- Joined
- Sep 27, 2019
- Messages
- 151
- Reaction score
- 48
I had a law firm reach out to me and ask if I could eval a patient and fill out a form describing their level of functionality. I'm curious to know what the risks are if I do this.
Disability Evaluations
- Thread starter Psychferlyfe3000
- Start date
So there are much better questions than risks here, but this forum sure does get obsessed about liability, so okay. You can get sued if the patient dislikes your report. You can get sued if the disability carrier doesn't like your report. You get sued for anything at any time. You can get sued if you say the person isn't disabled and then goes on to do something in their job that harms someone else. You can also get sued if you refuse to do it at all for an established patient! Is any of this likely, no, it definitely is not. Liability is a question for whoever will be responsible for defending you in court, eg your malpractice carrier. Now onto better questions. Is this sort of thing within your training? Did you do these in residency? I know you didn't do FAA or commercial driving exams in residency. You probably did do SSDI exams and some states require you to do them if you have an established relationship and it is within your scope of knowledge. What kind of functionality are they asking? Are you familiar with that job requirements? How would you actually assess it if you were? There are so many questions here.
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2014
- Messages
- 2,925
- Reaction score
- 5,950
"I had a law firm reach out to me and ask if I could eval a patient and fill out a form describing their level of functionality. I'm curious to know what the risks are if I do this."
Are we talking about a 'form' (questionnaire?) that was constructed by people working at a law office? In my one instance of having such a 'form' (along with a request that I fill it out) mailed to me by a lawyer, I was impressed by how biased / potentially misleading the form was and refused to fill it out.
The PCL-5 (filled out by patients) is bad enough. Being asked to complete a 'form' (with ratings/scales slapped down by lawyers (not psychometricians)) strikes me as kind of dubious, I dunno. I guess it depends on the structure/nature of the form.
Liability may be a concern but, for me, the central concern would be with respect to the validity/integrity of my responses and how they were to be used.
Are we talking about a 'form' (questionnaire?) that was constructed by people working at a law office? In my one instance of having such a 'form' (along with a request that I fill it out) mailed to me by a lawyer, I was impressed by how biased / potentially misleading the form was and refused to fill it out.
The PCL-5 (filled out by patients) is bad enough. Being asked to complete a 'form' (with ratings/scales slapped down by lawyers (not psychometricians)) strikes me as kind of dubious, I dunno. I guess it depends on the structure/nature of the form.
Liability may be a concern but, for me, the central concern would be with respect to the validity/integrity of my responses and how they were to be used.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2005
- Messages
- 5,679
- Reaction score
- 9,798
That is an IME and you should bill in a level consistent with that kind of service.
The risks:
1) You, doing something you don't know how to do, and....
a. getting shredded by an opposing expert who points out that you don't know the usual methods and terms (Very very likely)
b. getting shredded in cross examination, for the same reasons if it goes to deposition (less likely)
c. getting a board complaint after its over by someone who says you didn't know the standards (even less likely)
d. getting a lawsuit without E&O insurance for the same, and losing your personal assets (very unlikely)
2) You charge a rate that is far below the market rate, and get screwed financially (very likely).
3) You charge a rate that is far below the market rate, it goes well, cruddy attorneys flood with referrals for this kind of work, and it limits your actual business until your opinion gets challenged and you lose this line of work (likely).
4) You try your best, make mistakes because you don't know the terms and methods, it backfires on the "patient" (hint, it's never "patient"), and they come to your office all pissed off because they think you're to blame for the failure of their life plan, and it is an unpleasant afternoon.
The risks:
1) You, doing something you don't know how to do, and....
a. getting shredded by an opposing expert who points out that you don't know the usual methods and terms (Very very likely)
b. getting shredded in cross examination, for the same reasons if it goes to deposition (less likely)
c. getting a board complaint after its over by someone who says you didn't know the standards (even less likely)
d. getting a lawsuit without E&O insurance for the same, and losing your personal assets (very unlikely)
2) You charge a rate that is far below the market rate, and get screwed financially (very likely).
3) You charge a rate that is far below the market rate, it goes well, cruddy attorneys flood with referrals for this kind of work, and it limits your actual business until your opinion gets challenged and you lose this line of work (likely).
4) You try your best, make mistakes because you don't know the terms and methods, it backfires on the "patient" (hint, it's never "patient"), and they come to your office all pissed off because they think you're to blame for the failure of their life plan, and it is an unpleasant afternoon.
All of the above, of course, but also thinking about it last night, disability evaluations are not good for just the clinical interaction, in general. It's very much a conflict of interest. Your goal is to get the patient as functional as possible. Very, very rarely is supporting a disability claim going to further this sort of goal. When I filled out SSDI applications for patients in residency it was pretty uniformly forms that parents of children with schizophrenia brought in. In terms of work disability, I would write for short term leave to do PHP/IOP, but that was it. Anything else was generally much more harmful than helpful. Of course declining the disability evaluation will upset the patient.
- Joined
- Mar 15, 2007
- Messages
- 1,940
- Reaction score
- 2,483
I think PsyDr nailed it.
The odds of getting sued are very low. Occasionally an evaluee sues an expert for something like Intentional Infliction of Emotional Distress (IIED), but this is very rare. The main person who has standing (authority) to sue you is the attorney who retained you, and for a variety of reasons this is very unlikely to happen. Still, as PsyDr pointed out your malpractice insurance probably does not cover such suits unless you have added forensic work to your policy in writing.
Much more likely is that your work will fall well below typical standards and criticism from the opposing expert and (if it goes to deposition) the defense attorney will be humiliating and stressful. This is unlikely to generate any formal professional sanction against you but can be really unpleasant.
If you are doing a disability evaluation for a disputed claim consider:
Keep in mind that the clinical role and the forensic role are very different, and you have to approach it that way when you accept forensic cases. See the famous "On Wearing Two Hats," free through JAAPL online On wearing two hats: role conflict in serving as both psychotherapist and expert witness - PubMed
The odds of getting sued are very low. Occasionally an evaluee sues an expert for something like Intentional Infliction of Emotional Distress (IIED), but this is very rare. The main person who has standing (authority) to sue you is the attorney who retained you, and for a variety of reasons this is very unlikely to happen. Still, as PsyDr pointed out your malpractice insurance probably does not cover such suits unless you have added forensic work to your policy in writing.
Much more likely is that your work will fall well below typical standards and criticism from the opposing expert and (if it goes to deposition) the defense attorney will be humiliating and stressful. This is unlikely to generate any formal professional sanction against you but can be really unpleasant.
If you are doing a disability evaluation for a disputed claim consider:
- Many exams can take 3-5 hours to complete and are far more thorough than a typical clinical intake.
- It is not unusual for the evaluating expert to consider a wide range of records including past medical records, employment records, depositions, and other case documents. Depending on record volume this can take anywhere from several hours to over 20 hours in the most record-intensive cases (though this would be rare for a pure disability claim).
- Psychological testing is becoming pretty much an expectation. The test should assess for malingering. If cognitive claims are involved, you may also find yourself up against neurocognitive testing. You should probably have neurocognitive testing done if it is likely to be an issue. Most psychiatrists don't have much training in test administration, so you have to proceed with caution.
- Writing a good forensic report is a skill that you hone with training and repetition. It sounds like they just want you do do a brief form, and I would be cautious agreeing to have that stand as a formal report.
Keep in mind that the clinical role and the forensic role are very different, and you have to approach it that way when you accept forensic cases. See the famous "On Wearing Two Hats," free through JAAPL online On wearing two hats: role conflict in serving as both psychotherapist and expert witness - PubMed
I think we're all assuming that there is some sort of litigation going on. The OP isn't clear on that at all. This may be a SSDI request. Some people waste their money on retaining lawyers for that. That does not typically involve forensic level write-ups or assessments and I'd be very surprised if any of them have any psychometric testing behind them.
- Joined
- Aug 9, 2012
- Messages
- 2,878
- Reaction score
- 5,483
I have completed a few of these for young adults (or late adolescents) with schizophrenia. It was actually pretty chill? I never got any pushback and don't have any forensic training. I felt it was the right thing to do and didn't charge for it, although I was salaried anyway at that job and not RVU based.
- Joined
- Nov 30, 2009
- Messages
- 4,329
- Reaction score
- 9,987
If it’s not for your patient this is a forensic eval. It sounds like they are trying to get something on the cheap I would politely decline. Once an attorney screamed at me after I told her my rate. This is after she was going on about how these SSDI psychiatrists don’t get paid enough to do a decent eval. The most common evals are for SSI/SSDI (which usually don't involve a forensic eval or IME). After that is worker's comp (doesn't sound like that is the case here). Then there are the C&P evals for vets or for nexus letters. Finally, there are private disability evals. These are better paying but the disability companies usually want to do a flat fee for the IME.
If it is for an existing patient I would usually decline unless it’s important to their care and wellbeing. For example patients with dementia, severe TBI, schizophrenia etc Instead I offer to provide their notes. That usually contains sufficient information even though the disability question is not specifically addressed.
If it is for an existing patient I would usually decline unless it’s important to their care and wellbeing. For example patients with dementia, severe TBI, schizophrenia etc Instead I offer to provide their notes. That usually contains sufficient information even though the disability question is not specifically addressed.
No. Asking for headaches. There are plenty of people that do this as their actual job and specialty.
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2018
- Messages
- 191
- Reaction score
- 439
Speaking of SSI evals, I haven't done them in years but did anyone actually get paid for them? I remember that standard government packet had a page where it said you can request some payment from the government for doing the evaluation. I sometimes tacked on a page requesting various amounts just for kicks (I wasn't expecting anything), anywhere from like $2 to $500, but nothing ever showed up.
