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CarribMDbythec

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This is a warning for all of you "get outta jail free" carribean-hopefuls who are thinking about going seaside for their medical training.
I graduated from SGU in 2006 after doing clinical rotations in the U.S mostly and in the U.K. All my life I wanted to be a surgeon, but after going to a prestigious New England school, had a mediocre GPA AND mcat. I didn't want to take time off, so I went to SGU for med school. Everyone said if I worked hard, I'd beokay. Right? WRONG!!!!! i Graduated top of my class, and killed the boards. So tell me why I couldnt get any surgery residency's, even in gen.? DO NOT BELIVE WHAT THEY TELL YOU!!! Everyone I graduated with is either in pediatrics, primary care, emergency med, or rehab. The school will tell you they have a deal with NYHHS and you will have a good shot at a strong residency, but you do not. My father has been a cardio-vasc surgeon in NJ my whole life, and even his connections could not get me aresidency in surgery. So take my unsolicited advice: IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE A PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN, DO NOT GO TO SGU...IT WILL NOT HAPPEN!👎
 
I am forewarned,,,thanks
 
CarribMDbythec said:
This is a warning for all of you "get outta jail free" carribean-hopefuls who are thinking about going seaside for their medical training.
I graduated from SGU in 2006 after doing clinical rotations in the U.S mostly and in the U.K. All my life I wanted to be a surgeon, but after going to a prestigious New England school, had a mediocre GPA AND mcat. I didn't want to take time off, so I went to SGU for med school. Everyone said if I worked hard, I'd beokay. Right? WRONG!!!!! i Graduated top of my class, and killed the boards. So tell me why I couldnt get any surgery residency's, even in gen.? DO NOT BELIVE WHAT THEY TELL YOU!!! Everyone I graduated with is either in pediatrics, primary care, emergency med, or rehab. The school will tell you they have a deal with NYHHS and you will have a good shot at a strong residency, but you do not. My father has been a cardio-vasc surgeon in NJ my whole life, and even his connections could not get me aresidency in surgery. So take my unsolicited advice: IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE A PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN, DO NOT GO TO SGU...IT WILL NOT HAPPEN!👎
Click to expand...

you can be totally right but you can not generalize. On the SGU, Ross, AUC, ... there are 10 or more matched each school with Surgery, 1-2 radiology, Ross had 2 ortho 2 years ago ...

So ... 😕
 
How do we know you're telling the truth? It seems odd to me that someone would become a new member and immediately post such a thing.

If it is true, I'm sorry that you are having so much difficulty post-med school.
 
silverlining1 said:
How do we know you're telling the truth? It seems odd to me that someone would become a new member and immediately post such a thing.

If it is true, I'm sorry that you are having so much difficulty post-med school.
Click to expand...

What seems most odd to me is that the OP is just posting now, in his first post, and match would have been back in March...

Fact of the matter is some carib grads do okay and some not as good. If you want to practice in the US, your path of least resistance is going to be to attend med school in the US.
 

Come on man...you gotta know that Eazy E spells it with a Z
 
CarribMDbythec said:
This is a warning for all of you "get outta jail free" carribean-hopefuls who are thinking about going seaside for their medical training.
I graduated from SGU in 2006 after doing clinical rotations in the U.S mostly and in the U.K. All my life I wanted to be a surgeon, but after going to a prestigious New England school, had a mediocre GPA AND mcat. I didn't want to take time off, so I went to SGU for med school. Everyone said if I worked hard, I'd beokay. Right? WRONG!!!!! i Graduated top of my class, and killed the boards. So tell me why I couldnt get any surgery residency's, even in gen.? DO NOT BELIVE WHAT THEY TELL YOU!!! Everyone I graduated with is either in pediatrics, primary care, emergency med, or rehab. The school will tell you they have a deal with NYHHS and you will have a good shot at a strong residency, but you do not. My father has been a cardio-vasc surgeon in NJ my whole life, and even his connections could not get me aresidency in surgery. So take my unsolicited advice: IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE A PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN, DO NOT GO TO SGU...IT WILL NOT HAPPEN!👎
Click to expand...

Hey atleast whoever landed that emergency medicine position is going to be making over 200k after they graduate...Chill.. Life has definitely not come to an end for you... Good Luck!
 
Does anyone else think those match lists might be a little fake?? All I have ever heard is people saying that FMD's can't match into specality residency in the US, but those don't support that. So either the OP is full of it and didn't match bc he didn't actually rock as much as he said, or the lists are a little off/to draw people to sgu. Or maybe the truth lies inbetween??
 
JaggerPlate said:
Does anyone else think those match lists might be a little fake?? All I have ever heard is people saying that FMD's can't match into specality residency in the US, but those don't support that. So either the OP is full of it and didn't match bc he didn't actually rock as much as he said, or the lists are a little off/to draw people to sgu. Or maybe the truth lies inbetween??
Click to expand...

I don't know that the lists are fake, but I do think some caribbean schools (not necessarilly this one) play games, in terms of holding people back a year and/or attrition, with who is "allowed" to sit for Step 1 and apply for the match when, such that the folks who don't make the cut never really appear in the statistics.

There are people who use the caribbean as a "second chance" and do great. But you certainly don't get the same opportunities as you would coming from a US school -- it is a harder road by any measure.
 
I just met 2 radiologist residents from St. George's today....

from what I've heard, it's pretty hard to match into Rads. If you do well in class, do well on the boards, and are involved, even with a Carib school, you have a chance.
 
CarribMDbythec said:
This is a warning for all of you "get outta jail free" carribean-hopefuls who are thinking about going seaside for their medical training.
I graduated from SGU in 2006 after doing clinical rotations in the U.S mostly and in the U.K. All my life I wanted to be a surgeon, but after going to a prestigious New England school, had a mediocre GPA AND mcat. I didn't want to take time off, so I went to SGU for med school. Everyone said if I worked hard, I'd beokay. Right? WRONG!!!!! i Graduated top of my class, and killed the boards. So tell me why I couldnt get any surgery residency's, even in gen.? DO NOT BELIVE WHAT THEY TELL YOU!!! Everyone I graduated with is either in pediatrics, primary care, emergency med, or rehab. The school will tell you they have a deal with NYHHS and you will have a good shot at a strong residency, but you do not. My father has been a cardio-vasc surgeon in NJ my whole life, and even his connections could not get me aresidency in surgery. So take my unsolicited advice: IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE A PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN, DO NOT GO TO SGU...IT WILL NOT HAPPEN!👎
Click to expand...

well at least you have an M.D. Sorry to hear the bad news. What are your plans now??
 
medguy83 said:
well at least you have an M.D. Sorry to hear the bad news. What are your plans now??
Click to expand...

This doesnt mean anything if in the end you end up in someplace you dont want to be. It's great that you will never be broke in life with the M.D., but will you be happy is another question all together. Good Luck OP, hopefully you will get that surgery residency whether it be down the line
 
john-bolton-douche.jpg
 
CarribMDbythec said:
This is a warning for all of you "get outta jail free" carribean-hopefuls who are thinking about going seaside for their medical training.
I graduated from SGU in 2006 after doing clinical rotations in the U.S mostly and in the U.K. All my life I wanted to be a surgeon, but after going to a prestigious New England school, had a mediocre GPA AND mcat. I didn't want to take time off, so I went to SGU for med school. Everyone said if I worked hard, I'd beokay. Right? WRONG!!!!! i Graduated top of my class, and killed the boards. So tell me why I couldnt get any surgery residency's, even in gen.? DO NOT BELIVE WHAT THEY TELL YOU!!! Everyone I graduated with is either in pediatrics, primary care, emergency med, or rehab. The school will tell you they have a deal with NYHHS and you will have a good shot at a strong residency, but you do not. My father has been a cardio-vasc surgeon in NJ my whole life, and even his connections could not get me aresidency in surgery. So take my unsolicited advice: IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE A PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN, DO NOT GO TO SGU...IT WILL NOT HAPPEN!👎
Click to expand...

ughhh, its says that u joined august 2007, this was ur firts post and says u r PRE-MEDICAL. SO U R A LIAR!!!!!
 
CarribMDbythec said:
This is a warning for all of you "get outta jail free" carribean-hopefuls who are thinking about going seaside for their medical training.
I graduated from SGU in 2006 after doing clinical rotations in the U.S mostly and in the U.K. All my life I wanted to be a surgeon, but after going to a prestigious New England school, had a mediocre GPA AND mcat. I didn't want to take time off, so I went to SGU for med school. Everyone said if I worked hard, I'd beokay. Right? WRONG!!!!! i Graduated top of my class, and killed the boards. So tell me why I couldnt get any surgery residency's, even in gen.? DO NOT BELIVE WHAT THEY TELL YOU!!! Everyone I graduated with is either in pediatrics, primary care, emergency med, or rehab. The school will tell you they have a deal with NYHHS and you will have a good shot at a strong residency, but you do not. My father has been a cardio-vasc surgeon in NJ my whole life, and even his connections could not get me aresidency in surgery. So take my unsolicited advice: IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO BE A PRIMARY CARE PHYSICIAN, DO NOT GO TO SGU...IT WILL NOT HAPPEN!👎
Click to expand...

What's wrong with primary care medicine? I think it's a fantastic role for an M.D. to play. True, they typically don't make the money that specialists and surgeons make (although ER physicians do quite well), but it has its definite perks: 1. you get to know your patients well, 2. you get to see their care from start to finish, 3. you get the opportunity to treat as wide a variety of diseases as you like (and feel comfortable treating), 4. you get to refer to specialists the problems you do not want to treat, and 5. for the most part, the nature of the work is less stressful and the hours are better (if that's important to you).

As a primary care physician, you are not shoe-horned into any particular role.

Moreover, and as I understand it, from an internal medicine residency you can apply to cardiology programs (if you want cardiology).
 
wow has competition for carribean med schools risen that much that we have to scare people out of it now?
 
newlifedrj said:
Hey atleast whoever landed that emergency medicine position is going to be making over 200k after they graduate...Chill.. Life has definitely not come to an end for you... Good Luck!
Click to expand...

Seriously, EM is more competitive than surgery anyways so the fact that anybody looks at matching into it as a personal failure is humerous. And EM physicians make more than most general surgeons but put in about half the hours.
 
Panda Bear said:
Seriously, EM is more competitive than surgery anyways so the fact that anybody looks at matching into it as a personal failure is humerous. And EM physicians make more than most general surgeons but put in about half the hours.
Click to expand...
Oh wow - I knew about the good salary of EM physicians, but I did not know that a) it is more competitive than surgery and b) has better hours. Can you direct me to some resources to read more about going into EM? I already know about your blog.
 
silverlining1 said:
Oh wow - I knew about the good salary of EM physicians, but I did not know that a) it is more competitive than surgery and b) has better hours. Can you direct me to some resources to read more about going into EM? I already know about your blog.
Click to expand...

Hellz yea. EM has MUCH better hours.....well, hour totals. I've seen numbers ranging from 120-180 hours a month being the average...but panda or one of the other guys would know more about that. Take mine with a grain of salt. 😉 No call is the best part of that gig I'd say.

Panda, some reason I think you should have my avatar. I have another one with a pandabear and a flamethrower that might work too. 😉
 
MossPoh said:
😉 No call is the best part of that gig I'd say.
Click to expand...
Holy crap! No call? (I'm kind of clueless about time commitments of different specialties, so I'd love to hear about a resource to learn about this.)

I'm a woman who plans to be married and have children, and I want to have time for them. I'm interested in surgery, so the physicians I've talked to have suggested that I look for subspecialties with few emergencies, such as breast cancer surgery.

EDIT: I found one good resource http://www.medschoolready.com/app/specialtychoice.asp but more suggestions would be appreciated. Sorry for thread hijacking 🙁

EDIT 2: http://www.smbs.buffalo.edu/RESIDENT/CareerCounseling/main_menu.htm Another good resource.
 
I think the basic point is to avoid going to the islands if at all possible and I agree with that advice.
 
shaggybill said:
Why are Caribbean schools frowned upon anyways? I would think that spending 4 years on a tropical island would actually be a coveted ordeal.

Guess not...
Click to expand...

You've obviously never lived on a carib island. There are of course both pros and cons, but it's definitely not what you imagine it to be.
 
Yes, baby doll.

As for Shaggybill's comment, the tropics are only nice if you want to get wasted every day. There are no waves to surf, no mountains to ski, and if you're in jamaica, the margaritas are six dollars a glass.
 
Well is there any kind of discrepancy between Carib MDs who were US citizens and those who were foraign grads?

Two of the three surgeons in my small town are both graduates from the University of the West Indies and were Jamaican citizens. Is it harder for US citizens from SGU, Ross, AUC, or AUA to get competitive residencies than it is for non-citizens from the schools in their own caribbean countries like Cuba, Dominican Republic, or West Indies.
 
littlealex said:
Yes, baby doll.

As for Shaggybill's comment, the tropics are only nice if you want to get wasted every day. There are no waves to surf, no mountains to ski, and if you're in jamaica, the margaritas are six dollars a glass.
Click to expand...


I don't drink. IF they are island how come there are no waves there?

Sorry I was a little sleepy.
 
jbrice1639 said:
my guess would be misuse of the apostrophe.
Click to expand...

whenever i give grammar/punctuation corrections, everyone yells at me. how come you get LOLs??

why do people hate me?
 
Panda Bear said:
Seriously, EM is more competitive than surgery anyways so the fact that anybody looks at matching into it as a personal failure is humerous. And EM physicians make more than most general surgeons but put in about half the hours.
Click to expand...

:laugh:

Is that the funny bone? I attribute this misspelling to the fact that you are a doctor.
 
Why anybody would say "Oh, I'll go to the Carribean instead of taking a year and re-applying" is totally beyond me. As if a year (or 2) matters at all in the grand scheme of things.
 
jhu1 said:
this is SGU 2007 mach : http://www.sgu.edu/ERD/ResidPost.nsf/BYPGY?OpenView&RestrictToCategory=PGY1&Count=-1


Man they have 2 Ortho 😕 , more than 20 Surgeries ...

Come on man!
Click to expand...

Just a word of warning - be very careful about what you make of things like this.

Make sure you know whether the "matches" they're advertising were prelim or categorical. When you match for residency, many programs & specialties will match you for your PGY-2 year (categorical), but for them to take you as a resident you'll need to match for a PGY-1 (intern, preliminary) year as well. It is possible to match only prelim or only categorical. Prelim surgery spots are really not competitive, because you don't have any guarantee of any surgery residency training, they've just agreed to keep you on for your surg internship year. So when I see 20 not that impressive surgery "matches" from SGU, I'm wondering:
1) how many are only prelim,
2) how many ranked surgery programs higher on their rank list than their actual match (how many tried for surgery and didn't get it),
3) what the average step I score was for those who matched (if it's 20 points above the national average, that tells me they had to really be exceptional),
4) how many students graduated with them (if it's really 20/800...see below, that's 2.5%, whereas the national average % of graduating seniors in the U.S. matching surgery is ~double that, and that's just for general surgery)
5) when they say "surgery", do they mean general surgery? I'm sure they'd list it if they matched people into surgical subspecialties, but keep in mind the surgical specialties include: general surgery, neurosurgery, plastic surgery, otolaryngology, OB/GYN, ophthalmology, urology, orthopedics.

Further, SGU has over 3,300 students in the medical school - that means over 800 per year.....wow. 20/800 = 2.5%. 2/800 = 0.25% (someone said 2 ortho matches). Now I'm not sure whether these numbers are correct, but the cynical appraisal doesn't paint a great picture. If you're considering caribbean schools as a sort of last resort, just be informed about what to expect and what your options will be and give it your best. If you think they're going to give you opportunities equivalent to those seen in the U.S., I wouldn't be so sure.

...sorry, I don't particularly care about this topic one way or the other, I just notice a lot of "SGU has a great match list!" type comments floating around and I'm not sure that it's accurate. My advice to any premed who's trying to interpret Match lists (if you must...) is to read up as much as possible on it. Head over to the residency forums and search for threads (don't post threads asking, "hey I'm thinking about doing ______, can I get a surg residency?" those are too plentiful) about matching, that reference stats, look up match results from the NRMP and San Fransisco Match, and realize it's a very subjective process and there's only so much you can know outside of these sources that isn't anecdotal and/or completely unhelpful. And when you're reading Match lists (if you must...), don't try to gauge how "competitive" the programs matched into were and judge the school based on that - it's just silly. I mean you can roughly tell the difference between the matches at Cornell and the matches at UND as far as "impressive" goes, but honestly you probably have no idea otherwise. The names can get confusing and misleading.

I think I just rambled.
 
Panda Bear said:
Seriously, EM is more competitive than surgery anyways so the fact that anybody looks at matching into it as a personal failure is humerous. And EM physicians make more than most general surgeons but put in about half the hours.
Click to expand...

I agree completely but have to stipulate that general surgery is a dying field, and most specialists that come out of gen surg residencies after an additional fellowship (ct, gi, you know them all of course) do make more $$ than EM, as do most surgeons that begin with their own residency like ortho, nsgy, and ent. The hours and call and lifestyle in general, however, cannot be debated, EM wins. Not that I'm going into it, actually.
 
Northerner said:
Further, SGU has over 3,300 students in the medical school - that means over 800 per year.....wow. 20/800 = 2.5%. 2/800 = 0.25% (someone said 2 ortho matches). Now I'm not sure whether these numbers are correct, but the cynical appraisal doesn't paint a great picture.
Click to expand...

Well, the school is not divided equally into 4 years of students based on the numbers I've seen; I think some people get "stuck" along the way. This may be reflective of the kind of games I've suggested above that some caribbean schools play -- where folks don't get to advance, sit for boards, or enter the match unless and until they are among the more competitive, giving very skewed statistics of success. So the percentage of "seniors" getting surgery might be higher than you suggest, but the odds of freshman to get to this point might be significantly worse.
 
My cousin went to a really good small liberal arts college and came out with a 3.0/ 30 MCAT. He went to SGU and now is in psych res. It worked out okay for him. He did say that living on the island really sucked and that the police close at 6pm!
 
There are plenty of anecdotal examples of caribbean success stories. Indeed, even the stats seem to support that caribbean grads have a pretty good shot at accomplishing their goals (as long as they're reasonable). I don't think anyone here is saying that you can't get a good education, that you can't get a pretty good residency, or that you can't be a good doctor coming out of a caribbean medical school. You can.

It does nothing, however, to delineate the differences between U.S. MD schools and caribbean MD schools to pre-med students by providing one, unsubstantiated example of anything from an anonymous source (and without details). So I think I take issue with seeming misrepresentations. Every time caribbean MD schools come up as a topic someone chimes in with, "No, you can get NSG from SGU!" and they give a link or some anecdotal example of someone who did. It doesn't tell us anything.
 
Law2Doc said:
Well, the school is not divided equally into 4 years of students based on the numbers I've seen; I think some people get "stuck" along the way. This may be reflective of the kind of games I've suggested above that some caribbean schools play -- where folks don't get to advance, sit for boards, or enter the match unless and until they are among the more competitive, giving very skewed statistics of success. So the percentage of "seniors" getting surgery might be higher than you suggest, but the odds of freshman to get to this point might be significantly worse.
Click to expand...

I see what you're saying.

Along similar lines, I'm curious how many graduating students are matching. If both of the ortho matches are scrambles from the class of 2005 who've been out doing research and internships/additional training, that's different than 2 graduating seniors matching straight out of med school.

edit: I just noticed that the OP misspelled "caribbean" (or his abbreviation) in several different places. Is it possible to spend 4 years in a place without learning how it's spelled?
 
Northerner said:
edit: I just noticed that the OP misspelled "caribbean" (or his abbreviation) in several different places. Is it possible to spend 4 years in a place without learning how it's spelled?
Click to expand...

absolutely; witness plenty of folks spelling berkeley as "berkley" or "berkely."
 
Whether or not the OP is 100 percent accurate, the fact is that foreign grads do face a tougher road when it comes to obtaining a compettitive residency but it is not impossible. You are fooling yourself if you think you are on a equal playing field as a US grad however.
 
If you can get into a program in the states, stay here. If you can't and your only option is the Carribean, go there.
 
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