EEG and First Unprovoked Seizure

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

NeuroDocDO

Full Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2007
Messages
112
Reaction score
4
I wanted to ask a question about using the EEG to decide whether or not to start someone on an antiseizure medication following a first unprovoked seizure with normal imaging. My understanding is that if the EEG shows occasional or frequent epileptiform discharges, it is reasonable to start an AED. However, if you see a single or rare epeileptiform discharges (e.g, 2-3 spkes or sharp waves during a routine EEG), it is reasonable to hold of on starting treatment as the EEG is only borderline abnormal. I would like to know how other Neurologists approach this issue.

Thanks,
 
I wanted to ask a question about using the EEG to decide whether or not to start someone on an antiseizure medication following a first unprovoked seizure with normal imaging. My understanding is that if the EEG shows occasional or frequent epileptiform discharges, it is reasonable to start an AED. However, if you see a single or rare epeileptiform discharges (e.g, 2-3 spkes or sharp waves during a routine EEG), it is reasonable to hold of on starting treatment as the EEG is only borderline abnormal. I would like to know how other Neurologists approach this issue.

Thanks,

Yeah, always a gray area, probably the best to jump in and offer their opinion would be an individual that did clinical neurophys training with emphasis on EEG, but I will give my two cents as a lowly general neurologist that see a bazillion headaches per year.

Yeah, "spikes" can be non-specific, but you have to take into the account the entire clinical picture. Okay, probably not the answer you are looking for but the number one tenant of EEG reading is not to overcall. I have a colleague in town that over calls many of these "spikes" and trust me, its really aggravating when I know that clincally the patient is psychogenic.

My rules are very simple, when in doubt, repeat and do serial EEGs, which most patients do not enjoy, so the other option is prolonged 96 hour ambulatory study done by my the local epilepsy center and reviewed by an epilepsy trained neurologist. I usually let them be the "tie breaker". Trust me I have seen a number of psychogenic cases where these little spikes were over called by a neurologist and the epilepsy center does these long studies on video and eventually says, "this is crap!".

Now, in your case, not psychogenic, "real" first time provoked seizure. Again, account for the entire clinical picture. I saw a patient recently who claims that his seizures were due to overuse of energy drinks. I have seen a few cases this year alone of individuals who took over the counter supplements, and whenever you research the ingredients, you find that these supplements have components that are metabolically converted to sympathamimetics, I have even seen one test positive for amphetamines. So, hey, perhaps a claim of overuse of energy drinks is valid? But he had three events? How many people day in day out overuse over the counter stimulants and do not have seizures? You'd have to wonder in this case why this individual's seizure threshold was so sensitive?

I'd refer to local epilepsy center, let them repeat the studies or offer a prolonged EEG with activating procedures and make the final call.
 
It's also huge to include the patient in the decision making. Some people are so medication-averse that they'd rather never drive or swim again and live in a bubble than take an AED, which can make the decision a bit easier. Others are so scared of a sz that they'd rather take a gram of levetiracetam a day for a year even with an essentially normal EEG until they get over the helpless feeling of waiting for another seizure.

Then again, I only treat SE, so what the heck do I know! Propofol is a great AED.
 
I wanted to ask a question about using the EEG to decide whether or not to start someone on an antiseizure medication following a first unprovoked seizure with normal imaging. My understanding is that if the EEG shows occasional or frequent epileptiform discharges, it is reasonable to start an AED. However, if you see a single or rare epeileptiform discharges (e.g, 2-3 spkes or sharp waves during a routine EEG), it is reasonable to hold of on starting treatment as the EEG is only borderline abnormal. I would like to know how other Neurologists approach this issue.

Agree with this approach and comments from posters above for tackling this problem.
 
A new onset seizure that was not provoked has a relatively low risk of recurrence (two year risk of around 42%). A second unprovoked seizure increases the risk of recurrence to 70-80%. If there is an abnormal EEG, then the relative risk is around 1.4-1.9 depending upon whether the patient has no known cause ("idiopathic") or prior neurological disease or syndrome ("remote symptomatic"). (Berg & Shinnar - Neurology 1991;41;965)

My algorithm in adult patients would be:
If the EEG demonstrates a epileptogenic focus, then start an AED and get an MRI to evaluate for a structural lesion (mesial temporal sclerosis, tumor, etc). If the EEG demonstrates a primary generalized trait and it would explain the event that the patient had, then start an AED. If the EEG is normal, then hold off on starting a medication.

I am not sure that I would ever call epileptiform discharges "borderline abnormal". If the issue is just that the reader of the EEG is unskilled (and may have interpreted a normal finding as a discharge), have a study performed and read at an academic center.
 
It's also huge to include the patient in the decision making. Some people are so medication-averse that they'd rather never drive or swim again and live in a bubble than take an AED, which can make the decision a bit easier. Others are so scared of a sz that they'd rather take a gram of levetiracetam a day for a year even with an essentially normal EEG until they get over the helpless feeling of waiting for another seizure.

Then again, I only treat SE, so what the heck do I know! Propofol is a great AED.

Agree, was staffing with an epileptologist on a young woman w/ an unprovoked grand mal seizure at night, witnessed by boyfriend with bloody pillow/ deep lateral tongue bites. Two previous pregnancies completely normal gestation and vaginal delivery family medicine style. She was at the end of her second trimester so we started her on Keppra, had an MRI without any abnormalities suspicious for seizure focus. We said that in studies (can't cite specific) that starting an AED at 1st seizure reduced the risk of recurrence in short term but then in long term starting one vs not starting one evened out. If the woman had another grand mal it could be catastrophic for her pregnancy, and since from that point the vast majority of what the fetus does is grow so considered her low risk for birth defects given the agent and the time of starting medication.

As an additional, we comanaged with OBGYN and they found 0 causes for gestation related convulsions (HELLP, preeclampsia, etc)
 
I think that you need to be certain that the seizure is really "unprovoked." Provocations can be as simple as "stress," sleep deprivation, and febrile illness...and sometimes meds known to lower seisure threshold (tramadol, buproprion, and some other psych meds). One seizure (provoked or not), doesn't constitute "epilepsy."
 
42% is "low risk"?

How 'bout if I told you that you have a 42% chance of being killed in a car accident some time in the next 2 years?

Risk is in the ear of the beholder . . .


58% chance they won't need it. That is why you present the risks, benefits and alternatives to the pt and have them make a decision that they are comfortable with when given all their options.

Not sure I would compare a seizure with death.
 
That is why you present the risks, benefits and alternatives to the pt and have them make a decision that they are comfortable with when given all their options.

Not sure I would compare a seizure with death.

That was basically my point: the patient needs to make the final call on that.

And IMHO, a "58%" chance is pretty much a coin toss. Depends on how lucky you feel.

And yes, if a seizure happens at 75 mph on the freeway, or up on a ladder, or in the middle of a lake, it is kinda comparable to death . . .
 
That was basically my point: the patient needs to make the final call on that.

And IMHO, a "58%" chance is pretty much a coin toss. Depends on how lucky you feel.

And yes, if a seizure happens at 75 mph on the freeway, or up on a ladder, or in the middle of a lake, it is kinda comparable to death . . .

Death is death. There is no mild death or partial death. The 42% chance is not a positive, it is a possibility.
 
That was basically my point: the patient needs to make the final call on that.

And IMHO, a "58%" chance is pretty much a coin toss. Depends on how lucky you feel.

And yes, if a seizure happens at 75 mph on the freeway, or up on a ladder, or in the middle of a lake, it is kinda comparable to death . . .


There is a reason that people are put on seizure precautions and driving restrictions despite not being put on a medication.
 
patients over 60 yrs have a much higher (I think around 90%) chance of recurrence and should probably all go on AED after first seizure.
 
In the above setting what are your recomendations to patients who drive
I know it varies from state to state.
I cant find information for my state
and I would appreciate if anybody could point me in the right direction as to where to look for such information. First seizure or syncope...what us the rule of thumb in terms of driving?
Thanks
 
In the above setting what are your recomendations to patients who drive
I know it varies from state to state.
I cant find information for my state
and I would appreciate if anybody could point me in the right direction as to where to look for such information. First seizure or syncope...what us the rule of thumb in terms of driving?
Thanks
I hope this isn't a TOS violation, but i didn't see anything against posting non-profit website links. This is the Epilepsy Foundation's website for driving restrictions by state.

http://www.epilepsyfoundation.org/resources/Driving-Laws-by-State.cfm
 
ThanksAlternate Some1
I saw that site. But for my state the information stated on that website I couldnt even verify that with DMV.
However I wanted any policy papers on the issue. I have tried Pubmed but cant find something solid in terms of recomemndations/guidelines.
I kno it differs from state to state but it would be nice if there were some sort of guidelines like ACC/AHA does so that we can base these decisions on
 
Top