experience with a DVM researcher

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sdlbk

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I'd like to get some vet experiences with a DVM who does research, but am not sure how to go about it. I'm finishing a MS right now so I can't really take on a big project or anything. I've found some local vets who do research at a nearby college campus, but I'm not sure what to contact them about. Has anyone ever "shadowed" a DVM researcher? Perhaps I should wait until I finish my MS and then see if I can take on a small project with them?

Thanks for any advice. :)

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I don't think asking to shadow a researcher is a good idea.

For one thing, the DVM PI (principle investigator) probably mostly sits in their office writing grants and editing papers most of the time. Not much to shadow there.

And if you were to shadow in a lab...well you'd really just end up getting in peoples way and pissing them off pretty quickly.

If you want to get research experience it can be done with anyone with a doctoral degree (PhD, DVM, MD etc) but you will have to wait until you can devote the time to a project. Labs typically do not want to take on people unless they are going to commit a significant amount of time because a) it takes a lot of time to train a new person b) the person training the new person inevitably cannot get as much done because they are training someone c) extra people in the lab = extra costs...you go through disposables/glassware faster PLUS the people who are supposed to be getting work done are not as getting as much work done as they could ... which all ends up costing money.

The problem is that most projects require a fair amount of time to get things done. You've either got cells growing that you need to split at whatever time THEY decide to be ready, or cultures that need to be analyzed whenever THEY decide to grow. That could be early in the day or it could be 11pm.

I think if you can devote 20+ hours/week to research then you should definitely contact one of these people. If not its probably better to try to find another way to gain different types of vet experience.

Good luck!
 
If you want to get research experience it can be done with anyone with a doctoral degree (PhD, DVM, MD etc) but you will have to wait until you can devote the time to a project.

If I do research with a PhD/MD, I don't think that will count under vet experience. I have adequate experience otherwise (in undergrad & grad); I just wanted experience with DVMs in as many settings as possible. You are probably right though, I probably shouldn't try to "shadow" someone in a lab, though I'm not sure I could just contact someone out of the blue (i.e. after I've graduated and aren't a student anymore or associated with their college), and say "hey can I work on your project with you?"
 
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If I do research with a PhD/MD, I don't think that will count under vet experience.

You can put it under veterinary experience on the VMCAS application, actually.

I'm pretty sure that the schools end up differentiating for themselves anyhow though.

If you're a graduate student you should know that doing research is really only productive and worthwhile if you are actually interested in the specific topic. If I were you, having a bunch of research experience already, I would probably look for something more clinical, or in a different species.

Or in your area of interest...
 
If I do research with a PhD/MD, I don't think that will count under vet experience. I have adequate experience otherwise (in undergrad & grad);

It most certainly does count given that the research you're doing is applicable to vet med. In terms of vet experience, I only had 700 hrs or so of shelter med aside from research with an MD PI... and all of my interviewers told me that I was "well rounded" :shrug:. I've had 0 contact with veterinarians outside of the shelter environment. Even then, I was only outright rejected by 1 out of the 7 schools I applied to. So if research is something you want to try, but you're finding more opportunities with MDs or PhDs, don't let that necessarily discourage you.

That being said, be careful what you choose to do for a research project (if you decide to do so) because like nyanko said, different vet schools will categorize your research experience as either animal or vet based on their own criteria. I think mine counted only because I work with several different in-vivo models.

But if your motivation for doing research is just to have a broad range of vet experience, I think your time will be better spent doing other things. It's way too time consuming for it to be worthwhile (putting in just 100 hrs total in a lab washing dishes will definitely not give you vet experience, whereas 100 hrs at a zoo or wildlife or ER totally would).
 
you should know that doing research is really only productive and worthwhile if you are actually interested in the specific topic.

haha... sad... i have absolutely 0 interest in the research topic of my lab. oh wells... i think it's been a productive and worthwhile experience though :rolleyes:.
 
My point is that doing any of this stuff just as a checkbox thing for an application is fairly lame, and it is really hard to get anything real out of being a lab monkey for research you aren't interested in or just passively watching somebody do it for that matter. You've got much, much more willpower than I do if you could independently see a worthwhile research endeavor through to completion without its topic at least being somewhat interesting to you.

And before someone comes in and points out that blah blah you have to take classes that aren't interesting to you...doing actual productive research independently is a much, much more long, involved and at times mind-numbing process than is taking a class.

edit: essentially what Minnerbelle said about doing it just for vet experience. :p
 
Maybe you would be interested in shadowing a vet who oversees animals used in animal research?

Definately very cool and would give you another window into an area of vet med.

Their job is more regulatory I would guess then strictly clinical vets but at least they don't spend almost all their time behind a desk.
 
(My first post on SDN! hurrah! this place is wonderful)

Hi all,
Along these lines, could I ask for your advice on how to categorize research experience on applications for vet school? Minnerbelle, it sounds like you've been through the process!
To summarize my situation, I finished up undergrad last May and am working as a lab tech (two year commitment) in an Anesthesiology lab at a hospital here in Boston. My PIs are MD researchers investigating the effects of anesthesia on aging and Alzheimer's disease. Besides in vitro studies on rat glia, we do in vivo behavioral studies with rats and mice. While it is very interesting work, it has made me realize that I have zero interest in a PhD, and I am unsure how to 'spin' this experience on an application to make it count as vet experience instead of unrelated research.
I worry that any interviewer would immediately question a) working in a lab geared toward human medicine (why not an MD/PhD instead of DVM?), and b) if it was because of an interest in veterinary research, then why not work for a DVM researcher!?
 
(My first post on SDN! hurrah! this place is wonderful)

Hi all,
Along these lines, could I ask for your advice on how to categorize research experience on applications for vet school? Minnerbelle, it sounds like you've been through the process!
To summarize my situation, I finished up undergrad last May and am working as a lab tech (two year commitment) in an Anesthesiology lab at a hospital here in Boston. My PIs are MD researchers investigating the effects of anesthesia on aging and Alzheimer's disease. Besides in vitro studies on rat glia, we do in vivo behavioral studies with rats and mice. While it is very interesting work, it has made me realize that I have zero interest in a PhD, and I am unsure how to 'spin' this experience on an application to make it count as vet experience instead of unrelated research.
I worry that any interviewer would immediately question a) working in a lab geared toward human medicine (why not an MD/PhD instead of DVM?), and b) if it was because of an interest in veterinary research, then why not work for a DVM researcher!?
 
Dang, your first post and you managed to post twice. :p

You're right, an interviewer *would* ask those questions. So... have good answers for them! If you were initially interested in a PhD but then decided that a DVM was for you, be able to explain what drove that decision. What is is about getting a DVM that appeals to you? How do you know it's the right choice?

As for mentioning the experience on your application, just play up the animal related parts and be prepared to explain how the research could apply to the field of veterinary medicine.
 
wooo! welcome aboard snigel! now's actually a great time to start asking questions and getting involved on SDN, because the more people hear from you early on, the more helpful they are when you're really in a pinch during the application process!

Just categorize your research experience on your applications under vet experience (there's only 3 categories: vet experience, animal experience, and non-animal related work experience). as long as it involved animals and you were supervised by a health professional. Some individual schools might decide not to count your research experience as vet experience, but that's their decision to make and not for you to worry about.

There's a bunch of people here who've done the research thing in all different shapes and sizes (honors theses, summer undergrad research, MS, and even PhD), so if you're worried about anything research related there's always someone here who can answer.

Like you, I work at a big hospital in Boston (as does theEVILshoe)! I pretty much said in my application/interviews that I took 2 years off after undergrad to work as a research technician just to make sure that I wasn't meant for a PhD. I didn't say much about my research in my PS though, since that's not really what my PS was about but I did put in there that because of my scientific training I would be a great asset to my field of interest (shelter med). When you write the descriptions for your experience though, I was told at least from Tufts that they want to see actual job descriptions rather than a long description on what your lab is studying. So I put a very short one liner about the topic we study, and then make a big long list of experiments i do.

I wouldn't worry too much about working in a lab geared towards human medicine. I mean, you wanted to gain research experience, and Boston happens to be a hub for biomedical research so you took a job in a lab. Unless your lab is very clinically oriented, what you learn in your lab is probably very applicable to any biomedical research. Especially if you're employed as a technician/assistant in a lab, it's not like you picked your research topic either.

I was never asked why not MD/PhD. However, after talking very passionately about my research, I was asked by one of my interviewers "wow, you seem so passionate about your work. are you sure you want to give that up?" :shifty: (My super honest answer would have been... I'm one of those people who gets passionate about anything, like, i would be a passionate pooper scooper if that was my job... and no, i would shoot myself with the thought of pursuing a PhD... but I didn't say that). Other interviewers were just simply fascinated, and didn't question anything.
 
heh... *embarrassed* Clearly need to figure out what all these buttons do before I launch myself into the wonderful world of SDN!

Thank you both for the great advice, it will be taken to heart and you can bet I'll be back for more :)
 
(My super honest answer would have been... I'm one of those people who gets passionate about anything, like, i would be a passionate pooper scooper if that was my job...

heehee, I like your enthusiasm :laugh:
 
heh... *embarrassed* Clearly need to figure out what all these buttons do before I launch myself into the wonderful world of SDN!

Thank you both for the great advice, it will be taken to heart and you can bet I'll be back for more :)

don't worry, i must have sent the same PM to someone over 3x before I realized that it actually went through the first time :p
 
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