Do per-diems generally get paid more than full-timers?

[Sparda29]

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I'm working FT at hospital A and per-diem at hospital B.

Hospital A pays me $51/hr for afternoon-evenings + benefits.

Hospital B pays me $60/hr for mornings, $66/hr for afternoon-evenings, and $75/hr for overnights. I'm thinking of eventually switching over to full time at hospital B if I have the chance. In general, do full-timers get the same rate as the per-diems?

 

[SkiPharmer]

This is correct...I work PRN at two hospitals and get about $65/hr....u won't make that as a staff. They do that cuz u aren't getting any benefits and u help bail them out when needed....

 

[xiphoid2010]

This is correct...I work PRN at two hospitals and get about $65/hr....u won't make that as a staff. They do that cuz u aren't getting any benefits and u help bail them out when needed....

This.

Besides bring in an extra $1k/month for covering a weekend, it also pads your CV and help with networking. It also may turn into a new career opportunity. For retail pharmacists, desperate DOPs looking for coverage might be the only option for getting some hospital experience. I would recommend it for most younger pharmacists who isn't tied down by a lot of things.

 

[owlegrad]

Yup, it is normal for PRN positions to make more than staff. You have to have some incentive to do it, right?

 

[xiphoid2010]

Yup, it is normal for PRN positions to make more than staff. You have to have some incentive to do it, right?

PRN pay on holidays is $100/hr yo!

 

[owlegrad]

PRN pay on holidays is $100/hr yo!

Sign me up!

 

[Sparda29]

Yup, it is normal for PRN positions to make more than staff. You have to have some incentive to do it, right?

Yeah, the way I see it, picking up 1 shift a month at Hospital B takes me from a Scion FR-S to a BMW M3. 😀😀😀😀

 

[thephoenician88]

This.

Besides bring in an extra $1k/month for covering a weekend, it also pads your CV and help with networking. It also may turn into a new career opportunity. For retail pharmacists, desperate DOPs looking for coverage might be the only option for getting some hospital experience. I would recommend it for most younger pharmacists who isn't tied down by a lot of things.

in order to get a per diem position though you need to have the availability and knowledge correct? You can't have both of those with a retail background. Will a hospital train you?

 

[xiphoid2010]

in order to get a per diem position though you need to have the availability and knowledge correct? You can't have both of those with a retail background. Will a hospital train you?

Knowledge and experience would be great, not as critical as most FTEs since PRNs usually are there to plug staffing gaps. Availability also need not be set in stone, although more available the better. Most of my PRNs work 2-6 shifts a month, weekends, holidays are usually where the gaps are. Other hospitals might need a PRN that work 2-3 days a week, more like a part-timer.

Of course the hospitals are required to given you training and competency assessments. Orientation, formulary, IV, PK, software etc. Of course it's much easier for a hospital pharmacists to hit the ground running.

 

[xiphoid2010]

Sign me up!

Right? Even DOP pay isn't that much. Always let my PRN job know early. July 4th? Sure! Not a significant date on my calendar. Now if they were paying 1.5x on Chinese new year, that might be a tough call.

Now all that glitter can be tempting, but try to do everything in moderation. I have a PRN pharmacist who works 7 on 7 off, then work about 80 hours every 4 weeks at 2 PRN jobs. He's raking in between $190-$200K/yr, but that's some crazy hours!

 

[Sparda29]

in order to get a per diem position though you need to have the availability and knowledge correct? You can't have both of those with a retail background. Will a hospital train you?

There's a pharmacist at my hospital who graduated in 2012, works full time for CVS but per-diem here. She trained for about 6 months since she could only really come in once or twice a month for training.

I'm still training at hospital B but I'm pretty close to being ready to work, it's just a matter of remembering hospital policies and whatnot and getting used to the computer system.

 

[kvl1027]

There's a pharmacist at my hospital who graduated in 2012, works full time for CVS but per-diem here. She trained for about 6 months since she could only really come in once or twice a month for training.

I'm still training at hospital B but I'm pretty close to being ready to work, it's just a matter of remembering hospital policies and whatnot and getting used to the computer system.

I'm per diem at a local hosp and it took me about 6 months to get trained. I only worked one-twice per month. I found the computer system to be easy to figure out, but it's all the policies and protocols that you can only learn from experience.

 

[TheBlaah]

I'm a little curious on how someone goes about finding/applying for per diem hospital jobs.

 

[confettiflyer]

I'm a little curious on how someone goes about finding/applying for per diem hospital jobs.

...seriously?

 

[Sparda29]

I'm a little curious on how someone goes about finding/applying for per diem hospital jobs.

I saw the listing on Indeed.com

 

[MatCauthon]

I think per diem used to pay more, but most of the per diem jobs I saw actually were giving lowball offers to desperate new grads. I did one myself and made only $50/hr, but it was good experience. I'm assuming you guys are using on-call and per diem interchangeably right??

Most of the hospitals in this area are only hiring per diem right now.

 

[TheBlaah]

Well, I guess what I really want to know is how the scheduling works for PRN jobs and what their standards of hiring, never having done such a position myself. I understand that you're generally just hired when their normal employees are off, but are you obligated to work a certain amount of shifts in a given time to remain on the payroll system?

Also, I was just curious since they're usually desperate to get the shift covered, would they be willing to hire new grads/retail pharmacists?

 

[Sparda29]

Well, I guess what I really want to know is how the scheduling works for PRN jobs and what their standards of hiring, never having done such a position myself. I understand that you're generally just hired when their normal employees are off, but are you obligated to work a certain amount of shifts in a given time to remain on the payroll system?

Also, I was just curious since they're usually desperate to get the shift covered, would they be willing to hire new grads/retail pharmacists?

Not sure, I saw this one per-diem pharmacist at my main hospital only twice in the entire 10 months I've been here. Like on Thanksgiving and in January. I think most hospitals generally look for someone with hospital experience when it comes to per-diems. Takes less time to train and are able to do more stuff when working. I hate working with per-diems who have barely any hospital experience. I'm sure the techs at my retail per-diem gig feel that way about me since I suck ass at solving insurance rejects.

There was this one time when I took a look at the schedule and saw that the next day I was working with a per-diem who main job is retail and doesn't know where any of the stuff is kept in my hospital. So the next morning I woke up and upon the first sign of the sniffles/cough I drove down to the doctor, got myself a doctor's note and called out.

 

[confettiflyer]

PRN is the back door to FT work for those in tight markets.

lol, i just used "back door" and "tight" in the same sentence and didn't get a mod warning

 

[xiphoid2010]

I understand that you're generally just hired when their normal employees are off, but are you obligated to work a certain amount of shifts in a given time to remain on the payroll system?

This is company dependent. Ours require at least 1 shift every 3 months to stay on the payroll. If someone haven't worked in 3 months, probably means either they are on the s*it-list or they are no-longer interested/available.

Also, I was just curious since they're usually desperate to get the shift covered, would they be willing to hire new grads/retail pharmacists?

Yes if they are desperate enough. So do you feel lucky?

 

[xiphoid2010]

PRN is the back door to FT work for those in tight markets.

lol, i just used "back door" and "tight" in the same sentence and didn't get a mod warning

Wasn't the plan when I first dove in, but glad that it came out that way.

 

[Sparda29]

This is company dependent. Ours require at least 1 shift every 3 months to stay on the payroll. If someone haven't worked in 3 months, probably means either they are on the s*it-list or they are no-longer interested/available.



Yes if they are desperate enough. So do you feel lucky?

Yup, I remember this one per diem who cursed out a nurse because she came to the pharmacy demanding meds without a proper written order. (She actually had started the cursing first). After that day, we didn't see him called in to cover any shifts.

 

[owlegrad]

Yup, I remember this one per diem who cursed out a nurse because she came to the pharmacy demanding meds without a proper written order. (She actually had started the cursing first). After that day, we didn't see him called in to cover any shifts.

Yeah, nurses can be worse than any customer ever thought about being IMO.

 

[Sparda29]

Yeah, nurses can be worse than any customer ever thought about being IMO.

I had that situation happen to me (nurse wanted me to make amiodarone bolus + drip without a proper order, she was freaking out because the patient was a 37 year old who was about to crash) but I just stayed calm and called the director at this house at 1030PM on a Sunday night, he told her exactly what I told her, "open the crash cart". For some reason the nurses here think that the crash cart can only be used after someone codes.

 

[confettiflyer]

I had that situation happen to me (nurse wanted me to make amiodarone bolus + drip without a proper order, she was freaking out because the patient was a 37 year old who was about to crash) but I just stayed calm and called the director at this house at 1030PM on a Sunday night, he told her exactly what I told her, "open the crash cart". For some reason the nurses here think that the crash cart can only be used after someone codes.

you seriously called your director for that?? I would have stood my ground and shot my supervisor an email the next morning.

 

[Sparda29]

you seriously called your director for that?? I would have stood my ground and shot my supervisor an email the next morning.

She actually asked me to call him, rofl!

 

[cycloketocaine]

She actually asked me to call him, rofl!

Still not cool, gotta respect the chain of command....

 

[Sparda29]

Still not cool, gotta respect the chain of command....

Really? You guys don't call the director when he's/she's at home? Who do you call when you don't know what to do? Especially when there's a nurse manager at your window going bat**** insane jumping up and down, banging on the plexiglass yelling that if the patient dies it's on us because we didn't give them the drugs.

 

[Carboxide]

Really? You guys don't call the director when he's/she's at home? Who do you call when you don't know what to do? Especially when there's a nurse manager at your window going bat**** insane jumping up and down, banging on the plexiglass yelling that if the patient dies it's on us because we didn't give them the drugs.

Call security...

 

[Sparda29]

Call security...

Our security office is right next door to us, like our window faces into their office. They saw the whole thing and just sat there, lmao. Probably the most incompetent security I've ever seen.

 

[confettiflyer]

Really? You guys don't call the director when he's/she's at home? Who do you call when you don't know what to do? Especially when there's a nurse manager at your window going bat**** insane jumping up and down, banging on the plexiglass yelling that if the patient dies it's on us because we didn't give them the drugs.

you exercise your authority as a pharmacist and order them to open the crash cart

hell send your technician to open the damn crash cart

anything but call your director...geez

 

[ucrx]

Really? You guys don't call the director when he's/she's at home? Who do you call when you don't know what to do? Especially when there's a nurse manager at your window going bat**** insane jumping up and down, banging on the plexiglass yelling that if the patient dies it's on us because we didn't give them the drugs.

We have a manager on call at all times for those things. This way they know they might get called. I've seen a similar system abused at another place I worked, so I always emphasize to never call when it's something relatively minor or that can wait. The person on the other end is either not at the hospital or doing their usual job and handling these requests on top of it.

 

[MackandBlues]

Yea we have a supervisor on call and an operations manager on call (the supervisor's boss). but we also have an evening shift supervisor during the week.

 

[Sparda29]

We have a manager on call at all times for those things. This way they know they might get called. I've seen a similar system abused at another place I worked, so I always emphasize to never call when it's something relatively minor or that can wait. The person on the other end is either not at the hospital or doing their usual job and handling these requests on top of it.

Ah okay. We don't have anyone between the staff pharmacists and the director other than the clinical pharmacist. Director told us not to contact the clinical pharmacist with issues and only himself.