Dr. John Delony and the invasion of "coaching" into the psychotherapeutic space

[BuckeyeLove]

Anybody heard of this dude? He's one of those guys on Dave Ramsey and they brought him on a few years back to touch on the emotional/behavioral aspects of money management/debt/wealth building. This dude presents himself as a clinician, clear as day, and has a practice coaching, but has his doctorate in some garbage degree like Counseling supervision or leadership or something like that. How did we get to this point as a field, where coaching is now becoming more mainstream than going to an actual doctoral level provider of psychology? If you go on twitter (especially right leaning bro twitter), there is rampant mistrust of mental health, especially psychologists, and they are much more open to "coaching." I just don't get it.

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[WisNeuro]

Anybody heard of this dude? He's one of those guys on Dave Ramsey and they brought him on a few years back to touch on the emotional/behavioral aspects of money management/debt/wealth building. This dude presents himself as a clinician, clear as day, and has a practice coaching, but has his doctorate in some garbage degree like Counseling supervision or leadership or something like that. How did we get to this point as a field, where coaching is now becoming more mainstream than going to an actual doctoral level provider of psychology? If you go on twitter (especially right leaning bro twitter), there is rampant mistrust of mental health, especially psychologists, and they are much more open to "coaching." I just don't get it.

Seems like part of the current political zeitgeist, actual experts are somewhat demonized by both wings. The wing right has long demonized the highly educated and scientific/medical experts for a long time, probably because many of their views rely on convincing people that science and facts don't matter. And, more recently, the left wing has been on a tear against "establishment" experts and relying more on spoken truth rather than objective fact, among other things. So, we really only appeal to a moderate, rational middle.

I'm very glad that I am a mid-career professional, making good money with multiple income streams. The clinical field is not one that I would recommend to most who have other interests and better options. I don't see good things happening to reimbursement, especially with advocacy essentially arguing for psychologists to become masters level providers in level of expertise.

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

Anybody heard of this dude? He's one of those guys on Dave Ramsey and they brought him on a few years back to touch on the emotional/behavioral aspects of money management/debt/wealth building. This dude presents himself as a clinician, clear as day, and has a practice coaching, but has his doctorate in some garbage degree like Counseling supervision or leadership or something like that. How did we get to this point as a field, where coaching is now becoming more mainstream than going to an actual doctoral level provider of psychology? If you go on twitter (especially right leaning bro twitter), there is rampant mistrust of mental health, especially psychologists, and they are much more open to "coaching." I just don't get it.

I think part of the problem is the impracticality of legally enforcing restrictions on who can practice 'talk therapy' at the end of the day. We can enforce bans on people using a protected title/license ("psychologist"), but not the service of 'counseling' itself--especially if it's private pay. Caveat Emptor is the only real public protection.

 

[Sanman]

Anybody heard of this dude? He's one of those guys on Dave Ramsey and they brought him on a few years back to touch on the emotional/behavioral aspects of money management/debt/wealth building. This dude presents himself as a clinician, clear as day, and has a practice coaching, but has his doctorate in some garbage degree like Counseling supervision or leadership or something like that. How did we get to this point as a field, where coaching is now becoming more mainstream than going to an actual doctoral level provider of psychology? If you go on twitter (especially right leaning bro twitter), there is rampant mistrust of mental health, especially psychologists, and they are much more open to "coaching." I just don't get it.

Not sure if it is just a rampant mistrust of mental health vs people who think you only go to a psychologist if you are "sick" and a life coach if you are a healthy person. They of course are a healthy person, not a crazy person. They just need tips on "living better". I liken this to a person with mobility problems who doesn't need physical therapy, they are fine. But maybe they will start going to the gym and seeing a personal trainer. As if physical therapy cannot both increase your mobility and improve your health.

 

[Shiori]

We can take it as a sign that we're cool. Medicine gets naturopaths. Physical therapy gets chiropractors. We get coaches. It does give clues about what the profession is lacking. For us, it might be the easier access and fewer requirements to stay on as a client. I have a pretty long waitlist. If someone wants to come in and request indefinite support/insight-based discussions, I gently but firmly let them them know that isn't really my role. Coaches are happy to swoop in and fill the gap.

 

[WPMO]

This dude presents himself as a clinician, clear as day, and has a practice coaching, but has his doctorate in some garbage degree like Counseling supervision or leadership or something like that. How did we get to this point as a field, where coaching is now becoming more mainstream than going to an actual doctoral level provider of psychology? If you go on twitter (especially right leaning bro twitter), there is rampant mistrust of mental health, especially psychologists, and they are much more open to "coaching." I just don't get it.

That is probably Counselor Education and Supervision, which is what a Mental Health Counseling doctorate is called. So this guy should be an LPC and have a Master's in Counseling, which is required to get into such programs. Now you can talk about the value of a CES degree instead of a Doctorate in Psychology or something else, but it is a doctorate in a related field...which is actually scarier.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Anybody heard of this dude? He's one of those guys on Dave Ramsey and they brought him on a few years back to touch on the emotional/behavioral aspects of money management/debt/wealth building. This dude presents himself as a clinician, clear as day, and has a practice coaching, but has his doctorate in some garbage degree like Counseling supervision or leadership or something like that. How did we get to this point as a field, where coaching is now becoming more mainstream than going to an actual doctoral level provider of psychology? If you go on twitter (especially right leaning bro twitter), there is rampant mistrust of mental health, especially psychologists, and they are much more open to "coaching." I just don't get it.

It's just the latest grift. Strip away the expert in an ivory tower argument, and it's just another way to separate idiots from their money. Credentials, training, and ethics be damned.

 

[Sanman]

At the end of the day, while it might be considered a grift, I don't think it is the worst out there. Certainly not in the coaching space. Jay Shetty is certifying life coaches based on his ability to purchase an orange hoodie, shave his head, and claim he was a monk.

 

[Chanandler Bong]

Late to this party, but I just saw a SLP repost something by this dude that looked emotionally manipulative... I googled him and found this post. I'm always disappointed to see fellow clinicians posting anything from people who want to be the next Dr. Oz/Phil/Chopra/Weil/whatever. Gross.