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bigdog8829

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Ok so I've been reading alot about going DO or whatnot and time after time again the resounding answer is, "Its the same. MD=DO".
Buttt everyone also talks about the extra "loopholes" a DO must go through. What are they? What are the disadvantages and few "extra" struggles a DO must go through that an MD has the pleasure of going without?
I've read that it may be harder to specailize, but what else?
 

spicedmanna

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Ok so I've been reading alot about going DO or whatnot and time after time again the resounding answer is, "Its the same. MD=DO".
Buttt everyone also talks about the extra "loopholes" a DO must go through. What are they? What are the disadvantages and few "extra" struggles a DO must go through that an MD has the pleasure of going without?
I've read that it may be harder to specailize, but what else?

There is some truth to that, but most definitely not universally. It might be harder to specialize, depending on the school. However, at some Osteopathic schools there is a high rate of specialization, etc.

DO's have their own residencies, but osteopathic students do elect to match in the allopathic system frequently. It's my understanding that if you want to match into an allopathic residency, it's usually a good idea to take the USMLE Step I in addition to the COMLEX. So you often elect to take two tests, whereas allopathic students only take Step I. Not sure, but that's what I've generally heard.

Since DO's represent about 6-7% of the physician population in the US, people tend not to know what a DO is. There is some confusion, so explanations are sometimes necessary. Generally, though DO and MD's work together without significant issues; there is mutual respect. The roles are the same. The general public goes on reputation and outcome, usually, not degree. I really don't think it's a problem.
 

MJB

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Buttt everyone also talks about the extra "loopholes" a DO must go through. What are they?

Since you've seen everyone talking about them, perhaps you could tell us what loopholes you're referring to.

I think the biggest "drawback" might be if one wants to specialize and enter SOME MD residencies...but I have no experience, and thus don't know.
 
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Toohotinvegas33

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The only real loopholes (which are changing) are.
1. You might want to take USMLE step 1 for some uber competitve residencies.
2. There are 5 states that require a AOA internship year before or mixed0-in with residency. There are however many ways around this.
 

MCATTT

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The only real loopholes (which are changing) are.
1. You might want to take USMLE step 1 for some uber competitve residencies.
2. There are 5 states that require a AOA internship year before or mixed0-in with residency. There are however many ways around this.

Can you take USMLE step II instep of I?
 

Toohotinvegas33

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Not sure about the step 2 over 1 thing. but its step 1 which holds majority of weight when program directors look at your file.
 

toothless rufus

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What probably sucks the most is the mandatory ventriloquism requirement.

But it does come in handy in Gross Anatomy:

"Ohh, ouch! Please stop cutting me!"
"Ok, who the &$#% said that!"
(Drops scalpel and runs...)
 

JonnyG

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The title of this thread has been annoying me sinc eit started. A loophole is a good thing. I think you meant extra hoops that DOs have to go through.

There are some good loopholes as a DO:

Being able to apply to both osteo and allo residencies.
Being able to sign outside the allo match. (can get a residency spot without going through the match)
 

Steiner

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The title of this thread has been annoying me sinc eit started. A loophole is a good thing. I think you meant extra hoops that DOs have to go through.

Finally, I thought the same thing. I saw "Loopholes" and was wondering what they were talking about.
 
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group_theory

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What ways are there around this? (other than the combined internship year with an osteopathic residency)

Getting your ACGME PGY-1 year to be AOA-approved via Resolution 42

or

For the state of Florida, you can petition the FL Board of Osteopathic Medicine to approve your ACGME PGY-1 year (not sure how hard or easy it is)


Resolution 42 is the way to go if you don't do an AOA internship year
 

shblay

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The title of this thread has been annoying me sinc eit started. A loophole is a good thing. I think you meant extra hoops that DOs have to go through.

There are some good loopholes as a DO:

Being able to apply to both osteo and allo residencies.
Being able to sign outside the allo match. (can get a residency spot without going through the match)

hah, thanks for that. i was reading through and was about to post the same thing.

Definatley the biggest extra hoop is taking 2 board exams.
 

JonnyG

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Really? I was under the impression that if you wanted to apply to allopathic residencies you had to take step 1, 2, and the physical exam. (along with the comlex 1,2, and PE)

you don't have to take any of them to apply to an allopathic residency. Alot of people only take step one as a Just in case i need it thing.
 

DrMom

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Really? I was under the impression that if you wanted to apply to allopathic residencies you had to take step 1, 2, and the physical exam. (along with the comlex 1,2, and PE)

A few folks take both step 1 & 2 of the USMLE, but most take just step 1 or step 2.

I haven't heard of anyone needing to take the USMLE CE.
 

Taus

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why would u say yes to this? how is it helpful (if even possible) for someone to take step 2 without taking step 1?
it is an objective measure that some programs like to use to measure you as an applicant as compared the the MD applicants....also if you are not a US MD student you can take the Steps in any order you please

btw DrMom is a resident and has been through the process....I would trust what she says
 

DrMom

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why would u say yes to this? how is it helpful (if even possible) for someone to take step 2 without taking step 1?

While the USMLE and COMLEX test the same information, there is a different emphasis on topics on Step 1 where there isn't on Step 2. For example, if you're studying for COMLEX step 1 you're going to emphasize anatomy, microbiology, and OMM. While anatomy and micro are on the USMLE step 1, there aren't many anatomy questions and not nearly as many micro. In addition, the COMLEX step 1 has lots of clinical questions, so the questions are framed differently. The USMLE step 1 has a lot of biochem and stats, which there are very few questions of on the COMLEX step 1.

Basically, if you're going to take both step 1 exams, you're going to have to do some different studying for each. On the other hand, if you're taking both step 2 exams there is little if any difference on emphasis (ignoring OMM) so there's no need to prepare differently.

As of right now, non-USMD students can take the USMLE exams out of order. Also, DO students don't have to complete the series...hence, you can take just step 2.
 

ladpm

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so how do you know which USMLE step to take for an allo residency? Does that mean each individual programs can either take Step 1 or Step 2? And does it enhance my chances for that residency position if I did BOTH examines (assuming I did well enough)?
 

spicedmanna

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so how do you know which USMLE step to take for an allo residency? Does that mean each individual programs can either take Step 1 or Step 2? And does it enhance my chances for that residency position if I did BOTH examines (assuming I did well enough)?

It's my understanding that pretty much Step I is what is used in the allo match.
 

melast

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important hoop for some schools:
moving, occasionally to a different state, to do clinical rotations in 3rd and 4th year. not just once. not just for electives.

keep in mind that this is not an issue everywhere..
 

bigdog8829

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What about specailizing? Is it significantly harder for the d.o. graduate to land a residency of his/her choice?
I know that there are specific d.o. residencies but taking a look at match lists, the vast majority of those who did specailize did so via an allopathic residency.
 

Taty

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I think landing the residency of your choice depends on many factors. If you are a good student with good board scores and good personality you will have a residency of your choice.
 

BradenDO

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While the USMLE and COMLEX test the same information, there is a different emphasis on topics on Step 1 where there isn't on Step 2. For example, if you're studying for COMLEX step 1 you're going to emphasize anatomy, microbiology, and OMM. While anatomy and micro are on the USMLE step 1, there aren't many anatomy questions and not nearly as many micro. In addition, the COMLEX step 1 has lots of clinical questions, so the questions are framed differently. The USMLE step 1 has a lot of biochem and stats, which there are very few questions of on the COMLEX step 1.

Basically, if you're going to take both step 1 exams, you're going to have to do some different studying for each. On the other hand, if you're taking both step 2 exams there is little if any difference on emphasis (ignoring OMM) so there's no need to prepare differently.

As of right now, non-USMD students can take the USMLE exams out of order. Also, DO students don't have to complete the series...hence, you can take just step 2.


So, it would be to the student's advantage to take step 2 instead of step 1?
 

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I think landing the residency of your choice depends on many factors. If you are a good student with good board scores and good personality you will have a residency of your choice.

Not quite. I had plenty of great interviews at great programs and landed my #1, but I was completely shut out of certain areas (Boston, NYC, Cali). These are very competitive anyway, and that level of competition only increases if you are a DO. To say you can get "the residency of your choice" is probably overreaching a little.
 
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