Don't Know Where to Begin

[jmahn13]

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I am about to turn 26, and living in the Toledo, Ohio area. I already have a bachelor's degree from the University of Washington (in Seattle), a BA in History. My cumulative GPA was something like 3.17. I had wanted to be a doctor all my life until I got to college. High school was just so easy for me that I did not bother to develop good study habits, so college was really a wake up call. And I chose the path of least resistance, which for me was a history degree. I worked as a cop in the Seattle area for a couple years, and now I am working a manufacturing job in the Toledo area, working 50 hours a week.

I have matured a lot since college, and I have fewer distractions. I believe I would be a much better student this time around, and I believe I can finally DO THIS. However, I do not know where to take my pre-req's or how I am going to pay for them. The University of Toledo limits you to 24 semester hours as a non-degree student, which I think would get me only halfway through the med school pre-req's. And they do not offer a postbac program for premeds. My only other option might be community college, but I would at most want to take the pre-req's two at a time. If you don't enroll full time, usually you do not get financial aid at a CC. I might have to resort to private loans, but for my dream I think it would be worth it.

I know I would also need to get my clinical volunteer experience in, shadow some doctors, and get letters of recommendation.

I know I am not the only person who has started this journey, but I was just hoping somebody had some advice on where to even begin. Am I totally out of luck if my only option is to take the pre-req's at a community college? Has anybody ever done this while working as many hours as I do? I know some of you do this with families and mortgages, etc. How the heck do you do it?

Any pointers would be greatly appreciated!

 

[To be MD]

I did classes while working. You are right to limit yourself to one/two a semester, if you're also working FT.

If you only can take two prereqs a semester, though, you're looking at about three years at minimum until you're ready to take the MCAT. Tack on to that another year for med school apps.

I think you fit into the mold of someone who should consider applying to a full-time 1 year postbacc program. You cannot and should not work during an intensive program like this, so you're going to go into (or just get more) student loan debt.

Before you write a bunch of essays about how badly you want to be an MD and plan out your finances, make sure you know what being a physician means in this day and age.

It is nothing like tv. Nothing. And, you can say, "I know that. Still want to do it." all you want, but until you get your butt into a hospital and a clinic and shadow and volunteer, you're not going to know what is like.

The clinical hours and volunteering isn't to show off how great of a person you are; it shows that you know the bull**** that comes with this profession and you still want to go. Do that first, then do a postbacc.

Otherwise, you can take a few prereqs this upcoming spring and see if you are really are a better student now (or not). Get hospital hours too, however you can. Do those prereqs at a 4-year; don't complicate things with CC classes.

 

[jmahn13]

I did classes while working. You are right to limit yourself to one/two a semester, if you're also working FT.

If you only can take two prereqs a semester, though, you're looking at about three years at minimum until you're ready to take the MCAT. Tack on to that another year for med school apps.

I think you fit into the mold of someone who should consider applying to a full-time 1 year postbacc program. You cannot and should not work during an intensive program like this, so you're going to go into (or just get more) student loan debt.

Before you write a bunch of essays about how badly you want to be an MD and plan out your finances, make sure you know what being a physician means in this day and age.

It is nothing like tv. Nothing. And, you can say, "I know that. Still want to do it." all you want, but until you get your butt into a hospital and a clinic and shadow and volunteer, you're not going to know what is like.

The clinical hours and volunteering isn't to show off how great of a person you are; it shows that you know the bull**** that comes with this profession and you still want to go. Do that first, then do a postbacc.

Otherwise, you can take a few prereqs this upcoming spring and see if you are really are a better student now (or not). Get hospital hours too, however you can. Do those prereqs at a 4-year; don't complicate things with CC classes.

Is it really that bad to take pre-req's at a CC? I have not been able to find any postbac programs close enough to me to be feasible. It looks like I CAN apply to the University of Toledo as a student interested in getting a second degree (even though I have no intention of getting one). Tuition is just twice as much there as Owens CC. UT also has an SMP, so maybe I could take the pre-req's and the MCAT over the next few years and then try to get into the SMP. I would be doing this all on more student loans as well. I have some considerable financial obligations outside of school, which include the usual rent, car payment, etc., but also some credit card debt I am paying off that I got myself into when I was younger and less mature.

Either way, I will definitely take your advice on the volunteering and clinical hours. I've thought about volunteering for Planned Parenthood since I happen to be rather passionate about a lot of the things they stand for. And in Toledo, there are plenty of other clinics at which I could get some exposure to the profession. How did you go about getting some shadowing in?

Thanks very much for your reply. My original post was somewhat lengthy, so I was worried I would not get anything! Everything you've said makes sense, and seeing as how you are a medical student I think I can trust that you know what you are talking about.

 

[Henry Killinger]

Splendid to see a potential fellow rocket!!! The main source of scholarships at UT is the blue and gold scholarship grid, which pays out a renewable scholarship of $1000-$6000 per year based on high school performance, or the Achievement Award, which is for transfer students and awards $1000-$4000 a year. Our science classes don't use a curve, but use a straight scale instead (where a certain percentage gets you a certain grade) and as a result the environment is very cooperative and laid back (It's class vs material, not student vs student) I feel this will be helpful to you. There's also free tutoring for the big premed courses that's available on a walk in basis at the library.

If you prefer to go to community college, you'll be glad to know that Owens has an excellent scientific curriculum and low tuition rates that make it much easier to do without financial aid. As far as finding hospital experience, the big players around here are Promedica and Mercy. Mercy will be your best bet, as they're smaller and much less bureaucratic.

Feel free to shoot me any questions and good luck!

 

[jmahn13]

Splendid to see a potential fellow rocket!!! The main source of scholarships at UT is the blue and gold scholarship grid, which pays out a renewable scholarship of $1000-$6000 per year based on high school performance, or the Achievement Award, which is for transfer students and awards $1000-$4000 a year. Our science classes don't use a curve, but use a straight scale instead (where a certain percentage gets you a certain grade) and as a result the environment is very cooperative and laid back (It's class vs material, not student vs student) I feel this will be helpful to you. There's also free tutoring for the big premed courses that's available on a walk in basis at the library.

If you prefer to go to community college, you'll be glad to know that Owens has an excellent scientific curriculum and low tuition rates that make it much easier to do without financial aid. As far as finding hospital experience, the big players around here are Promedica and Mercy. Mercy will be your best bet, as they're smaller and much less bureaucratic.

Feel free to shoot me any questions and good luck!

Hi! UT is sounding more and more like good place to get my pre-req's in. When I went to the University of Washington it was VERY student vs. student. I will definitely be sending you a message!

 

[To be MD]

Is it really that bad to take pre-req's at a CC? I have not been able to find any postbac programs close enough to me to be feasible. It looks like I CAN apply to the University of Toledo as a student interested in getting a second degree (even though I have no intention of getting one). Tuition is just twice as much there as Owens CC. UT also has an SMP, so maybe I could take the pre-req's and the MCAT over the next few years and then try to get into the SMP. I would be doing this all on more student loans as well. I have some considerable financial obligations outside of school, which include the usual rent, car payment, etc., but also some credit card debt I am paying off that I got myself into when I was younger and less mature.

Either way, I will definitely take your advice on the volunteering and clinical hours. I've thought about volunteering for Planned Parenthood since I happen to be rather passionate about a lot of the things they stand for. And in Toledo, there are plenty of other clinics at which I could get some exposure to the profession. How did you go about getting some shadowing in?

Thanks very much for your reply. My original post was somewhat lengthy, so I was worried I would not get anything! Everything you've said makes sense, and seeing as how you are a medical student I think I can trust that you know what you are talking about.

A lot of medical schools don't allow CC classes to count for prerequisites. You can buy the MSAR and look this data up, or just scroll down on this .pdf: from the AAMC website.

It's just not worth it, most of the time, to detract from the list of schools where you're eligible to apply.

Personally, I worked in a health-related facility (like Planned Parenthood, etc.) and did some work with a doctor there, who then recommended me to shadow one of his friends.

A lot of shadowing is networking. You can start doing that in your clinical volunteering. Hospice is also an easy one to gain access to!

 

[jmahn13]

A lot of medical schools don't allow CC classes to count for prerequisites. You can buy the MSAR and look this data up, or just scroll down on this .pdf: from the AAMC website.

It's just not worth it, most of the time, to detract from the list of schools where you're eligible to apply.

Personally, I worked in a health-related facility (like Planned Parenthood, etc.) and did some work with a doctor there, who then recommended me to shadow one of his friends.

A lot of shadowing is networking. You can start doing that in your clinical volunteering. Hospice is also an easy one to gain access to!

Thank you so much for your reply! I am leaning more and more toward doing the prereqs at UT just so I know med schools will accept my credits.

I forgot to mention, I took 2 quarters of general Chem and two quarters of physics when I got my history degree. I did OK in chemistry, but only average in physics. I know that allopathic medical schools average your grades of you take a class again, and DO schools count only your retake. Is it still worth my time considering allopathic schools? If I'm retaking part of two of the prereqs am I better off just trying osteopathic med school?

 

[To be MD]

Thank you so much for your reply! I am leaning more and more toward doing the prereqs at UT just so I know med schools will accept my credits.

I forgot to mention, I took 2 quarters of general Chem and two quarters of physics when I got my history degree. I did OK in chemistry, but only average in physics. I know that allopathic medical schools average your grades of you take a class again, and DO schools count only your retake. Is it still worth my time considering allopathic schools? If I'm retaking part of two of the prereqs am I better off just trying osteopathic med school?

You'll probably need to retake them anyway (some schools require the classes are within ~5 years or so), so don't worry about MD/DO and just take all the classes like you would normally.

You can shadow both MDs and DOs, see where your MCAT score & postbacc GPA fall, and then decide. Hell, I know plenty of people who applied to both during the same cycle.

 

[esob]

Standard advice, but worry way less about your shadowing/volunteering and worry more about your GPA/MCAT. It's easy to get the impression that both are equally important but that is simply not the case. As far as working full time and going to school full time, it can be done. I work 60+ hrs some weeks and raise 4 kids and have been full time for 4 semesters now with straight A's. It really depends on how efficient of a learner you are and how frugal you can be with your free time. I basically have zero personal time but I've always been a mule so it's just par for the course for me

 

[jmahn13]

Standard advice, but worry way less about your shadowing/volunteering and worry more about your GPA/MCAT. It's easy to get the impression that both are equally important but that is simply not the case. As far as working full time and going to school full time, it can be done. I work 60+ hrs some weeks and raise 4 kids and have been full time for 4 semesters now with straight A's. It really depends on how efficient of a learner you are and how frugal you can be with your free time. I basically have zero personal time but I've always been a mule so it's just par for the course for me

Thank you so much. I am very glad to hear working full time and going to school full time can be done. I am prepared to be EXTREMELY frugal with my spare time. I work ten hours a day Monday through Friday, so I am just worried about how to fit my studying and homework in on top of classes. Luckily I don't live more than a couple miles from campus. You must be a great note-taker, which I am definitely going to need to learn to do. How do you fit your MCAT studying in on top of taking care of the kiddos and everything else? I would like to get my shadowing and volunteering started early, but I will definitely make sure to keep my GPA and MCAT as the top priority.

 

[esob]

Thank you so much. I am very glad to hear working full time and going to school full time can be done. I am prepared to be EXTREMELY frugal with my spare time. I work ten hours a day Monday through Friday, so I am just worried about how to fit my studying and homework in on top of classes. Luckily I don't live more than a couple miles from campus. You must be a great note-taker, which I am definitely going to need to learn to do. How do you fit your MCAT studying in on top of taking care of the kiddos and everything else? I would like to get my shadowing and volunteering started early, but I will definitely make sure to keep my GPA and MCAT as the top priority.

Well honestly I don't study much outside of class, I just don't have time. What I have done is hired a voice actor to read my texts/notes/slides to audio and I listen to them when I'm driving, when I'm walking the dog, when I'm putting one of the boys to sleep, etc. I end up spending probably 12+ hrs per week on the road, all of which I use to listen to school work. I haven't done too much MCAT prep yet but I recently signed up for Jack Weston's CARS course which starts in 4 days, so I will spend my Thanksgiving and Christmas break doing CARS intensive study and then I plan to drop to half time for one semester when I take the MCAT. You basically just make time wherever you can steal it from 😀