Third year med student interested in the above 3. With EM grads now eligible to take the IM CC boards, can anyone with more experience speak to the advantages of EM/IM or EM/IM/CC? Is there any advantage to the additional IM training in this case?
Third year med student interested in the above 3. With EM grads now eligible to take the IM CC boards, can anyone with more experience speak to the advantages of EM/IM or EM/IM/CC? Is there any advantage to the additional IM training in this case?
Only an MS3, but I think EM with a CC fellowship would serve most people fine.
I would still personally probably opt for the EM/IM/CC route because the IM certification adds a lot of career flexibility and a little more alphabet to your soup for just one extra year of training. Probably particularly beneficial in academics...
I have been thinking about this also and am kind of leaning towards EM/CCM and forgoing the IM training. Not sure how smart that is since this track is relatively new. Guess it boils down to, do we really need the additional IM training to be competent in CCM?
How does that work? 3 year EM + 1 year IM + 2 year CC fellow?
Only an MS3, but I think EM with a CC fellowship would serve most people fine.
I would still personally probably opt for the EM/IM/CC route because the IM certification adds a lot of career flexibility and a little more alphabet to your soup for just one extra year of training. Probably particularly beneficial in academics...
How does that work? 3 year EM + 1 year IM + 2 year CC fellow?
I don't think so, but I still think it's helpful.
An extra year of training worth of helpful? (Forget EM/IM + 2yr CC--I've already taken 8 years for med school)
It's totally not necessary, but I find my chronic disease background to be helpful in the MICU. It all kind of depends on what you want to do in the future.
Likely academics, and probably MICU--came into med school thinking IM followed by pulm/CC. I decided I definitely want an EM component, but really like the complex pathophys management part of IM that is lacking in EM because of the short duration of care.
I'll be applying next cycle. Right now I'm thinking I'll apply mostly to EM programs with a strong CC component, plus the EM/IM programs that have the option of 1 extra year for CC.
EM/IM is 5 years. A critical care fellowship will be two more.
As I understand it, the combined EM/IM/CC residencies will be only 6 years.
7 years training?
So you could train neurosurgery or EM/IM/CC...
If you think about it, a good chunk of specialties require 5-6 years nowadays (Cards, Pulm-CC, Surgical Specialties, Radiology/Rad Onc, etc). Even Anesthesia/Path training takes 5-6 years now due to the job market since it takes completion of a fellowship to have the most options from what I hear. Neurosurgery takes 6-8 years but your lifestyle is WAY worse in residency than as an EM/IM on average and likely after you get out. You may as well put in the time now to have the most options later on and if you want an EM component to your practice then EM/IM is really the option to go with unless you want to be doing a second residency.Likely academics, and probably MICU--came into med school thinking IM followed by pulm/CC. I decided I definitely want an EM component, but really like the complex pathophys management part of IM that is lacking in EM because of the short duration of care.
I'll be applying next cycle. Right now I'm thinking I'll apply mostly to EM programs with a strong CC component, plus the EM/IM programs that have the option of 1 extra year for CC.
Bump. Just wanted to see how you guys were thinking/doing since this thread has started. MS3, soon to be MS4 here thinking the exact same thing. I like EM/CC/IM, but not sure which way to go, which programs to shoot for, competitiveness, etc. Bumpity bump
Your best bet is to email those places that do have an established EM/IM program and ask if they also offer the EM/IM/CC pathway.
I've been doing this with the programs in areas of the country where I'd be interested in living, and the answer so far from most of them is "No".
I'm almost certain you can get the 6 year gig at Hennepin County in Minneapolis (at least some of the EM/IM guys were talking about it).
That's a negative per my communication with their PD. He said they've discussed it but apparently most of their residents want to do the full pulm/CC fellowship. A friend of mine has threatened to call a psych consult on me if I seriously consider EM/IM-->pulm/CC after an 8-year MD/PhD.
http://www.bidmc.org/CentersandDepa...etOurTeam/AcademicFaculty/MichaelDonnino.aspxIt is beginning to sound more and more like a theoretical possibility but no one is doing it yet. That's unfortunate.
Also guy at Maryland did EM/IM then 2 year CC fellowship at Dartmouth.
He could do EM/IM and then a 2 year CC fellowship like everyone else, but he's looking to cut the year. It seems finding a program that will do this is difficult.
Got it. Well I think you have the right idea about your application strategy given your goals. The PhD should definitely kick open most doors with your goals as well.Yeah, exactly. I want to combine emergency medicine and critical care. I don't need the IM training, but I think it would add to my strength as an intensivist.
However, I'm not willing to be in training for ever. I'm going to be 30 as it is when I graduate from med school, and I've decided 6 years post-grad training is my limit. Thus I'm applying mainly to EM (especially CC-strong programs, with the plan to do a 2-year fellowship afterward), and also to those EM/IM/CC programs where the 6th year for CC board eligibility is a possibility.
I am really interested in IM-->CCM and IM/EM-->CCM, both with the intention of practicing CCM in the end. There are only a few hospitals with CCM fellowships and both IM and IM/EM residencies. Being limited geographically, these are fellowships that I am very interested in. Would applying to the combined program and the categorical program at the same hospital drop me down the rank list, even if I just were to say something like "i want your CCM fellowship. IM/EM is my first choice because I feel I would benefit as an intensivist with the additional training. If not i still want to train at your hospital in IM with the intention of applying for your CCM fellowship down the line"?
Most candidates apply to EM/IM in addition to EM or IM (some to all three). I do not think that you will be adversely affected by disclosing this. If you choose not to apply to the categorical program at the same hospital, this may even be considered a negative as programs may feel that you don't think the categorical program is strong enough.
If you choose to dual-apply and actively deny this, your lie will likely be discovered and will result in bad things.
Thank you, thats exactly what I was looking to hear. I was just worried that I would appear like a flip flop and hurt my chances at both programs.