Failed CK

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alex21

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I ended up with a 174 (71) on the new CK. Pretty disappointing, as I did much better on Step 1, passing with what I consider a good score on my first attempt. I am an IMG, who has a few interviews approaching (one very soon) and wasn't sure what to do next. I can get over this and believe my new approach will involve Kaplan notes, and more UW as well as reading Secrets at least twice.

My prep for my first attempt consisted of UW questions along with Case Files during my rotations as well as Secrets. I did well on my shelf exams, have good clinical grades, so this is the biggest problem I have encountered so far. I was thinking about a retake in Dec/early January, so I can still participate in the 2010 match while still giving myself the additional study time I obviously need. Does this seem like a good idea or possible? I am right in the middle of clinicals and have no time to break until graduation, so taking a month off to study is out. Should I still interview, and since they know my results are pending I feel I will be asked about CK during these interviews. What can I say other than the obvious? Thanks for your help,
Alex21

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sorry about the unfortunate grade. I'd say go for it, especially if you feel you can improve your knowledge base between now and Jan, or if there was something unforutunate about your test day, like anxiety or lack of sleep which stold significant points. You have your 2nd attempt at stake, but a lot to gain. That's my idea. Good luck.
 
Tough break Alex21. My thoughts are if you do decide to take in Dec/Jan, then perhaps doing a practice exam or two well before that time might help you gauge if you are ready or not. If you are still borderline around that time, then pushing it back might not be a bad idea. Good luck.
 
I ended up with a 174 (71) on the new CK. Pretty disappointing, as I did much better on Step 1, passing with what I consider a good score on my first attempt. I am an IMG, who has a few interviews approaching (one very soon) and wasn't sure what to do next. I can get over this and believe my new approach will involve Kaplan notes, and more UW as well as reading Secrets at least twice.

My prep for my first attempt consisted of UW questions along with Case Files during my rotations as well as Secrets. I did well on my shelf exams, have good clinical grades, so this is the biggest problem I have encountered so far. I was thinking about a retake in Dec/early January, so I can still participate in the 2010 match while still giving myself the additional study time I obviously need. Does this seem like a good idea or possible? I am right in the middle of clinicals and have no time to break until graduation, so taking a month off to study is out. Should I still interview, and since they know my results are pending I feel I will be asked about CK during these interviews. What can I say other than the obvious? Thanks for your help,
Alex21
Questions:
1. When you say you did well on shelf exams, are you referring to the official NBME shelf exams?
2. What clinicals are you doing now? Had you finished all of your core rotations (IM, Surg, OB/Gyn, Peds, Psych, +/- FM and Neuro before you took Step 2?
3. Did you auto report Step 2 or will programs be unaware of your score?

I am asking these questions because:

1. If you passed step 1, your test taking ability/reading speed and comprehension isn't likely the culprit here. However, you scored approx 3 SD below the mean, so there is a serious knowledge gap somewhere. If you did well on NBME shelf exams, I am at a loss for where that gap could be. If your shelf exams were not the official NBME ones, perhaps there is a different focus in your curriculum and you need to focus more on NBME style.

2. Did you not have all the clinicals covered on Step 2? That could be an obvious problem.

3. If programs will not be aware of your failing score, you can probably afford to wait until later before you take it again and pass it. If programs are aware that you have failed, you probably need to take it ASAP and prove you are going to pass the exam. I would expect programs to be very hesitant to offer a contract to someone who isn't going to be able to pass Step 2. I can't recall, but are you required, as an IMG, to release all of your scores when you apply?
 
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When I say did well on exams, I mean my school's shelf exams. The NBME I took I didn't take seriously and took over a month before my exam, and the score was exactly 174. This should have been a warning sign, but I though that because I had over a month to go, I could still do it.

I did not finish all my cores. I was right in the middle of my last core when I took the exam, and that core was heavily tested on CK, and I did very, very poorly on that portion. Also, another core I had was strictly outpatient, so it was myself and an attending in a clinic, so I got no exposure to inpatient peds, and I also did very poorly on peds. I somehow thought my peds shelf would correlate to me doing well on the peds portion of CK. This was not true. My Ob/Gyn was solid on CK, and my medicine was way better than the other parts in the score breakdown.

The way I see it, I have 3 months, and I will start with Peds and Psych which were all over my exam and were my lowest scores and then go to everything else. I also have an elective month that I haven't scheduled it so I was thinking about Heme/Onc or Rheum, things I feel I could learn more about for CK.

Also, my scores have NOT been released to ERAS. Not that I could predict this happening, but I was instructed to wait and not release them. I am glad I did this, but I still have interviews. I finding myself getting a little down about going to the interview knowing my score and how I have to take it again, and having thoughts like they probably won't want me, a person that didn't pass CK or thoughts like "I bet the residents I am meeting didn't take CK twice. Haha, I am laughing at myself and my thought process, but me getting mad at myself usually motivates me and things end up well. What are your thoughts about the interviews and how I address CK with the programs.

So, a little mad at myself for not reading the signs that I wasn't quite ready, but still thought I could make it. Now that I understand what I did wrong, I feel I can begin studying again. Sound like a decent plan?
Thanks again for all your help
Alex21
 
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Just asking, because I am an IMG myself. How many Interviews did you get on just your Step 1 score? It sounds to me that you got more than one, which is sort of excellent for an IMG, especially with one score.

That must mean you have something noteworthy about the rest of your CV.
 
By "new CK" I mean the new format with 44 question as opposed to the old 46 question format.

I have 4 interviews, 2 university and 2 private. I think the rest of my application is solid, but my CK status is killing me.

To answer a few of the previous questions I forgot to address, I am a CHRONICALLY anxious and nervous person. For some reason, it didn't affect me too much for Step 1. During clinicals I can hide it, but I am a very anxious person. I can't say whether it affected my performance on CK. I took a break after each block, trying to calm myself down. I can't believe it affected me terribly this attempt.

The most annoying aspect is to have to sit down and study again, but the way I see it I can either think about what went wrong, or just learn from it and move on. I have (haha, yet again) purchased 3 months of usmleworld, Kaplan books are on the way, and I guess that's all I can do for now. Again, thanks for your posts and if anybody has anything else they think I should be doing, please let me know. I will plan on hitting the books hard for the next 2 months, taking NBME exams along the way, and plan on sitting for the exam again in January. I'll let you know how it goes.

Alex21
 
it sucks hard seeing FAIL.
good luck to you..just keep pluggin away....
these exams are a mild form of torture.
 
Really, not to beat a dead horse here, but anxiety affected me so badly on step 1, and then every core exam after that, I knew I had to do something for step 2. I got this book "How to conquer test anxiety and achieve higher scores..." (very long title, by a very experienced psychologist). The author is Neil Fiore, PhD, and you can only get it in Audible format (mp3, audible.com), but it's only 10.00 or so. And a very good "listen". I've tried a lot of things for anxiety, and I'll say this cinched it for me. I know anxiety took at least 10% of questions on step 1, because I felt panicky and sort of floating during each block, and after the end, I was exhauseted, almost dissociated. Not so on step 2, I had desensitized myself, spent regular time using these techniques of the book, and felt maybe 20% of the anxiety, and in life also.

I hope this helps. Anyway, it's relaxing and positive to listen to as you are driving, etc. And you may find it makes a huge difference.

Best of luck.
 
Obviously, your rotations and school shelf exams didn't prepare you well for CK. I suggest you utilize the Kaplan CK notes and UW. If you know that material, there is no way you won't pass.

As for interviews, if CK comes up, just say something nondescript like, "I am preparing now and plan to take it in a couple months." Which will be true, because you are planning to take it soon. I definitely don't think you can afford to say you failed it. If they directly ask if you failed already (I really doubt they will), then I'm not sure what you should say. Either way you answer it, the situation is unlikely to end well for you.
 
I'm not gonna sugarcoat it.

UWORLD is not everything.

with that 174 nbme pretest, your foundation is weak. So you can't use UW to make up for that.

The forum people here did not start from failing levels, and then get their 85+ ck score from UW alone.

Some schools also curve shelf exams, so that would give you a false sense of confidence.


with a fail on CK, you probably won't get any interviews. But you can take it again, and try your luck in the Scramble.
In the meantime, you can apply to a bunch of residencies. it's just money. a few hundred or thousand $$.
 
I'm not gonna sugarcoat it.

UWORLD is not everything.

with that 174 nbme pretest, your foundation is weak. So you can't use UW to make up for that.

The forum people here did not start from failing levels, and then get their 85+ ck score from UW alone.

Some schools also curve shelf exams, so that would give you a false sense of confidence.


with a fail on CK, you probably won't get any interviews. But you can take it again, and try your luck in the Scramble.
In the meantime, you can apply to a bunch of residencies. it's just money. a few hundred or thousand $$.

I know this is n=1, but my first nbme was a bare pass (180 something), and I ended up with a 242/99. That's with a **** ton of secrets/B&W reading throughout 3rd year and 2 solid weeks of UWorld. Not saying that's the end all/be all for everyone, but I firmly believe that if you put in the time with UWorld (tutor mode), you will dramatically improve your potential score.
 
I know this is n=1, but my first nbme was a bare pass (180 something), and I ended up with a 242/99. That's with a **** ton of secrets/B&W reading throughout 3rd year and 2 solid weeks of UWorld. Not saying that's the end all/be all for everyone, but I firmly believe that if you put in the time with UWorld (tutor mode), you will dramatically improve your potential score.



yeah.

or he may have just panicked big time.

panic can fck a person up real bad. :D
 
Fo sho. I feel for him. I can only imagine...and I honestly hope he absolutely owns it the next time he takes it.
 
I'm not gonna sugarcoat it.

UWORLD is not everything.

with that 174 nbme pretest, your foundation is weak. So you can't use UW to make up for that.

The forum people here did not start from failing levels, and then get their 85+ ck score from UW alone.

I agree, especially here on SDN you would think that everyone who does UW ends up with a 250+. But that relationship is not causative. Truth be told, I bet a lot of the people on this forum would probably score 230+ without any studying at all.

That's not where you are at, and I think you would be well served to include Kaplan notes or some other background reading into your study plan. I really think you will pass without a problem eventually. The fact is that if you are equally well prepared for Steps I and II, you will probably do better on Step II because most people don't prepare as much for Step II. So if you did well on Step I, you can do this easily. But you need to spend some time building your knowledge base and don't try to just rush into it because you want to be done with it.
 
ok, so after 1500 USMLEWORLD questions, a month off dedicated to studying, and over 3 months studying during rotations, NBME is telling me I am right where I started. So, it is obvious I will not be retaking the exam soon. Does anybody have any suggestions as far as how i proceed. I have printed the NBME results, and will obviously focus on my worst subjects.
At this point, I feel it is more of HOW I am taking the tests than the actual content. My USMLEWORLD average now is 56%, which I know isn't great but I don't think corresponds to my NBME score, which is still in low 70s. I have no idea if it is anxiety, poor test taking ability (which has been a problem for me) lack of knowledge or what.
I think I will just have to continue to study, finish 4th year, graduate in May, take a Kaplan course this summer, take the exam after that, and match in 2011.
Due to family pressures, I am being told that I should not wait and match in 2011. There is a program that knows me well, and someone suggested I see if I can start in August of 2010 after I pass the exam. I tried to explain to family that this does not happen and that programs are full generally after march, but that fell on deaf ears. What do I do about this?

If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know. I just can't take the exam now, and feel a Kaplan course (which helped me for step 1) will do the same for step 2.
 
ok, so after 1500 USMLEWORLD questions, a month off dedicated to studying, and over 3 months studying during rotations, NBME is telling me I am right where I started. So, it is obvious I will not be retaking the exam soon. Does anybody have any suggestions as far as how i proceed. I have printed the NBME results, and will obviously focus on my worst subjects.
At this point, I feel it is more of HOW I am taking the tests than the actual content. My USMLEWORLD average now is 56%, which I know isn't great but I don't think corresponds to my NBME score, which is still in low 70s. I have no idea if it is anxiety, poor test taking ability (which has been a problem for me) lack of knowledge or what.
I think I will just have to continue to study, finish 4th year, graduate in May, take a Kaplan course this summer, take the exam after that, and match in 2011.
Due to family pressures, I am being told that I should not wait and match in 2011. There is a program that knows me well, and someone suggested I see if I can start in August of 2010 after I pass the exam. I tried to explain to family that this does not happen and that programs are full generally after march, but that fell on deaf ears. What do I do about this?

If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know. I just can't take the exam now, and feel a Kaplan course (which helped me for step 1) will do the same for step 2.

My advice would be to take the Kaplan course. Good luck.
 
Work on test anxiety, it can drop your score by 20% easily. I noticed my anxiety would kick in on the NBME exams far more than Uworld, because NBME feels like "ok, this is what I'm going to score, so I HAVE TO DO WELL HERE (poisonous belief).

I reccomend a book which is brief, accurate, and highly effective. Last year, it was available only in audible format, that's how I used it. Amazon now shows an older paperback verions, but I think it's worth the investement to listen (can do it on any mp3 player, total cost maybe 10$ more) because hearing the author's voice, and guidance is far more therapeutic than reading, to me. This all may be totally off the mark of what you need, but if it is ringing a bell, the title is "How to Conquer test anxiety and achieve higher scores on any exam", Neil Fiore.

Or get face to face help with text taking, that sounds like more the issue, especially if you are getting 56 on USMLE, that's not a bad correlate.
 
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