did i ruin my chances to get into a credible school?

[Brandonh131]

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Well, I have a decent gpa (3.73) great extracurriculars (shadowing, research etc) but I failed miserably on my MCAT (8,2,9) when i saw my score i went on an impulse and retook it unfortunately i didnt do better (9,4,6) I was doing very well on my practices so i know Im capable of doing much better.


My current plan is to study my a** off and take the new mcat, I cleared my mind of all the stress that was holding me back and will take it 6/19. But in all reality, did I ruin any change to get into a decent school. I live in Michigan and prefer to stay home.

and yes I know, I dont know how the heck I got a 2 in verbal either.

To be honest, I really don't mind the fact that I have to test again but the fact that I have those on my application give me so much anxiety. Please help

 

[Brandonh131]

Well, I have a decent gpa (3.73) great extracurriculars (shadowing, research etc) but I failed miserably on my MCAT (8,2,9) when i saw my score i went on an impulse and retook it unfortunately i didnt do better (9,4,6) I was doing very well on my practices so i know Im capable of doing much better.


My current plan is to study my a** off and take the new mcat, I cleared my mind of all the stress that was holding me back and will take it 6/19. But in all reality, did I ruin any change to get into a decent school. I live in Michigan and prefer to stay home.

and yes I know, I dont know how the heck I got a 2 in verbal either.

To be honest, I really don't mind the fact that I have to test again but the fact that I have those on my application give me so much anxiety. Please help

 

[gettheleadout]

I'd imagine MD is out of the question barring miracles. I'm unsure how DO schools would view a successful (~30) retake after those two priors.

 

[Chansey]

...Have you taken an MCAT test-prep course? I usually don't think they're necessary, but I think in your case, a private tutor would help a great deal. Obviously, something isn't clicking for you during your self study.

I'm not going to lie - your MCAT scores are very bad. That said, your GPA is good, so you aren't out of the running yet. What do you mean by "credible schools"? Getting a sub-20 MCAT twice might be lethal for top institutions, but I think US MD is still possible if you can get ~33 on your next MCAT.

 

[Relax!]

If you do STELLAR (>96-97th percentile) on this new MCAT, you might have a shot at DO schools and some newer and low-tier MDs. Two very low MCATs don't speak well about your maturity and ability to handle failure, so you really have to make sure that every other aspect of your application makes up for this and is outstanding.

 

[Brandonh131]

...Have you taken an MCAT test-prep course? I usually don't think they're necessary, but I think in your case, a private tutor would help a great deal. Obviously, something isn't clicking for you during your self study.

I'm not going to lie - your MCAT scores are very bad. That said, your GPA is good, so you aren't out of the running yet. What do you mean by "credible schools"? Getting a sub-20 MCAT twice might be lethal for top institutions, but I think US MD is still possible if you can get ~33 on your next MCAT.

My first two choices are Wayne state and Oakland university WB. But anywhere in Michigan all reality

 

[palatopharyngeus]

Well, I have a decent gpa (3.73) great extracurriculars (shadowing, research etc) but I failed miserably on my MCAT (8,2,9) when i saw my score i went on an impulse and retook it unfortunately i didnt do better (9,4,6) I was doing very well on my practices so i know Im capable of doing much better.


My current plan is to study my a** off and take the new mcat, I cleared my mind of all the stress that was holding me back and will take it 6/19. But in all reality, did I ruin any change to get into a decent school. I live in Michigan and prefer to stay home.

and yes I know, I dont know how the heck I got a 2 in verbal either.

To be honest, I really don't mind the fact that I have to test again but the fact that I have those on my application give me so much anxiety. Please help

forget about MD programs

retake mcat and aim for something in the 20s. apply to a bunch of DO schools and maybe even the caribs, if you want to be a doctor badly enough

 

[MaybeDr]

Honestly if you can score a 518+ on the new MCAT you will probably be okay. There are many schools that only consider the highest score when deciding. That being said it is very hard to score a 96+ percentile. You would have to work very hard. It's not impossible. It's been done before.

 

[gettheleadout]

Honestly if you can score a 518+ on the new MCAT you will probably be okay. There are many schools that only consider the highest score when deciding. That being said it is very hard to score a 96+ percentile. You would have to work very hard. It's not impossible. It's been done before.

lol I totally forgot the scoring system changed with the new test. Yeah, unfortunately a jump from guessing rate (2-4) in VR to a 96th percentile overall is unlikely to say the least.

 

[hoihaie]

what were you scoring on your practice tests?

 

[PlaqueBuster]

I had to do a double take on the 2..but I believe you will have a tough time in both MD and DO schools with those scores. Take the next test seriously and attempt for a 30+ (10/10/10) if you want to be considered seriously

 

[Doug Underhill]

Are you getting extreme test anxiety? This is treatable. A person with a 3.73 GPA in a pre-med major at a reputable school shouldn't be getting 4s in verbal and 6 in BS.

Did you take the AAMC practice exams?

Most admissions offices say that they only take the highest set of scores (best exam, basically) into consideration when evaluating an applicant. Some say they average scores. There is an adcom member who posts on this forum who states that all sets of scores will be taken into consideration. It seems like you should change all your study habits and resolve your difficulties and ace the new exam.

 

[referee3]

Michigan is a great state to be applying from. That being said, you should start working on your plan B now as you study for the next MCAT. You could do Pod School?

 

[Goro]

It's time for Plan B. I do not think you are a viable candidate for any US medical school.

Well, I have a decent gpa (3.73) great extracurriculars (shadowing, research etc) but I failed miserably on my MCAT (8,2,9) when i saw my score i went on an impulse and retook it unfortunately i didnt do better (9,4,6) I was doing very well on my practices so i know Im capable of doing much better.


My current plan is to study my a** off and take the new mcat, I cleared my mind of all the stress that was holding me back and will take it 6/19. But in all reality, did I ruin any change to get into a decent school. I live in Michigan and prefer to stay home.

and yes I know, I dont know how the heck I got a 2 in verbal either.

To be honest, I really don't mind the fact that I have to test again but the fact that I have those on my application give me so much anxiety. Please help

 

[palatopharyngeus]

It's time for Plan B. I do not think you are a viable candidate for any US medical school.

he/she should be fine for DO schools though right? if he/she scores somewhere in the 20s on a future retake?

agree that MDs are out of question at this point and would be foolish to pursue any further

 

[ridethecliche]

Did you like...try to get everything wrong on verbal?

Getting a 2 is kind of impressive from a statistical standpoint.

 

[palatopharyngeus]

...a jump from guessing rate (2-4) in VR...

Did you like...try to get everything wrong on verbal?

Getting a 2 is kind of impressive from a statistical standpoint.

lmfao at some of these comments regarding op's verbal score 😆😆😆

 

[gettheleadout]

Did you like...try to get everything wrong on verbal?

Getting a 2 is kind of impressive from a statistical standpoint.

No need to be mean. It's not like zero VR skill would mean a guessing rate of success, since misinterpretation of questions and answers is actually *likely* to yield incorrect answers and eliminate correct ones.

 

[caffeinemia]

It's time for Plan B. I do not think you are a viable candidate for any US medical school.

Thank you for being real GORO. What a breath of fresh air.

 

[breakintheroof]

Scores like OP's 2 in verbal aren't ultra-rare. Michigan received an application with a composite MCAT of 7 this year. (It's a little hard to read on the graph below.) @gyngyn's school receives single-digit composites every year.

I have come to think that the MCAT should have a pass/fail cutoff at roughly the minimum conceivable score to be admitted. Maybe that could increase awareness of the need to do well on the exam, not just take it, in order to apply. This post makes me think there should also be minimum subsection scores. Maybe below 5 in any section, or below 20 overall, should just be reported as a straight "Fail." (Read as "Retake" for the undaunted.)

That was a little off-topic and I don't mean to be harsh on OP. @Brandonh131, you have done the right thing by coming here to ask about your options. I don't have anything to offer in the way of advice beyond @Goro's. Good luck.

 

[Brandonh131]

he/she should be fine for DO schools though right? if he/she scores somewhere in the 20s on a future retake?

agree that MDs are out of question at this point and would be foolish to pursue any further

so even if i retake and get a very competitive score, I dont really have a chance?

 

[ridethecliche]

so even if i retake and get a very competitive score, I dont really have a chance?

Odds are that this is not going to happen, but you have one shot at the MCAT left so have at it if you will. The fact that you actually went down in BS doesn't bode well for yet another retake....

 

[Brandonh131]

Well we need to understand what you've been doing to prepare thus far and how feasible it is that you could improve. You haven't told anyone what practice materials you've been using, what your practice scores were, etc, despite being asked.

Regardless, yes, these scores will significantly hurt you in the future, even if you improve. The verbal scores are a real killer.

I was scoring very well in practice verbal (8 min) but the night before I got screwed over and had to work a night shift which, as you can tell, didn't work out very well. for the second one, it was after a month of no review, I signed up for it 9 days before the actual test and got nervous during test day

 

[WingedOx]

Well we need to understand what you've been doing to prepare thus far and how feasible it is that you could improve. You haven't told anyone what practice materials you've been using, what your practice scores were, etc, despite being asked.

Regardless, yes, these scores will significantly hurt you in the future, even if you improve. The verbal scores are a real killer.

Yup, it's more than just retaking and doing well, it's understanding WHY you had so much trouble so far.

OP, What undergrad are you at? How did you study the first two times?

 

[palatopharyngeus]

so even if i retake and get a very competitive score, I dont really have a chance?

for MD programs? honestly man, after getting two 19s, I don't know if a 30+ is really doable for you...again, I don't know how much/if you prepared, so I could be wrong (I hope im wrong)...

but if you retake and get something in the 20s (preferably mid-20s), I definitely think you can get into a DO school or one of the caribs

 

[palatopharyngeus]

...the night before I got screwed over and had to work a night shift which, as you can tell, didn't work out very well.

for the second one, it was after a month of no review, I signed up for it 9 days before the actual test and got nervous during test day

 

[Brandonh131]

Yup, it's more than just retaking and doing well, it's understanding WHY you had so much trouble so far.

OP, What undergrad are you at? How did you study the first two times?

I go to Oakland University, and I used the princeton class, my practices were very well, min 25 on aamcs and for the second one I just did the diagnostics because I pretty much memorized the aamcs and literally got full on majority of the passages, again I had 9 days so i tried doing as many passages as I could

 

[gettheleadout]

I go to Oakland University, and I used the princeton class, my practices were very well, min 25 on aamcs and for the second one I just did the diagnostics because I pretty much memorized the aamcs and literally got full on majority of the passages, again I had 9 days so i tried doing as many passages as I could

You made a terrible decision to only allow yourself about a week of prep after a terrible score on the first try! What in the world were you thinking?

 

[Brandonh131]

You made a terrible decision to only allow yourself about a week of prep after a terrible score on the first try! What in the world were you thinking?

I thought it was the fact that I worked 9 hours over night and then took the test, I actually thought I did well on the actual test day 2 but apparently not or I would've for sure voided

 

[ridethecliche]

You made a terrible decision to only allow yourself about a week of prep after a terrible score on the first try! What in the world were you thinking?

No need to be mean...

 

[Brandonh131]

No need to be mean...

Believe me, I appreciate the honesty, I'm not offended in any possible way, thank you though

 

[Shams al Deen]

Well you are capable of 9s in the science section, which is not easy. Only thing holding you back is verbal. I have a hard time believing that someone who scored 9 in BS cannot bring the verbal up to something respectable for DO (like 7 or 8). Getting high 20s (or new MCAT equivalent) seems totally doable for you. Go for it.

 

[Brandonh131]

Well you are capable of 9s in the science section-which is not easy. Only thing holding you back is verbal. I have a hard time believing that someone who scored 9 in BS cannot bring the verbal up to something respectable for DO (like 7 or 8). Getting high 20s (or new MCAT equivalent) seems totally doable for you. Go for it.

I appreciate it, I know I messed up and I know I can kill the next one, I quit my job, and have nothing to do but study, my biggest concern was the fact that those scores will be on my app

 

[deleted480308]

Trying to look out for you as a human, due to either poor decision making skills or poor test taking skills (both of which are contra-indications for assuming success through medical training) I think you should consider something else in life

Feel free to swing for the fences but you might want to consider these scores a merciful warning shot

 

[Vain Brother]

So you took it once under bad conditions, and a second on a whim without preparation.

That's bad test prep plus bad decision making combined.

there's no excuse for a 2 or a 4 in verbal, though. there's no reason a month-long layoff beforehand would make an otherwise good test-taker get a 4. in a science section it would matter more but basic reading comprehension doesn't require that kind of cramming

OP, if you were to get a very good score on your MCAT, of course you would have a chance at getting in somewhere, probably DO. i think what most here are getting at is that scoring very well after two very low scores is really unlikely, and you should think hard about whether it's worth the time and money given the long odds. if you really feel like you can get >90th percentile on the new MCAT (and honestly since there's no validated practice tests, i don't know how you could be confident in this), sure, go for it. and if you don't mind blowing the time or money, try it anyway, it can't hurt. but it's time to start thinking about plan B too

 

[breakintheroof]

Feel free to swing for the fences but you might want to consider these scores a merciful warning shot

Agreed. To unmix the metaphor, maybe replace "warning shot" with a high inside fastball.

 

[Inventor of Post-Its]

After two 19s, I think the highest score you can realistically hope to get is a 30 (or whatever the percentile equivalent is on the new MCAT). Many med schools will average these, and that puts you just below 23. That's not competitive even at DO schools.

Even if a school looks at all your scores individually, if they see two of the same very low score, plus one above-average score, you can guess which one they will conclude is the outlier.

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

After two 19s, I think the highest score you can realistically hope to get is a 30 (or whatever the percentile equivalent is on the new MCAT). Many med schools will average these, and that puts you just below 23. That's not competitive even at DO schools.

Even if a school looks at all your scores individually, if they see two of the same very low score, plus one above-average score, you can guess which one they will conclude is the outlier.

Some consider highest and most recent score

 

[owlegrad]

Merged duplicate threads. Please do not create multiple threads about the same topic.

 

[deleted480308]

There was a paper a few years ago that changed the practice at a lot of schools (basically showed that averaging best predicts passing M1/M2 - I can't find the citation). Averaging is by far the most common method used now in light of that study's findings.

it makes sense for a field dominated by standardized testing for a school to not take risks with proven shortcomings on standardized tests

 

[Spinach Dip]

Honestly if you can't score a 5 or higher on VR, yes, you are done.

But the MCAT2015 just came out, and there is a possibility that some schools will look only at the new score. I haven't looked into this, but you certainly should.



And I suggest that this time you STUDY and call in sick to work rather than fail the test again.

 

[Throwaway6969420]

.

 

[Goro]

There are schools that super score (take the best composite). So yes, I do think you'd have a chance. But two spectacularly disastrous exams, simply retaking with the hope of doing better is mere magic thinking, and is not going to work. "Studying your ass off" isn't going to work...you already tried that.


You have a major, career-lethal deficit, and that needs to be fixed before even thinking about taking the text again.

Poor MCAT results correlate with failing out of med school, or failing Boards.

so even if i retake and get a very competitive score, I dont really have a chance?

The combination of poor results AND poor choice making would have Adcom colleagues of mine outright rejecting OP.

So you took it once under bad conditions, and a second on a whim without preparation.

That's bad test prep plus bad decision making combined.

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

There was a paper a few years ago that changed the practice at a lot of schools (basically showed that averaging best predicts passing M1/M2 - I can't find the citation). Averaging is by far the most common method used now in light of that study's findings.

My medical school takes the highest score. Just got to find the ones who do.