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ErynD

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Hi, all,

I was just wondering if a DO trained in the US is internationally recognized. Do you just have to take that country's test in order to be qualified to enter as a physician most of the time?

How much of an effect does being trained as a DO in the states differ from being trained elsewhere?

Thank you!
 

Taus

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fyi the training of DO's outside of the US is very different then here....foreign trained DO's are only trained in manipulation and function in a similar role as a chiropractor in the US...they are not fully trained physiciancs as they are here. Its unfortunate to say the least that the intials they earn are the same as we do here even though the training and scope of practice is entirely different.
 
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Faraaz23

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A big part of it is taking the time to make a well-organized and thorough presentation to those accrediting bodies in foreign countries. If they are shown sufficient evidence that DO's have a curriculum and training equivalent to an MD or MBBS you definitely have a shot.
 

Jack Daniel

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When it says Scope of Practice= Unlimited what does it mean?

It means that the DO would be allowed to practice medicine as any other complete physician in that country would be able to practice medicine.

For example in the US, chiropractors and naturopaths have a limited scope of practice. Most can't write prescriptions, perform surgery, or practice obstetrics. In contrast, MDs & DOs have an unlimited scope.

In some countries, osteopaths are trained only in manual medicine and only have a limited scope of practice. However, in countries where American-trained DOs are recognized as full physicians, i.e. equivalent to their own physicians, they, too, are allowed an unlimited scope of practice.
 

Good Mountain

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It means that the DO would be allowed to practice medicine as any other complete physician in that country would be able to practice medicine.

For example in the US, chiropractors and naturopaths have a limited scope of practice. Most can't write prescriptions, perform surgery, or practice obstetrics. In contrast, MDs & DOs have an unlimited scope.

In some countries, osteopaths are trained only in manual medicine and only have a limited scope of practice. However, in countries where American-trained DOs are recognized as full physicians, i.e. equivalent to their own physicians, they, too, are allowed an unlimited scope of practice.

That's what i thought it meant. Then the article is wrong. In my country DOs are not allowed to practice medicine. No one even knows what a DO does or is. There is no university for DO's. The article says "Unlimited practice" so I would not trust the source.

Thanx for the explanation.​
 

Pansit

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That's what i thought it meant. Then the article is wrong. In my country DOs are not allowed to practice medicine. No one even knows what a DO does or is. There is no university for DO's. The article says "Unlimited practice" so I would not trust the source.

Thanx for the explanation.​

what country are you from? Doesnt mean you cant practice as a DO there if there is no university for DO's or that nobody knows what a DO stands for. There is no university of MBBS here in the US and the majority of the public does not know what that means but they can have unlimited practice. For a current update on the international issue this is what the president of the AOA stated:

"The AOA is working closely with the WHO to use our standards and definition of an Osteopathic Physician and to identify them versus Osteopaths or Chiropractors in all countries. The work is progressing nicely with the next meeting this March in Milan, Italy. Watch DO-Online for further updates, and I feel that in the near future our degree will be designated and recognized by the WHO and American Osteopathic Physicians will be able to practice world wide"
 

Jack Daniel

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That's what i thought it meant. Then the article is wrong. In my country DOs are not allowed to practice medicine. No one even knows what a DO does or is. There is no university for DO's. The article says "Unlimited practice" so I would not trust the source.

Thanx for the explanation.​

Cute. So, you're from Argentina?
http://www.osteopathic.org/index.cfm?PageID=ost_dogoblobal

Second paragraph: "In recent years, D.O.s have gained practice rights in countries from Finland to Argentina. In fact, a few months ago the profession celebrated a huge victory when the United Kingdom announced that U.S.-trained D.O.s would be granted full medical practice rights."

It doesn't surprise me that you haven't heard of DOs. There are people here in the US that haven't heard of them either. :)

My source is from the AOA, which is the organization that represents DOs. So, unless you're the Argentine Minister of Health or something, I'm going with mine.
 

Good Mountain

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Cute. So, you're from Argentina?
http://www.osteopathic.org/index.cfm?PageID=ost_dogoblobal

Second paragraph: "In recent years, D.O.s have gained practice rights in countries from Finland to Argentina. In fact, a few months ago the profession celebrated a huge victory when the United Kingdom announced that U.S.-trained D.O.s would be granted full medical practice rights."

It doesn't surprise me that you haven't heard of DOs. There are people here in the US that haven't heard of them either. :)

My source is from the AOA, which is the organization that represents DOs. So, unless you're the Argentine Minister of Health or something, I'm going with mine.

Ok, go with yours. but the bottom line is... DOs cannot practice medicine in Argentina. You have to be a Kinesiologist to do osteopathy. you can check the web site www.osteopatia.org.ar to see. You should ask AOA what they mean by "practice rights". Its nothing like in USA where you can be a general surgeon or whatever you want.
 

tkim

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Ok, go with yours. but the bottom line is... DOs cannot practice medicine in Argentina. You have to be a Kinesiologist to do osteopathy. you can check the web site www.osteopatia.org.ar to see. You should ask AOA what they mean by "practice rights". Its nothing like in USA where you can be a general surgeon or whatever you want.

This is from the full practice rights document attached to the end of the practice rights thread regarding Argentina:

"Argentina
Year of Last Request: 1994
Scope of Practice: unlimited

Per correspondence from the Ministry of Culture and Education, it appears that U.S.-trained D.O.s will be permitted to obtain a full physician license in Argentina in accordance with requirements for all foreign physicians. Argentine law does not specifically include osteopathic medicine or the D.O. degree; instead, foreign physicians must submit credentials to various agencies and then appear before any of the National Universities in order to have their diploma considered as an Argentine equivalent.

Contact: Secretary General
Confederacion Medica Argentina
Ave Belgrano 1235
Buenos Aires 1093
Argentina
P: 541143838414"

As for the www.osteopatia.org.ar website that you posted - that's the problem with foreign osteopathic training versus US-trained osteopathic medicine. The US is the only country that trains full physicians with an osteopathic background. Your Argentinian website is for *Argentinian* osteopaths - not US-trained osteopathic physicians. It's easy to confuse them. Hope this helps.

Also, please note that *any* foreign medical degree holder has to jump through the same hoops in order to be licensed in Argentina.
 

tkim

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This brings me to next logical question. US-trained osteopathic medical degree holders have a clear list of international practice rights that they can refer to.

But people often tout the US MD as a license that is recognized internationally, or at least more so than the US DO. I'm certain the latter is true, since the US MD has been around a lot longer, but I curious - is there some way to find out exactly where the US MD is accepted internationally? Like the list that US DO's have.

It would be interesting to see if the US MD degree is as widely accepted internationally as people seem to think.
 

Jack Daniel

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This brings me to next logical question. US-trained osteopathic medical degree holders have a clear list of international practice rights that they can refer to.

But people often tout the US MD as a license that is recognized internationally, or at least more so than the US DO. I'm certain the latter is true, since the US MD has been around a lot longer, but I curious - is there some way to find out exactly where the US MD is accepted internationally? Like the list that US DO's have.

It would be interesting to see if the US MD degree is as widely accepted internationally as people seem to think.

That's a good question. I can answer a small part.
Let's take Singapore, for example. It appears only graduates from 32 schools (all MDs, no DOs) are eligible for licensure.
http://www.smc.gov.sg/html/1153709442948.html

So are the graduates of the other ~100 US MD schools out of luck? Probably not--but I bet it takes a great deal of effort to get a school added onto the almighty approval "list". I cite this as an example of not being able to just waltz into a country and start practicing as a physician--even if one has an MD. It's reasonable to think that international practicing priviledges have less to do with degree and more about protecting the home turf.
 

Jack Daniel

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... No one even knows what a DO does or is. ..

I'm speculating here, but if a US DO's medical credentials were accepted by the appropriate Argentine agency as equivalent, then the DO might be allowed to use whatever licensure is most recognized by the population. This could explain your perception that no one has seen a DO as a physician in Argentina. In other words, maybe they are there, but they appear to have the same medical degree as everyone else.

Regardless, Argentina is a relatively big country. Is it possible there could be US trained DOs there, but you haven't yet met one?:rolleyes:
 

Good Mountain

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I'm speculating here, but if a US DO's medical credentials were accepted by the appropriate Argentine agency as equivalent, then the DO might be allowed to use whatever licensure is most recognized by the population. This could explain your perception that no one has seen a DO as a physician in Argentina. In other words, maybe they are there, but they appear to have the same medical degree as everyone else.

Regardless, Argentina is a relatively big country. Is it possible there could be US trained DOs there, but you haven't yet met one?:rolleyes:


The problem is that in my country osteopaths are not trained as in the USA. Some of the two should have a different name! That’s why here they are seen as "alternate medicine", but just because they are. Of course its a different thing in USA. I really don’t know if a DO of USA would be recognized as doctor in Argentina. What I was defending earlier is that in here no Osteopath practices medicine.

The following is a bit of topic: Also the problem in my country is that we have fair enough doctors ( we have more doctors per capita than USA, and far beyond what the WHO recommends. For example, in Spain there are 300 neurosurgeons for 40 million people. In Argentina there are 1234 neurosurgeons for 37 million people. The WHO recomends 1 every 100.000. We have 1 every 30.000 and in capital city 1 every 5000) so the law is very strict and does not let any "non physician" practice medicine.

A few differences with USA:
No Optometrists... only ophthalmologists can prescribe eyeglasses.
No mid wife’s delivering babys... only obstetricians
No CRNAs ... only anesthesiologists
No nurses are allowed to prescribe, only physicians
No podiatry


Maybe as you are physicians in the USA then you are considered physicians in Argentina and that’s what your article states. (That is different than saying that osteopathy is allowed to practice medicine in arg). I will look into it. :cool:

Of course you are welcomed in argentina:thumbup: . We are the 37th best country to live in (USA is 8th).
 
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Jack Daniel

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The following is a bit of topic: Also the problem in my country is that we have fair enough doctors ( we have more doctors per capita than USA, and far beyond what the WHO recommends. For example, in Spain there are 300 neurosurgeons for 40 million people. In Argentina there are 1234 neurosurgeons for 37 million people. The WHO recomends 1 every 100.000. We have 1 every 30.000 and in capital city 1 every 5000) so the law is very strict and does not let any "non physician" practice medicine.

A few differences with USA:
No Optometrists... only ophthalmologists can prescribe eyeglasses.
No mid wife’s delivering babys... only obstetricians
No CRNAs ... only anesthesiologists
No nurses are allowed to prescribe, only physicians
No podiatry

Maybe as you are physicians in the USA then you are considered physicians in Argentina and that’s what your article states. (That is different than saying that osteopathy is allowed to practice medicine in arg). I will look into it. :cool:

Of course you are welcomed in argentina:thumbup: . We are the 37th best country to live in (USA is 8th).

Thanks for the invite! I've always wanted to visit and I look forward to the opportunity. I've only been as far south as Rio--which isn't that far away. But my Spanish is much better than my Portuguese.

Those numbers are interesting. Makes me better appreciate that the USA has such a well developed system of healthcare professions.
 
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