Failed Ochem

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
A

andysandy

Full Member
7+ Year Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2014
Messages
28
Reaction score
0
Members do not see this ad.
I didn't fail, I emailed the professor as I started making this thread. I thought I would fail based on grading, but I got a C and was 1 point, 1 ****ING point, away from a C+.

Now I'm more upset over the 1 point than the C, but any ways:

I go to a a top school and got through high school with As easily. The only other time I did not get good grades was when it required work (elementary school). Nonetheless, my standarized test scores always passed me to the next grade.

So 12 years of no hard work and entering college with people naturally smarter than me and a lot hard working was obviously a big blow. I didn't try for the first 1.5 years due to confidence issues and just being lazy. I attempted Orgo my freshman year and failed. My science GPA was miserable after 2 years and my regular GPA is okay, but not by med school standards.


Fast forward to today. I got an A the first quarter without trying and just listening to an amazing professor. I got a C the second quarter because I learned week 1 material during week 4 which left little room for the new stuff which was half the final. I blew half the final.

If I get an A third quarter, should I repeat second quarter? I am hoping to apply to MD schools if my GPAs are high enough with the upward trend (3.4/3.6+++).

TLDR; Did bad first two years at top school, started upward trend, got C in Orgo 2, lazy, doomed?
 
As long as your final GPA is in an acceptable range, have all your prereqs in the passing range, and you've demonstrated a good upward trend, you will be fine.
 
Unfortunately, repeating Cs only makes sense for DO schools because of grade forgiveness.
 
What should I do about the situation? I'm going to view my final and see if I can find the point I need. From what I've seen, he easily awards points that TAs missed. Should I beg? This is 1 points out of more than 300.
 
andysandy said:
What should I do about the situation? I'm going to view my final and see if I can find the point I need. From what I've seen, he easily awards points that TAs missed. Should I beg? This is 1 points out of more than 300.
Click to expand...

of course you go argue for it
 
And people think I'm crazy when I say that every point matters 🙄
 
I think the issue here has more to do with your coasting than your grades.

Focus on preparing your mindset for the rigors of college and medical schools, and forget about your natural aptitude or intelligence. Those two traits come in truck loads - everyone's Einstein on an IQ test. It's the transcript that matters.
 
I see an extremely evident issue with regards to your character. You keep using the word 'lazy' to describe yourself. Why on God's green earth would you want to become a physician if you are a self-proclaimed, academically lazy person?

Shadow some doctors and see for yourself what they're up to all day. It may end up changing your career aspirations. Not to mention, the difficulty you face as a pre-med student now isn't even similar to the abuse you'll take as a medical student and, eventually, a resident. It's awful, from what I've seen and heard. 'Laziness' isn't an attribute that these people possess. The attributes are usually more along the lines of 'obsessive' and 'perfectionist.'

That's just my two cents... Or three.
 
kthxbai said:
I think the issue here has more to do with your coasting than your grades.

Focus on preparing your mindset for the rigors of college and medical schools, and forget about your natural aptitude or intelligence. Those two traits come in truck loads - everyone's Einstein on an IQ test. It's the transcript that matters.
Click to expand...
DocConk said:
I see an extremely evident issue with regards to your character. You keep using the word 'lazy' to describe yourself. Why on God's green earth would you want to become a physician if you are a self-proclaimed, academically lazy person?

Shadow some doctors and see for yourself what they're up to all day. It may end up changing your career aspirations. Not to mention, the difficulty you face as a pre-med student now isn't even similar to the abuse you'll take as a medical student and, eventually, a resident. It's awful, from what I've seen and heard. 'Laziness' isn't an attribute that these people possess. The attributes are usually more along the lines of 'obsessive' and 'perfectionist.'

That's just my two cents... Or three.
Click to expand...
moisne said:
You admit to being lazy and you have not addressed how you are going to fix it - yes you are screwed.
Click to expand...
I know I want to be a doctor. I've had more than enough interaction with them to know. I say I'm lazy, but that's an easy way to describe it. I have worked hard the last 6 years, but the last 2 years school was a nightmare because I thought I was so much stupider than all my classmates and schoolwork intimidated me.
 
How should I approach asking for the 1 point I need.
 
andysandy said:
The only other time I did not get good grades was when it required work (elementary school).
Click to expand...

Lol wut :laugh: I distinctly remember elementary school with nap times, recess, and not giving two sh***s about my grades
 
Doctor Dream said:
Lol wut :laugh: I distinctly remember elementary school with nap times, recess, and not giving two sh***s about my grades
Click to expand...
Doctor Dream said:
Lol wut :laugh: I distinctly remember elementary school with nap times, recess, and not giving two sh***s about my grades
Click to expand...
Failed sixth grade Math for never handing in homework. Then again it could have been due to me being so loud. GUESS they graded on behavior. Ugh Im so down
 
Looking back, it was probably mostly behavior. One student teacher transferred because of me
 
andysandy said:
I know, I'm wondering if I should take a leave from school
Click to expand...

I think you need to grow up.
get a part time job and really understand that if you lose now your parents won't be there to save you. you're the last person.

I don't want to sound like a dick but... from reading your posts, it seems like you're blaming everything except for yourself. Having confidence is good but don't fool yourself thinking that you're the next genius who doesn't have to study to pass. I'm not saying you're dumb... it just sounds like it because everyone looks at the GPA.
 
medicalmnt said:
I think you need to grow up.
get a part time job and really understand that if you lose now your parents won't be there to save you. you're the last person.

I don't want to sound like a dick but... from reading your posts, it seems like you're blaming everything except for yourself. Having confidence is good but don't fool yourself thinking that you're the next genius who doesn't have to study to pass. I'm not saying you're dumb... it just sounds like it because everyone looks at the GPA.
Click to expand...
It sounds like I'm dumb? LMFAO, every doctor I have met has said, "I wish my son/daughter was smart enough to get into your school." GPA does not equal smarts. I know many idiots with a higher GPA than me. Maybe I should transfer to prove I'm "smart" even though my habits won't be changed and I'll be screwed if I did get in. But nah that'd be so embaressing.
 
andysandy said:
GPA does not equal smarts. I know many idiots with a higher GPA than me.
Click to expand...
No, GPA does reflect your intelligence to adcoms and grad programs. It also reflects hard work or lack thereof. The fact that you have known you are being lazy but haven't done much to change that reflects stupidity or apathy toward becoming a doctor. Neither bode well.
 
Thales said:
No, GPA does reflect your intelligence to adcoms and grad programs. It also reflects hard work or lack thereof. The fact that you have known you are being lazy but haven't done much to change that reflects stupidity or apathy toward becoming a doctor. Neither bode well.
Click to expand...
So what do you say about people with 3.7+ GPAs and MCATs in the low 20s? I have to disagree with graduate schools. 5 people from my lab went to top research schools (Harvard, etc) based on research at a top school and GPA sub3.0. But, research isn't for me so should I transfer to an easier school (cc/low ranked state school) to "prove" my smarts?
 
andysandy said:
So what do you say about people with 3.7+ GPAs and MCATs in the low 20s? I have to disagree with graduate schools. 5 people from my lab went to top research schools (Harvard, etc) based on research at a top school and GPA sub3.0. But, research isn't for me so should I transfer to an easier school (cc/low ranked state school) to "prove" my smarts?
Click to expand...
"GPA does reflect your intelligence to adcoms and grad programs"- Reflect, not define. A terrible GPA reflects poorly upon your intelligence and even a lack of hard work. You would be hard pressed to find many schools that would accept someone at the opposite end of the spectrum; a terrible GPA and a stellar MCAT. You're only fooling yourself if you think most people (admissions staff included) don't correlate GPA with intelligence, even just a little bit.

Bio Major with a 2.5 GPA vs. 3.5, I'm sure at first glance anyone would think; "Gee, that applicant with the 2.5 is equally intelligent and qualified for our grad program as that applicant with the 3.5".

Furthermore, the prevailing suggestion of SDNers (some of whom are in the know) on most forum sections is that GPA is a very important factor in graduate school admissions.
 
Thales said:
"GPA does reflect your intelligence to adcoms and grad programs"- Reflect, not define. A terrible GPA reflects poorly upon your intelligence and even a lack of hard work. You would be hard pressed to find many schools that would accept someone at the opposite end of the spectrum; a terrible GPA and a stellar MCAT. You're only fooling yourself if you think most people (admissions staff included) don't correlate GPA with intelligence, even just a little bit.

Bio Major with a 2.5 GPA vs. 3.5, I'm sure at first glance anyone would think; "Gee, that applicant with the 2.5 is equally intelligent and qualified for our grad program as that applicant with the 3.5".

Furthermore, the prevailing suggestion of SDNers (some of whom are in the know) on most forum sections is that GPA is a very important factor in graduate school admissions.
Click to expand...
I agree I need to bring my 3.0*** up, but come on. I was browsing SDN and found a dude who had a 3.7 and couldn't break a 22 MCAT from one of my home state schools. That shows natural intelligence IMO. GPA is about hard work, but if you can't break a 22 MCAT, how can you possibly do well in med school? So many undergrads get good GPAs and low MCATs from ****ty schools and I have never seen them get in to medical school and they actually gave up fairly easy (hard work you say?) but I have seen lots of high MCATs and "low" GPAs from great schools get in
 
andysandy said:
I agree I need to bring my 3.0*** up, but come on. I was browsing SDN and found a dude who had a 3.7 and couldn't break a 22 MCAT from one of my home state schools. That shows natural intelligence IMO. GPA is about hard work, but if you can't break a 22 MCAT, how can you possibly do well in med school? So many undergrads get good GPAs and low MCATs from ****ty schools and I have never seen them get in to medical school and they actually gave up fairly easy (hard work you say?) but I have seen lots of high MCATs and "low" GPAs from great schools get in
Click to expand...

My point still stands- GPA reflects intelligence (and hard work) to adcoms and grad programs. MCAT helps predict success in med school.

If you're confident that a stellar MCAT will suffice, knock it out of the park and see how many allo schools come knocking with a 3.0*** GPA from a "great school". After ~5 years on SDN I've read innumerable posts that say a low GPA, even from a "great school", is a no-go.
 
Thales said:
My point still stands- GPA reflects intelligence (and hard work) to adcoms and grad programs. MCAT helps predict success in med school.

If you're confident that a stellar MCAT will suffice, knock it out of the park and see how many allo schools come knocking with a 3.0*** GPA from a "great school". After ~5 years on SDN I've read innumerable posts that say a low GPA, even from a "great school", is a no-go.
Click to expand...
I would say it's the opposite. But, regardless, I need to improve my GPA. Should I transfer to another school? I feel like at my school I can't constantly get As, B+ and higher, yes, but will that be enough of a trend?
 
andysandy said:
I would say it's the opposite. But, regardless, I need to improve my GPA. Should I transfer to another school? I feel like at my school I can't constantly get As, B+ and higher, yes, but will that be enough of a trend?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately the general consensus seems to be if you're transferring "down" it doesn't work in your favor either, and in a sense does look like gpa padding.
 
ciestar said:
Unfortunately the general consensus seems to be if you're transferring "down" it doesn't work in your favor either, and in a sense does look like gpa padding.
Click to expand...
Damn, I'm hopeless.
 
andysandy said:
I would say it's the opposite. But, regardless, I need to improve my GPA. Should I transfer to another school? I feel like at my school I can't constantly get As, B+ and higher, yes, but will that be enough of a trend?
Click to expand...

If you can't confidently get As in whatever school you're at you're going to struggle in med school, all of which are harder than undergrad by a lot. The reason the GPA requirement is so high is because people who can't break a 3.5 aren't going to do very well once they're in med school.
 
I got a gentleman's C in organic chemistry. Basically, if you passed the first semester and survived the second, the prof wouldn't fail you, he would just give you a C, no matter how bad your grades (I had like a C- average). I applied to med school with a 3.1 sGPA.

I graduated junior AOA from a good MD school and am now an otolaryngology resident.
 
alerk323 said:
If you can't confidently get As in whatever school you're at you're going to struggle in med school, all of which are harder than undergrad by a lot. The reason the GPA requirement is so high is because people who can't break a 3.5 aren't going to do very well once they're in med school.
Click to expand...

.
 
Last edited:
GPA is important OP. Regardless of where you go to undergrad. Yes, in some ways, it is somewhat of a disadvantage going to a top school, with A's being much harder to come by. (I know by experience, i went to a top school of ug as well). Unfortunately this is the way it is. Regardless of where you go, adcoms actually do care about your gpa. State School, top school, ivy it still matters.

What will help you is doing your best to bring your sgpa up as much as possible, 3.5, or 3.6, and rocking the MCAT. The MCAT is the great equalizer, so as long as you do well, it actually will mitigate a lower gpa.

For example, my brother went to a top school, had a 3.3 gpa, destroyed the MCAT, and got into Mt. Sinai, Emory, Dartmouth, and Columbia Med Schools among others. It is possible.
 
andysandy said:
How should I approach asking for the 1 point I need.
Click to expand...

Tell him that you didn't try very hard in his class, weren't keeping up with the class material, and think that you deserve an extra point for ****s/giggles. No way this goes poorly.

EDIT:

After reading this post:

andysandy said:
It sounds like I'm dumb? LMFAO, every doctor I have met has said, "I wish my son/daughter was smart enough to get into your school." GPA does not equal smarts. I know many idiots with a higher GPA than me. Maybe I should transfer to prove I'm "smart" even though my habits won't be changed and I'll be screwed if I did get in. But nah that'd be so embaressing.
Click to expand...

I'm thinking troll.
 
alerk323 said:
If you can't confidently get As in whatever school you're at you're going to struggle in med school, all of which are harder than undergrad by a lot. The reason the GPA requirement is so high is because people who can't break a 3.5 aren't going to do very well once they're in med school.
Click to expand...
You say that, but you haven't experienced fierce competition before. In my Summer Orgo Class, 3/4 kids who had guaranteed acceptances to medical school dropped (and they had 36 ACTs/4.0s in high school) because if they didn't they would fail the course or get a C-.
 
andysandy said:
It sounds like I'm dumb? LMFAO, every doctor I have met has said, "I wish my son/daughter was smart enough to get into your school." GPA does not equal smarts. I know many idiots with a higher GPA than me. Maybe I should transfer to prove I'm "smart" even though my habits won't be changed and I'll be screwed if I did get in. But nah that'd be so embaressing.
Click to expand...

I'm convinced you are a dumb troll...

1. He said "I'm NOT saying you are dumb..."; though I have to disagree.
2. You realize people say that to you and don't have to mean it?
3. GPA =/= smarts; but GPA = smarts + effort.... :/
4. Clearly you AREN'T as smart as you think considering I am SURE there is SOMEONE at your school with a 4.0 in your major. I'm also positive there are SOME STUDENTS who have A's in your classes, so clearly you are NOT smart enough to get A's without studying.

All students think they are super smart until they hit the ground of reality.
 
moisne said:
I'm convinced you are a dumb troll...

1. He said "I'm NOT saying you are dumb..."; though I have to disagree.
2. You realize people say that to you and don't have to mean it?
3. GPA =/= smarts; but GPA = smarts + effort.... :/
4. Clearly you AREN'T as smart as you think considering I am SURE there is SOMEONE at your school with a 4.0 in your major. I'm also positive there are SOME STUDENTS who have A's in your classes, so clearly you are NOT smart enough to get A's without studying.

All students think they are super smart until they hit the ground of reality.
Click to expand...
HOW on earth does GPA show smarts and not effort. The MCAT shows smarts because it's standarized. Everyone obviously goes to schools they CAN get As at because they wouldn't be accepted into them and ALL schools are definitely not equal. Does anyone on here go to a top 10-20 school, I'd like to get their opinion.

And no, I asked my dean, a 4.0 is a rarity, as in a handful in a few thousands and that's not counting science classes which are heavily deflated. Summa cum laude is a 3.7 range within my school. So I wish I was only as lucky to go to a school where 4.0s are common.
 
Last edited:
alerk323 said:
If you can't confidently get As in whatever school you're at you're going to struggle in med school, all of which are harder than undergrad by a lot. The reason the GPA requirement is so high is because people who can't break a 3.5 aren't going to do very well once they're in med school.
Click to expand...
Again, I'll disagree. How is a person who breaks a 40 MCAT going to struggle in medical school? That makes little to no sense. My school's average ACT is 33 and you're telling me a person here who has a 3.3 is going to struggle more than a person who has a 3.7 at a school with an average ACT of 20? My best friend at Princeton got into medical school with a 3.2, my other best friend couldn't break a 30 MCAT with a 3.7 at a crappy state school. Just because my competition is fiercer doesn't mean I won't succeed in medical school. So please get your facts straight. I don't know anyone who got into medical school with a crappy MCAT and a high GPA from a crappy school but I do know people who got in with great MCATs, okay GPA, from great schools. It's pretty humorous to watch someone who has done well their first 3 years at college think they are amazing and then they get MCAT scores in the teens/twenties and give up automatically. So, if I can get B+s, A-s, and As from now on, should I transfer? I don't know where I stand in a class until it's over unlike my state schools that either 1. grade on a curve with lots of people with ACTs in the 20s/don't care or 2. grade on a grading scale? I will drop my OChem class if you're saying grades matter, no matter where they come from? There is still time to enroll in a OChem class somewhere else as it is not required for my major.Because, for example, my friend had such a hard time in OChem and then I found out her exams were multiple choice ACS questions.... My teacher gave us an ACS exam so we'd score higher (though, on a curve, it doesn't really matter) and it was easy as **** and included a year of material during the second quarter lol.
 
And I'm not making excuses for my F or anything below a C+(average), I should have at least gotten average. I just don't know what to do. Should I transfer to a school where 4.0s are so common within science majors?
 
andysandy said:
HOW on earth does GPA show smarts and not effort. The MCAT shows smarts because it's standarized. Everyone obviously goes to schools they CAN get As at because they wouldn't be accepted into them and ALL schools are definitely not equal. Does anyone on here go to a top 10-20 school, I'd like to get their opinion.

And no, I asked my dean, a 4.0 is a rarity, as in a handful in a few thousands and that's not counting science classes which are heavily deflated. Summa cum laude is a 3.7 range within my school. So I wish I was only as lucky to go to a school where 4.0s are common.
Click to expand...

Dude, you can't read... can you?

I said GPA = smart + effort...
MCAT shows "smarts"? Hardly... why you can improve on MCATS if it's only measuring intelligence? Because your innate intelligence doesn't actually change.
Yeah, I went to a top 20 but I never complained about getting lower than an A.
4.0 is a rarity, yes, but clearly if you are a genius you can manage it right? 😀

With all your complaining... just transfer ffs because all you do is complain, be lazy, pretend to be smart, put in zero effort... and you think a C+ is ok (from a pre-med perspective, it is NOT ok).

Have you even taken the MCAT yet?
 
andysandy said:
I have worked hard the last 6 years, but the last 2 years school was a nightmare because I thought I was so much stupider than all my classmates and schoolwork intimidated me.
Click to expand...

You know, I only say this because my naïveté is convinced that you are well intended, but here's the deal: there will be times of struggle regardless of how you live your life, and college is no exception. It can be a difficult transition from coasting in high school to having to work harder in college; and it can make someone feel inferior to their colleagues. Those feelings are somewhat natural as you change from a big fish in a little pond to a sardine in a school. It's a different feeling, and it can be very hard for people to adapt to that.

College is supposed to teach you not what to think, but how to think. It is supposed to reveal to you what makes you tick, and it's a great experience if used correctly to help you figure out who you are and how you operate.

I wish you the best regardless, and I do hope that you can find what makes you happy. 🙂
 
OP, your coming off as combative and a little arrogant. I went to a top 20 school as I mentioned. A's and 4.0s were hard to come by in most classes and majors, as I am sure they are at your school as well.

Bottom line: stop complaining, and figured out a way to excel in whatever environment you are in. That is what will get you into Med School. If that means withdrawing from your class and taking it again for a better grade, then do it. If that means transferring schools, then do it. You need to do whatever you can to succeed going forward. And at the end of the day adcoms really don't care that state schools are easier grade wise. So your bashing is pointless.
 
With a 24.9 mean, and a 6.4 standard deviation, the percent chance you have of scoring a 40 or better is .9%. (calculated by using normalcdf(40,e99,24.9,6.4).)

You are more likely to be on a plane with a drunken pilot. (http://www.funny2.com/odds.htm, should you want some kicks.)
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

E
"Time you failed/made a mistake" question
Replies
10
Views
3K
Egret_Farmer
E
M
  • Locked
Failed EMT course
Replies
17
Views
4K
Serendipitykitcat
S
F
Failed Research Project Impact on Future
Replies
14
Views
2K
Med Ed
Med Ed
B
time when I failed: secondary ideas?
Replies
12
Views
3K
Med Ed
Med Ed
D
Failed Ph.D. Student to M.D. program
Replies
10
Views
2K
Mr.Smile12
Mr.Smile12
Top