Do adcoms see right through phony leadership positions?

[toff4l]

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Members don't see this ad.

I'm under the impression that a successful candidate has a strong leadership position on their resume'.

Can an adcom see right through phony leadership credentials?

Like president of the non-existent pre-med society or treasurer of the future-physicians club; a club that exists only in name.

For a leadership position to be a real and credible position, does it need to be a part of a bigger organization?

I've already heard from two med students who feel that they didn't get in on the first try because they did not have leadership positions.

 

[sylvanthus]

They probably don't have the time to research all the clubs/organizations to see if it is bogus. But, if they ask about it, they will be able to tell if someone is BSing them.

 

[alwaysaangel]

I'm under the impression that a successful candidate has a strong leadership position on their resume'.

Can an adcom see right through phony leadership credentials?

Like president of the non-existent pre-med society or treasurer of the future-physicians club; a club that exists only in name.

For a leadership position to be a real and credible position, does it need to be a part of a bigger organization?

I've already heard from two med students who feel that they didn't get in on the first try because they did not have leadership positions.

Yes they will see through it. For it to actually have value as an activity you need to be able to explain what you did and what you got out of it. Both on paper and in person. If it seems like BS you could easily sink yourself.

Why don't you just get involved in something and get a real leadership position?

 

[MossPoh]

Lying about anything is bad. Now, I was president of a club with a very large membership base on paper where about 10 people showed up to the meetings. I DID stuff, but it was something that looked far more impressive on paper than it truly was. I got nothing but compliments for it on the interview trail, whereas the stuff I invested TONS of time in never got a mention.

 

[Mornhavon]

.

 

[toff4l]

Yes they will see through it. For it to actually have value as an activity you need to be able to explain what you did and what you got out of it. Both on paper and in person. If it seems like BS you could easily sink yourself.

Why don't you just get involved in something and get a real leadership position?

I am not going to put any phony credentials on my resume'. I applied to be a support group facilitator for a national organization. I hope I get it. If I do, that will be a real leadership position because it will be well documented and monitored. I just wanted to know how the adcoms view something like this and the president of pre-med society.

Honestly, real leadership positions are few and far between.

 

[alwaysaangel]

I am not going to put any phony credentials on my resume'. I applied to be a support group facilitator for a national organization. I hope I get it. If I do, that will be a real leadership position because it will be well documented and monitored. I just wanted to know how the adcoms view something like this and the president of pre-med society.

Honestly, real leadership positions are few and far between.

Leadership is what you make of it. They are not few and far between. Titles, Documentation and supervision do not make "good leadership positions."

If you actually do things in your clubs, expand programs you are running and work hard - you will make a difference and as a result it will be a high quality leadership position.

If you don't do anything in the leadership position that is your choice and you are correct - it won't be worth much to admissions committees.

 

[toff4l]

Leadership is what you make of it. They are not few and far between. Titles, Documentation and supervision do not make "good leadership positions."

If you actually do things in your clubs, expand programs you are running and work hard - you will make a difference and as a result it will be a high quality leadership position.

If you don't do anything in the leadership position that is your choice and you are correct - it won't be worth much to admissions committees.

I understand perfectly what you are saying and I believe it myself but for the purpose of med school admissions, isn't is safe to say that "if it's not documented, then it didn't happen?

 

[alwaysaangel]

I understand perfectly what you are saying and I believe it myself but for the purpose of med school admissions, isn't is safe to say that "if it's not documented, then it didn't happen?

No. If you didn't get anything out of it - it didn't happen.

If you contribute to your community, lead fellow students, expand programs and can describe what you did and discuss it at an interview - then it happened and is valuable. Whether there is documentation of it or not.

None of my leadership positions in undergrad or medical school were 'documented'. They all helped me get where I wanted to go because I learned something from them and I can talk about it easily.

 

[toff4l]

No. If you didn't get anything out of it - it didn't happen.

If you contribute to your community, lead fellow students, expand programs and can describe what you did and discuss it at an interview - then it happened and is valuable. Whether there is documentation of it or not.

None of my leadership positions in undergrad or medical school were 'documented'. They all helped me get where I wanted to go because I learned something from them and I can talk about it easily.

So if I worked for some cause and I made a difference and I learned something about myself, I could list this? I like math and I don't mind teaching kids but I always was under the impression that if you were to go down this path, you had to register with some school or organization first. Are you saying that I can just tutor on my own terms, list it, and then talk about it.

 

[LizzyM]

leadership gets differing emphasis depening on the school's adcom leadership. Some put a big emphasis on it and some don't. For some adcom, a specific task that involves directing others such as assignment editor for the school's daily paper would be leadership. Being a team captain on a sports team, an Eagle Scout, supervising and training others on the job or at a volunteer agency would also be leadership.

As you can see, none of this involves club membership.

 

[alwaysaangel]

So if I worked for some cause and I made a difference and I learned something about myself, I could list this? I like math and I don't mind teaching kids but I always was under the impression that if you were to go down this path, you had to register with some school or organization first. Are you saying that I can just tutor on my own terms, list it, and then talk about it.

Yes, but that would just be a valuable activity - not necessarily a leadership position.

Now if you started a tutoring organization and led several other students in scheduling and working with other students. Or created a connection with a local school and recruited fellow students to work with you. That would be a leadership position.

You don't need to register anything. Again, none of my activities have ever been 'documented.' Do what you're passionate about and do it well. You'll be fine.

 

[LizzyM]

Yes, but that would just be a valuable activity - not necessarily a leadership position.

Now if you started a tutoring organization and led several other students in scheduling and working with other students. Or created a connection with a local school and recruited fellow students to work with you. That would be a leadership position.

You don't need to register anything. Again, none of my activities have ever been 'documented.' Do what you're passionate about and do it well. You'll be fine.

As someone already in medical school, you may not have heard the latest news: every experience listed on the AMCAS needs to have an identified contact along with a phone number or email. So, the pressure on current applicants is to have a faculty moderator, supervisor, employer or other "contact" for each activity.

 

[alwaysaangel]

As someone already in medical school, you may not have heard the latest news: every experience listed on the AMCAS needs to have an identified contact along with a phone number or email. So, the pressure on current applicants is to have a faculty moderator, supervisor, employer or other "contact" for each activity.

I think we had to have that when I applied. But thats not really "documented." You put your boss, school contact, the parent of your student that you tutor, the faculty supervisor of a club, the faculty supervisor of a team.

I dunno, its one thing to have someone who knows what you did to contact but to the OP seems to think it has to be more formal. I guess thats what I was trying to get across.

 

[halethsonofhama]

I started a club on campus that failed hard but I still listed it as leadership.

It was Haiti group dedicated to not let people forget about haiti and to keep the students up to date on their ongoing needs. Unfortunately everybody in the group eventually forgot about haiti and stopped working for it (i made sure to joke about that in my interviews).

I wanted to get involved in haiti relief cause I cared, I started my own student group cause I needed leadership (as opposed to joining one of the many other groups already doing haiti relief).

Now I'm sure adcoms can see right through BS like that, But I made sure to emphasize the good that my group did do before it fizzled. I also was able to explain that the responsibility was real and not just something I made up.

I don't know if this helped my application, but it wasn't a red flag or anything. So if you really can't land a leadership position (like me), come up with a way to make your own position as long as it legitimately is leadership.

 

[sylvanthus]

I started a club on campus that failed hard but I still listed it as leadership.

It was Haiti group dedicated to not let people forget about haiti and to keep the students up to date on their ongoing needs. Unfortunately everybody in the group eventually forgot about haiti and stopped working for it (i made sure to joke about that in my interviews).

I wanted to get involved in haiti relief cause I cared, I started my own student group cause I needed leadership (as opposed to joining one of the many other groups already doing haiti relief).

Now I'm sure adcoms can see right through BS like that, But I made sure to emphasize the good that my group did do before it fizzled. I also was able to explain that the responsibility was real and not just something I made up.

I don't know if this helped my application, but it wasn't a red flag or anything. So if you really can't land a leadership position (like me), come up with a way to make your own position as long as it legitimately is leadership.

This is bad advice. Don't just start some group merely to pad your resume. Pretty sure that people can see through that. Plus, with this example there were so many groups sending aid to Haiti that to just start a group based solely on that looks freakin fishy to me. There are plenty of ways to help without starting a group just to benefit yourself.

 

[hiyaman]

leadership gets differing emphasis depening on the school's adcom leadership. Some put a big emphasis on it and some don't. For some adcom, a specific task that involves directing others such as assignment editor for the school's daily paper would be leadership. Being a team captain on a sports team, an Eagle Scout, supervising and training others on the job or at a volunteer agency would also be leadership.

As you can see, none of this involves club membership.

What about leading an intramural basketball team? Since intramural sports are less important/competitive than if you were on your schools team?Would that be worth mentioning or is that just a hobby?

 

[halethsonofhama]

This is bad advice. Don't just start some group merely to pad your resume. Pretty sure that people can see through that. Plus, with this example there were so many groups sending aid to Haiti that to just start a group based solely on that looks freakin fishy to me. There are plenty of ways to help without starting a group just to benefit yourself.

It's extremely bad advice.

 

[farrago]

As someone already in medical school, you may not have heard the latest news: every experience listed on the AMCAS needs to have an identified contact along with a phone number or email. So, the pressure on current applicants is to have a faculty moderator, supervisor, employer or other "contact" for each activity.

I'm assuming you can still put yourself as contact for hobbies and things you did in solitude in your basement? 😕

 

[mitchlucker]

As someone already in medical school, you may not have heard the latest news: every experience listed on the AMCAS needs to have an identified contact along with a phone number or email. So, the pressure on current applicants is to have a faculty moderator, supervisor, employer or other "contact" for each activity.

What about things you did freshman year that you have lost contact with the people on? Discount it completely?

Or volunteer work at a hospital, would you put the volunteer coordinator or something?

For intramurals and other activities, who would be an appropriate listing?

 

[ReptarBar]

im gonna have fun with the contacts. no way anyone is checking on my activities.

 

[Propylene]

Intramural basketball is certainly better than nothing, but basketball is kind of a blue collar sport and you will find many elitists in the medical world.

I think this is overthinking things... If you enjoy an activity you should go for it.

 

[hiyaman]

What about things you did freshman year that you have lost contact with the people on? Discount it completely?

Or volunteer work at a hospital, would you put the volunteer coordinator or something?

For intramurals and other activities, who would be an appropriate listing?

Hmm I'm interested in this, would it be the coordinator for the intramural sports? lol. I don't think they would remember who I was, or if they even keep the sign in sheets after each quarter.

 

[rhcarolina]

Or volunteer work at a hospital, would you put the volunteer coordinator or something?

I put the down the contact information for the director of volunteering department

For intramurals and other activities, who would be an appropriate listing?

Maybe the captain of your intramural team?

 

[LizzyM]

im gonna have fun with the contacts. no way anyone is checking on my activities.

I chucked an application last cycle because the name of the volunteer coordinator provided as a contact was someone who had left the institution well before the applicant had begun volunteering. It raised enough doubt in my mind to say we didn't need to interview that applicant. So, have fun at your own risk.

There should be a coach, teammate, teacher (piano, art), or someone who can vouch for a meaningful experience.

 

[toff4l]

I had a feeling my intuition was right. It's just so easy to list an activity that never happened or can't be verified.

I still don't understand why a lot of student's list some "so-what" activities.

 

[sciencebooks]

I'm get emails every day from the red cross, animals for humanity habitat something something, pre-med society, and a few other things that I instantly delete.

If I round up, the time I spend deleting those emails is about 3 hrs a week per group.

Seems legit. 👍

qft

 

[juniord]

For a leadership position to be a real and credible position, does it need to be a part of a bigger organization?

Not necessarily; it just needs to involve actually doing something. The easiest way to get involved in a real leadership opportunity is to engage something that's interesting and meaningful to you.

I'm the President of Philosophy Club at my university. It's a small organization with very few regular members, but I've organized two conferences featuring national scholars and many events in between. It's been a blast and an incredible learning experience. Just try to have fun with something and limit the BS on the AMCAS to an Honors society or two ;-)

 

[hiyaman]

I had a feeling my intuition was right. It's just so easy to list an activity that never happened or can't be verified.

I still don't understand why a lot of student's list some "so-what" activities.

People tell me to list my hobbies too so that people can see that i'm not some robot and that I actually have a personality.

 

[HAV000]

As someone already in medical school, you may not have heard the latest news: every experience listed on the AMCAS needs to have an identified contact along with a phone number or email. So, the pressure on current applicants is to have a faculty moderator, supervisor, employer or other "contact" for each activity.

I think the requirement for contact's information is a positive step in terms of accountability. If someone's biggest achievements/leadership positions were more than 4 years ago, adcoms may not check but that doesn't look that great anyway imo - it can be construed as your performance has been declining ever since.

As for trying to fabricate great achievements that are more recent, it's not worth the risk because it only takes one person on adcom, one staff member, to email/call the contact (who is fully expected to remember the candidate), do a web search (e.g. respectable clubs/orgs/awards tend to have websites that list past board members/winners), etc. to generate any doubt or suspicion.

 

[NickNaylor]

Depends entirely on how you present the experience. It'll be blatantly obvious that you haven't had leadership experience if you say you have. But it's certainly possible to make an experience to seem more impressive than it is (and, if you suck at expressing yourself, making a big experience seem unimportant).