Emergency! Low GPA but also need to retake ochem. Master's? Post bac?

[Futuredds2010]

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Hi
I was going to apply to dental school this year but got really discouraged because my ochem grade came back to haunt me!!!! I received a D both semesters in ochem. I am a biochemistry major and received B's in the other biochem courses. I have also taken, microbiology(C+), neuroscience (B), physiology (C), and histology (C). The C's did not help my GPA at all and I am very frustrated. My science GPA is 2.5 and total is 2.65. I have been talking to deans at UIC,SIU,UofP, U of Tenessee, and Meharry. Most of them recommend that I do a masters and to be careful which masters program I choose since some are seminar/research related and are not helpful for dental school.
There is a post bac program at SIU that seems pretty legit but....I do not know if it is hard enough for me to demonstrate that I took a tough course load after undergrad to boost my gpa!!!!!!! I have not taken the DAT yet and plan on getting above 20 in all sections in August.

So any advice anyone?😕

 

[4thMolar]

Well you definitely need to enroll in some sort of Special Masters Program (SMP) to give you the best chance at being competitive for dental school admissions. Check out the post-bacc forum of student doctor and you will find several programs that are available. The deadlines to most programs have already passed for Fall 2009 admission, but there are some that you can apply for and enroll in for Spring 2010.

You will also need to retake both organic chemistry courses since many schools require you get at least a C (2.0) in prereqs. So what I would suggest is, if you still plan on taking the DAT in august, take the DAT, re-take Orgo 1 in the fall, orgo 2 in the spring (thus you cannot start an SMP in Spring 2010), and then begin an SMP in Fall 2010. But if you do this it may set you back two years b/c there won't be too much improvement in your grades (unless you take more courses as well along with orgo) to apply next year as well.

Another thing you can do is take some courses in the Fall at a local university, start your SMP in spring 2010, apply in summer 2010 (with one semester of graduate grades), finish the SMP in fall 2010, and then retake orgo 2 if you need to in spring 2011. You may be able to get interviews with a semester's worth of graduate grades, but they may ask you to repeat orgo 2 before you matriculate.

Oh and one more thing, with your low GPA, I'm not sure how many SMPs you'd be eligible for (since many have min requirement of 3.0 GPA, but I'm sure if you look, you'll find some)

 

[Futuredds2010]

Thanks for the response! I forgot to mention I am a senior in college and I will be graduating in June 2010. So, I still have time to increase my GPA to atleast 3.0. Barry University is on my list of schools to apply to for a Masters because it has a SMP for dental students. Other than that, I was going to take orgo over after my masters is completed in June 2011. In the fall of 2011, while I am applying to dental schools for the 2012 cycle I will retake Ochem at Barry. That is a possible plan.....

 

[4thMolar]

Can't you retake both orgo courses during your senior year of college (fall and spring semesters); that way you can go ahead and get that out of the way instead of waiting till after you finish the masters program.

 

[Futuredds2010]

Well the problem with that is that I have to take a required course for my biochem major. And its the same time as orgo I. I could take orgo II next semester though...do you think it will be better to take orgo II over and take orgo I some other time? Also, some schools recommended me not to take it at a community college because that was what I was going to do this year since there is a cc near my college.

 

[4thMolar]

Well the problem with that is that I have to take a required course for my biochem major. And its the same time as orgo I. I could take orgo II next semester though...do you think it will be better to take orgo II over and take orgo I some other time? Also, some schools recommended me not to take it at a community college because that was what I was going to do this year since there is a cc near my college.

Well it would be kind of weird to retake orgo 2 before orgo 1, but there's really no problem in that I guess, so go ahead and do that if you can. And yeah, I wouldn't take it at a CC either, as some schools don't accept CC credits.

 

[Futuredds2010]

Well you know, I have been in contact with Southern Illinois MEDPREP post bac program. They have told me that I would be able to retake organic chemistry in their program in addition to taking other upper level courses. So if I get into the program for fall 2010 I will take orgo fall 2010. It only makes sense that I HAVE to retake ocem period. I don't think there is anyway I can avoid retaking ochem. Hopefully, that will boost my GPA and when I take the other upper level courses in the post bac program it will also help boost my GPA.

Thanks for your response! Have you gotten into dental school?

 

[4thMolar]

That's great that you can retake orgo during that specific program, and it would seem to be the best option then. I'm applying to dschools this cycle, so I'll see how it goes.

 

[Futuredds2010]

Good luck! What schools are you applying to?

I have a question. Since the post bac I am doing is 2 years long and I start in the fall of 2010, would it make sense to apply in June 2011 for admission into the 2012 class or wait until 2012 to apply? I hate wasting time so I think that applying for admission into the 2012 cycle will be best.

But I am not sure how much my GPA will increase by then. Considering that my GPA will definitely go up my senior year to at least a 3.0 by graduation and taking orgo over will help push me to maybe a 3.3-3.5 (If I get an A in both courses), I might have a shot at the 2011 cycle right? Also, when is a good time to take the DAT. I took the Kaplan course this summer and paid $400. It was really helpful but I dont want it to go to waste since I am not applying this cycle. So should I still take the DAT in August if I feel pretty confident about doing well? The only problem is that the scores can only be 2 years old when you apply and if I apply for the 2011 cycle my scores may be outdated :-( lol

 

[4thMolar]

Good luck! What schools are you applying to?

I have a question. Since the post bac I am doing is 2 years long and I start in the fall of 2010, would it make sense to apply in June 2011 for admission into the 2012 class or wait until 2012 to apply? I hate wasting time so I think that applying for admission into the 2012 cycle will be best.

But I am not sure how much my GPA will increase by then. Considering that my GPA will definitely go up my senior year to at least a 3.0 by graduation and taking orgo over will help push me to maybe a 3.3-3.5 (If I get an A in both courses), I might have a shot at the 2011 cycle right? Also, when is a good time to take the DAT. I took the Kaplan course this summer and paid $400. It was really helpful but I dont want it to go to waste since I am not applying this cycle. So should I still take the DAT in August if I feel pretty confident about doing well? The only problem is that the scores can only be 2 years old when you apply and if I apply for the 2011 cycle my scores may be outdated :-( lol

For this post-bacc program, how many credit hours does it include? Also, one thing you should note is that if you enroll in a post-bacc program, it only adds to your undergraduate GPA, which may not change much depending on the amount of credits you have already taken. Doing an SMP will create a completely new GPA for you, which will be designated as your graduate GPA. Some schools look more favorably on you if you have a high graduate GPA, and will take that into consideration b/c they know how tough the courses can be. I know this b/c that's what several adcoms have told me this when I spoke with them. Additionally, there are several SMPs that are one year long, and plus you get an actual degree. Furthermore, since an SMP is specifically designed for pre-health students, you will be taking many courses that mimic those you will take in your first year of dental school, such as Gross Anatomy, Neuro, etc.

Either way, if you choose to do an SMP or this post-bacc program, I would apply for dschools in summer of 2010. You'll have a full years worth of courses taken and hopefully have your GPA increased. You may not make a definitive decision btw a post bacc or SMP yet since you still have a year left of courses to take, so once you have a fair estimate of where your GPA will be by the end of your senior year, you will have a better idea of where to go from there.

As far as your DAT goes, if you feel ready, go ahead and take it in August before your fall semester starts. This way, if you don't do as well as you would have liked, you can always take it early next summer and have a better feel for how it's like. Also, DAT scores are valid for 3 years, not 2 years (for most schools I believe).

 

[Futuredds2010]

Thanks so much!

I agree that a SMP is better. Barry University has a Masters in Biomedical Science degree. I could do the 1 year or 18 month track and they offer courses like anatomy,neuro,biochem,physiology,general dentistry etc.

I have read the threads on this site about Barry and the students who went there didnt have positive things to say about it. Most of them complained about it not having an affliation with a dental school and they did not get into dental school after completing their masters. So I was kind of concerned about that. But they could have not gotten in because of other reasons too I guess.

I will still apply to this post bac but I am also going to apply for the masters at Barry as well. The SMP will definitely make me more competitive given that I graduate with a 4.0!!!!!! As for retaking ochem..I would have to do that after my master's I guess.

Oh and did you mean that I should apply in 2010 for admission into 2011 cycle since my GPA will have increased from senior year? If so, would they still look down on my app since I did not retake ochem???

 

[Futuredds2010]

Actually, I can take ochem next summer at a 4 year college near my home and still do a one year masters fall 2010. I think that's my best bet. Thanks for your help!


Good luck!

 

[GiTsticker]

You may not make a definitive decision btw a post bacc or SMP yet since you still have a year left of courses to take, so once you have a fair estimate of where your GPA will be by the end of your senior year, you will have a better idea of where to go from there.

Why would the GPA determine whether someone should apply to SMP or postbac? Are you reasoning that a low GPA would be better suited for postbac because it could be more dramatically improved? And that a ~3.0 GPA can't be moved much and therefore a brand new GPA would be better? Sorry if I'm hijacking...just curious. My GPA is 3.1/3.1 overall/science.

 

[4thMolar]

Why would the GPA determine whether someone should apply to SMP or postbac? Are you reasoning that a low GPA would be better suited for postbac because it could be more dramatically improved? And that a ~3.0 GPA can't be moved much and therefore a brand new GPA would be better? Sorry if I'm hijacking...just curious. My GPA is 3.1/3.1 overall/science.

Well generally if you have a really low GPA (like 3.0 or below), it would be better to do an SMP so that a new GPA can be calculated and will be given more consideration since you would be taking graduate level courses (according to adcoms I have spoken with). Since the OP mentioned his GPA was in the 2.5-2.65 range, it would take a significant amount of A's in postbacc work to raise it since he would presumably have taken many credit hours since he is a senior now, and since it only adds to your undergraduate GPA. If you were borderline in GPA (3.1-3.3ish), you may be able to take enough classes to raise it to a level that is competitive. You also have to take into consideration DAT scores and other aspects of your application as well when considering chances for interviews. By the look of your DAT scores, I would think you would be competitve enough for at least interviews. Anyways, I was just saying this b/c this is what adcoms have told me so I thought it would be a good to pass along.

 

[Futuredds2010]

What is adcoms?

 

[4thMolar]

What is adcoms?

admission committees

 

[Talisa3636]

Futuredds2010 we are in the same boat and graduating the same year! I am a psychology major with a chem minor and im worried about schools! I plan on retaking physics since ive done well in my other preq's but physics is my killer! I will apply for SIU second cycle just to be on the safe side and if I get in take physics during the program. If not I will take courses during the fall after graduation and start a 1year SMP in January 2011. How are your extracurriculars going? Im going to be pretty involved this year plus several job shadowing opps to get hours.

 

[Futuredds2010]

Futuredds2010 we are in the same boat and graduating the same year! I am a psychology major with a chem minor and im worried about schools! I plan on retaking physics since ive done well in my other preq's but physics is my killer! I will apply for SIU second cycle just to be on the safe side and if I get in take physics during the program. If not I will take courses during the fall after graduation and start a 1year SMP in January 2011. How are your extracurriculars going? Im going to be pretty involved this year plus several job shadowing opps to get hours.

Well at least we are in the same boat. I plan on taking ochem the first year in MEDPREP and applying to dental school 2011. You know you still have time to apply for the first cycle. The deadline is sept 15.

As for my extracurriculars, I have a pretty solid record. I plan on shadowing more this winter break though.

 

[Talisa3636]

I would love to apply in time for Sept 15 but Im not sure that I will have my LORs in time! I go to Howard and professors really need to be notified ahead of time since admin. can get a bit crazy. Im really excited and I going to start working on my application this upcoming week! Ditto with applying for 2011, im looking at UNC, Howard, Meharry, East Carolina(new dental school), UMD and UoP(I love how dedicated they are to the students!). Girl were going to be rolling in debt when we are DDS!

 

[Futuredds2010]

I would love to apply in time for Sept 15 but Im not sure that I will have my LORs in time! I go to Howard and professors really need to be notified ahead of time since admin. can get a bit crazy. Im really excited and I going to start working on my application this upcoming week! Ditto with applying for 2011, im looking at UNC, Howard, Meharry, East Carolina(new dental school), UMD and UoP(I love how dedicated they are to the students!). Girl were going to be rolling in debt when we are DDS!

Wow we have alot in common! lol You are right about Howard because I have a friend who goes there and said the same thing about the admin and asking for LOE ahead of time. I went to HU for SMDEP 2007 and loved it there. Howard and Meharry are my top choices for dental school. When I apply in 2011 I am applying to 15 schools though. I LOVE U o P as as well. The administratration there are so nice and you graduate in 3 years!!! 😎 lol. I didnt know east carolina was opening a new dental school. I will have to check that out. I am from Illinois and Midwestern University is opening a new dental school in 2010. In addition, Western University of Health Sciences in Cali and Midwestern in AZ are new dental schools a well. I am glad they are opening more dental schools.

Good luck on the application!

 

[Murl]

If you did really well on the DAT you may have a shot at Meharry, assumingyou are a minority. I thought about applying there but I am a white male and decided it would probably be a real waste of time and money. There science GPA is fairly low, 2.8ish. Good luck, if you need to know anything about the area I live about an hour from Nashville.

 

[Talisa3636]

If you did really well on the DAT you may have a shot at Meharry, assumingyou are a minority. I thought about applying there but I am a white male and decided it would probably be a real waste of time and money. There science GPA is fairly low, 2.8ish. Good luck, if you need to know anything about the area I live about an hour from Nashville.

I wont hurt trying! At Howard there are plenty of white students in the med and dental schools, I feel that if your goal is to serve in underserved communities you will have a good chance.

 

[Murl]

Yeah I come from an underserved area and plan to go back. I love Nashville but I would much rather go to a state school for the simple reason of oweing so much less money when I am done. As long as I don't get like a 9 on the DAT I should be good for my state schools here. There are in state students that started this year with 15's and 16's AA, I know this because I know some of them and did some post bac work with them.

 

[Futuredds2010]

If you did really well on the DAT you may have a shot at Meharry, assumingyou are a minority. I thought about applying there but I am a white male and decided it would probably be a real waste of time and money. There science GPA is fairly low, 2.8ish. Good luck, if you need to know anything about the area I live about an hour from Nashville.

I don't think it will be a waste of time and money for you. You should still apply. I visited Meharry last summer and I loved it. Are you applying to University of Tennessee then?

 

[DDMess]

well future for one, i wouldn't take what anybody on these forums says for more than a few grains of salt. you need to talk to adcoms, be real with them and see what they think is the best way to improve your application. from the looks of things it could be your GPA but if you do well this year and slaughter the DAT you definitely have a shot at a school like Meharry. if i were you i wouldn't be set on an SMP unless it was my last choice and i was fully committed to it.

 

[Futuredds2010]

well future for one, i wouldn't take what anybody on these forums says for more than a few grains of salt. you need to talk to adcoms, be real with them and see what they think is the best way to improve your application. from the looks of things it could be your GPA but if you do well this year and slaughter the DAT you definitely have a shot at a school like Meharry. if i were you i wouldn't be set on an SMP unless it was my last choice and i was fully committed to it.

You are right. I definitely value adcoms opinions over anyone else's. They have told me to increase my gpa and that is what I plan to do my senior year. I really want to apply next summer but since I need to retake ochem I am not sure whether I will get an interview as a result of my grade. Or of they will wait on my grade on ochem to give me an interview.

 

[DDMess]

You are right. I definitely value adcoms opinions over anyone else's. They have told me to increase my gpa and that is what I plan to do my senior year. I really want to apply next summer but since I need to retake ochem I am not sure whether I will get an interview as a result of my grade. Or of they will wait on my grade on ochem to give me an interview.

Try to talk to the adcoms over this coming year, stay in constant contact with them. I'd say try to achieve a 3.75 or higher your senior year, adcoms will take notice. Make sure you put a voice, a personality, a face (if possible) to your application. It will go a long way.

 

[DDMess]

btw future, is that you in your pic? you are hawtt

 

[Futuredds2010]

btw future, is that you in your pic? you are hawtt

haha sorry for the late reply. yea that's me lol