everyone so smart

[NearnstPotentia]

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How are you guys tested? Fill in? Multiple choice? essay? Combination?

 

[Morsetlis]

Death by Scantron.

 

[loveoforganic]

Only a first year, but our tests for histo and anatomy/embryo are multiple choice on the computer for anatomy/embryo/histo written test and written for the histo/anatomy/embryo practicals

 

[CaptainSSO]

I agree with you on every point except the competitiveness. I got roughly the same score as you on the MCAT but I am well below the average. This could certainly be because I haven't studied enough but I have still studied way more than I did in undergrad. But yes, people study an insane amount here, so I still agree that med school is more about hard work than intelligence. Unfortunately at a top
20 people are way more intense about getting into a "good" residency than elsewhere.

Yea I mean I can see it being like that. I feel like people are pretty intense here, as well, and this is nowhere close to a top school. But in my mind, getting 36+ on your MCAT, there's no reason you can't be towards the top of your class. Take a lot of work though.

"Lil" Mick
We're in a population that is statistically different from the normal population (minimal level of intelligence needed for college and medical school+anyone higher than that). I doubt your average person from high school/lower tier college could pass exams in the time given for us to study...

It doesn't require an extraordinary intellectual acumen to do well in medical school, just hard work. If the average person from a "lower-tier" university put in the requisite time, I have no doubt they could pass. Passing is actually pretty easy. Doing better than that would be a different story, but plenty of average, B students from my undergrad got into med school, and they're doing just fine.

 

[Masticate3Xaday]

Not tooting my own horn here, but I'm currently at a top 3 institution, and we had a girl in our class from a small school (probably not even top 150 according to USWR's useless rankings) and she absolutely dominated the 1st anatomy exam. She even did better than alums from places like MIT, Harvard, and Stanford.

It's all about the person and how much time they are willing to invest. Personally, as long as I pass I feel like I'm OK. I really don't see the point of killing yourself studying for 100 more hours only so you can get 10 extra points on an exam.

 

[45408]

Could have been as hard as any other med school exam... (I.e. at another school could have been a 70% average).

There can be huge differences in student body skill levels / effort. Hardly any slackers right now at my school, everyone still gunning for H's right now.

Doubt it.

I'm just saying that in comparison to all of the other exams I've taken in my life, it was legitimately difficult. There were hardly any gimme questions, the average question integrated multiple concepts, and the amount of material covered on the exam was daunting, at least to me as an M1.

I gunned for 2 solid weeks, performed well on test day, and still only landed at the class average. In other student populations (like my undergrad), I would've set the curve, no doubt. But in my med school class, the average student was just as on top of the material as I was, and that was eye-opening to me. It's just weird to be in an environment where the typical student is busting their ass and/or really on top of ALL the material.

Welcome to med school. I crushed the curve all the time in undergrad, only to land squarely in the middle of it (and occasionally behind it) as an M1-M2. In gen chem 2, out of 200 people, I was the first person finished with the test, and I got a 99% with a class average of 54%. Let's just say that was never even close to the scenario in med school.

(almost) everyone is ready. A few will get lost in the flow, but most people are pretty hard core. Do not believe the people who look like they're just chilling and laughing at the nerds who study all the time. They're studying even more than everyone else.

 

[45408]

It doesn't require an extraordinary intellectual acumen to do well in medical school, just hard work. If the average person from a "lower-tier" university put in the requisite time, I have no doubt they could pass. Passing is actually pretty easy. Doing better than that would be a different story, but plenty of average, B students from my undergrad got into med school, and they're doing just fine.

Maybe not extraordinary, but above average intelligence is not just the rule, it's a virtual requirement.

 

[Jack is Back]

do not believe the people who look like they're just chilling and laughing at the nerds who study all the time. They're studying even more than everyone else.

+1

 

[Lil Mick]

It doesn't require an extraordinary intellectual acumen to do well in medical school, just hard work. If the average person from a "lower-tier" university put in the requisite time, I have no doubt they could pass. Passing is actually pretty easy. Doing better than that would be a different story, but plenty of average, B students from my undergrad got into med school, and they're doing just fine.

If you read my post carefully, you'd have found that I was talking about putting the average person (not college graduate--the guy working hard and getting B's and C's at your local high school) in medical school. They would not pass, and I doubt they'd find it easy. A minimal level of intelligence is necessary to pass in medical school. Beyond that, hard work will do a lot for you.

 

[Morsetlis]

Smarts makes the hard work less hard.

It's still hard work!

<--Curve setter in gen chem and ochem 🙁

 

[mrwesticles]

It's just like gambling. People only talk about their wins, even if they are losing most of the time.

A lot of medicine is posturing and pretending you know more than you really do. Just wait until clinical rotations for proof of that.

 

[Crow King]

And in case you're wondering if you've ever met a genius, then you haven't. When you do, you'll know it. It tends to be a very humbling experience.

Yeah right, I knew a ton of legitimate geniuses in undergrad. Most medical students would judge them to be average or possibly even stupid.

They were way more intelligent than the average medical student.

Not sure how anyone can tell who is smart in medical school. Where is the tough stuff? It's just memorizing a bunch of crap.

Medicine isn't intellectual, sorry. Math and physics is.

This should be evident by the large number of women in medicine and the very, very small number of successful women mathematicians and physicists.

 

[adaptation1]

your last sentence is just a trollol bag, waiting to collect the naivetes who will leap at this chance for controversy. I WILL NOT !!! I STNAD TALL!!!

Yeah right, I knew a ton of legitimate geniuses in undergrad. Most medical students would judge them to be average or possibly even stupid.

They were way more intelligent than the average medical student.

Not sure how anyone can tell who is smart in medical school. Where is the tough stuff? It's just memorizing a bunch of crap.

Medicine isn't intellectual, sorry. Math and physics is.

This should be evident by the large number of women in medicine and the very, very small number of successful women mathematicians and physicists.

 

[AugustBurnsDan]

I'm just a lowly college graduate waiting on interviews...Although I can't say much about how it is in the trenches, I'll still injerject my humble opinion 😀

talking to one of my dad's good friends, a dagnostic radiologist, I am always blown away by his knowledge base. He is president of a decently sized group, and an all around great individual who recently was inducted into the American College of Radiology. He did very average on the mcats and did not get in his first year. (I learned all this when I was bummin' about not getting in my first year)

This guy had a goal of being in the top 1/3 of his class at Louisville, which he did. Seems that the difference between top third and top 10% was such an inordinate amount of work, that he never thought it was worth it. He claims to never have been smart, he just studied. But ya, it seems like hard work + decent smarts can take you far, regardless of how much smarter others might seem to be

 

[Morsetlis]

I'm just a lowly college graduate waiting on interviews...Although I can't say much about how it is in the trenches, I'll still injerject my humble opinion 😀

talking to one of my dad's good friends, a dagnostic radiologist, I am always blown away by his knowledge base. He is president of a decently sized group, and an all around great individual who recently was inducted into the American College of Radiology. He did very average on the mcats and did not get in his first year. (I learned all this when I was bummin' about not getting in my first year)

This guy had a goal of being in the top 1/3 of his class at Louisville, which he did. Seems that the difference between top third and top 10% was such an inordinate amount of work, that he never thought it was worth it. He claims to never have been smart, he just studied. But ya, it seems like hard work + decent smarts can take you far, regardless of how much smarter others might seem to be

So you're saying that he wasn't relatively smart (low MCAT)
and didn't work relatively hard (not top 10%)
but that you were impressed by his knowledge base.

So which contributed to this knowledge base? His looooong years of experience, or intrinsic intelligence and/or work ethics?

 

[CaptainSSO]

Yeah right, I knew a ton of legitimate geniuses in undergrad. Most medical students would judge them to be average or possibly even stupid.

They were way more intelligent than the average medical student.

Not sure how anyone can tell who is smart in medical school. Where is the tough stuff? It's just memorizing a bunch of crap.

Medicine isn't intellectual, sorry. Math and physics is.

This should be evident by the large number of women in medicine and the very, very small number of successful women mathematicians and physicists.

Go ahead and give me the link to support your last sentence, since I know you have one ready, making a statement like that.

 

[CatFactorial]

Not a link, but who was the last woman to win the Fields Medal or Nobel prize in Physics? Many medical school classes have at least 40% women.

Disclaimer: Not judging or anything. I have no interest/opinion on gender abilities.

 

[Crow King]

Not a link, but who was the last woman to win the Fields Medal or Nobel prize in Physics? Many medical school classes have at least 40% women.

Disclaimer: Not judging or anything. I have no interest/opinion on gender abilities.

BUT, he does want a link:

Go ahead and give me the link to support your last sentence, since I know you have one ready, making a statement like that.

SO,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fields_Medalists

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nobel_laureates_in_Physics

No woman has won the Fields Medal. 2 women have won the nobel prize in physics. 4 have in chemistry.

Also, I can tell from your post you have never taken an advanced math or physics course in your life.

Cheers.

 

[CaptainSSO]

BUT, he does want a link:



SO,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fields_Medalists

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nobel_laureates_in_Physics

No woman has won the Fields Medal. 2 women have won the nobel prize in physics. 4 have in chemistry.

Also, I can tell from your post you have never taken an advanced math or physics course in your life.

Cheers.

Me? Or CatFactorial? I have--I was a math minor.

Also, the link I'm asking about is one to support the claim that men are naturally more intelligent on average than women. Googling it, I'm finding only tenuous and near negligible data to support the claim.

Lack of Fields Medals doesn't satisfy me--there could be a host of other reasons as to why women don't commonly become physicists or mathematicians--perhaps men are more inclined to gravitate towards these fields, for reasons independent of intelligence.

 

[D elegans]

Also, the link I'm asking about is one to support the claim that men are naturally more intelligent on average than women. Googling it, I'm finding only tenuous and near negligible data to support the claim.

Nah brah, we're taught from when we're little kids that men use their left side of the brain and are better at math, science, sports, and running countries. Women use the right side of their brain and are better at art, music, cooking, and having babies.




I love the gender distinctions we drill into kids' brains.

 

[Lil Mick]

Here's an interesting article about gender differences in mathematics by culture: http://www.ams.org/staff/jackson/fea-gallian.pdf

Also (can't find the exact article right now), girls talented in math and science tend to also be talented in other areas and leave math for those careers (I was one until dramatic circumstances threw me back to math), while men talented in math are less likely to be equally talented in English or art...

It's a shame about the Fields Medals, though. I know Princeton has a good summer research/development program for women in mathematics at all college and post-college levels of education. As for my department, it's mostly men in faculty positions and nearly all men in the graduate program.

 

[Crow King]

Me? Or CatFactorial? I have--I was a math minor.

From where?

There are so many degree-granting "colleges" in today's world that these things have to be qualified.

Also, the link I'm asking about is one to support the claim that men are naturally more intelligent on average than women. Googling it, I'm finding only tenuous and near negligible data to support the claim.

I don't believe men are that much more intelligent than women on average, if at all.

But the really, really smart people are generally men, and generally European (particularly German). These are the facts of life. Don't cry about it.

It should be obvious to anyone who has ever picked up a math, physics or chemistry books.

BUT ANYWAYZ,

this whole discussion was originally about how smart people are at medical school, which I think is a load of ****. We are discussing what is supposed to be the upper echelon of smart people, and there are claims that medical students occupy this spot.

It actually annoys me that people are here flattering themselves with such self-aggrandizing assessments of med student intelligence.

 

[Crow King]

Also (can't find the exact article right now), girls talented in math and science tend to also be talented in other areas and leave math for those careers (I was one until dramatic circumstances threw me back to math), while men talented in math are less likely to be equally talented in English or art...

The only arguments to explain the discepancy would, OF COURSE, be complimentary to female intelligence.

Math girls are just all around smart compared to their male counterparts. That's it.

It's a shame about the Fields Medals, though. I know Princeton has a good summer research/development program for women in mathematics at all college and post-college levels of education. As for my department, it's mostly men in faculty positions and nearly all men in the graduate program.

Why is it a shame?

 

[CaptainSSO]

Nah brah, we're taught from when we're little kids that men use their left side of the brain and are better at math, science, sports, and running countries. Women use the right side of their brain and are better at art, music, cooking, and having babies.




I love the gender distinctions we drill into kids' brains.

lmao

But the really, really smart people are generally men, and generally European
(particularly German). These are the facts of life. Don't cry about
it.

It should be obvious to anyone who has ever picked up a math, physics
or chemistry books.

I assume you're talking about the Bohrs, Einsteins, Schrodingers, and Heisenbergs (totally blanked on Heisenberg's name, I only remembered it because of Breaking Bad)? Don't know where all of them are from, but I know they're European white males. Now, isn't it possible you are confusing the prominence and fame of these individuals with the idea that the smartest people all fit their same profile?

How about Marilyn vos Savant? That was just off the top of my head. And she's American. Madam Curie. There's another.

Don't cry about
it.

It should be obvious to anyone who has ever
picked up a math, physics
or chemistry books.

Not crying about it, just wondering what you're basing your observations off of--I'm looking for objective facts. Keep in mind that during the time period of all these giants in quantum physics (assuming these are the European males you were referring to), women were pretty well disenfranchised.