East Coast DO Psych Programs

[curious3637]

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Does anyone have any information about DO psych residencies on the east coast?

 

[psychphan]

Ive found it pretty difficult to get information on the DO psych programs. Most of their we sits have almost no information, and very few people post on here about their DO psych programs. Also, I have very little first hand information on the DO psych programs, but I will share with you the hearsay that I've come across, with the preface that it is just that.

Millcreek in Erie, has been around for a while and from what I've heard is a pretty solid program. But Erie PA isn't the most desirable lace to leave, and like most DO Places is a community rather than an academic place.

There are a number of programs in FL. Largo's psych program is brand new this year, so that in itself can be a negative. However, they are a large teaching facility for a DO residency system (over 15 different residencies and fellowships) and thus is probably fiscally strong so could be a good place to be if you don't mind a brand new program. There is also a dually accredited DO/MD psych residency at one of the Atlantic coast places, I believe Columbia, FL. That's likely pretty strong, and I remember their website actually had information about the curriculum, didactics, etc.

If you consider Michigan east coast, then you have MSU's psych residency which is also dually accredited and I think widely considered the best DO psych residency. There is also Henry Ford in Michigan, which I know very little about but have heard vague positive things.

I've heard absolutely nothing about the other DO east coast psych residencies (NJ,NY,OH), sorry.

Sorry this is so generic, and probably not all that helpful, but I figured I'd pass on what I have heard. Also, you can check out the website opportunities.osteopathic.org and search all DO residencies. Maybe you will find some helpful information there.

 

[NJWxMan]

Your input is not accurate. The Millcreek program has not been around very long. These days, there is absolutely no reason any osteopathic graduate should enter into a osteopathic psychiatry residency. There are simply too many strong ACGME programs that are DO-friendly for one to have to take the AOA route. If anyone wants to chime in, I really don't know any advantages of taking the AOA residency route for psychiatry.

 

[digitlnoize]

Your input is not accurate. The Millcreek program has not been around very long. These days, there is absolutely no reason any osteopathic graduate should enter into a osteopathic psychiatry residency. There are simply too many strong ACGME programs that are DO-friendly for one to have to take the AOA route. If anyone wants to chime in, I really don't know any advantages of taking the AOA residency route for psychiatry.

I know of one person doing the DO route for family/personal reasons. Everyone else I know is doing MD psych.

I think part of the problem is that there are so few DO residencies, the locations suck, and they are severely lacking fellowships. Other than that, the general training is likely fine.

One thing I'm not sure of: Do the DO/AOA residencies follow the ACGME rules? I don't believe they do, as a rule. I know a few people doing DO residencies in other fields (IM, OB) and their residencies are NOT following the work hour restrictions (although they're not malignant, just 24-36h shifts occasionally, no q2 call or anything THAT bad).

 

[psychphan]

Your input is not accurate. The Millcreek program has not been around very long. These days, there is absolutely no reason any osteopathic graduate should enter into a osteopathic psychiatry residency. There are simply too many strong ACGME programs that are DO-friendly for one to have to take the AOA route. If anyone wants to chime in, I really don't know any advantages of taking the AOA residency route for psychiatry.

I said a while, I didn't say a long time. And it's all relative. When you consider the east coast programs, Many of them (Orlando, Larkin, Columbia, Dayton, Largo) are in their first 1 -2 yrs. Millcreek at least has current PGY4s for sure and I believe has been around longer than that. Iwill correct myself though, in that Larkin is the FL residency that is dually accredited, not Columbia.

Also, you shouldn't speak in absolutes. You do not know this person, their life situation, values, and preferences for education, career, and life. Yes, there certainly are plenty of good allopathic residencies that are easily accessible to DOs. However, if this person wants to investigate or pursue the DO psychiatry residency path, then there is nothing wrong with that.

 

[peppy]

The DO world has its own work hour rules so they don't abide by the ACGME rules. I no longer recall the specifics of how their rules are different though.

As for the DO psych programs, it does seem like there is not much information out there. However, I did rotate at the Henry Ford program as a med student and I thought it was a strong clinically oriented program - in my view, probably the best program in the DO world, especially since it is dually-accredited.
They have good clinical sites such as Kingswood, a dedicated psych hospital, which is something that few if any of the other DO programs offer. I also suspect that the c/l experience at Henry Ford Hospital would be interesting since that's the large urban hospital that many of the smaller community hospitals transfer their big cases to.
From what I've heard, apparently there are other DO programs where most of the clinical training is at a VA hospital or even a prison. Now, having SOME exposure to those sites is good, but I do think it's less than optimal if those sites are the mainstay of someone's residency experience.

The other issue with DO programs is that apparently at some (possibly all?) of the DO psych residencies you have to continue to learn OMM. I have to say that I don't think that is a very good use of a psychiatry resident's time since the situations where it would be appropriate for a psychiatrist to do OMM on a patient are, in my view, almost non-existent.
Maybe people who just really like OMM and want to have the skill to use on family/friends or something might like the idea of continuing to learn it though. I also would not be surprised to find out that some of the programs probably are different in how seriously they take the OMM requirement.

 

[curious3637]

Do you think MD psych is attainable for an average DO student? (decent grades, positive clinical experiences/LORs, low but passing comclex-didn't take USMLE 1-plan to take USMLE2).
Thanks.I really appreciate the input.

 

[digitlnoize]

Do you think MD psych is attainable for an average DO student? (decent grades, positive clinical experiences/LORs, low but passing comclex-didn't take USMLE 1-plan to take USMLE2).
Thanks.I really appreciate the input.

Yes. I'm a similar student and got a bazillion MD invites at decent places. I did not take USMLE 2, but my COMLEX 2 improved quite a bit over my surprisingly (to me) slightly low step 1.

 

[peppy]

Do you think MD psych is attainable for an average DO student? (decent grades, positive clinical experiences/LORs, low but passing comclex-didn't take USMLE 1-plan to take USMLE2).
Thanks.I really appreciate the input.

Yeah, you should be fine. Just make sure you apply to a good number of programs and go on a good number of interviews.
The most desirable MD programs are competitive for anyone (DO or MD), but there are enough low to middle-tier MD psych programs out there (and so few DO psych programs) that it's not really necessary for a DO student who wants to do psych to go with the DO programs unless they have a strong reason to want to stay in a location that has a DO program.

 

[curious3637]

Encouraging to hear, thanks all🙂

 

[foounke]

Your input is not accurate. The Millcreek program has not been around very long. These days, there is absolutely no reason any osteopathic graduate should enter into a osteopathic psychiatry residency. There are simply too many strong ACGME programs that are DO-friendly for one to have to take the AOA route. If anyone wants to chime in, I really don't know any advantages of taking the AOA residency route for psychiatry.

Wow, why is it so bad for a DO to do an AOA Psych residency? I would appreciate some enlightenment.