Dr. Jill Biden

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JustFillIt

JustFillIt

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Dr. Jill Biden - yea okay I get it. I submit to the social justice shaming which demands I respect a title.....

Does that mean we get to sling the same shame on others? Are we finally doctors now? I mean, dentists and eye docs have successfully claimed the title... Tomorrow I will start requesting this generally and see how it goes.
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Every time I see the debate come up, it seems like we're the only ones against pharmacists using the title. Not that I disagree, I don't particularly want anyone to call me Dr but it seems like (most of) the rest of the medical community supports it as long as we aren't misleading anyone about our actual qualifications.
 
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Deja said:
I think alot of people with phD have Dr. as their title
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It only makes a difference in a clinical setting.

Although I always had an issue with Dr Laura Schlessinger and the like doling out advice with listeners likely thinking they are talking to a therapist or something.
 
reminds me of this.... starts at 2:18 mark lol

 
radio frequency said:
The only person who calls me doctor is my own doctor (no, I never asked them to, and it feels a little awkward). I’m fine with that. I have enough imposter syndrome I’ve had to beat back already.
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For me it's pretty much only my alumni association begging for money.

Oh, and my brother. But he's a friar so I'm pretty much forced to refer to him by his official title, I think it's only fair that he does the same.
 
The whole debate is ridiculous. The word 'doctor' comes from 'docere' - 'to teach', and it is an academic title everywhere in the world - except in the English-speaking countries it became conflated with 'medical doctor' and in the US it's the worst, even in the UK they don't use it nearly as much (GP, specialty name, physician are used as often or more often). This whole 'but patients will be confused!!!!' only serves to perpetuate the 'dumb American' stereotype.
 
Professors with a phd have every right to be referred to as a doctor, other than perhaps inside a medical facility. It's a term that's used for high-level educators

Seeing as she's a professor with a phd in education, it makes sense to refer to her as one.
 
Over 200 people in Congress have a JD. Imagine if all those dingus started calling themselves doctors.
 
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TheBlaah said:
Professors with a phd have every right to be referred to as a doctor, other than perhaps inside a medical facility. It's a term that's used for high-level educators

Seeing as she's a professor with a phd in education, it makes sense to refer to her as one.
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For clarification. She has a doctorate in education, which is different than a PhD.

Not saying we shouldn’t call her doctor, .. . But I find it odd to insist On being called doctor outside of my professional setting.
 
NITRAS said:
For clarification. She has a doctorate in education, which is different than a PhD.

Not saying we shouldn’t call her doctor, .. . But I find it odd to insist On being called doctor outside of my professional setting.
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I’ve met a few medical doctors who insist on being called Doctor no matter where they are. It seems it’s not universal however; usually these are older doctors.
 
Almost everyone in academia has PhD or equivalent. There are huge labs at some universities that employ many postdocs, all with PhDs. I rarely hear them addressed as Dr in or out of their work setting. Most of the time it is in a very formal setting... Conference... Tv appearance....

So I guess continue addressing her as a Dr. It is just weird and almost unnecessary to me. It is like when a CNN reporter says Mr. Trump and Fox President Trump. Isn't there some guy in commercials for pain cream who is a 'Dr' but in political science? One of Trump's economic advisors made a fuss that he is also a Dr but anchor didn't like it and told him it is not even in science.
 
M0df said:
Almost everyone in academia has PhD or equivalent. There are huge labs at some universities that employ many postdocs, all with PhDs. I rarely hear them addressed as Dr in or out of their work setting. Most of the time it is in a very formal setting... Conference... Tv appearance....

So I guess continue addressing her as a Dr. It is just weird and almost unnecessary to me. It is like when a CNN reporter says Mr. Trump and Fox President Trump. Isn't there some guy in commercials for pain cream who is a 'Dr' but in political science? One of Trump's economic advisors made a fuss that he is also a Dr but anchor didn't like it and told him it is not even in science.
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I guess my thought is...why does it matter? Some people want to use their title. That’s fine. They earned it. Just because I don’t use mine or others don’t doesn’t make them wrong for using their title. Maybe they like to use it to remind themselves they can do hard things. Maybe as a reminder to keep grinding. Maybe it helps them combat their own insecurities. Whatever. It costs me nothing to address them how they would prefer based on an earned title.
 
radio frequency said:
I guess my thought is...why does it matter? Some people want to use their title. That’s fine. They earned it. Just because I don’t use mine or others don’t doesn’t make them wrong for using their title. Maybe they like to use it to remind themselves they can do hard things. Maybe as a reminder to keep grinding. Maybe it helps them combat their own insecurities. Whatever. It costs me nothing to address them how they would prefer based on an earned title.
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I think this is how I feel as well. I don’t use my title for the same reason I don’t ask people to call me Mr. Owle. It’s dumb and everyone I know uses their first name. I’m certainly not gonna tell someone else not to use a title they’ve earned.

That op Ed was so clearly meant to generate controversy that I can’t even take it seriously though.
 
One of my professors was a floater at a Walgreens where I had a rotation. I addressed her by "Dr" like we do in school. She said "call me by my first name here".
 
I suppose if you have a doctorate in anything, you could be called Dr. ____ but do you really need to force people to call you Dr. _____ ? lol sounds like someone has an inferiority issue. I didn't hear the media or any left/democrats calling Ben Carson, Dr. Ben Carson and the man is a neurosurgeon. lol. hypocrisy is unreal these days.
 
owlegrad said:
I think this is how I feel as well. I don’t use my title for the same reason I don’t ask people to call me Mr. Owle. It’s dumb and everyone I know uses their first name. I’m certainly not gonna tell someone else not to use a title they’ve earned.

That op Ed was so clearly meant to generate controversy that I can’t even take it seriously though.
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I wouldn’t call you Mr. Owle unless I knew your desired pronoun. You might be a Ms. or a Mx.

How about everyone just wear a “Hi my name is _____” sticker and that’s what we use verbatim.

Hell let’s face it if I got a doctorate in tiktok at an unaccredited place of learning (influencers blog) I don’t want you to take that accomplishment away from me if I feel it was an important one. Who are you to distinguish one accomplishment from another or one degree from another.
 
WorthlessOxygen said:
For what it's worth, I don't think she asked anyone to call her "doctor." The opinion piece seemed to be unprovoked and was intentionally controversial.
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Exactly. It was an opinion that triggered the left. I just found that to be oddly satisfying and ironic. lol.
 
In a hospital setting I don't know of any PharmD that wants to be addressed as Doctor because we definitely don't want anyone, especially a patient and their family, to confuse us for a medical doctor. In fact, in Arizona I read there is a law that states we can introduce ourselves as Dr but we must also specify the profession at the end.

Only one hospital personnel has ever addressed me as doctor routinely and it was security guard I was friends with.

But if I was lecturing I think I would be comfortable using doctor.
 
All fair points - and until yesterday I never would have considered such a ridiculous concept.

I was on twitter the other day and I saw some prominent physician in Oregon (Dr. Gu I think?) going off on how he expects everyone to address Jill Biden as “Dr. Jill Biden” and anyone who disagrees is deserving of social justice shaming..

I just could not help but to picture him at work and addressing the pharmacist as, Dr. _____. My guess is that this is someone who gets to pick and choose who these expectations apply to.

This is a scary world we are moving into
 
That. You want to call her doctor. I don't really care. All I am saying is that I always assumed she was a medical doctor. Until this article, I didn't even look into what doctor she was. Maybe like Az, we should just clarify what type of dr. Someone is. It wouldn't create too much extra burden since we are already at this point.... Just say Doctor of Education Jill Biden. Not too much to ask for.
 
I propose we adopt a naming system like Russia and Iceland, with the first name and patronymic being used instead of title + last name to address a person formally. Avoid all kinds of title controversies entirely, people have become way to sensitive.
 
TikiTorches said:
Let's not forget nurses with dnp degrees who further obfuscate
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I chat with those nurses very frequently. And if I know they have a DNP I call them Dr Soandso if I don’t know them well and nobody else is around. They generally tell me not to after that, but I figure if they by chance care at all about that credential, I’d rather not accidentally offend while educating and asking them to fix something for me.

The ones I laugh about are the PAs without a doctorate who return my calls as “Dr Soandso.” These are usually men. I have no idea why.
 
What did you call for PharmD professors? Dr. Why? Because that is the tit;e they earned. You write a PhD thesis and defend it. She is Dr. Jill Biden and it would't have been a problem if she was a man.
 
mentos said:
One of my professors was a floater at a Walgreens where I had a rotation. I addressed her by "Dr" like we do in school. She said "call me by my first name here".
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All of my preceptors have asked me to call them by their first name. I mean we are just pharmacists and I don’t know why we had to call everyone by Dr. in pharmacy school. I went to public research university for my undergraduate and lot of my professors were PhD but hardly any one called them by dr. I don’t think they really care.
 
She earned it and deserves respect. All good. But let's say she is doing an interview and millions watching her. She is introduced as Dr. Jill Biden, then proceeds providing some medical information, just like Fauci might but not as detailed. Will all of the audience realize what her expertise actually is?
 
Part of me thinks that from this point forward, if you don't know she is an educator then that is your own fault. If you are in the US, you should know at least that much about the First Lady. No one ever has a problem with Dr. King who had a PhD.
Sine Cura said:
Over 200 people in Congress have a JD. Imagine if all those dingus started calling themselves doctors.
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It is not traditional to refer to those that hold JD as Dr. They already have a designation, esquire.
iamapharmacist said:
Exactly. It was an opinion that triggered the left. I just found that to be oddly satisfying and ironic. lol.
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He might not have garnered so much attention if he had not called the next First Lady "kiddo." That was over the line regardless of what his opinion was about the use of her earned prefix.
 
Old Timer said:
What did you call for PharmD professors? Dr. Why? Because that is the tit;e they earned. You write a PhD thesis and defend it. She is Dr. Jill Biden and it would't have been a problem if she was a man.
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The general public is not expected to call a professor Dr. and typically just won’t.

A student professor relationship is different. I would never have an issue calling a physician a “doctor”. For any pharmacist with decent intellect and social skills - it is just obvious to us that the title “doctor” is jargon used among people to establish the presence of a physician and to acknowledge who is the captain of the ship we are sailing with patient care.

I understand that In academia the student calls the professor a doctor as a term of respect and apprenticeship. However this rule can not be applied to the general public.

I still maintain my position. I will only call someone, besides physicians, a “doctor” unless they refer to me as the same. I call my dentist by his first name.
 
KidPharmD said:
Part of me thinks that from this point forward, if you don't know she is an educator then that is your own fault. If you are in the US, you should know at least that much about the First Lady. No one ever has a problem with Dr. King who had a PhD.

It is not traditional to refer to those that hold JD as Dr. They already have a designation, esquire.

He might not have garnered so much attention if he had not called the next First Lady "kiddo." That was over the line regardless of what his opinion was about the use of her earned prefix.
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Dr. King was a hero of the people and a historical legend. That is also a class of its own. I would refer to him as doctor as a term of deep respect for his historical and social prowess.
 
JustFillIt said:
Dr. King was a hero of the people and a historical legend. That is also a class of its own. I would refer to him as doctor as a term of deep respect for his historical and social prowess.
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Yes. Dr. King is on another level. But the argument isn't really about respect here. The argument people give is that people will think she is a physician, and I think that Dr. King is an example that people can recognize that isn't always what that title means.
 
M0df said:
She earned it and deserves respect. All good. But let's say she is doing an interview and millions watching her. She is introduced as Dr. Jill Biden, then proceeds providing some medical information, just like Fauci might but not as detailed. Will all of the audience realize what her expertise actually is?
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Honestly, I feel it’s necessary to background check even when the medical advice is from an MD/DO.

Case in point: Dr Stella Immanuel.

Or, closer to home, there’s a general surgeon who’s a member of my in-laws’ church who has told the church that masks are unnecessary and do more harm than good. As a general surgeon, he realistically has no more expertise in COVID than a community pharmacist. But the church members believe him because he is a doctor.
 
TikiTorches said:
Not all doctorates are equal. Some are online degrees...
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That’s true, but for me there is no benefit in not addressing others with a title they might care about. So I do it, in case they care.

I have no personal reason to cast judgement on the quality of their education. I meet some pretty crappy medical doctors sometimes too. I still call them doctor.

This doesn’t mean I think all doctors are the same or all degrees are the same. I still seek skilled MDs for my own family’s medical care. It’s just a way of showing respect by using an honorific to honor that person’s work. No more and no less.
 
radio frequency said:
That’s true, but for me there is no benefit in not addressing others with a title they might care about. So I do it, in case they care.

I have no personal reason to cast judgement on the quality of their education. I meet some pretty crappy medical doctors sometimes too. I still call them doctor.

This doesn’t mean I think all doctors are the same or all degrees are the same. I still seek skilled MDs for my own family’s medical care. It’s just a way of showing respect by using an honorific to honor that person’s work. No more and no less.
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The amount of schooling , residency, licensing exams, difficulty getting in and thru etc usually turns out a much less "crappy doc" than an dnp. You really should look at their education. People go thru accelerated nursing programs where they work half the time or are online, then online dnp. Dnp is to obfuscate for patients. It's not a clinical degree.
 
TikiTorches said:
The amount of schooling , residency, licensing exams, difficulty getting in and thru etc usually turns out a much less "crappy doc" than an dnp. You really should look at their education. People go thru accelerated nursing programs where they work half the time or are online, then online dnp. Dnp is to obfuscate for patients. It's not a clinical degree.
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I’m not disagreeing. I know about their schooling. At least where I work, the NPs and PAs pass difficult cases on to MDs, which limits their usefulness and also their risk. They are generally good at the basics where I work; I’ve seen them myself. I do worry about their lack of antibiotic understanding at times, but the smart ones reach out to pharmacy with questions before prescribing.

But crappy MDs still exist somehow too. And I work at a place that is well known for having really great MDs. They mostly are. Some are less great though. The crappy MDs seem to be especially lacking in self awareness of their lack of knowledge.
 
radio frequency said:
I’m not disagreeing. I know about their schooling. At least where I work, the NPs and PAs pass difficult cases on to MDs, which limits their usefulness and also their risk. They are generally good at the basics where I work; I’ve seen them myself. I do worry about their lack of antibiotic understanding at times, but the smart ones reach out to pharmacy with questions before prescribing.

But crappy MDs still exist somehow too. And I work at a place that is well known for having really great MDs. They mostly are. Some are less great though. The crappy MDs seem to be especially lacking in self awareness of their lack of knowledge.
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In my world the nurses have private practice where the supervisor Physician is over 50 miles away. They do everything. And it's scary.
The terrible Physician and the one to graduate last from med school still knows alot more than the top in many other fields.
You said the smart mid-levels reach out to you before prescribing, but that's not all of them.
And the attending physician is responsible for himself. The mid-levels mess up, it's on the Physician, not them
 
TikiTorches said:
In my world the nurses have private practice where the supervisor Physician is over 50 miles away. They do everything. And it's scary
The terrible Physician and the one to graduate last from med school still knows alot more than the top in many other fields.
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Glad I’m not where you are; I wouldn’t be a fan. This said, if they are under a supervising physician, why does the supervising physician allow this? I would call it a failure of supervision.

It’s also crazy to think that in some states, even naturopaths have independent prescribing rights. Thankfully not in mine.

I don’t know that I’d make that claim about the last to graduate MD school being better than the top of other fields. I imagine you meet pretty competent MDs. The dregs unfortunately also exist, though they usually get rooted out of their employment over time. Unfortunately some still prescribe, regardless. As a group though, MDs do seem better at self policing their own. Usually.
 
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That's pretty funny. The worst doctor is better than the top of many other fields? The worst doctors include the likes Andrew Wakefield or Steven LaTulippe. I think they are pretty significantly worse than the "tops of many other fields", whatever that is supposed to mean.

But what does this have to do with if Dr. Jill Biden should be referred to as "kiddo" or not?
 
KidPharmD said:
Part of me thinks that from this point forward, if you don't know she is an educator then that is your own fault. If you are in the US, you should know at least that much about the First Lady. No one ever has a problem with Dr. King who had a PhD.

It is not traditional to refer to those that hold JD as Dr. They already have a designation, esquire.

He might not have garnered so much attention if he had not called the next First Lady "kiddo." That was over the line regardless of what his opinion was about the use of her earned prefix.
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Eh im sure Melania Trump was called worse things. Again, I dont care about anyone’s political spectrum but the hypocrisy is what makes me cringe.
 
owlegrad said:
That's pretty funny. The worst doctor is better than the top of many other fields? The worst doctors include the likes Andrew Wakefield or Steven LaTulippe. I think they are pretty significantly worse than the "tops of many other fields", whatever that is supposed to mean.

But what does this have to do with if Dr. Jill Biden should be referred to as "kiddo" or not?
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When it comes to sheer amount of knowlege yes. Nothing like undergrad to prepare for med school, MCAT, get in, medical school, residency at least 3 years, 3 national licensing exams, then board certifcations, renewals, CME which is much harder than CE in other fields, Medical boards always gunning for us. I havent seen other boards like this, or other education like this.
 
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