Difference between the imaginations and realities in OMFS

[yorta]

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To current OMFS residents or practicing OMFS professionals,

Would you mind sharing your insights into the field—things you’ve learned that were different from what you initially expected? Both positive and negative aspects are welcome.

Some topics you might consider addressing (but are not limited to):

1. The excitement of learning and performing surgeries
2. The sense of value and fulfillment in your work
3. Earnings and lifestyle balance
4. Faculty-resident relationships
5. The evolution and future direction of the field

As a dental student for over a year, I’ve grown increasingly disillusioned with general dentistry and dental school education. I’m eager to learn as much as possible about the realities of OMFS training and the working environment, so I can make an informed decision and avoid future regret.

I sincerely appreciate your input and the sharing of your experiences.

Thank you in advance!

 

[OrphanageCaretaker]

1. Grows day by day
2. Generally overall pleased
3. I can’t wait to start practicing and make $
4. Depends on your personality and work ethic tbh
5. Changes slowly but change is present everywhere

 

[deleted923283]

1. The excitement of learning and performing surgeries
2. The sense of value and fulfillment in your work
3. Earnings and lifestyle balance
4. Faculty-resident relationships
5. The evolution and future direction of the field

1. Procedures become routine. But as you get older, it’s nice to do procedures that are routine and easy. After residency, there won’t be much surgery learning. You can’t do big cases without being in an academic center.
2. I feel valuable. I provide vital care to patients in a hospital who have been rejected by everyone else. But the patients are usually terrible and ungrateful and sick AF.
3. Earnings come very very late. You won’t see any money until you’re at least 32. More if you have school debt. There is no lifestyle or balance during residency. I’m on day #5 of 21 straight days that go 5:30am to 7:00pm. Maybe there is money at the end, but the road there is too rough. There’s not much life outside of work to have. What’s money worth if you’re missing out on the time of your life when all your peers are living their best lives? By the time you get money in your career, you don’t even need it anymore When you’re out, you’ll get a job, just like everyone else. It’s not magical.
4. Old school attendings are harsh and brutal at times. You learn to just deal with it. They live to show their superiority.
5. Everyone is just becoming an employee at an equity group. Over time, less and less surgeons doing hospital work. Too much BS to deal with. I didn’t sacrifice my life until my late 30s to work more and get paid less, get disrespected by the hospital, and lose my hair managing a struggling business.

Do an externship and ask yourself if you want to spend the best years of your life doing that.

 

[piratewow]

To current OMFS residents or practicing OMFS professionals,

Would you mind sharing your insights into the field—things you’ve learned that were different from what you initially expected? Both positive and negative aspects are welcome.

Some topics you might consider addressing (but are not limited to):

1. The excitement of learning and performing surgeries
2. The sense of value and fulfillment in your work
3. Earnings and lifestyle balance
4. Faculty-resident relationships
5. The evolution and future direction of the field

As a dental student for over a year, I’ve grown increasingly disillusioned with general dentistry and dental school education. I’m eager to learn as much as possible about the realities of OMFS training and the working environment, so I can make an informed decision and avoid future regret.

I sincerely appreciate your input and the sharing of your experiences.

Thank you in advance!

1. I'm a midlevel, and most a lot of the excitement has worn off, but I still enjoy the surgery itself especially now I'm getting to cut more of it instead of just retracting. I've probably seen maybe 60-70 mandible fractures for example, and gotten to cut a handful, but I still think they're fun.

2. I think it's very fulfilling, but my program mostly does major surgeries like free flaps, orthognathic, TMJ, craniofacial. I think if I went to a program heavy on dentoalveolar or outpatient clinic I probably would feel more neutral.

3.I earn enough to live, but I don't have kids. I realized OMFS earns way way more than I initially thought, and that goes for academics too. The further I get, the more I realize enjoying what you do is more important than earning an extra 2-300k. My worst week of intern year I worked 130 hrs, now that I only work 80-90 (of which 10-20 is home call) it's super chill. I love being in the OR and could never give it up, especially after spending 6 years training to do these badass surgeries. Even if it means earning a bit less money.

4.I've worked with probably 10 different attendings, I like the ones that tend to let you do your own thing instead of micromanage. There are plenty of attendings that are wonderful people, but terrible to work with, and vice versa. This goes for chiefs/upper levels as well. My favorite chiefs weren't the ones that I vibed with personality wise the most, more the ones that taught me and let me cut/make decisions.

5. Fewer people want to go into academia, expanded scope, or hospital surgery in general. Fewer people want to go into OMFS period. Don't do it for the money, it's not worth it. But I don't know a single recent graduating chief in my program from the past 2-3 yrs that thinks they're underpaid. Our compensation is higher than almost every single medical specialty except NSG,PRS,CT surg, Ortho, and maybe 1 or 2 others, and our lifestyle is better than all of theirs as well. It's not as good as it was in the 90s, sure, but neither is any other career.

 

[D1Bound]

1. I'm a midlevel, and most a lot of the excitement has worn off, but I still enjoy the surgery itself especially now I'm getting to cut more of it instead of just retracting. I've probably seen maybe 60-70 mandible fractures for example, and gotten to cut a handful, but I still think they're fun.

2. I think it's very fulfilling, but my program mostly does major surgeries like free flaps, orthognathic, TMJ, craniofacial. I think if I went to a program heavy on dentoalveolar or outpatient clinic I probably would feel more neutral.

3.I earn enough to live, but I don't have kids. I realized OMFS earns way way more than I initially thought, and that goes for academics too. The further I get, the more I realize enjoying what you do is more important than earning an extra 2-300k. My worst week of intern year I worked 130 hrs, now that I only work 80-90 (of which 10-20 is home call) it's super chill. I love being in the OR and could never give it up, especially after spending 6 years training to do these badass surgeries. Even if it means earning a bit less money.

4.I've worked with probably 10 different attendings, I like the ones that tend to let you do your own thing instead of micromanage. There are plenty of attendings that are wonderful people, but terrible to work with, and vice versa. This goes for chiefs/upper levels as well. My favorite chiefs weren't the ones that I vibed with personality wise the most, more the ones that taught me and let me cut/make decisions.

5. Fewer people want to go into academia, expanded scope, or hospital surgery in general. Fewer people want to go into OMFS period. Don't do it for the money, it's not worth it. But I don't know a single recent graduating chief in my program from the past 2-3 yrs that thinks they're underpaid. Our compensation is higher than almost every single medical specialty except NSG,PRS,CT surg, Ortho, and maybe 1 or 2 others, and our lifestyle is better than all of theirs as well. It's not as good as it was in the 90s, sure, but neither is any other career.

“Don’t do it for the money, it’s not worth it.” I know a senior resident before he graduated was offered a 750k salary. The only people that don’t think that’s worth it have rich parents to begin with.

 

[JacquesVallee]

“Don’t do it for the money, it’s not worth it.” I know a senior resident before he graduated was offered a 750k salary. The only people that don’t think that’s worth it have rich parents to begin with.

No amount of money could get me to go through what OMFS residents endure during residency

 

[piratewow]

“Don’t do it for the money, it’s not worth it.” I know a senior resident before he graduated was offered a 750k salary. The only people that don’t think that’s worth it have rich parents to begin with.

I know endos, perio, ortho, and general dentists that make that much money. Specifically for an endo I know his starting was 650k. You don’t seem to understand the statement I’m making.

Have you ever worked 130 hrs a week? Have you ever gone 48 hrs with no sleep? Have you ever been cussed out or had patients scream while you’re draining their abscess?

 

[deleted923283]

I know endos, perio, ortho, and general dentists that make that much money. Specifically for an endo I know his starting was 650k. You don’t seem to understand the statement I’m making.

Have you ever worked 130 hrs a week? Have you ever gone 48 hrs with no sleep? Have you ever been cussed out or had patients scream while you’re draining their abscess?

Edit: I was cranky

 

[D1Bound]

I know endos, perio, ortho, and general dentists that make that much money. Specifically for an endo I know his starting was 650k. You don’t seem to understand the statement I’m making.

Have you ever worked 130 hrs a week? Have you ever gone 48 hrs with no sleep? Have you ever been cussed out or had patients scream while you’re draining their abscess?

I’ve never seen or heard of an associate contract of any other specialty except possibly endo (or anesthesia) that can touch OMS. The only GP and perio I’ve known that have seemed to make money like that were owners, and they were feeling every minute of it. There’s no free lunch. OMS earn it. The training sucks, but it is a turn key money maker no question about it.

 

[HockeyDocOMFS]

1. Procedures become routine. But as you get older, it’s nice to do procedures that are routine and easy. After residency, there won’t be much surgery learning. You can’t do big cases without being in an academic center.

Don’t completely agree with this. I know plenty of people who do orthognathics and trauma while having their own private practice, but you have to enjoy it since it is more of charity work (unless you are charging cash for orthognathics, which some people I know also do). People are just too lazy to do bigger surgeries and only see the dollar signs of teeth and titanium.

 

[Life of Pablo]

or missed weddings and funerals, gotten a divorce, missed the chance to have kids, missed the chance to raise your kids, lost your hair, gotten fat because Laura Doons are the only things you can eat, develop chronic back problems, develop chronic insomnia because you take so much call for 6 years, lose contact with all of your friends,…

There’s a lot of sacrifice in residency. And the eventual money doesn’t quite make up for it.

Jeez guys. “Residency doesn’t have to be a greek tragedy…”

Maybe it’s just my program, but I don’t share this sentiment at all. For anyone reading this, there is definitely a life outside residency. I’ve gotten married, about to have a kid etc all during residency. My coresidents are the same. It’s not all doom and gloom as everyone makes it sound, and I really doubt my program is unique. Residency can actually be quite fun, and honestly we’re quite lucky that the “light at the end of the tunnel” is brighter than essentially any other profession out there. If I had a dollar every time some physician told me how lucky I was to be doing OMFS during my med school clerkships..

 

[stealyoface]

Jeez guys. “Residency doesn’t have to be a greek tragedy…”

Maybe it’s just my program, but I don’t share this sentiment at all. For anyone reading this, there is definitely a life outside residency. I’ve gotten married, about to have a kid etc all during residency. My coresidents are the same. It’s not all doom and gloom as everyone makes it sound, and I really doubt my program is unique. Residency can actually be quite fun, and honestly we’re quite lucky that the “light at the end of the tunnel” is brighter than essentially any other profession out there. If I had a dollar every time some physician told me how lucky I was to be doing OMFS during my med school clerkships..

I’m with you. It’s not that bad. It sucks often but you get used to it. There are days I can’t eat lunch but they’re rare. I can eat a meal in 5 min. We can step away from work for 5 min lol. Yes we will all miss some life events but if they’re truly important, you can get coresidents to switch call with you so you can go. I have a great time hanging with my coresidents both at the hospital and outside of work. We go on trips out of town not infrequently. Still enough time to enjoy sports/hobbies as well. Maybe that’s not the case everywhere but life doesn’t pause when you start residency

 

[Allsmiles!]

Once intern year & step 1 is out of the way, things become a bit more normal…well, as normal as it can be for being in a residency. I do think certain program’s culture helps…I feel pretty lucky at my program…great culture and we often get together out of work for all sorts of stuff.

 

[Colastick]

Reading some of the above comments makes me wonder if i went to lifestyle residency program ha. I never had 130 hour work week. 80+? Sure. Residency was hard but at the same time, it was fun and fulfilling (especially retrospectively). If you are thinking omfs, go for it!

 

[Contach]

As a dental student for over a year, I’ve grown increasingly disillusioned with general dentistry and dental school education. I’m eager to learn as much as possible about the realities of OMFS training and the working environment, so I can make an informed decision and avoid future regret.

If you think dental school has made you disillusioned, the hospital system will floor you.
If you think you've jumped through hoops to get through dental school, residency is way worse: months of rotations, presentations on topics foreign to you/your career, rounds, pre-rounds, pre-pre-pre-rounds.

 

[Contach]

“Don’t do it for the money, it’s not worth it.” I know a senior resident before he graduated was offered a 750k salary. The only people that don’t think that’s worth it have rich parents to begin with.

Aspen Dental advertised at last year's AAOMS (our annual event) that the first year guarantee for OMS is 750k for full-time, which for them is 14 days per month. The money is good no doubt.

Now that I have money, I feel like I want things less. I drive a ****tier car now than I did in residency - the irony, right? (It's a company car, and I can't say no to free)

 

[D1Bound]

Aspen Dental advertised at last year's AAOMS (our annual event) that the first year guarantee for OMS is 750k for full-time, which for them is 14 days per month. The money is good no doubt.

Now that I have money, I feel like I want things less. I drive a ****tier car now than I did in residency - the irony, right? (It's a company car, and I can't say no to free)

That is such an incredible compensation and work life balance.

 

[deleted923283]

That is such an incredible compensation and work life balance.

There’s a catch

 

[D1Bound]

There’s a catch

?

 

[OrphanageCaretaker]

?

The catch is you work for Aspen.

 

[D1Bound]

The catch is you work for Aspen.

Bottom line I know brand new grad GPs making 200-300k. 2-3 for an OMS is tomfoolery