

Yohomey,

I have been reading your posts and realize that you have been giving out a lot wrong information. You need to do more research before you give some people advice.

For those non-english speakers out there, RC is important but you dont need a minimum of 20 to be competitive. For example, I got 14 RC + went to a CC for 2 years but still manage to get 3 pre-dec interviews.

I have talked to a few adcoms, they understand my situation.

Work hard and you will get to where you want one day.

 

[YoHomey]

1/ This graph offers no insight on the correlation between the performance of native vs. non-native speakers on the RC section and admissions.

2/ You're making the faulty assumption that RC score tremendously reflects dental school performance.


Most schools do not require a 20 RC. Why do you think this is a minimum for anyone at all?!! What kind of reasoning is this?

I have made connections with a handful of Directors of Admissions from different schools over the past 1.5 years from visiting the schools directly and/or meeting them in person at ADA conferences. One of them even told me directly that his school is lenient with QR and PAT but that RC is important because there is a high correlation between RC scores and success in dental school. These are his words and substantiated by other Directors who follow the same reasoning. So this is NOT an assumption I am making. I am merely a messenger who is reiterating what Admissions Directors have told me.

You're the one who is making assumptions. I guess we know who didn't score too well on RC lol. You should understand that for int'l and foreign applicants, there are limited seats and there is concern for their English verbal ability, and if schools value RC for native speakers, then imagine how much higher standards will be for foreign and int'l applicants.

You have a faulty logic that because someone has limited skills in English due to being a non-native, then the schools will be lenient. That's like saying I'm applying to grad school in France and since my French speaking skills are limited, the French school will give me a break even though it's quite evident I won't be able to handle all the reading for 4 years which will be in French.

 

[dmdluffy]

RC is an important DAT subsection. There was that study by UNLV that I'm sure everyone heard about indicating RC is correlated with good NBDE I scores. Add to the fact the national average for RC is 19 (not 17), I do believe high RC scores are important.

 

[Bereno]

lol, this gets me every time!

Once again, there is NOT a strong correlation between dental school performance and your RC score! RC has a statistically significant correlation for about half the schools in the US, and of these schools it is a medium to weak correlation. If you are familiar with your statistics, this indicates.... not much really haha. However, of the other sections of the DAT, the RC section has the highest (note, not "high") number of significant correlations, even though the correlation itself is not strong. Another thing to note is that these measurements are usually based on first and second year performance only - they do not include 3rd and 4th year performance. Additionally, some of these studies include board scores as well. Adcoms know that these studies only show small trends in first and second year grades, and that they have way of showing how strong of a clinician you can be.

Either way, I would not put so much emphasis on the RC section like so many people seem to do. I got a 19RC, which apparently is below the "min" yet I have 5 pre-dec interviews... Sure, RC is important, but its overall importance really pales in comparison to importance of the sum of everything else in your application.

👍

 

[vicsin]

You guys should chill about RC. I got a 21 RC and my sister got an 18. We both got interviews at all the schools we applied to at the same time. The most important factor correlating with dental school performance is GPA, of course, as it shows commitment for a few years. Also, it is all about the overall application. Be strong as possible in every section on the app and you have a chance...numbers have to look decent.

 

[hmmmmm]

i got a 24 rc


and only 1 pre dec interview and 1 post 🙁

 

[AlbinoPolarBear]

Alright guys, let me clear this up about RC.

It DOES NOT have a strong correlation with dental school success. The best correlation to first year dental school success is Academical Average and GPA. Surprise!

This comes from the DAT User manual, page 21.

http://www.ada.org/sections/educationAndCareers/pdfs/dat_users_manual.pdf

This chart shows us the correlation between undergraduate marks, DAT with first year dental school achievements. From this chart, we can see that the argument for vast amount of reading and RC score correlation, as YoHomie suggested, isn't valid.

So why do schools care about RC so much? It's either that they:
1. Do not believe in the stats and continue to believe in anecdotal evidence that RC is essential to Dschool success, or
2. They don't want a school composed mainly of fresh of the boat students. This acts as an amazing filter as this demographic tends to score the lowest on the RC. These students also are less likely to participate in extracurriculars, which is vital to the social aspect of the school.

Or it's a combination of both. Either way, dental schools care, whether you like it or not. To provide an extreme example, Penn matriculants have an average RC of 22.

BUT, they might be willing to overlook it if the rest of your application is outstanding, like a 3.90 GPA, or you have a personal statement so touching that it serves a dual purpose of wiping tears. But for a regular applicant, they might eliminate you based on your RC score. Get 19+ and you'll be in good shape.

 

[dentalWorks]

I agree with both arguments...

1) (IMO) RC shouldn't be this important and...
2) DS's get hard-ons when they see high RC.

Check this out, you will frequently hear of people getting in with a 13 or 14 in QR... Have you ever heard of a 13 or 14 RC get in? I haven't....

 

[Baker2010]

if you are a minority (black or spanish) then with a 2.5 and 16 you can get in. contrary to what anyone else says.

Umm, which schools are you talking about here??? Can you please provide the list of schools?
With these scores, if the applicant actually matriculated, he would very likely not be able to handle the coursework and fail out leading to the school losing a quarter of a million dollars.
Does that sounds logical to you?

Please, think before you start typing buddy.

 

[Bereno]

Alright guys, let me clear this up about RC.

It DOES NOT have a strong correlation with dental school success. The best correlation to first year dental school success is Academical Average and GPA. Surprise!

This comes from the DAT User manual, page 21.

http://www.ada.org/sections/educationAndCareers/pdfs/dat_users_manual.pdf

This chart shows us the correlation between undergraduate marks, DAT with first year dental school achievements. From this chart, we can see that the argument for vast amount of reading and RC score correlation, as YoHomie suggested, isn't valid.

So why do schools care about RC so much? It's either that they:
1. Do not believe in the stats and continue to believe in anecdotal evidence that RC is essential to Dschool success, or
2. They don't want a school composed mainly of fresh of the boat students. This acts as an amazing filter as this demographic tends to score the lowest on the RC. These students also are less likely to participate in extracurriculars, which is vital to the social aspect of the school.

Or it's a combination of both. Either way, dental schools care, whether you like it or not. To provide an extreme example, Penn matriculants have an average RC of 22.

BUT, they might be willing to overlook it if the rest of your application is outstanding, like a 3.90 GPA, or you have a personal statement so touching that it serves a dual purpose of wiping tears. But for a regular applicant, they might eliminate you based on your RC score. Get 19+ and you'll be in good shape.

3 things:

1) Good post! People should also understand that these percentages are not the correlations themselves, but rather the percent of dental schools that had a significant correlation. For example in 2007-2008 51% of all dental schools showed a significant correlation between a students RC score and their first year GPA. This is not saying that there is a correlation of .51 with RC and first year GPA!

2) If you look at other studies on the same subject, it is clear that when using a multiple regression model, the RC score has the highest coefficient. However, if memory serves me correctly, it is a very low coefficient, that might even have been statistically insignificant haha. I would have to find one of those studies again to see for sure.

3) I thought YoHomey was saying RC was super important? lol 😀

 

[YoHomey]

Hey, I'm just reiterating what admissions directors have told me. It seems like a lot of people on this thread are trying to justify their low RC scores. I agree that a lower RC score won't doom someone as long as everything else (GPA, DAT TS) is high assuming it is above a certain cutoff. But if everything else is average a lower RC won't help for sure.

I remember reading a thread a few months ago about some dude who scored 20s across the board except in RC and got no interviews to his 10 schools. When he called them asking for an explanation, they said it was because of his 17 RC score. I'm sure there are thousands like him. They're just not on this thread.

Also, you guys are arguing whether RC scores have a high/low correlation with success in dental school, instead of whether RC scores are important/unimportant for admissions which is the more relavant thing as it relates to the OP.