China and Eastern Asia DO or go to Med School in Phil?

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FilipinoAmMD

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it might be early for me to think of this... i am still a freshman, doing good with my science courses... but not good in my pre cal class. and i know this will affect my gpa, then it might be tough for me to apply to med shools here in the us...

my first choice is still to get my GPA up to get in to a med school here... but just in case... would you guys recommend me to consider DO or should i just go back home to phil and go to med school there...
 
If you want to practice in the United States, DO is the best option by far, because otherwise you'll be considered an IMG (International Medical Graduate), and because of the health care reform by Barack Obama, there will be a strong localization of doctors in the United States, which means they will prefer doctors who graduated from a medical school in the United States over foreign graduates.

However, if you plan to return to your home country and practice medicine there, then either way is fine. I'm not sure if DO is an accepted degree in the Phillipines, but it's an equally powerful degree equivalent to an MD AND you can choose to do an MD residency with a DO degree, WHICH will be accepted if you go back to the Phillipines.

But look up and do some research on Phillipine medical schools, their requirements, and how they compete internationally. Remember, research is your best friend, and google is research's best friend. They will tell you the truth more than any information you may be hand-fed on this forum (or any other forums) actually.
 
thanks for the info..

about obamas reform, so it wouldnt matter if you are a US citizen. bec you grad at a foreign school...

im still a newbie soo. amm.. what do you mean by getting into a MD residency with a DO degree?

would it be possible for DO to become MD?

I know it doesnt matter... but it doesnt matter to US who knows that DO and MD has really no difference... but what about patients and other people who dont know about DO?

can DO's become cardiovascular surgeons? or EM?
 
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I would suggest try going the DO route first before going overseas. Osteopathic schools have their own residency programs where MD's are not allowed to compete so your chances for residency is better even for competitive fields.
I've seen DO' in many fields (a lot of them are in EM). CVS is more competitive but it is still possible as a DO.
 
thanks for the info..

about obamas reform, so it wouldnt matter if you are a US citizen. bec you grad at a foreign school...

im still a newbie soo. amm.. what do you mean by getting into a MD residency with a DO degree?

would it be possible for DO to become MD?

I know it doesnt matter... but it doesnt matter to US who knows that DO and MD has really no difference... but what about patients and other people who dont know about DO?

can DO's become cardiovascular surgeons? or EM?

To answer the last question, yes. DO's get the same benefits as MD, actually, it's just the name that's different in America. You'll be able to attend MD residencies, and yes surgery and emergency medicine. It's no different in America, it's just... well, since you graduated from an Osteopathic school in America, you hold a DO title rather than an MD and I'm not sure if that will hold you back if you wish to practice in your home country. You have to check with your home country with that. Do some research. Google is your friend.

And one thing to tell you what's good about DO: For DO graduates, you can attend MD residency programs, but MD graduates CAN'T attend DO programs because they're osteopathic medicine EXCLUSIVE. You have your own programs that will guarantee your entry AND you can compete with regular MDs for a spot in their residency and such. If it were not for the lower entry scores and different titles, I'd say DO may hold more benefits than MD.

Btw, titles don't mean anything. In fact, most of the patients don't care as long as you're a good doctor. You can have DO, MD, or in my case (a few years later) MBBS (equivalent to an MD, but it's the BBS at the end that's different; and for god's sake it's a BACHELOR's degree =="). Quoted by a patient my doctor had once: "As long as they get me better, I don't care if they have an MD or DO or whatever the hell they give you so long as it's board certified."
 
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its getting clearer now... im mean really... im just aiming to be a cardiologist, EM, nephrologist, IM, CVS.

another question...
i know this might be a dumb question but...
lets be realistic people need money so...
does DO's get paid the same as MD's?
 
its getting clearer now... im mean really... im just aiming to be a cardiologist, EM, nephrologist, IM, CVS.

another question...
i know this might be a dumb question but...
lets be realistic people need money so...
does DO's get paid the same as MD's?

Of course they do. I told you, it doesn't matter what degree you hold in the United States, as long as you become a doctor and you enter a fellowship/residency in a hospital, they give you the same.

I mean, I've never heard of a hospital who differentiates in payment of a cardiovascular surgeon because he's DO or MD. It depends on how well you practice. If you pass both your licensing and board exams after you get that degree, they don't care.

I told you, there's no difference between DO and MD in terms of rankings. NONE. The only reason some people might think DO is inferior is because since DO is a relatively new concept, DO schools are afraid to make the scores too high that no one will want to enter. To attract more students, they lower the scores to welcome more people. Otherwise, aside from what they teach in their curriculum and a general few concepts, they are THE SAME. The only thing that will differ in pay will be whether you're a good doctor or not. In the end, degrees don't even matter so long as you cure the patients. No one is that petty, because if you've saved a life of someone who thought he/she was dying, they'll hug you and shower you with gifts all the same.

If you're a good doctor, you get good pay. If you're a bad one. You don't get good pay. That's really... it. Degrees, what are they for? Well, after you pass both USMLE/COMLEX and the board certification exams, they serve you nothing, but to show off, and even then they become insignificant in contrast to any research awards, published papers, or whatnot you may have over the years. In the early stages, it may matter between an MD or DO, 10 or a 9. But once you get a lot of experience with hundreds of points, 10 or 9 won't even matter anymore because they are enveloped by the much larger points you already have.

But just because DO have lower entry scores doesn't mean they are uncompetitive. You still need to get good MCAT scores and good GPAs. Lower entry, but still competitive. Keep your grades up, especially organic chemistry. That's a fatal weakness for many MD applicants and many pre-med's (including me, when I was still studying Orgo). Study and study hard. Don't let yourself down, or otherwise you may not even make it to a DO school.
 
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have to agree that the DO route will be a better choice than going abroad and coming back as an IMG. ultimately, you learn the same information with the additional OMM (osteopathic manipulative medicine) and you'll still be able to compete against MDs for residency spots.
 
thank you for all the explination... it is now so much clearer...

im still a freshman so i still have high hopes.. im thinking even if i get a low grade in my pre cal, and make good grades in other subjects specially my science courses, and have a great GPA and high MCAT score... hopefully ill get into an MD program... if not ill do what you guys advised me and try the DO route...

by the way, this might be out of topic, when would you guys recommend taking the MCATS? i work full time and go to school part time, so it makes it hard for me to fit in so much courses in one sem. i have read people taking it after spring in their jr. year.... should i first get all my physics, bio and chem out of the way before taking it?

thnx again in advance
 
then you still have time if you're a freshman still. make sure to be an all around student instead of just being about the gpa and high mcat score. this is probably where i lost out since i had no leadership positions and few extracurricular activities despite plenty of volunteer hours.

most students take their mcat before the end of the summer of their junior year, some even earlier, so that it gives them plenty of time to complete their applications that summer before their senior year. this was around the time period i took my mcat.
 
i think im pretty good with my clinical exp... i have worked in dialysis for two and a half years... then i just got an interview for being an ER tech in one of the hospitals in the area..

dunno how to find a physician to shadow... i just try to get near physicians whenever they do rounds on pts in our clinic ... but thats pretty much it...

as for EC's... now because this is needed... i might as well join the table tennis tournament... they have been asking me to join... but never did...
and maybe one of the religious groups... knights of columbus... and when i transfer might as well join the pre med organization they have at the univ im trying to transfer at.... also the asian american club they have at our campus... hehehe... hopefully this would work... hehehe...
 
thank you for all the explination... it is now so much clearer...

im still a freshman so i still have high hopes.. im thinking even if i get a low grade in my pre cal, and make good grades in other subjects specially my science courses, and have a great GPA and high MCAT score... hopefully ill get into an MD program... if not ill do what you guys advised me and try the DO route...

by the way, this might be out of topic, when would you guys recommend taking the MCATS? i work full time and go to school part time, so it makes it hard for me to fit in so much courses in one sem. i have read people taking it after spring in their jr. year.... should i first get all my physics, bio and chem out of the way before taking it?

thnx again in advance

Actually here's what I would plan:

[Year 1~2]
Run full gear on your grades and extracurricular activities. Most, if not all, what's tested on the MCAT are completed in your 1st two years, including General Chemistry, Organic Chemistry, Physics, and General Biology (Calculus excluded). You must go full gear on these subjects and grind the basics HARD. Otherwise, no amount of self-study guides or review courses can make up for your lack of solid basics.

Also, go for extracurricular activites and have one or two special ones and STICK with it. Admission committees can smell fraud if you enter during your last year just to stick some extracurricular activities in. They'll think you're doing cramming them just for having them, but in reality you never did. Do you have any hobbies? Art? Music? DIYs? Sports? Reading? Join some clubs. I know you have interests. If you have leadership positions, then some bonus points for you! And if possible, start clinically related volunteer work in late year 2 or early 3 year.

[Years 3~4]
This is where I start recommending you starting to prepare for the MCAT. You're done with your courses that are MCAT related and basic knowledge. Now it's time for the two major things geared toward Medical School preparation:

1. MCAT preparation: Start EARLY and prepare EARLY. No matter how many people say they studied in 3 months before they took the MCAT, they either LIED or got bad grades. You cannot review 2 years worth of stuff in just 3 months. Even with prep-courses. You need at least 6 months or even up to a year. I recommend taking the MCAT in either April of your junior year or the summer after your 3rd year, but before your 4th.

Here's a general rule: Review once, and you get MCATs in the low 20s. Review twice, upper 20s to low 30. And If you review three times or more, then you'll get into the upper 30s. For the best review guides, go on the MCAT section of SDN. There are HUNDREDS (if not millions) of threads that ask which prep books, courses, etc are the best. Buy some MCAT practice exams and take them every 1~2 weeks even before you finish reviewing. TAKE them. That'll assess your weakness and give you a general direction. Not taking practice exams are FATAL. You'll never know where you'll land and it's dangerous. Medical Schools will look at all your MCAT scores usually the 1st score will determine your direction. AND you'll be tired and fatigued after the 1st round of the MCAT. Unless you have hell of an endurance, you won't perform better on the 2nd round or 3rd or 4th. People get tired and that's why they pour all their efforts on the first. Take the MCAT once and pour your blood, sweat, and soul into it. Otherwise, you'll regret it and that you took the MCAT multiple times WILL linger over your head (and leave a mark in the Admission committee's profile of you).

2. Clinical Volunteer: As some Adcoms will love to say, "How the !@$# do you expect to enter medical school without having stepped foot in the hospital?" This is for both interviews and pre-medical school learning. You learn about the environment, you learn about what they do, and you learn about the patient-doctor interactions. Also equally important is to find a doctor with a major that you find interest in, such as Cardiovascular surgery. Shadow the doctor (but ask permission first!) and learn about his life and job. That will determine whether you really want to be a doctor or not. And also, it will get you a letter of recommendation from a hospital, which will be a HUGE bonus for your grades.

This is also a good time to find your pre-med committee or career center or whatever the hell they call it and talk to them. They'll assess your qualities and test your interests. Just be yourself and you'll do fine. They'll tell you about medical school, about how to enter, and whether your direction is fine. It's essential you talk to them, because you need a letter of recommendation from them and you need to be on good terms with them. Start early with them, if possible, and get a good relationship with them. Go to their office often with questions or just to chat. If you're friendly with them, they'll be friendly with you. If you are their long time friend, they'll write a letter of recommendation with all their heart. If you just seize your chance at your last year because you need a letter of recommendation from them, then they won't put as much effort into it.

And finally, apply. And apply EARLY. Most medical schools accept students on a rolling basis. Which MEANS they take in students they like as time rolls along. Interviews are offered early. Positions will be filled as time rolls along. Say application begins in June. By July, for a class of 100, there will already be 5~10 positions filled. By August, 20 are filled. Etc... and the later you apply, the more people you will be competing with for a smaller amount of vacancies. As you approach the deadline, all you'll be competing for is for a spot on the waiting list. And even then you're pushed all the way to the back.

Apply for BOTH DO and MD, no matter how high your scores are. Some medical schools will like you and some won't. That's the truth. It's like finding friends. No matter how hard you try, you can't please everyone. There are bound to be some that will hate you. But on the other hand, there will be some that will definitely love you. It's whether you applied broadly enough so that those schools that may like you, you will find,

Get your personal statements and letters of recommendation EARLY. Find the professors that love you most (preferrably in the science area) and push them to write it. Make them meet an early deadline and if they don't meet it, write one yourself and ask them to sign it.

And then... the rest will be in the pre-med subsection and application section. There will be help every cycle. There are the "what are my chances" calculators, etc. And such. Good luck and if you have any more questions, PM me. But not too often to the fact that you're clingy, because I'll get annoyed. Otherwise, have fun at pre-med!