Fed up w/peoples view of a DO!

[PharmDr.]

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Why can't people believe someone elses view on being a "doctor"? Today before my bio 2 class I had a discussion w/ several other students about what my plans for the future were. When I said I wanted to be a DO they all responded with "why do you want to be a wonabe doctor"? They continued to say that "you know that they are not respected by MDs and it would be a waste of my time to become a low of the line physician". I responded with how do you know this? I then said make sure you get your facts straight b/c you are wrong in all aspects. For starters the education is the same as a MD, but even more. I then briefly talked about OMM and using palpative techniques to cure. I also said that DOs get paid the same and are respected by their MD collegues greatly. I am just so sick of the undeducated responses to what a "DO" is all about. Why cant I do something that is not the norm (ex. MD route) and be happy with it? I hate everyday hearing from professors and friends and tv and parents that MD is the only mentioned type of physician. MD has become the staple for what a doctor is. Dont get me wrong I dont have problems with MDs for the most part but I think as this forum has stated a HUNDRED TIMES THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE AWARENESS FOR WHAT A DO IS! Ok, enough of me rambling, its just that I hate going through life day after day and hearing from the whole world that my choice in direction to become a doctor is wrong. I guess I will have to live with that for now.

On another note, does it seem that people are jealous and seem to despise your choice of becoming a doctor? It's like people now think that you want to be so much better than everyone else.Why can't I just be interested in medicine?

 

[kinetic]

Why can't people believe someone elses view on being a "doctor"? Today before my bio 2 class I had a discussion w/ several other students about what my plans for the future were. When I said I wanted to be a DO they all responded with "why do you want to be a wonabe doctor"? They continued to say that "you know that they are not respected by MDs and it would be a waste of my time to become a low of the line physician". I responded with how do you know this? I then said make sure you get your facts straight b/c you are wrong in all aspects. For starters the education is the same as a MD, but even more. I then briefly talked about OMM and using palpative techniques to cure. I also said that DOs get paid the same and are respected by their MD collegues greatly. I am just so sick of the undeducated responses to what a "DO" is all about. Why cant I do something that is not the norm (ex. MD route) and be happy with it? I hate everyday hearing from professors and friends and tv and parents that MD is the only mentioned type of physician. MD has become the staple for what a doctor is. Dont get me wrong I dont have problems with MDs for the most part but I think as this forum has stated a HUNDRED TIMES THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE AWARENESS FOR WHAT A DO IS! Ok, enough of me rambling, its just that I hate going through life day after day and hearing from the whole world that my choice in direction to become a doctor is wrong. I guess I will have to live with that for now.

On another note, does it seem that people are jealous and seem to despise your choice of becoming a doctor? It's like people now think that you want to be so much better than everyone else.Why can't I just be interested in medicine?

Posts like this are a lose-lose situation. It seems like this is a rhetorical question that D.O.s ask all the time. What do I mean by that? Well, you know the answer as well as I do. And if someone DOES answer the question honestly, they are just "stuck-up M.D.s". You want the truth? Here goes:

1) D.O. schools require, on average, much lower stats to get in. Am I saying that ALL D.O.s have 2.1 GPAs and 15 MCATs? No. But to pretend that D.O. applicants (at least based purely on scores alone) are on par with their M.D. equivalents is mistaken. Does that make them worse PEOPLE? No. But it is a fact that, if you have scores which effectively exclude you from an allopathic school, you still have a pretty fair shot at getting into a D.O. school.

2) D.O. degrees are the second-choice for people. Now, whoa! Before everyone runs in here and proclaims that "I was accepted by an M.D. school and turned them down because I wanted to be a D.O." or "I never even considered being an M.D. even though I was qualified", you're not the majority. In general, people who are borderline M.D. candidates apply to M.D. schools and D.O. schools (as safeties); people who are strong candidates apply only to M.D. schools; and people who are very weak candidates apply only to D.O. schools. I personally have never heard of someone who was well-qualified for an M.D., or who got into an allopathic school, and turned it down or didn't even consider it.

What does this mean? You're going to be looked down upon. I mean, community colleges teach calculus just the same as a state college (I presume). But it's much easier to get into a community college. And don't pretend that YOU don't consider a community college to be inferior to a "real college". (And don't tell me everyone in community college is there because it's less expensive.)

3) OMM is not widely practiced. I don't know enough about OMM to comment on its effectiveness, so this has nothing to do with that. But even you guys have your own thread about silly OMM techniques. And the few D.O.s I know don't even use it. So why would you expect people to be in awe of OMM or the fact that you learn it?

 

[dancinjenn]

I feel your pain. Recently my Grandmother said "So after these years of school can you go on to be a REAL doctor?" I about flipped my lid. I agree that there needs to be more awareness about what a DO is.

On your side note: I try not to even mention that I am going to med school in the fall. I just say that I'm a student and moving to Des Moines. Some times people ask what for...then I have to say for medical school. I then get one of two replies (1) Wow! That's great, must be exciting! ...and then they ask what type of doc I want to be or (2) Oh! Good for you...followed by an immediate change of subject or a discussion on how difficult and rewarding their job is. It gets tiresome at times. Even my fiance catches slack for it 😳 oh well, I just keep telling myself that soon I will be one of the crowd again. One of the few, the proud, the first years...where we will all be on equal footing again struggling to make the grade.

 

[(nicedream)]

Bottom line is there's a difference in numerical student quality, but not practice. People are correct in their characterization of DO schools as typically a 2nd choice and easier to get into, but incorrect in their characterization of DO's as inferior to MD's.

 

[Cowboy DO]

Posts like this are a lose-lose situation. It seems like this is a rhetorical question that D.O.s ask all the time. What do I mean by that? Well, you know the answer as well as I do. And if someone DOES answer the question honestly, they are just "stuck-up M.D.s". You want the truth? Here goes:

1) D.O. schools require, on average, much lower stats to get in. Am I saying that ALL D.O.s have 2.1 GPAs and 15 MCATs? No. But to pretend that D.O. applicants (at least based purely on scores alone) are on par with their M.D. equivalents is mistaken. Does that make them worse PEOPLE? No. But it is a fact that, if you have scores which effectively exclude you from an allopathic school, you still have a pretty fair shot at getting into a D.O. school.

2) D.O. degrees are the second-choice for people. Now, whoa! Before everyone runs in here and proclaims that "I was accepted by an M.D. school and turned them down because I wanted to be a D.O." or "I never even considered being an M.D. even though I was qualified", you're not the majority. In general, people who are borderline M.D. candidates apply to M.D. schools and D.O. schools (as safeties); people who are strong candidates apply only to M.D. schools; and people who are very weak candidates apply only to D.O. schools. I personally have never heard of someone who was well-qualified for an M.D., or who got into an allopathic school, and turned it down or didn't even consider it.

What does this mean? You're going to be looked down upon. I mean, community colleges teach calculus just the same as a state college (I presume). But it's much easier to get into a community college. And don't pretend that YOU don't consider a community college to be inferior to a "real college". (And don't tell me everyone in community college is there because it's less expensive.)

3) OMM is not widely practiced. I don't know enough about OMM to comment on its effectiveness, so this has nothing to do with that. But even you guys have your own thread about silly OMM techniques. And the few D.O.s I know don't even use it. So why would you expect people to be in awe of OMM or the fact that you learn it?

 

[internetwop]

I would be grateful if I was accepted into EITHER program-DO or MD. I don't care about other peoples opinions, I'm not going to school for them, I'm doing it for myself. I think people lose sight of what being a doctor is all about. All I hear is who is better than one another, whether it's RN to doctor or DO to MD. We are ALL health care providers & need to focus on the best interests of patients, not on egotistical ideas on who is better!! Sometimes I think people just like the idea of becoming a doctor & don't really understand what it's all about. For me, it's about taking the knowledge I have from being an RN for 8 years & taking it to another level so that I can have a larger part in my patients' plan of care. Patients want a physician who is kind, honest, intelligent & confident & if you don't have that then medical school shouldn't be an option-MD or DO! Just thought I would throw in my 2 sense.

 

[Eyecon82]

Why can't people believe someone elses view on being a "doctor"? Today before my bio 2 class I had a discussion w/ several other students about what my plans for the future were. When I said I wanted to be a DO they all responded with "why do you want to be a wonabe doctor"? They continued to say that "you know that they are not respected by MDs and it would be a waste of my time to become a low of the line physician". I responded with how do you know this? I then said make sure you get your facts straight b/c you are wrong in all aspects. For starters the education is the same as a MD, but even more. I then briefly talked about OMM and using palpative techniques to cure. I also said that DOs get paid the same and are respected by their MD collegues greatly. I am just so sick of the undeducated responses to what a "DO" is all about. Why cant I do something that is not the norm (ex. MD route) and be happy with it? I hate everyday hearing from professors and friends and tv and parents that MD is the only mentioned type of physician. MD has become the staple for what a doctor is. Dont get me wrong I dont have problems with MDs for the most part but I think as this forum has stated a HUNDRED TIMES THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE AWARENESS FOR WHAT A DO IS! Ok, enough of me rambling, its just that I hate going through life day after day and hearing from the whole world that my choice in direction to become a doctor is wrong. I guess I will have to live with that for now.

On another note, does it seem that people are jealous and seem to despise your choice of becoming a doctor? It's like people now think that you want to be so much better than everyone else.Why can't I just be interested in medicine?

dont worry man, it's only the PRE-meds that say stuff like that. pre-meds are the most insecure group of people i have ever seen. that's why they say stuff like that...to justify that their chosen MD route is the only genuine route. this is what they're thinking in their head...."oh my god i worked my a$$ off and this person with lower stats will end up in the same position i will be even though i worked harder"...

Of course you'll get the occasional professional that will say that...but hey...that's their loss if they can't accept reality...

 

[JohnnyOU]

dont worry man, it's only the PRE-meds that say stuff like that. pre-meds are the most insecure group of people i have ever seen. that's why they say stuff like that...to justify that their chosen MD route is the only genuine route. this is what they're thinking in their head...."oh my god i worked my a$$ off and this person with lower stats will end up in the same position i will be even though i worked harder"...

Of course you'll get the occasional professional that will say that...but hey...that's their loss if they can't accept reality...

LOL.... kinda bashing the premeds there eh?

What is it you think those silly premeds are insecure about? Are they just jealous of you? LOL

BTW...weren't you a premed for about 4 years?

😀

J~

 

[OnMyWayThere]

Majority of premeds in my school are jealous, competitive losers who have no life outside of school so I pay no attention to them.

Now if an MD or DO told me, hey - think again about becoming a DO, I'd take it into consideration.

Otherwise, you're getting the finger.

Pursue your goal man, it's all about becoming a physician and we will become that.

 

[JohnnyOU]

Majority of premeds in my school are jealous, competitive losers who have no life outside of school so I pay no attention to them.

Now if an MD or DO told me, hey - think again about becoming a DO, I'd take it into consideration.

Otherwise, you're getting the finger.

Pursue your goal man, it's all about becoming a physician and we will become that.

What are they jealous of ?

J~

 

[specialkay]

OK - so Osteopathy needs an "Extreme Makeover" with a crew of plastic surgeons and maybe a therapist to shape it into something everyone wants. Until then, its up to us, who love the philosophy and can't wait to practice holistic health, to represent Osteo on our campuses and in our communities. We've all seen those T-shirts that say "this is what a feminist looks like", maybe we should get t-shirts that say "this is what an Osteopath looks like"!!

I'm sorry to hear you're being attacked by people around you - ouch! Yes, we've all been attacked by friends, family members who wanted us to pursue MD's and told us we won't be respected, its not as "prestigious" - these people give me the feeling they want to brag about knowing a MD more than they care about which philosophy is more appealing to me or my happiness in general. I just hit them up for MD tuition donations and they usually leave me alone after that. 😛

The people who have bashed DO to me usually fall in one of the two categories:

My dad's friends - older foreign born doctors who had to kill themselves to become MD's in this country by jumping through innumerable hoops - becoming an MD, not a DO, made them who they are in this country so it seems like they see it as the pinnacle of success, and the only way.

My 18-21 year old pre-med peers - not all of them, but most, have never worked in a hospital or clinic and seen DO's at work. Hell, most of them have never even had a job or lived outside the house. Seems like most of them are just parroting what their parents say at home. "MD! Only! MD! Squaaawk!!"

Both sets of people are understandable, and forgiveable. Either way, WHO CARES!? If you're going to sit around worrying what others think about you, don't become a DO. In fact, don't become an MD because a lot of other people "hate doctors" as well for whatever reason. If you really care all that much about what others think, don't do anything because eventually you're going to offend someone and god forbid when that happens.

On a personal level - I really don't care what my pre-MD peers thought of me. I'll never see them again after this Friday and they can "have a nice day"! I won't miss seeing their competitive, unfriendly little faces or watching them squirm when a test is passed back.

On a professional level, I care 100% what my patients think of the level of care I will be providing to them. Will I bust my a** in school to study every possible disease I can cram in my head? Yes. Will it be different from the diseases taught at MD schools? No. Will I take the COMLEX as well as the USMLE to prove that my education is equal to my peers? Yes. Will I strive to be the best, most thorough, well-educated, understanding health-care practitioner out there? Absolutely.

So, until the AOA can hire a team of swat recruiters to fan across the country in an Osteopathic Marketing scheme, we're going to have to be the ambassadors and enlighten, educate and move on to the next patient, just like a "regular" doctor! 😉

 

[Eyecon82]

LOL.... kinda bashing the premeds there eh?

What is it you think those silly premeds are insecure about? Are they just jealous of you? LOL

BTW...weren't you a premed for about 4 years?

😀

J~

hehe.....i wouldn't consider myself a pre-med...pre-meds are those people...when asked..."what's your major?" ..."oh...im a premed" ....if i was asked what my major was...id say psychology...not oh..im a premed....cuz that doesnt mean anything until you're accepted somewhere

now don't get me wrong and think that im talking about all pre-meds...im talking about the majority of them....those people know who they are

id say they're insucure about themselves....i mean...its tough..knowing that half of them arn't going to get in medical schools...so i really can't blame them for that..i've always had that anxiety as well

about being jelous of me....hehe..i hope not...im not what you consider a role model..

 

[Eyecon82]

So, until the AOA can hire a team of swat recruiters to fan across the country in an Osteopathic Marketing scheme, we're going to have to be the ambassadors and enlighten, educate and move on to the next patient, just like a "regular" doctor! 😉

well...the current aoa board blows....they are fighting so hard to distinguish themselves from MD's....but are forgetting about spreading knowledge about osteopathic physicians...

i know that our generation will definetly fix that mistake....many people argue that marketing osteopathic medicine will just make us seem desperate...i believe its the complete opposite. when you see university of chicago hospital commercials on their cancer-care......the thought of "hmm...pritzker school of medicne must be really desperate to have cancer patients come to them" never crossed my mind...id think it'd open up patients eyes

 

[(nicedream)]

As long as the admissions standards are different, those that see osteopathic medicine as inferior will continue to do so.

 

[specialkay]

I don't know if I'd agree that marketing a school or profession makes you look desperate. Its all about attracting the top people for the field, whatever the field is. We have more posters for the international medical schools in the hallways at school than any other and they don't look desperate - they look like they are trying to make a buck providing an education. But its all in the interpretation.

If I were at the helm of the AOA, I would do a lot more marketing on college campuses than what is currently done - close to zero from what I've seen. I attended one Osteopathic conference at USC four years ago, sponsored by COMP. The AOA president was there as well as the student recruiter.

Turning the public's view of Osteopathy around is going to take a long time. Television is the best way to get the message out - followed by radio and college visits. There's a lot of work that has to be done before the ignorance ends, but who is willing to do it/pay for it?

 

[BlueFalcon]

For the insecure, it makes them feel better to be able to say "you're less than me because..." These clowns who dis D.O.s are in that boat. Yes, the average MCAT and GPA is higher at allopathic schools than D.O. schools. So what? The average MCAT and GPA is higher at Harvard than St. Louis University. Does that mean that graduates of St. Louis University, or even Duke for that matter, shouldn't practice medicine? Many of the graduates of St. Louis University will become better physicians than many of the Harvard grads. How is this possible? Last I checked, a physician's ability to practice medicine wasn't predicated on the average MCAT and GPA of their med school class. Work hard and be good at your craft, and patients and peers will respect you. Certainly the school from which you graduate can make differerence in placement, but when the rubber meets the road, it's your performance and expertise as a clinician that will define you. If your pre-med buds aren't #1 in their class at Duke or Stanford it doesn't serve them to strut around with a superior attitude. While they're strutting, you study; and you'll have the last laugh.

 

[Eyecon82]

As long as the admissions standards are different, those that see osteopathic medicine as inferior will continue to do so.

yea..true...but osteopathic schools look more at your life background then your stats....

sort of like AIU online....yes its an onlne school and people talk trash about it all the time...but guess what? its regionally accredited..meaning it has the same acredditing body such as duke, harvard, etc. when it comes to fortune 500 companies...that's what they look for...because AIU online accepts students based on their desire, interest, and motivation, and many of these companies are starting to realize that....these are the students that would really help their company succeed...not the students who's mommy and daddy forced them to go to school right out of high school....(i am one of them)

 

[IndyZX]

i have a question. what life backgrounds do osteopathic schools consider valuable? and why?

 

[gioia]

Turning the public's view of Osteopathy around is going to take a long time. Television is the best way to get the message out - followed by radio and college visits. There's a lot of work that has to be done before the ignorance ends, but who is willing to do it/pay for it?

The easiest way is to have excellent DO's in the media. It is a similar quandry to that of getting the medical profession represented in State politics.

Excellent DO's in media would speak volumes!

 

[KatieOConnor]

I was trying to explain to my aunt recently what a DO is, and she was like, "They are actually normal doctors?! I thought they were chiropractor-like"

She was actually very impressed when I explained what they are, what their philosophy is, and how I had a sports medicine doctor who is a DO. I agree that DOs in the media would work wonders. Maybe there could be one on scrubs, or ER. And perhaps networks could consult them on medical issues in the news.

I'm not applying to DO schools, but I definitely considered it and I feel that if people knew more about these doctors, and if people knew that they ARE doctors, then the respect would increase a lot. Personally I had no idea they existed until I started looking into medical school. Then I noticed that my sports medicine doctor was a DO.

 

[gioia]

Production teams consult DO's frequently for acurate medical drama depictions. In fact, I believe that the largest source of television/media medical information is a company run by DO's.

Networks only consult physicians that have media exposure exp. They also rely on medical broadcasters to convey the info., even though they are not in the profession, because media is about image and most doctors look like a muppet when they are speaking to a camera.

So, for those of you w/ high VR and dynamic personalities.... become involved in the media!! 🙂

 

[PharmDr.]

I actually dont let the other "pre-meds" bother me b/c my dream is to become a doctor in any way. I will strive to be my best in any approach(MD or DO). It's just I needed to vent and hear if you guys get the same drift as i do. The only problem so far that I have faced is a decreased social life. It's kinda hard to hang out with the guys when you are stuck home this summer doing anat. lab reports and anat. and bio2 and every other week a 2 page paper is due for bio2 lab and theres also psychology where the tests are all essay based where the minimum is a page answer to every question! I am just at a small college that used to be a community college! Im not trying to complain but I am just trying to state how "our" situation could and does "for me" effect our day to day life. I am willing to work hard so I am not out of the "pre-med" boat yet cause I know it's just gonna get harder. Let's not try to seperate ourselves from each other on this forum by "stick together" cause were all in the same boat and many of us (hopefully) might become physicians and collegues.

 

[JohnDO]

I've kind of learned to ignore other premeds. As far as I can see, the whole MD DO rivalry is only kept alive by premedical kiddies.

 

[medic170]

I've kind of learned to ignore other premeds. As far as I can see, the whole MD DO rivalry is only kept alive by premedical kiddies.

Very true. DO vs. MD is not an issue among most people, especially among medical professionals. In fact, I never even heard of this as an issue until I started mingling with premeds. it was never an issue in practices, hospitals, or urgent care clinics I worked at.

 

[Chronotropic]

Most of these premeds are probably in it for an ego trip. And anything that takes away from any of their prestige in unacceptable to them.

 

[JohnDO]

Most of these premeds are probably in it for an ego trip. And anything that stakes away from any of their prestige in unacceptable to them.

Indeed. There are those premeds that still say "B-b-b-ut it's not M.D." even after you've explained it 20 times to them. That's why I've given up explaining my decision to other premeds.

I've actually been pleasently suprised with the amount of awareness of osteopathic medicine at my university as of late. There is a new advisor who pushes osteopathic medicine, and so many premeds are very aware of it. I was suprised at the number of kids that showed up for a LECOM presentation on their new florida branch that were also in my organic 2 class.

 

[Amy B]

Very true. DO vs. MD is not an issue among most people, especially among medical professionals. In fact, I never even heard of this as an issue until I started mingling with premeds. it was never an issue in practices, hospitals, or urgent care clinics I worked at.

That is what I have heard as well from professionals out in the working world. Pre-meds are obsessed about it and they make it seem like 100% of health professionals look down on DOs and that simply is not true.

 

[dancinjenn]

My wife was accepted into DMU. On our way out to find apartments in Des moines, we stopped at her grandparents house for breakfast. (A nice way to cut a 10 hour drive) We were talking, and her grandmother says "So after your done with this school can you go one and become a real doctor?" "No, grandma after this I WILL be a real doctor." "I'll be able to perscribe medication and perform surgery and everything." I thought she was going to jump across the table and smack her grandmother, but she restrained herself to the above cynicism. Betrayed but your own flesh and blood, can you imagine.

 

[gioia]

Betrayed but your own flesh and blood, can you imagine.

Umm.... YES!

Plan to have something of Machiavelli in your personal library. You can start with the Prince and go from there.

Machiavelli's philosphy is very appropriate in situations such as that! 🙂

 

[Richie Truxillo]

We will see threads like this until the day the AOA gets off their arses and actually advertises what the profession is about. Where in the Hippocractic Oath does it say "Thou Shalt Not Advertise?"

-Richie

 

[HoodyHoo]

I mean, community colleges teach calculus just the same as a state college (I presume). But it's much easier to get into a community college. And don't pretend that YOU don't consider a community college to be inferior to a "real college". (And don't tell me everyone in community college is there because it's less expensive.)

Yeah, but community college courses are generally much easier than at a univeristy, are you saying the sciences at osteopathic schools are easier than at allopathic?

 

[no-see-um]

Posts like this are a lose-lose situation. It seems like this is a rhetorical question that D.O.s ask all the time. What do I mean by that? Well, you know the answer as well as I do. And if someone DOES answer the question honestly, they are just "stuck-up M.D.s". You want the truth? Here goes:

1) D.O. schools require, on average, much lower stats to get in. Am I saying that ALL D.O.s have 2.1 GPAs and 15 MCATs? No. But to pretend that D.O. applicants (at least based purely on scores alone) are on par with their M.D. equivalents is mistaken. Does that make them worse PEOPLE? No. But it is a fact that, if you have scores which effectively exclude you from an allopathic school, you still have a pretty fair shot at getting into a D.O. school.

2) D.O. degrees are the second-choice for people. Now, whoa! Before everyone runs in here and proclaims that "I was accepted by an M.D. school and turned them down because I wanted to be a D.O." or "I never even considered being an M.D. even though I was qualified", you're not the majority. In general, people who are borderline M.D. candidates apply to M.D. schools and D.O. schools (as safeties); people who are strong candidates apply only to M.D. schools; and people who are very weak candidates apply only to D.O. schools. I personally have never heard of someone who was well-qualified for an M.D., or who got into an allopathic school, and turned it down or didn't even consider it.

What does this mean? You're going to be looked down upon. I mean, community colleges teach calculus just the same as a state college (I presume). But it's much easier to get into a community college. And don't pretend that YOU don't consider a community college to be inferior to a "real college". (And don't tell me everyone in community college is there because it's less expensive.)

3) OMM is not widely practiced. I don't know enough about OMM to comment on its effectiveness, so this has nothing to do with that. But even you guys have your own thread about silly OMM techniques. And the few D.O.s I know don't even use it. So why would you expect people to be in awe of OMM or the fact that you learn it?

Ok, you had something going until you got to the second paragraph of #2 and beyond...

Just because it may be easier to get into a school, does not mean it does not prepare you as well or better than other schools. There is a major flaw when it comes to people's outlook on the "prestige" of education in this country.

I could tell you one thing, on any level of academics, there are schools that are hard as hell to make, but easy to get out of. Yet, there are easier schools to make and hard ones to get out of. Now, as long as you are learning what you need to learn and could make a difference in patient's lives, each should be prestigious. The act of getting into a hard school, although glorious, does not translate into anything in terms of health care. The only major upshot to your argument, perhaps, is in terms of getting into schools, not in terms of what each does in thse schools and how they function to produce doctors out of applicants. If you want to call that vanity, glory, prestige, call it whatever you want. You cannot dismiss DO's as anything but fine health care professionals through your line of reasoning...


Also, your remarks on OMM do not fall anywhere short of being ignorant and unresearched, which you did actually admit, so I can't fault you there. Because you did not research it, your argument boils down to a fundamental claim that you are expecting to apply rather generally, that I could take the pleasure of giving a wide range of scenarios where this is indeed not the case (you seem like a smart guy, I don't have to spoonfeed you that part).

To say that, because something may not be widely practiced, that people should not have respect for it, is illogical. Furthermore, it is prejudicial to make such a claim without having researched the specific area you are applying that claim to.

 

[Doc Martins]

I would be grateful if I was accepted into EITHER program-DO or MD. I don't care about other peoples opinions, I'm not going to school for them, I'm doing it for myself. I think people lose sight of what being a doctor is all about. All I hear is who is better than one another, whether it's RN to doctor or DO to MD. We are ALL health care providers & need to focus on the best interests of patients, not on egotistical ideas on who is better!! Sometimes I think people just like the idea of becoming a doctor & don't really understand what it's all about. For me, it's about taking the knowledge I have from being an RN for 8 years & taking it to another level so that I can have a larger part in my patients' plan of care. Patients want a physician who is kind, honest, intelligent & confident & if you don't have that then medical school shouldn't be an option-MD or DO! Just thought I would throw in my 2 sense.

👍 I couldn't agree more... we have to care less about how others will perceive us and be confident in ourselves. I for one need to start following this advice because I tend to regard others' opinions way more than I should.

 

[mickdogg81]

Doc Martins,

I couldn't have posted it better. We need to remain confident in ourselves, who cares what a few ingorant people think. Now, no offense to the pre-meds, I was once one as well, but to go on bashing DO's without any knowledge of the profession, is unwarranted. Additionally, I ask that you first, get into med school, then say what you want. If you put prestige before your desire to be a true, dedicated doctor, then so be it. In the end, we are all going to be studying for boards, attaining a residency, and eventually practicing medicine. Personally, I am proud of my choice to go DO, as should everyone else in the forum who is/will be a DO!

 

[Eyecon82]

Doc Martins,

I couldn't have posted it better. We need to remain confident in ourselves, who cares what a few ingorant people think. Now, no offense to the pre-meds, I was once one as well, but to go on bashing DO's without any knowledge of the profession, is unwarranted. Additionally, I ask that you first, get into med school, then say what you want. If you put prestige before your desire to be a true, dedicated doctor, then so be it. In the end, we are all going to be studying for boards, attaining a residency, and eventually practicing medicine. Personally, I am proud of my choice to go DO, as should everyone else in the forum who is/will be a DO!

yea...its definetly established that pre-meds are the only ones that still fuel the md vs do debate....once you're in the real professional world...it'll completely dissapear

 

[(nicedream)]

yea...its definetly established that pre-meds are the only ones that still fuel the md vs do debate....once you're in the real professional world...it'll completely dissapear

That's overly optimistic. It's not just premeds, they're just the ones that speak with you candidly. I've talked to many MD's that think DO's are inferior. In the professional world, such talk just goes on behind people's backs rather than to their faces.

 

[medic170]

That's overly optimistic. It's not just premeds, they're just the ones that speak with you candidly. I've talked to many MD's that think DO's are inferior. In the professional world, such talk just goes on behind people's backs rather than to their faces.

If you say so. At least around here, there are a plethora of partner and group practices in which D.O.s and M.D.s are partners. I doubt that these M.D.s talk behind their partner's backs about how inferior they are, if they thought that, why would they be partners in a practice with them. M.D.s and D.O.s also work side by side in virtually every hospital, clinic, and specialty in medicine in this geographic area. Of course, Michigan is known for being D.O. friendly, so maybe I am just sheltered from the ignorance, but I can assure you that, at least around here, the D.O. inferiority thing is NEVER an issue among professionals. So, I guess I'll be sure to practice in Michigan where the medical professionals are more professional, better informed, and are smart enough to know that D.O.s are in no way inferior to M.D.s.

 

[WillowRose]

I'm going to pretend that *my* class wasn't in the group of "easier community college classes." Like all things, there is a perception that classes are easier at community college because it's easier to get in. However, many students are unpleasantly surprised to discover that some classes are hard no matter where they are.

Plenty have said it before, your MCAT scores and GPA's don't determine what kind of doctor you will be. I had a student (from a line of MD's) say "Oh you're going to be a DO......." He went on to say how his parents felt about DO's (not favorably). I replied (half joking) that it was "Big talk for a couple of foreign medical graduates."

As if it isn't enough of a pain to spend time "justifying" your choice to others, having a student try to look down at you is *really* peeving! At least I can rest easy knowing that he learned a lot more than Biology in my class and perhaps he will be a better doctor because of it.

Willow

 

[cbc]

Your last two lines are contradictory to your entire post. If you only care to practice medicine, which you will with the DO, then why all the anger? Is it because you want to be perceived as better than everyone else? If not, I don't see why you care what these people are saying, if in fact the only thing you care about is to practice medicine.

I also suggest DO *may be viewed* as inferior to *some* because the more prestigious universities and institutions do not endorse this degree. If Harvard, Yale, and Columbia begins teaching and giving out DO degrees, I bet DO would gain more "prestige."

Why can't people believe someone elses view on being a "doctor"? Today before my bio 2 class I had a discussion w/ several other students about what my plans for the future were. When I said I wanted to be a DO they all responded with "why do you want to be a wonabe doctor"? They continued to say that "you know that they are not respected by MDs and it would be a waste of my time to become a low of the line physician". I responded with how do you know this? I then said make sure you get your facts straight b/c you are wrong in all aspects. For starters the education is the same as a MD, but even more. I then briefly talked about OMM and using palpative techniques to cure. I also said that DOs get paid the same and are respected by their MD collegues greatly. I am just so sick of the undeducated responses to what a "DO" is all about. Why cant I do something that is not the norm (ex. MD route) and be happy with it? I hate everyday hearing from professors and friends and tv and parents that MD is the only mentioned type of physician. MD has become the staple for what a doctor is. Dont get me wrong I dont have problems with MDs for the most part but I think as this forum has stated a HUNDRED TIMES THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE AWARENESS FOR WHAT A DO IS! Ok, enough of me rambling, its just that I hate going through life day after day and hearing from the whole world that my choice in direction to become a doctor is wrong. I guess I will have to live with that for now.

On another note, does it seem that people are jealous and seem to despise your choice of becoming a doctor? It's like people now think that you want to be so much better than everyone else.Why can't I just be interested in medicine?

 

[oceandoc]

"I personally have never heard of someone who was well-qualified for an M.D., or who got into an allopathic school, and turned it down or didn't even consider it."

Are you kidding, Kinetic? I know of at least 4 people here at UNECOM who turned down MD acceptances (one of those to Dartmouth medical school) to come to UNE.

 

[merlin17]

That's overly optimistic. It's not just premeds, they're just the ones that speak with you candidly. I've talked to many MD's that think DO's are inferior. In the professional world, such talk just goes on behind people's backs rather than to their faces.

I have to agree that this is unfortunately true. I am a medical student and up until this point (4 years premed, many years volunteering, many years of research, now 1 year of medical school) I have only met one DO during my training and have never ever heard osteopathy mentioned in undergrad or medical school. This is really a shame and the fault of the medical school. I am encouraged to interact and learn about all other health professions and how we all serve different roles in the medical team, but maybe because DO/MD is so similar, DO just isn't mentioned.

We had one DO student rotate through one of our teaching hospitals for PM&R. He was really really nice and I met him at a party one night in our dorm. He said he was a visiting student and when I asked him where he was from, he said a school on long island that I wouldn't have heard of...I surprised the hell out of him when I had indeed heard of his school (since one of my old coworkers is first year at MSU-COM and we applied to med schools together). He said that I was the first person that had a clue what he was talking about and we talked about his school, OMM etc. all night. I learned a ton...but that doesn't help the fact that no one else at my school had a clue that there were other types of doctors out there. I think its a regional thing. I did a search for DOs on my health plan website...only ten or so showed up out of the 10,000 I could choose from. I think its just a numbers thing...but who knows.

 

[gioia]

"I personally have never heard of someone who was well-qualified for an M.D., or who got into an allopathic school, and turned it down or didn't even consider it."

Are you kidding, Kinetic? I know of at least 4 people here at UNECOM who turned down MD acceptances (one of those to Dartmouth medical school) to come to UNE.

Go, OceanDoc, Go!

 

[Neon Black]

Who fvcking cares what your called. You'll still be making more money than 99% of the people in the U.S. or different majors out there. If anyone slags you just whip out your money clip with your bling and tell them to go die. 👍

 

[Eyecon82]

"I personally have never heard of someone who was well-qualified for an M.D., or who got into an allopathic school, and turned it down or didn't even consider it."

Are you kidding, Kinetic? I know of at least 4 people here at UNECOM who turned down MD acceptances (one of those to Dartmouth medical school) to come to UNE.

I rejected Finch and SIU for CCOM. I rather go to a top DO school than a lower-tier MD school.

 

[medic170]

Who fvcking cares what your called. You'll still be making more money than 99% of the people in the U.S. or different majors out there. If anyone slags you just whip out your money clip with your bling and tell them to go die. 👍

Oh yeah, I keep forgetting I am doing this for the money. Wait thats right, if I make $150,000 a year, then by the time I make my student loan payment($1800 a month for 25 years) and pay my higher taxes(since liberals think I am rich), Dr. medic170 only gets to keep about $70,000. I guess I am not doing it fot the money after all, since i won't really have that much.

I think that more than 1% of the population will be making more than I will be. Nice thought though.

 

[Hotsauce21]

if you want a post-med school perspective, i would say the difference is minimal, but palpable. the big difference i think is that being a d.o. makes it a little tougher to get a "good" residency. i dont see d.o's as any different personally. there is still some mild prejudice though, likely, by both patients and fellow m.d.'s, but so minimal im not sure its worth worrying about.

 

[mackaikai]

I basically explain DO to ppl by using the dentist example, "do you know that there are 2 degrees for dentist? DMD and DDS, they are the same. People going to dentist usually have no clue which degree their dentist has. There are also two equivalent degrees for physician, DO and MD and ..."

most of them wouldn't ask more questions about "What is DO"

 

[Eyecon82]

I basically explain DO to ppl by using the dentist example, "do you know that there are 2 degrees for dentist? DMD and DDS, they are the same. People going to dentist usually have no clue which degree their dentist has. There are also two equivalent degrees for physician, DO and MD and ..."

most of them wouldn't ask more questions about "What is DO"

yep...that's the same example i use and it definetly clears up a lot of confusion after that..

 

[medic170]

I basically explain DO to ppl by using the dentist example, "do you know that there are 2 degrees for dentist? DMD and DDS, they are the same. People going to dentist usually have no clue which degree their dentist has. There are also two equivalent degrees for physician, DO and MD and ..."

most of them wouldn't ask more questions about "What is DO"

I've never heard it explained that way before, but that is interesting. it really simplifies the explanation for those with whom you don't want to spend the next 3 hours explaining what a D.O. is. I like it.

 

[Eyecon82]

I've never heard it explained that way before, but that is interesting. it really simplifies the explanation for those with whom you don't want to spend the next 3 hours explaining what a D.O. is. I like it.

it'll definetly crunch an hour of explaining into 10 seconds...i dont even bother talking about the philosophy...because in the end...it really doesnt matter and it just raises more questions and doubts.

MD and DO's are absolutely equivelent. the AOA pushes the same bull**** over and over again and spends their time trying to distinguish themselves from md's when in reality..besides the OMM...there is no difference....the philosophy is essentially the same thing....about how everything is interconnected and bla bla bla....when it comes to practicing medicine...they do it the same way...that philosophy has no place in a clinical setting.