FAP Violation, will I be blacklisted?

[herewego253]

I know I made a horrible mistake but I need advice moving forward.

In the fall, I made an AAMC account to fill out the FAP form. I rushed through the form because I needed to get it in before a deadline and I was being stupid and gave them rounded numbers instead of looking at the appropriate forms. I was denied FAP and but I knew I qualified because I am extremely low income. I couldn't redo the FAP form on the same account so, I made another AAMC account to fill out the FAP form correctly and was granted fee assistance.

Last month, AAMC investigations emailed me saying they are investigating my accounts and FAP applications because they both have different numbers on them. I explained to them what exactly went wrong. I called them a couple of days ago and they said I will receive a violation of the policy on my AAMC status, so when I apply to med school in the future all the med schools will know.

I made a HUGE mistake doing this and I now regret everything, I would've rather just paid for all the MCAT and med school app material than go through this mess. I just need advice on what to do and if this will affect my admissions into medical school. I completely messed up and I take full ownership of that. What can I do moving forward?

I just called the officer doing the investigation and they told me that "they have all the information they need and will be meeting to make a decision on what to do".

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[viralhiker]

So your violation would be misusing the service by making a second account? If you used the correct data the second time around, and were approved as low-income, I can't see why they would punish you. It sounds like an honest mistake of someone who didn't realize the form could only be submitted once.

In your situation I can't imagine any school holding this against you. If all you did was incorrectly report that your family made more money than they truly did?

 

[Goro]

I suggest you wait for AAMC to tell you what's the verdict, as it's impossible to answer your question now.

 

[herewego253]

So your violation would be misusing the service by making a second account? If you used the correct data the second time around, and were approved as low-income, I can't see why they would punish you. It sounds like an honest mistake of someone who didn't realize the form could only be submitted once.

In your situation I can't imagine any school holding this against you. If all you did was incorrectly report that your family made more money than they truly did?

It was a genuine mistake of making 2 different accounts. They said in their FAP guideline document that creating 2 accounts is against their policies, however, I didn't even know about this document until someone from AAMC emailed me about my account being investigated. In the first FAP form I submitted, there were a ton of mistakes, but the second form I submitted was all correct and they made me submit tax forms and financial aid forms from my college to verify the information. The employee I was talking to said that if they find me guilty for creating 2 accounts and trying to mislead them (which i did not do and had no intention of doing) then they will give me a violation on my record and med schools will see this. I posted about this on reddit and people were saying to not apply MD and only DO. Now I'm really scared that this really stupid mistake is going to not let me even apply to MD schools.

 

[herewego253]

I suggest you wait for AAMC to tell you what's the verdict, as it's impossible to answer your question now.

Ok, I get where you are coming from but I also dont want it to be too late for me to do anything about it. The employee I was talking to said they need to meet with their "lawyers" (which scared the sh** out of me) and make a decision. If they give me a violation then all the medical schools I apply to in the future will know about it.

 

[Goro]

Can't sugar coat this, OP, this type of behavior "I rushed through the form because I needed to get it in before a deadline" gets people screened out of med schools.

 

[Talldoctor96]

Can't sugar coat this, OP, this type of behavior "I rushed through the form because I needed to get it in before a deadline" gets people screened out of med schools.

I think the best approach is to stop making excuses like that you rush, etc whatever. Those are nothing more than excuses.

Its time to grow up, be an adult, take responsibility, explain that you now understand why what you did was wrong. And make it clear that you had good intentions, to correctly portray your information. But no more excuses. Own it.

 

[herewego253]

I think the best approach is to stop making excuses like that you rush, etc whatever. Those are nothing more than excuses.

Its time to grow up, be an adult, take responsibility, explain that you now understand why what you did was wrong. And make it clear that you had good intentions, to correctly portray your information. But no more excuses. Own it.

Thanks for the honesty and its true. I made a terrible mistake and I'm going to own up to it hopefully med schools see that I have learned from this!

 

[herewego253]

Can't sugar coat this, OP, this type of behavior "I rushed through the form because I needed to get it in before a deadline" gets people screened out of med schools.

youre right. thanks! Do you think I will get screened out of MD schools if i get a violation? I understand it is my mistake and I definitely have learned my lesson.

 

[Goro]

youre right. thanks! Do you think I will get screened out of MD schools if i get a violation? I understand it is my mistake and I definitely have learned my lesson.

Impossible to answer

 

[YCAGA]

youre right. thanks! Do you think I will get screened out of MD schools if i get a violation? I understand it is my mistake and I definitely have learned my lesson.

If you get secondaries, you will definitely need to explain it on there. I would try really REALLY hard to get it removed.

 

[Banco]

If the extent of the issue is as OP says, how much would adcoms really even care about this. Seems trivial.

 

[LittleBrother]

Take a deep breath. You didn't make a "terrible" mistake. You don't need to flagellate yourself over this. Let the dust settle first before we start this weird confessional stuff. It might quickly turn into a big nothing burger.

 

[viralhiker]

Take a deep breath. You didn't make a "terrible" mistake. You don't need to flagellate yourself over this. Let the dust settle first before we start this weird confessional stuff. It might quickly turn into a big nothing burger.

Do you blame him? I'm surprised at people’s reactions here, telling him to “grow up and own it“ and that he might be screened out of med school. If that’s truly the case, and OP is not misrepresenting his situation, it would only be because he had the misfortune of getting in the way of a cold AAMC bureaucracy.

 

[Mad Jack]

Can't sugar coat this, OP, this type of behavior "I rushed through the form because I needed to get it in before a deadline" gets people screened out of med schools.

Same sort of thing as, "I was in a rush, so I charted procedures that weren't done to save time" a few years down the line. Doesn't bode well with regard to integrity on an application, and is an almost certain denial at many schools. No way to know until there's both a final verdict and their application hits some eyeballs

OP, you could try to roll your dice in the DO realm if you get no luck on the AAMC side of things, since they use an entirely different application system.

 

[LittleBrother]

Same sort of thing as, "I was in a rush, so I charted procedures that weren't done to save time" a few years down the line.

Not at all. There is nothing comparable between rounding some figures on a financial form and pencil-whipping your actual job. OP didn't try to defraud FAP if they incorrectly *overestimated* their income. AAMC probably is investigating OP on the suspicion that the second application that was granted financial assistance was the fraudulent one, not the first one.

Hell, the IRS wouldn't even get mad if I *overestimated* the taxes I owed them.

 

[herewego253]

Take a deep breath. You didn't make a "terrible" mistake. You don't need to flagellate yourself over this. Let the dust settle first before we start this weird confessional stuff. It might quickly turn into a big nothing burger.

I'm really hoping for its nothing, but the employee I talked to said I will "most definitely get a violation". I sent them a letter explaining everything, and throughout our emails he was asking specifics from the FAP application

Not at all. There is nothing comparable between rounding some figures on a financial form and pencil-whipping your actual job. OP didn't try to defraud FAP if they incorrectly *overestimated* their income. AAMC probably is investigating OP on the suspicion that the second application that was granted financial assistance was the fraudulent one, not the first one.

Hell, the IRS wouldn't even get mad if I *overestimated* the taxes I owed them.

Thanks for keeping it positive! I definitely messed up because I was not supposed to make another AAMC account to fill out the FAP again. It was in their FAP guidelines document and I didn't even know about it until the investigation employee told me.

 

[herewego253]

Same sort of thing as, "I was in a rush, so I charted procedures that weren't done to save time" a few years down the line. Doesn't bode well with regard to integrity on an application, and is an almost certain denial at many schools. No way to know until there's both a final verdict and their application hits some eyeballs

OP, you could try to roll your dice in the DO realm if you get no luck on the AAMC side of things, since they use an entirely different application system.

I agree, even though its not exactly the same situation they are not wrong to assume I will rush through everything I do without paying attention. Overnight, I realized my mistake and Im ready to face the lesson of what I did. I did not read their FAP guidelines which I violated, I didn't know about any guidelines until the investigations people emailed me about it.

 

[YCAGA]

Not at all. There is nothing comparable between rounding some figures on a financial form and pencil-whipping your actual job. OP didn't try to defraud FAP if they incorrectly *overestimated* their income. AAMC probably is investigating OP on the suspicion that the second application that was granted financial assistance was the fraudulent one, not the first one.

Hell, the IRS wouldn't even get mad if I *overestimated* the taxes I owed them.

I think you are misunderstanding which direction is fraud here. Saying your income is lower with the second account makes it seem like OP was lying to get FAP. To extend that to your IRS analogy, it would be like if OP filed their taxes and then got hit with a fine for some reason, then refilled with new amounts to avoid the fine. Pretty suspicious at face value, even if in both cases the FAP rejection/fine made OP think “shoot, maybe I should have been more precise with my numbers” and nothing malicious was going on.

I am just guessing but I think the system probably automatically flags anyone who makes two accounts with the same name+birthday if the first account is rejected. The assumption being that the second account is used to put in more “favorable” numbers, which is exactly what OP’s paper trail looks like.

Anyways, OP says they are very very poor. Putting in $25,000/yr versus $24,569/yr should not have made a difference. They seem to imply that they are quite far away from the FAP cutoff. This doesn’t seem like a “rounding mistake.”

 

[herewego253]

Do you blame him? I'm surprised at people’s reactions here, telling him to “grow up and own it“ and that he might be screened out of med school. If that’s truly the case, and OP is not misrepresenting his situation, it would only be because he had the misfortune of getting in the way of a cold AAMC bureaucracy.

I'm tried my best to represent the situation as accurately as possible. I was advised on reddit to post here and I really need genuine advice as to what I should do. I do understand that I need to grow up, I recently turned 21 and have to face my own mistakes. Yeah it sucks because AAMC will probably try to punish me more than what I deserve but its their business too. They profit off of hardworking, low income students by making them pay so much money for MCAT, med school, step practice exams, residency etc etc, it just seems like they never try to help the students.

 

[herewego253]

I think you are misunderstanding which direction is fraud here. Saying your income is lower with the second account makes it seem like OP was lying to get FAP. To extend that to your IRS analogy, it would be like if OP filed their taxes and then got hit with a fine for some reason, then refilled with new amounts to avoid the fine. Pretty suspicious at face value, even if in both cases the FAP rejection/fine made OP think “shoot, maybe I should have been more precise with my numbers” and nothing malicious was going on.

I am just guessing but I think the system probably automatically flags anyone who makes two accounts with the same name+birthday if the first account is rejected. The assumption being that the second account is used to put in more “favorable” numbers, which is exactly what OP’s paper trail looks like.

Anyways, OP says they are very very poor. Putting in $25,000/yr versus $24,569/yr should not have made a difference. They seem to imply that they are quite far away from the FAP cutoff. This doesn’t seem like a “rounding mistake.”

I am low income, and within their poverty guidelines. I completely messed up the first application by putting in extra digits, so for food/housing assistant I said I receive 70K instead of 7k which I didn't even double check to make sure what correct.

 

[herewego253]

So your violation would be misusing the service by making a second account? If you used the correct data the second time around, and were approved as low-income, I can't see why they would punish you. It sounds like an honest mistake of someone who didn't realize the form could only be submitted once.

In your situation I can't imagine any school holding this against you. If all you did was incorrectly report that your family made more money than they truly did?

In my first FAP form, I said I received more food and housing aid than in reality, I accidentally added another digit making a 4 digit number a 5 digit one. And that's why I was denied the first time. The second time I typed in the actual numbers and made sure everything was correct.

 

[viralhiker]

I am low income, and within their poverty guidelines. I completely messed up the first application by putting in extra digits, so for food/housing assistant I said I receive 70K instead of 7k which I didn't even double check to make sure what correct.

Idk OP, that sounds like a mistake that could one day cost patient lives. Better rethink your career choices... /s

I’m sorry you’re going through this. I understand the stress of trying to procure financial assistance. I would hope that anyone who looks at your case rationally would understand that what happened was an honest mistake and undeserving of punishment. Best of luck, but I doubt you’ll receive any more help from this forum; only people debating their own opinions on your situation.

 

[YCAGA]

I am low income, and within their poverty guidelines. I completely messed up the first application by putting in extra digits, so for food/housing assistant I said I receive 70K instead of 7k which I didn't even double check to make sure what correct.

Gotcha. Thanks for explaining the actual numbers involved, that makes more sense. I mean...not double checking the numbers is a pretty dumb mistake, but not something that most of haven't done before when filling out a form online. The real mistake was making a second account to circumvent the rejection instead of just emailing and calling AAMC to explain your data entry mistake. Anyone with half a brain at AAMC would understand that you aren't receiving $6k/month in food and housing help. It looks bad that you would rather make another account in a flurry of panic than just tell someone you are an idiot and messed up.

Even then, I don't think your mistake is THAT bad if you explain it exactly as you have here. Just say you meant to put in $7k and accidently put an extra 0, got rejected, made a second account with the correct numbers, got flagged for fraud, and then AAMC refused to listen to your explanation. The big thing is do NOT play the victim card or talk about AAMC being a capitalist organization (even though their fees are indeed insane). Some schools might weed you out but I don't personally think this is too concerning.

Your mistake is less dumb than an AI for getting caught with alcohol as a freshman, which tons and tons of people get into med school with. I wouldn't worry about it that much unless you get 0 interviews with an otherwise solid app.

 

[YCAGA]

Idk OP, that sounds like a mistake that could one day cost patient lives. Better rethink your career choices... /s

Some insane interviewer/adcom member might actually argue this, but no one on earth is perfect enough to say they haven't done similar to OP. So I think most places would just roll their eyes at that knucklehead on the admission committee and continue the discussion of OP's actual credentials.

 

[herewego253]

Idk OP, that sounds like a mistake that could one day cost patient lives. Better rethink your career choices... /s

I’m sorry you’re going through this. I understand the stress of trying to procure financial assistance. I would hope that anyone who looks at your case rationally would understand that what happened was an honest mistake and undeserving of punishment. Best of luck, but I doubt you’ll receive any more help from this forum; only people debating their own opinions on your situation.

thats very true and thank you for your advice! I have def learned my lesson and hopefully I can show med schools I have matured from what I just did

 

[herewego253]

Some insane interviewer/adcom member might actually argue this, but no one on earth is perfect enough to say they haven't done similar to OP. So I think most places would just roll their eyes at that knucklehead on the admission committee and continue the discussion of OP's actual credentials.

Thats what im hoping but if they question my abilities to help/treat others because of this one mistake (arguably a big one), then that's a little insane right?

 

[herewego253]

Gotcha. Thanks for explaining the actual numbers involved, that makes more sense. I mean...not double checking the numbers is a pretty dumb mistake, but not something that most of haven't done before when filling out a form online. The real mistake was making a second account to circumvent the rejection instead of just emailing and calling AAMC to explain your data entry mistake. Anyone with half a brain at AAMC would understand that you aren't receiving $6k/month in food and housing help. It looks bad that you would rather make another account in a flurry of panic than just tell someone you are an idiot and messed up.

Even then, I don't think your mistake is THAT bad if you explain it exactly as you have here. Just say you meant to put in $7k and accidently put an extra 0, got rejected, made a second account with the correct numbers, got flagged for fraud, and then AAMC refused to listen to your explanation. The big thing is do NOT play the victim card or talk about AAMC being a capitalist organization (even though their fees are indeed insane). Some schools might weed you out but I don't personally think this is too concerning.

Your mistake is less dumb than an AI for getting caught with alcohol as a freshman, which tons and tons of people get into med school with. I wouldn't worry about it that much unless you get 0 interviews with an otherwise solid app.

thank you this made me feel a lot better. I was panicking because I need fee assistance for mcat prep materials and then deadline was the same day my original FAP was denied. And without even knowing that this account is used through my medical journey and without reading the guidelines I made another account to get approved quicker. I have a decent app so far, and I'm continuing my volunteering and research. What do you think I can do to show that I have learned my lesson. For example students with an IA for cheating do a post-bac or masters to show they have grown from that, do you think there is anything I can do that shows Ive grown on paper other than just saying I learned from my mistakes?

 

[herewego253]

And the thing is I did all of this just to get fee assistance so I could take the mcat in Jan 2021. I didnt even take it or use any of their free resources materials.

 

[YCAGA]

thank you this made me feel a lot better. I was panicking because I need fee assistance for mcat prep materials and then deadline was the same day my original FAP was denied. And without even knowing that this account is used through my medical journey and without reading the guidelines I made another account to get approved quicker. I have a decent app so far, and I'm continuing my volunteering and research. What do you think I can do to show that I have learned my lesson. For example students with an IA for cheating do a post-bac or masters to show they have grown from that, do you think there is anything I can do that shows Ive grown on paper other than just saying I learned from my mistakes?

Explain the MCAT prep materials and same day deadline. That is some pretty important context lol

And just have a perfectly clean record otherwise. You’ll be fine

 

[herewego253]

Explain the MCAT prep materials and same day deadline. That is some pretty important context lol

And just have a perfectly clean record otherwise. You’ll be fine

So the first time I filled out the FAP form was in Sept, I found out it was denied on Nov 9th which was the same day as the deadline to submit a FAP form to get a reduced MCAT registration price. I wanted the aid and did not read the FAP guideline document that says you can appeal or call AAMC to fix it. Instead, I made another account and filled the FAP form the same day and it was approved before midnight nov 9th so I was able to get a reduced mcat price with the free prep.

 

[YCAGA]

So the first time I filled out the FAP form was in Sept, I found out it was denied on Nov 9th which was the same day as the deadline to submit a FAP form to get a reduced MCAT registration price. I wanted the aid and did not read the FAP guideline document that says you can appeal or call AAMC to fix it. Instead, I made another account and filled the FAP form the same day and it was approved before midnight nov 9th so I was able to get a reduced mcat price with the free prep.

Sorry I was unclear. Explain that context to medical schools, not me lol. That time pressure makes you seem less impulsive for no reason. Still impulsive, but at least it is more understandable.

 

[herewego253]

Sorry I was unclear. Explain that context to medical schools, not me lol. That time pressure makes you seem less impulsive for no reason. Still impulsive, but at least it is more understandable.

HAHA i wasnt sure what you meant but i explained to the AAMC investigation ppl in an email and on the phone. And if I do get a violation I will explain this well to med schools. thank you!

 

[LunaOri]

Hoping for the best! And if it does mess up your chances for MD, you can still apply DO and be a doctor.

 

[Stride]

Idk OP, that sounds like a mistake that could one day cost patient lives. Better rethink your career choices... /s

Satire detected!

By far one of the most intriguing trends on SDN is for users to point out someone made a mistake by extrapolating it to reach the most sensationalized conclusions. Yes, making two AAMC accounts surely indicates you would be a danger to patients! False equivalencies and misapplied analogies galore.

OP, if people can get into medical school with charges of plagiarism or cheating, I wouldn't let this bother you too much. Just own that you made a mistake. We are all human. I bet you can still get in with good stats/activities. Good luck 🙂

 

[herewego253]

Satire detected!

By far one of the most intriguing trends on SDN is for users to point out someone made a mistake by extrapolating it to reach the most sensationalized conclusions. Yes, making two AAMC accounts surely indicates you would be a danger to patients! False equivalencies and misapplied analogies galore.

OP, if people can get into medical school with charges of plagiarism or cheating, I wouldn't let this bother you too much. Just own that you made a mistake. We are all human. I bet you can still get in with good stats/activities. Good luck 🙂

Thank you so much! I really needed to hear this.

 

[Mad Jack]

I agree, even though its not exactly the same situation they are not wrong to assume I will rush through everything I do without paying attention. Overnight, I realized my mistake and Im ready to face the lesson of what I did. I did not read their FAP guidelines which I violated, I didn't know about any guidelines until the investigations people emailed me about it.

I'm not making a big judgement on you, you're probably alright as a person. Just calling it as I see it from the position of a person that's had to review hundreds of applications to find 5 candidates. When you've got that kind of numerical pressure, a whole lot of things land apps in the trash that wouldn't otherwise

 

[RJ McReady]

Same sort of thing as, "I was in a rush, so I charted procedures that weren't done to save time" a few years down the line. Doesn't bode well with regard to integrity on an application, and is an almost certain denial at many schools. No way to know until there's both a final verdict and their application hits some eyeballs

OP, you could try to roll your dice in the DO realm if you get no luck on the AAMC side of things, since they use an entirely different application system.

I really hate it when people try to equate an honest mistake with chronic carelessness or lack of integrity. Apparently every form that has ever been filled out in the history of human existence should be done exactly correctly, and if not, say goodbye to any future dreams or plans you may have had. Just hope you didnt have the misfortune to apply to Mad Jack’s school...

 

[Mad Jack]

I really hate it when people try to equate an honest mistake with chronic carelessness or lack of integrity. Apparently every form that has ever been filled out in the history of human existence should be done exactly correctly, and if not, say goodbye to any future dreams or plans you may have had. Just hope you didnt have the misfortune to apply to Mad Jack’s school...

It really comes down to "there's 1000 people without violations on their record, if I take this one guy with a violation on and reject one of the ones with a spotless record and he does something down the line, can I accept that being my fault." It's not that the OP is some imperfect monster. It's that we've got very few data points and if one of them is a red flag, well- in admissions the one thing that holds more true than anything is that past results are indicative of future performance, give or take.

 

[RJ McReady]

Very few data points?
You can’t be serious...
Is there any application for any position in any other professional school that is as rigorous and requires you to check more boxes than an application to medical school?

 

[KnightDoc]

I am not passing judgment on OP at all. I have absolutely no idea what was going on in his head with respect to thinking AAMC wouldn't catch, and come down extremely hard, on a duplicate account. Or thinking that it would be okay, under any circumstances, no matter much FAP money was at stake, or what time constraints existed.

Everyone here is focusing on the seriousness of carelessly filling out a financial aid form, but ignoring the mischief that would ensue in the entire application process, from hiding bad MCAT scores to being a multi-time reapplicant, with each application appearing as the first, if AAMC didn't vigorously police and enforce this.

THAT is why AAMC is going crazy over this, and why if OP fails in making it go away, he is going to have a huge problem at the schools when AAMC reports it when transmitting his primary. Remember AAMC IS a collection of the schools; the schools are not simply going to consider this a learning experience, look for a sign of contrition, and move on. This is THE cardinal sin in dealing with AAMC, right up there with cheating on the MCAT. Lying on an application is the schools' problem. That's why AAMC doesn't even try to vet them. Messing around with their process, on the other hand, is an entirely different matter, and the sanctity of one account per applicant is at its core.

This is a huge deal, which is why AAMC is consulting with lawyers before deciding how to proceed. If they do in fact make a federal case out of this, I think @Mad Jack is spot on, and it's going to be difficult if not impossible to overcome this at AAMC schools. JMHO as an applicant, but the first thing I noticed, the first time I had any interaction at all with AAMC is how when I set up my account, it is mine for life, with no others, ever. I never applied for a FAP, and didn't need to see whatever document OP has been referring to to know that making a second account is a HUGE deal to AAMC. For crying out loud, under certain conditions that can even get you banned from SDN!!!

I REALLY hope OP obtains a favorable resolution with AAMC, because it appears from his posts that he had no idea what the gravity of this action would be, and how there was practically no way he wouldn't get caught. But, if this gets reported, I honestly don't see the schools cutting anyone any slack when AAMC decides something is so serious that it warrants a report to the schools. Anti-trust legal concerns are probably the only reason AAMC doesn't just refuse to process the applications in cases like this, but I doubt schools undermine the judgment of their collective organization and decide that reports like this from AAMC are not a big deal.

 

[Mad Jack]

Very few data points?
You can’t be serious...
Is there any application for any position in any other professional school that is as rigorous and requires you to check more boxes than an application to medical school?

Even what we get is very few data points (and many of them carefully curated) to describe the entirety of a human being.

 

[Stride]

I am not passing judgment on OP at all. I have absolutely no idea what was going on in his head with respect to thinking AAMC wouldn't catch, and come down extremely hard, on a duplicate account. Or thinking that it would be okay, under any circumstances, no matter much FAP money was at stake, or what time constraints existed.

Everyone here is focusing on the seriousness of carelessly filling out a financial aid form, but ignoring the mischief that would ensue in the entire application process, from hiding bad MCAT scores to being a multi-time reapplicant, with each application appearing as the first, if AAMC didn't vigorously police and enforce this.

THAT is why AAMC is going crazy over this, and why if OP fails in making it go away, he is going to have a huge problem at the schools when AAMC reports it when transmitting his primary. Remember AAMC IS a collection of the schools; the schools are not simply going to consider this a learning experience, look for a sign of contrition, and move on. This is THE cardinal sin in dealing with AAMC, right up there with cheating on the MCAT. Lying on an application is the schools' problem. That's why AAMC doesn't even try to vet them. Messing around with their process, on the other hand, is an entirely different matter, and the sanctity of one account per applicant is at its core.

This is a huge deal, which is why AAMC is consulting with lawyers before deciding how to proceed. If they do in fact make a federal case out of this, I think @Mad Jack is spot on, and it's going to be difficult if not impossible to overcome this at AAMC schools. JMHO as an applicant, but the first thing I noticed, the first time I had any interaction at all with AAMC is how when I set up my account, it is mine for life, with no others, ever. I never applied for a FAP, and didn't need to see whatever document OP has been referring to to know that making a second account is a HUGE deal to AAMC. For crying out loud, under certain conditions that can even get you banned from SDN!!!

I see your point @KnightDoc, but I think this is a little too dramatic.

Let's remember that the OP did not lie on any form-- they accidentally overestimated their wealth, resulting in them getting no money. They saved the AAMC money the first time, lol. It was dumb to make a second account without checking the rules (we all agree), but we diverge in the likely repercussions. I don't believe that this will be an application-ending error. If the OP had made the second account in a malicious fashion to get money that belonged to applicants of lower SES-- yes, of course, the app is DOA. However, the OP, in fact, made an account to simply correct financial information. This is not the same as concealing MCAT scores. Give me a break. Intent matters.

I happen to agree with @Mad Jack that some schools have so many applications that they have to screen people out with things like this. No doubt. However, the first statement they made was to analogize this mistake with a physician not charting correctly. I don't agree that is a fair comparison. I think that is what people took issue with.

 

[Mad Jack]

I see your point @KnightDoc, but I think this is a little too dramatic.

Let's remember that the OP did not lie on any form-- they accidentally overestimated their wealth, resulting in them getting no money. They saved the AAMC money the first time, lol. It was dumb to make a second account without checking the rules (we all agree), but we diverge in the likely repercussions. I don't believe that this will be an application-ending error. If the OP had made the second account in a malicious fashion to get money that belonged to applicants of lower SES-- yes, of course, the app is DOA. However, the OP, in fact, made an account to simply correct financial information. This is not the same as concealing MCAT scores. Give me a break. Intent matters.

I happen to agree with @Mad Jack that some schools have so many applications that they have to screen people out with things like this. No doubt. However, the first statement they made was to analogize this mistake with a physician not charting correctly. I don't agree that is a fair comparison. I think that is what people took issue with.

I mean, you think it's a false equivalency but get back to me when you're trying to see 24 patients a day. "I've seen this patient a dozen times, I can just fill in X part of the exam" is the same sort of thinking as "in just saving time by not going thrive the proper process." It amounts to cutting corners in the interest of time, mostly harmless, except when it isn't

 

[KnightDoc]

I see your point @KnightDoc, but I think this is a little too dramatic.

Let's remember that the OP did not lie on any form-- they accidentally overestimated their wealth, resulting in them getting no money. They saved the AAMC money the first time, lol. It was dumb to make a second account without checking the rules (we all agree), but we diverge in the likely repercussions. I don't believe that this will be an application-ending error. If the OP had made the second account in a malicious fashion to get money that belonged to applicants of lower SES-- yes, of course, the app is DOA. However, the OP, in fact, made an account to simply correct financial information. This is not the same as concealing MCAT scores. Give me a break. Intent matters.

I happen to agree with @Mad Jack that some schools have so many applications that they have to screen people out with things like this. No doubt. However, the first statement they made was to analogize this mistake with a physician not charting correctly. I don't agree that is a fair comparison. I think that is what people took issue with.

I don't mean to be dramatic at all, and I 100% agree with the equities that everyone is expressing here. Hopefully, this is exactly what AAMC is considering when deciding what to do here. I'm just saying that creating a second account is a huge violation, maybe not to us, but to them. Limiting us to a single account, for life, is what allows them to do what they do with respect to tracking us and enforcing their rules. I don't know whether or not they make exceptions, or under what circumstances, but OP is about to find out.

I have no knowledge other than what has been posted here, but, from what I'm reading, everyone if focusing on the FAP, which is WHY OP did this. AAMC might not care about that, and they might stop at the fact that he did it.

I never tried, so I don't know what, if any, safeguards are built into the system to stop someone from inadvertently creating a duplicate account (because they didn't read the document), and whether OP intentionally circumvented them in order to get his application in before the deadline. If this happened, I'm not sure that the fact that OP isn't concealing anything or maliciously claiming money he's not entitled to will matter to AAMC.

Again, I'm not passing judgment. I'm only expressing an opinion on whether schools will show mercy if this ends up being reported.

 

[herewego253]

I am not passing judgment on OP at all. I have absolutely no idea what was going on in his head with respect to thinking AAMC wouldn't catch, and come down extremely hard, on a duplicate account. Or thinking that it would be okay, under any circumstances, no matter much FAP money was at stake, or what time constraints existed.

Everyone here is focusing on the seriousness of carelessly filling out a financial aid form, but ignoring the mischief that would ensue in the entire application process, from hiding bad MCAT scores to being a multi-time reapplicant, with each application appearing as the first, if AAMC didn't vigorously police and enforce this.

THAT is why AAMC is going crazy over this, and why if OP fails in making it go away, he is going to have a huge problem at the schools when AAMC reports it when transmitting his primary. Remember AAMC IS a collection of the schools; the schools are not simply going to consider this a learning experience, look for a sign of contrition, and move on. This is THE cardinal sin in dealing with AAMC, right up there with cheating on the MCAT. Lying on an application is the schools' problem. That's why AAMC doesn't even try to vet them. Messing around with their process, on the other hand, is an entirely different matter, and the sanctity of one account per applicant is at its core.

This is a huge deal, which is why AAMC is consulting with lawyers before deciding how to proceed. If they do in fact make a federal case out of this, I think @Mad Jack is spot on, and it's going to be difficult if not impossible to overcome this at AAMC schools. JMHO as an applicant, but the first thing I noticed, the first time I had any interaction at all with AAMC is how when I set up my account, it is mine for life, with no others, ever. I never applied for a FAP, and didn't need to see whatever document OP has been referring to to know that making a second account is a HUGE deal to AAMC. For crying out loud, under certain conditions that can even get you banned from SDN!!!

I REALLY hope OP obtains a favorable resolution with AAMC, because it appears from his posts that he had no idea what the gravity of this action would be, and how there was practically no way he wouldn't get caught. But, if this gets reported, I honestly don't see the schools cutting anyone any slack when AAMC decides something is so serious that it warrants a report to the schools. Anti-trust legal concerns are probably the only reason AAMC doesn't just refuse to process the applications in cases like this, but I doubt schools undermine the judgment of their collective organization and decide that reports like this from AAMC are not a big deal.

This is what the employee said as well and I when I was making a second account that thought never crossed my mind. I was only focused on getting the FAP in before the deadline for MCAT PREP MATERIALS AND HAD NO OTHER INTENTION. In that moment I completely forgot (edit: i didn't forget I didnt even know I could do that, these accounts are connected to my SSN I would never do anything like that an account linked to my SSN and in general) I will be using the same account to apply for med schools and residency. I now understand why he was going to talk to lawyers however, I literally was only focusing on the mcat and didn't even think about other things like that.

 

[herewego253]

I don't mean to be dramatic at all, and I 100% agree with the equities that everyone is expressing here. Hopefully, this is exactly what AAMC is considering when deciding what to do here. I'm just saying that creating a second account is a huge violation, maybe not to us, but to them. Limiting us to a single account, for life, is what allows them to do what they do with respect to tracking us and enforcing their rules. I don't know whether or not they make exceptions, or under what circumstances, but OP is about to find out.

I have no knowledge other than what has been posted here, but, from what I'm reading, everyone if focusing on the FAP, which is WHY OP did this. AAMC might not care about that, and they might stop at the fact that he did it.

I never tried, so I don't know what, if any, safeguards are built into the system to stop someone from inadvertently creating a duplicate account (because they didn't read the document), and whether OP intentionally circumvented them in order to get his application in before the deadline. If this happened, I'm not sure that the fact that OP isn't concealing anything or maliciously claiming money he's not entitled to will matter to AAMC.

Again, I'm not passing judgment. I'm only expressing an opinion on whether schools will show mercy if this ends up being reported.

omg this is really scaring me should I email them a clear that up? I already emailed them a statement trying to resolving the situation and show them what exactly I was doing and thinking but that thought never even crossed my mind.

 

[KnightDoc]

omg this is really scaring me should I email them a clear that up? I already emailed them a statement trying to resolving the situation and show them what exactly I was doing and thinking but that thought never even crossed my mind.

IMHO, if you've already explained yourself, you have nothing to gain by repeating yourself before they tell you what they are going to do. If it was me, and the worst happens, I'd get a lawyer involved because I don't think schools are going to give you the benefit of the doubt after their umbrella organization didn't.

I'd want that note in my file removed BEFORE I applied because, if it isn't, you'll always wonder, for every rejection, whether it would have happened anyway. If you don't want to spend the money or take the time to fight it (again, we're jumping the gun because it hasn't happened yet -- DO NOT go by what customer service rep told you on the phone!!) if it does happen, then don't go by anyone here saying you're DOA, OR anyone saying you'll be fine because it's no big deal.

Prepare for the worst by applying DO, even if you weren't intending to before, in addition to doing your MD thing. If the optimists are correct, great, you were all worked up about nothing. If I'm right, you'll be prepared and you'll still be able to become a doctor. If you spend some time reading some of the threads here, there are many people in a way worse position than you, even if the worst case scenario comes to pass.

 

[herewego253]

IMHO, if you've already explained yourself, you have nothing to gain by repeating yourself before they tell you what they are going to do. If it was me, and the worst happens, I'd get a lawyer involved because I don't think schools are going to give you the benefit of the doubt after their umbrella organization didn't.

I'd want that note in my file removed BEFORE I applied because, if it isn't, you'll always wonder, for every rejection, whether it would have happened anyway. If you don't want to spend the money or take the time to fight it (again, we're jumping the gun because it hasn't happened yet -- DO NOT go by what customer service rep told you on the phone!!) if it does happen, then don't go by anyone here saying you're DOA, OR anyone saying you'll be fine because it's no big deal.

Prepare for the worst by applying DO, even if you weren't intending to before, in addition to doing your MD thing. If the optimists are correct, great, you were all worked up about nothing. If I'm right, you'll be prepared and you'll still be able to become a doctor. If you spend some time reading some of the threads here, there are many people in a way worse position than you, even if the worst case scenario comes to pass.

thank you for the advice and maybe i should go by the plan for the worst hope for the best mentality with this. but the main reason I'm in this whole mess is that I'm a low-income student first gen student. So I'm already doing this all by myself without my parents or families help, how will I even afford a lawyer. Also if they are meeting with their lawyers then wouldn't their lawyers talk about my intent and how I was only intending to do the FAP again and not anything else. Or are these lawyers malicious and prey on low income students cuz if that's the case, I want to become a doctor and not be associated with any malicious business that's out to get people.

 

[herewego253]

I mean, you think it's a false equivalency but get back to me when you're trying to see 24 patients a day. "I've seen this patient a dozen times, I can just fill in X part of the exam" is the same sort of thinking as "in just saving time by not going thrive the proper process." It amounts to cutting corners in the interest of time, mostly harmless, except when it isn't

I understand how adcoms could think this so how can I show them I've learned from this mistake? it was a genuine mistake and I had no intention of doing it.