Don't know what to do

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Medme22

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I'm currently in a PhD program and I was thinking about doing PharmD/ PhD. However the admissions committee wants me to wait until after I finish my PhD( gave no reason why). Doing both would've been an extra 2 years added on to the 2 I have remaining in my PhD program. Should I cut my losses and just do the PharmD program once I finish my PhD program, stick with the PhD program or just stop my PhD program and switch over to PharmD.
 
Is there anything else you are passionate about? I think you already know what the prospects are for PhDs these days so we don't need to have that conversation, but what exactly do you plan to do with the dual degrees? Pharmacy, as a field, is going through many painful changes. Merges, store closures, buyouts,etc. Its messy right now dude. I really hope you are not looking at it as your "bread and butter" job in addition to research. Do not be deceived. I cannot in good conscience say that pharmacy is a guarantee anymore. Sorry.
There has to be something else you are excited about man....be careful with this one...BE VERY CAREFUL.
You didn't start your school as a PharmD/PhD student. Maybe that is why they want you to wait? I dunno. You are probably in your third or fourth year of grad school. Approaching the end. Maybe that is the reason too?
 
Shazzy1228 said:
Is there anything else you are passionate about? I think you already know what the prospects are for PhDs these days so we don't need to have that conversation, but what exactly do you plan to do with the dual degrees? Pharmacy, as a field, is going through many painful changes. Merges, store closures, buyouts,etc. Its messy right now dude. I really hope you are not looking at it as your "bread and butter" job in addition to research. Do not be deceived. I cannot in good conscience say that pharmacy is a guarantee anymore. Sorry.
There has to be something else you are excited about man....be careful with this one...BE VERY CAREFUL.
You didn't start your school as a PharmD/PhD student. Maybe that is why they want you to wait? I dunno. You are probably in your third or fourth year of grad school. Approaching the end. Maybe that is the reason too?
Click to expand...
I love to help people. Medicine and the healthcare field has always been a passion of mine. I've heard that PhDs job security isn't the best so I wanted something to fall back on which is why I wanted to do pharmacy. I know that the pharmacy profession isn't the best right now and by the time I finish my PhD program it will probably be worse. I'm actually in my 2nd year but I just don't know what to do. I enjoy research but I want something more clinical. I want to be able to have something to fall back on if the PhD doesn't produce the opportunities that I would like. I thought about dentistry at one point
 
What is your Ph.D in? If it's not your passion, don't do it. Ph.Ds are much harder to get than Pharm.Ds since they can be upwards of 5,6, or 7 years especially if what you are working on doesn't come out right. But Pharm.D isn't a bright path either. Do what you are passionate about, so when things get hard, some part of you will say "keep going".
 
EyeTeeFarmer said:
What is your Ph.D in? If it's not your passion, don't do it. Ph.Ds are much harder to get than Pharm.Ds since they can be upwards of 5,6, or 7 years especially if what you are working on doesn't come out right. But Pharm.D isn't a bright path either. Do what you are passionate about, so when things get hard, some part of you will say "keep going".
Click to expand...
I'm getting my PhD in pharmacology... I like doing research but I want to do more clinical research. And right both aren't bright paths but I don't really know which would be better being that I'm already two years into my program.
 
You love to help people. It also seems that you are a critical thinker and can come up with your own ideas(I hope so? You are a grad student). Those who are successful in the tech industry must have the same qualities.
Ok storytime. I know a former grad student who was nervous about the prospects of her PhD program in pharmacology as well. Pharmacy was in slightly better shape then, but not by much. She sat down and thought about what she really likes to do: she just likes solving problems and creating ideas. Entrepreneurs do that when they launch their own startups. She did some reading on startup tech companies and realized that professionals at places like Google and Apple MUST be innovative and look for ways to solve problems. As far as I am concerned, they help people everyday by creating apps to make our lives a little easier. She works at Google now as a software engineer😉. It was a major and difficult switch indeed, but it seems to have been for the best. She still feels like a scientist to some extent as an engineer and as a Google employee. She eventually wants to start her own company one day.
Am I saying you should be a software engineer? Nah. I am saying to examine the "bare bones" of what is that you really love and its feasibility(relative job prospects).
Good luck:happy:
And don't even think about that pharmacy:rage:
 
Medme22 said:
I want something to fall back on if the PhD doesn't guarantee me a job
Click to expand...
Then get the PharmD and then tell me how well you "fall back" into a job

You will likely keep "falling "
 
If you want something to fall back on, learn how to code or explore bioinformatics. Coding is a great skill to have that can help you land all sorts of different jobs, including positions with pharma companies and biotech.

A PhD graduate doesn't have the best job prospects right now. Many get the PhD with the hopes of becoming a professor, but the jobs just aren't there. If you wanted to teach, you're looking at doing a post doc or two and then being an adjunct until something better comes along or the tenured professors finally retire. There are jobs available in industry, but you're going to have to be in California or Massachusetts for many of those. I'm from Boston and our biotech scene is huge and constantly expanding, but then you have to deal with the cost of living here as well and realizing that you may not be making 6 figs straight out of your program. An ex boyfriend of mine's father has a PhD and works for a pharma company. He's been in the industry for 20 years now and makes just around $120k a year. He most certainly wasn't making that kind of money fresh out of his program. There's no reason for these companies to pay a brand new PhD graduate such a high wage when there's so many clamoring for the same position and willing to accept a lower pay. Be aware though that these jobs are a lot more hours than just 40 hours a week, 9-5 living. If you aren't passionate about your research then the next 3-4 years are going to be rough for you. I have a lot of friends pursuing a PhD right now, and only those who are absolutely 100% in love with doing science are having a good time (albeit still struggling) in their programs.

I've considered a PhD in the past, as well as medical school, but I realized that the PhD just doesn't offer the clinical aspect that I want and the MD is much too much of a commitment for me. I'm aware of the struggling field that I'll be facing in 4 years when I graduate from my PharmD program, but this is a risk I am willing to take. No job is just handed to you straight out of school, and anybody who goes around telling you engineers and computer scientists are easily making 6 figs upon graduation from college is full of ****. Most students graduate from "just okay" universities, and they aren't going to be making the same wages they'd get as an MIT graduate working in the Bay area for Google. That same ex I mentioned earlier graduated from a "just okay" state school with a BS in mechanical engineering. His first job paid him just around $50k. So if you get anything out of this wall of text, it's to really sit down and think about what you want from life and your career. The closest you're going to get to guaranteed job security is to have an MD, and even then who knows what could happen to their wages in the future. Just look to how little doctors are paid through the NHS in the UK to see what could happen in the case of single payer healthcare.
 
Shazzy1228 said:
You love to help people. It also seems that you are a critical thinker and can come up with your own ideas(I hope so? You are a grad student). Those who are successful in the tech industry must have the same qualities.
Ok storytime. I know a former grad student who was nervous about the prospects of her PhD program in pharmacology as well. Pharmacy was in slightly better shape then, but not by much. She sat down and thought about what she really likes to do: she just likes solving problems and creating ideas. Entrepreneurs do that when they launch their own startups. She did some reading on startup tech companies and realized that professionals at places like Google and Apple MUST be innovative and look for ways to solve problems. As far as I am concerned, they help people everyday by creating apps to make our lives a little easier. She works at Google now as a software engineer😉. It was a major and difficult switch indeed, but it seems to have been for the best. She still feels like a scientist to some extent as an engineer and as a Google employee. She eventually wants to start her own company one day.
Am I saying you should be a software engineer? Nah. I am saying to examine the "bare bones" of what is that you really love and its feasibility(relative job prospects).
Good luck:happy:
And don't even think about that pharmacy:rage:
Click to expand...
I just don't know if I'm as passionate about research as I was when I first started the program. I could always do something else when I finish my PhD but I feel like it would be a waste of time
 
Rukn said:
Then get the PharmD and then tell me how well you "fall back" into a job

You will likely keep "falling "
Click to expand...
Pharmacy just seems to be on my mind. I see the state of pharmacy and how's it dooming as we speak and I don't know why I still want to do it when I know the job outlook is horrible
 
med77 said:
If you want something to fall back on, learn how to code or explore bioinformatics. Coding is a great skill to have that can help you land all sorts of different jobs, including positions with pharma companies and biotech.

A PhD graduate doesn't have the best job prospects right now. Many get the PhD with the hopes of becoming a professor, but the jobs just aren't there. If you wanted to teach, you're looking at doing a post doc or two and then being an adjunct until something better comes along or the tenured professors finally retire. There are jobs available in industry, but you're going to have to be in California or Massachusetts for many of those. I'm from Boston and our biotech scene is huge and constantly expanding, but then you have to deal with the cost of living here as well and realizing that you may not be making 6 figs straight out of your program. An ex boyfriend of mine's father has a PhD and works for a pharma company. He's been in the industry for 20 years now and makes just around $120k a year. He most certainly wasn't making that kind of money fresh out of his program. There's no reason for these companies to pay a brand new PhD graduate such a high wage when there's so many clamoring for the same position and willing to accept a lower pay. Be aware though that these jobs are a lot more hours than just 40 hours a week, 9-5 living. If you aren't passionate about your research then the next 3-4 years are going to be rough for you. I have a lot of friends pursuing a PhD right now, and only those who are absolutely 100% in love with doing science are having a good time (albeit still struggling) in their programs.

I've considered a PhD in the past, as well as medical school, but I realized that the PhD just doesn't offer the clinical aspect that I want and the MD is much too much of a commitment for me. I'm aware of the struggling field that I'll be facing in 4 years when I graduate from my PharmD program, but this is a risk I am willing to take. No job is just handed to you straight out of school, and anybody who goes around telling you engineers and computer scientists are easily making 6 figs upon graduation from college is full of ****. Most students graduate from "just okay" universities, and they aren't going to be making the same wages they'd get as an MIT graduate working in the Bay area for Google. That same ex I mentioned earlier graduated from a "just okay" state school with a BS in mechanical engineering. His first job paid him just around $50k. So if you get anything out of this wall of text, it's to really sit down and think about what you want from life and your career. The closest you're going to get to guaranteed job security is to have an MD, and even then who knows what could happen to their wages in the future. Just look to how little doctors are paid through the NHS in the UK to see what could happen in the case of single payer healthcare.
Click to expand...
See I can't see myself as a professor and I would love a job in industry but its location for me. I don't want to move to California or Boston. I would like to be in the south but I don't know how the job outlook is in that area. I thought about PA school, dental school and MD/DO but I feel as if it's too late. I just want a good career once I finish but I don't know if my passion in research is still there. I could possibly explore one of the above options once I finish my program but that's more school. I've been in school for 7 years and I just don't know what I want to do and what I need to do.
 
Rukn said:
Forget PharmD
Click to expand...
It's getting worse by the day it seems. With all these mergers and at least 15,000 graduates a year I don't know which way that career is headed
 
Medme,
I think all of us have given you as much feedback as we could. Its now time to figure what you are going to do. Your grad program should be connected to an undergraduate campus. Maybe talk to a career center there. I just recently made the decision not to pursue research as an undergrad after painfully thinking things over in my head. Visiting my school's career center and talking to advising offices for the various colleges at my university helped a lot. I am gravitating towards the world of business now.
We have given you the tools now medme. Go off and learn and make some tough decisions. No more "I don't know" or " I'm not sure".
And stop looking for a guaranteed gig. It doesn't exist anymore. You may have to make another switch later in life. This is just the reality of today's market. Okay?
 
Seriously,

you're like that indecisive kid who keeps juggling between two paths and end up never doing anything. nothing in life is guaranteed. there's no guaranteed of a job in either field. do what makes you happy...or just pick one and run with it. if job prospect is all you're worried about then do PA or NP...I can't see primary care going away and mid levels are currently eating the MD's lunch when it comes to primary care.
 
Shazzy1228 said:
Medme,
I think all of us have given you as much feedback as we could. Its now time to figure what you are going to do. Your grad program should be connected to an undergraduate campus. Maybe talk to a career center there. I just recently made the decision not to pursue research as an undergrad after painfully thinking things over in my head. Visiting my school's career center and talking to advising offices for the various colleges at my university helped a lot. I am gravitating towards the world of business now.
We have given you the tools now medme. Go off and learn and make some tough decisions. No more "I don't know" or " I'm not sure".
And stop looking for a guaranteed gig. It doesn't exist anymore. You may have to make another switch later in life. This is just the reality of today's market. Okay?
Click to expand...
Wait are you an undergrad providing advice?
 
Lnsean said:
Seriously,

you're like that indecisive kid who keeps juggling between two paths and end up never doing anything. nothing in life is guaranteed. there's no guaranteed of a job in either field. do what makes you happy...or just pick one and run with it. if job prospect is all you're worried about then do PA or NP...I can't see primary care going away and mid levels are currently eating the MD's lunch when it comes to primary care.
Click to expand...

This....
 
If you are specifically looking to get into healthcare NP seems to not only have a high salary/education ratio (in terms of competitiveness/tuition/years of training) but it also seems to grant generous privileges given the education requirements.

At the end of the day you spend less time in school, deal with less competition and cost, and in many states gain generous prescribing privileges from what I can gather. I believe in many areas a NP can prescribe freely where most pharmacists can't even prescribe a protocol approved antibiotic...

In addition I preceive the demand to grow given the shortage of primary care physicians.

This being said I haven't actively researched the degree or profession so my perception could be way off
 
My oldest son tells me his fall back plans are to work fast food......they are always hiring.
 
npage148 said:
And with a cat named misty marlarky ying yang. Not she how she's not our presidential candidate front runner. I'd vote for her
Click to expand...

I thought this was the more telling line in the bio:
In September 1996, Carter married computer consultant James Gregory Wentzel, whom she had met while attending Tulane. Carter chose not to be given away, stating that she "belonged to no one".

What's Guiliani's son (the one who took the Oath of Office in tandem with his father, and had people briefly scared that there were TWO legally sworn in mayors of NYC) up to nowadays?
 
297point1 said:
I thought this was the more telling line in the bio:
In September 1996, Carter married computer consultant James Gregory Wentzel, whom she had met while attending Tulane. Carter chose not to be given away, stating that she "belonged to no one".
Click to expand...

What does that even mean? Choosing not to be given away?
 
It means she didn't conform to tradional patriarchal tradional in which the father owns the daughter until marriage. Not sure what it had to do about beings handed a job just becaue of who she's related to
 
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Medme22 said:
Wait are you an undergrad providing advice?
Click to expand...
I certainly am. An undergrad who took time off, worked as a tech in a crazy busy retail pharmacy, has two publications under her belt, and is now moving in a new direction.
😉 I'm not a 20 year old undergrad. I'm 26 with a young child. I understand both of OP's areas so I can comment.
 
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Medme22 said:
See I can't see myself as a professor and I would love a job in industry but its location for me. I don't want to move to California or Boston. I would like to be in the south but I don't know how the job outlook is in that area. I thought about PA school, dental school and MD/DO but I feel as if it's too late. I just want a good career once I finish but I don't know if my passion in research is still there. I could possibly explore one of the above options once I finish my program but that's more school. I've been in school for 7 years and I just don't know what I want to do and what I need to do.
Click to expand...

Have you thought about "managed care"? There are a lot of companies you could work for, especially in the south. Consider an MBA while you are working as an entry level associate. Make some money now, make real money later.



The negatives are: Patient interaction = 0
The positives are: Clean, well lit working area, lunch breaks and free coffee and no more [intense] schooling
 
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