ETSU (MD) vs KCU (DO)

[medhopeful82]

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I have been accepted to these 2 schools and I am struggling to make a decision. I loved both schools on interview day. ETSU had a slight edge in my mind due to small class sizes and no competition with other med school students for rotations. But I like the city of Kansas City better

Would you agree these 2 schools are about equal in terms of setting me up for a successful career? Any opinion or insight is helpful

 

[Lawpy]

US MD > US DO. It will help you in the long run especially for better residency placements (even for primary care). And you take fewer standardized exams (you avoid COMLEX completely)

Unless you are pressured by family or financial obligations, go for ETSU

 

[GrapesofRath]

Regardless of how you define a successful career; there is little question an US MD program provides more diverse opportunities for residencies(not just in terms of specialities being accessible but the quality/tier and in turn location of residency programs for less competitive fields as well).

Even most of the biggest DO advocates/fanatics would tell you to take a US MD acceptance and run with it, particularly with the upcoming "merger"( hostile takeover might be a better word than merger)

 

[ZorkDork1]

Regardless of how you define a successful career; there is little question an US MD program provides more diverse opportunities for residencies(not just in terms of specialities being accessible but the quality/tier and in turn location of residency programs for less competitive fields as well).

Even most of the biggest DO advocates/fanatics would tell you to take a US MD acceptance and run with it, particularly with the upcoming "merger"( hostile takeover might be a better word than merger)

Hi, what merger are you talking about? Not to hi jack the thread.


OP: I say go for the MD! Congratulations on both acceptances anyhow! 🙂

 

[Doug Underhill]

ETSU has a very specific culture. They self-select for it heavily, so if you were accepted there, they probably think you would not be too out of place there. One major difference between ETSU and KCUMB is the class size: ETSU's is very small (70). while KCUMB is large (265). ETSU is one of the most rural medical schools in the nation, while KCUMB is in an urban area. ETSU has a mission for primary care, often in rural areas. The median matriculant at ETSU has significantly better stats (3.8/30) than the median KCUMB matriculant(3.63/26). If you are a resident of Tennessee (which you probably are, since ETSU takes very few non-residents), tuition is significantly cheaper for ETSU, with tuition + fees being $30,000 compared to $43,500 for KCUMB.

This information may be more pertinent than the simple MD vs. DO comparison.

 

[ChrisMack390]

You will never regret getting an MD instead of a DO.

There is a chance, however small, that you will regret getting a DO instead of an MD.

 

[ahc336]

Keep in mind you're in the pre-MD forum right now. Ask this same question in the DO forum and compare your responses to get the most informed answer.

 

[medic86]

Keep in mind you're in the pre-MD forum right now. Ask this same question in the DO forum and compare your responses to get the most informed answer.

The answers will be about the same.

 

[Lawpy]

Keep in mind you're in the pre-MD forum right now. Ask this same question in the DO forum and compare your responses to get the most informed answer.

The answers will be about the same.

I'm curious who would oppose the above statements. They really aren't debatable. In fact, i learned more about DO education pathway by talking to the guys over in pre-osteo forums.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I am a DO advocate who will most likely be applying to mostly DO schools the upcoming cycle. Take the MD acceptance and run. Honestly KCU is a great school that will give you a large number of opportunities but the MD can provide an edge in opportunities come match time and that fact cannot be overlooked. Congrats on the acceptances!

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I'm curious who would oppose the above statements. They really aren't debatable. In fact, i learned more about DO education pathway by talking to the guys over in pre-osteo forums.

I would oppose your statement of US MD > US DO. This notion only exists among the uninformed and the minds of pre-meds. Unless of course you were strictly talking about opportunities then yes the opportunities at a MD school often outweigh the opportunities afforded at most DO programs.

 

[Lawpy]

I would oppose your statement of US MD > US DO. This notion only exists among the uninformed and the minds of pre-meds. Unless of course you were strictly talking about opportunities then yes the opportunities at a MD school often outweigh the opportunities afforded at most DO programs.

I guess > was used ambiguously. I'm viewing it purely out of efficiency basis that is broadly generalized. Basically, having fewer exams to study for and more opportunities/resources to help you get into good residency of any specialty are driving reasons why imo MD is better than DO.

But i really mean it broadly. I am still of a very strong opinion that top DO schools completely surpass many lower tier MD schools in educational quality (which is why i always say PCOM >>> Drexel). But a direct comparison between two general pathways is something to be noted.

 

[medhopeful82]

I guess > was used ambiguously. I'm viewing it purely out of efficiency basis that is broadly generalized. Basically, having fewer exams to study for and more opportunities/resources to help you get into good residency of any specialty are driving reasons why imo MD is better than DO.

But i really mean it broadly. I am still of a very strong opinion that top DO schools completely surpass many lower tier MD schools in educational quality (which is why i always say PCOM >>> Drexel). But a direct comparison between two general pathways is something to be noted.

Going off of the last part of your statement... Would you still agree that ETSU (a lower tier MD) >> than KCU (a top DO)

I understand the overall statement that MD has more opportunities than DO. But I didn't know when the ranking comes in to play like it does for PCOM and Drexel

 

[AlteredScale]

Choosing an MD program is never a bad idea. I would take ETSU because firstly you don't have to fight for clinical rotations. And moreover, even though ETSU is small, there are far greater opportunities for scholarly activity there (ETSU recently received a 2.7 million dollar NIH award for CRP investigation) which can help you tremendously. Imo, even as a student from kcu, you cant hide these advantages with going to ETSU. Best of luck in your decision!

 

[GrapesofRath]

Going off of the last part of your statement... Would you still agree that ETSU (a lower tier MD) >> than KCU (a top DO)

I understand the overall statement that MD has more opportunities than DO. But I didn't know when the ranking comes in to play like it does for PCOM and Drexel

Your potential residency opportunites at Drexel or ETSU(both in terms of specialities and tier of residency programs even for the less competitive specialities) will be more plentiful than they will at PCOM. Period. I really have absolutely no idea how anybody could suggest otherwise.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Listen to AlteredScale ^^^

 

[medhopeful82]

Thank you everyone!!

 

[Lawpy]

Going off of the last part of your statement... Would you still agree that ETSU (a lower tier MD) >> than KCU (a top DO)

I understand the overall statement that MD has more opportunities than DO. But I didn't know when the ranking comes in to play like it does for PCOM and Drexel

No of course not. The two are comparable (leaning towards KCUMB being better) but i chose ETSU purely out of comparison between the education pathways

Your potential residency opportunites at Drexel or ETSU(both in terms of specialities and tier of residency programs even for the less competitive specialities) will be more plentiful than they will at PCOM. Period. I really have absolutely no idea how anybody could suggest otherwise.

My comment on Drexel has nothing to do with residency placements but rather is about the overall quality of the school. Some say it's better than PCOM because it has the main teaching hospital, but.... Hahnemann is pretty unstable on top of numerous issues that Drexel is suffering from. Not worth the risk.

 

[PugsAndHugs]

I am still of a very strong opinion that top DO schools completely surpass many lower tier MD schools in educational quality (which is why i always say PCOM >>> Drexel).

I've also heard of the PCOM and Drexel comparison before. Are there any other specifc DO schools that you think surpass lower tier MD schools in terms of education quality (not residency)? Just curious as someone that is in this current application cycle trying to get different perspectives.

 

[Goro]

Here's what's really important: wet barbecue or dry???

I have been accepted to these 2 schools and I am struggling to make a decision. I loved both schools on interview day. ETSU had a slight edge in my mind due to small class sizes and no competition with other med school students for rotations. But I like the city of Kansas City better

Would you agree these 2 schools are about equal in terms of setting me up for a successful career? Any opinion or insight is helpful

 

[Goro]

No brainer there.... most COMs vs CNU

I've also heard of the PCOM and Drexel comparison before. Are there any other specifc DO schools that you think surpass lower tier MD schools in terms of education quality (not residency)? Just curious as someone that is in this current application cycle trying to get different perspectives.

 

[Dustbowl12]

If this was the 90's or 80's take the MD.....today, base it off of fit, location, tuition, rotation sites, match lists...not on the letters....Compare program vs program based on rotations, match lists, research if that matters to you, mission, residency affiliations...

That being said
KCU is a great school, I have never heard of ETSU. I would go with KCU

 

[Lawpy]

I've also heard of the PCOM and Drexel comparison before. Are there any other specifc DO schools that you think surpass lower tier MD schools in terms of education quality (not residency)? Just curious as someone that is in this current application cycle trying to get different perspectives.

Well I was surprised to hear recently that Rosalind Franklin was having some serious issues with its rotations, so I'd wager that CCOM is superior. MSUCOM, Western and Touros are excellent schools but I can't think of a corresponding MD comparison for them (I guess MSUCOM is better than the MD counterpart because it's more established)

No brainer there.... most COMs vs CNU

Rocky Vista is far superior to CNU. Dead serious here.

 

[Dustbowl12]

No brainer there.... most COMs vs CNU

I would take PCOM over Drexel too. Based on Rotation strength, match lists, and ability to have additional training in OMM.

I would also take Western Pomona over UCR MD.

 

[Doug Underhill]

KCU is a great school, I have never heard of ETSU. I would go with KCU

It's a school with a mission to serve the residents of rural Tennessee. If you've never heard of it, you probably don't have any connections to that area. It has a heavy in-state bias, so there's not much reason for non-TN residents to send an app there (despite this, they still get about 2000 OOS apps and invite about three people to interview)

 

[Dustbowl12]

Well I was surprised to hear recently that Rosalind Franklin was having some serious issues with its rotations, so I'd wager that CCOM is superior. MSUCOM, Western and Touros are excellent schools but I can't think of a corresponding MD comparison for them (I guess MSUCOM is better than the MD counterpart because it's more established)



Rocky Vista is far superior to CNU. Dead serious here.

MSU's DO program is ranked 12 in nation for primary care, their MD program is ranked like 70 something. The DO program is more established and older.

Rocky Vista has great match lists, better and more experienced faculty by a long shot, and has far better rotation sites than CNU.

This blind MD>DO is just plain wrong. It is really a case by case thing. It is dishonest to tell premeds that every single MD> Every single DO because it isn't true.

You are all physicians/medical students. Be nuanced, fair and accurate. Im not saying anything more or less than there are several DO programs that are superior to some MD programs

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

ETSU has a very specific culture. They self-select for it heavily, so if you were accepted there, they probably think you would not be too out of place there. One major difference between ETSU and KCUMB is the class size: ETSU's is very small (70). while KCUMB is large (265). ETSU is one of the most rural medical schools in the nation, while KCUMB is in an urban area. ETSU has a mission for primary care, often in rural areas. The median matriculant at ETSU has significantly better stats (3.8/30) than the median KCUMB matriculant(3.63/26). If you are a resident of Tennessee (which you probably are, since ETSU takes very few non-residents), tuition is significantly cheaper for ETSU, with tuition + fees being $30,000 compared to $43,500 for KCUMB.

This information may be more pertinent than the simple MD vs. DO comparison.

Kcu MCAT is 29. Difference in stats barely exists.

 

[allantois]

MSU's DO program is ranked 12 in nation for primary care, their MD program is ranked like 70 something. The DO program is more established and older.

Rocky Vista has great match lists, better and more experienced faculty by a long shot, and has far better rotation sites than CNU.

This blind MD>DO is just plain wrong. It is really a case by case thing. It is dishonest to tell premeds that every single MD> Every single DO because it isn't true.

You are all physicians/medical students. Be nuanced, fair and accurate. Im not saying anything more or less than there are several DO programs that are superior to some MD programs

Are we supposed to be impressed by ranking for primary care? Any school will get you spot to a primary care residency.

 

[AlteredScale]

I really don't think stats are what's important here. KCU interviews people above a 30 MCAT all the time. I know of 5 in my class who's MCAT ranged from 31-34.

The big thing here is what opportunites will be available. Though KCU offers a great amount, ETSU offers a bit more. And that comes with the territory of being a medical school affiliated with a public university.

 

[Dustbowl12]

Are we supposed to be impressed by ranking for primary care? Any school will get you spot to a primary care residency.

Very arrogant to look down upon primary care. There are prestiguous primary care residencies, they aren't all the same.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Are we supposed to be impressed by ranking for primary care? Any school will get you spot to a primary care residency.

What if the person wants a cardio, gastro, heme/onco fellowship? You want to be in a good school which will place you in a good residency (a little off tangent, I know).

 

[Dr Tony T. Chopper]

Considering many pre-osteo people chill in pre-allo, you aren't entirely preaching to the choir. As a DO student, I agree that MD route is currently the path of least resistance in residency opportunities.

 

[Doug Underhill]

Kcu MCAT is 29. Difference in stats barely exists.

I'm basing it off this:

http://kcumb.uberflip.com/i/162339-com-fact-sheet

It says 26 here.

http://www.kcumb.edu/academics/college-of-osteopathic-medicine/students-and-alumni/

However, here, it says 27.8

Either way, there's still .13 difference in GPA and 1 point of MCAT even with a 29, which is not the biggest difference in the world, admittedly.

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

I'm basing it off this:

http://kcumb.uberflip.com/i/162339-com-fact-sheet

It says 26 here.

http://www.kcumb.edu/academics/college-of-osteopathic-medicine/students-and-alumni/

However, here, it says 27.8

Either way, there's still .13 difference in GPA and 1 point of MCAT even with a 29, which is not the biggest difference in the world, admittedly.

Outdated info. Class of 2017/2018 respectively. 2019 is 29.

 

[AzizImSorry]

If tuition isn't a concern, I say go wherever makes you happiest. Happy people work harder and are generally more satisfied with the choice they've made. Sure, you'll have more opportunities at any US MD school, but you already knew that. If you have a goal and are willing to work for it, you can make it happen the DO route (albeit a more difficult path for certain specialties, and virtually impossible for the most competitive ones). I personally would rather work my ass off and be happy than regret my decision and choose the path of least resistance. Good luck with your choice!

*Happiness is obviously relative