MD & DO First Timer! 3.57c/3.59s GPA 23 MCAT

[InthatHickTown]

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Hello all!

I have been searching these boards for years, and I thought it was time to receive some help/advice!

For starters, I just finished my junior year and plan to apply this cycle. I am an Iowa resident, going to undergrad in Illinois, white, and first generation college student.

My cGPA is 3.57 and my sGPA is 3.59

My MCAT the first go around was 23 (7PS 9VR 7 BS), and I know this is terrible and I plan on retaking in July.

My EC's aren't officially concrete, because a lot of the work I will be doing will be done this summer. As of right now I have:
-Currently doing 10 weeks of research in a molecular physiology lab, searching for mechanisms dealing with Rheumatoid Arthritis and MS (potentially resulting in two publications)
-Will have around 50 hours of volunteering at a children's hosptital by the end of the summer, and an additional 150 hours during my senior year at the hospital near my college
-Will job shadow various physicians this summer, equating to around 20 hours of shadowing
-I also plan on working with a DO in the fall

I am confident that I will receive well written LoR from various science professors and my PI (still hoping to find a DO).

During my time as an undergrad, I have accomplished:
-Being the Executive Director of my college's Office of Student Activities, leading a team of 24 students in planning campus wide events throughout the academic year
-Being the President of my fraternity
-Singlehandedly coordinating a successful fundraiser for breast cancer research
-Being VP of Fraternities for my campus's Greek Council
-Gaining around 200 hours of non-clinical volunteering through Greek group, and various groups through the school

Some honors that I have received are a leadership award through my school, triBeta Biological Honor Society, Mortar Board, Omicron Delta Kappa Leadership Honor Society, Order of Omega Honor Society for Greeks, and Dean's List for several terms, to name those that come to mind.

I know my EC's aren't as much as I would like, my GPA isn't the greatest, but still mildly competitive, and I know my MCAT is my absolute downfall, which I intend to improve on with my next test.

I am very open minded to both MD and DO, as I have researched and reviewed a lot of the philosophies of both, and loved both aspects.

The MD schools I plan on applying to as of right now (in no particular order) are:
Baylor
Northwestern
Mayo
University of Wisconsin
University of Iowa
University of Colorado
Wake Forest
University of Washington
Loyola
University of Chicago

The DO schools I plan on applying to are:
Michigan State
Midwestern
Des Moines
Ohio
Kirksville

These are not by any means set in concrete, and I would be more than happy for any suggestions to other schools, and know that I am willing to travel all around the country for medical school (except for the Caribbean).

Thank you so much everyone for taking the time to read this, I know it was very long, but I wanted to be as thorough as possible to give the best indication for my chances of getting accepted into Medical school. Any and all advice is greatly appreciated.

 

[DoctorSynthesis]

Almost zero chance. Improve your mcat . Only competitive in carribean. Don't go there. Some of those Md schools I'm laughing at . U of Chicago?

 

[el_duderino]

Your chances for this cycle are virtually zero, given the low MCAT, virtually zero clinical hours, and zero shadowing. Plan to apply next year and spend the next year racking up humanitarian volunteer hours, shadowing hours, and boosting that MCAT score. You should also do everything you can to get straight A's the next two semesters.

 

[thegypsyqueen]

Zero chance at MD and slim to zero for DO. On top of that your MD list is a bunch of upper tiers that matriculate students with MCATs that are 11-13 points higher than yours. You need to focus on improving your MCAT and then realistically assessing where to apply by looking at the MSAR. I am sorry to be crass but someone needs to tell you before you blow a bunch of money. You seem misinformed and it is a good thing you are on SDN asking these questions. Focus on retaking your MCAT and if you can bring it up to a 27-29 you'll have a good shot at DO.

 

[gyngyn]

To summarize what has previously been mentioned, your MCAT is about 2 SD's below acceptable at the MD schools you have listed.

There may be DO schools that will consider you but it will take a bit of research on the pre DO forum to identify them.

 

[jacksonlikesturtles]

Also, by the time you get your retake score, it is already August.

 

[Person0715]

You should consider taking a gap year so you can retake the MCAT when you're more prepared. How long have you been studying for your July retake?

 

[InthatHickTown]

I have been studying for the past month, and plan to study all of June, when I am not researching. I am very anxious about taking a gap year because of loans starting to surface from undergrad, and I know right now I won't make the cut at a lot of these schools, but I wasn't entirely sure what some of the lower tiered schools were. Also, DO is an option I would be more than willing to pursue. I actually bounce a lot between applying to solely DO schools because of their philosophy alone. But at the same time there are some MD programs that I have always dreamed of going to. What should I aim for for my next MCAT (besides much higher than 23)?

 

[el_duderino]

Don't rush this. It sounds like your app needs a lot of work to be competitive. You have stuff lined up for the coming year that will round it out pretty decently. Your GPA is competitive. You need some intense work on your MCAT score in addition to the other stuff you're doing.

Do this smart and plan on a gap year. Get your volunteering, clinical experience, and shadowing in starting now. Get A's in the fall and spring. Spend the summer studying hard for the MCAT and think about maybe taking it in August before the next semester starts if you can really dedicate the next 2-3 months to busting your butt for it. Plan something awesome for your gap year, such as an SMP or Peace Corps or something.

 

[chemguy79]

Given your GPA, you need (at the very least) a 10 point improvement to be somewhat competitive for MD. In addition, you have quite a few OOS MD schools on your list that I would remove (Washington, Colorado, and Wisconsin). Unfortunately, I don't think that your statistics match your dream schools. In order to be competitive for MD, you need to be at or above a 30 given the rest of your application for low-tier MD programs.

Personally, I would apply strictly DO regardless of your MD dreams because a 10 point improvement is going to be incredibly difficult. Frankly, I would pursue a gap year regardless of your student loans unless you dramatically improve your MCAT score.

 

[StBernardsRule]

I have been studying for the past month, and plan to study all of June, when I am not researching. I am very anxious about taking a gap year because of loans starting to surface from undergrad, and I know right now I won't make the cut at a lot of these schools, but I wasn't entirely sure what some of the lower tiered schools were. Also, DO is an option I would be more than willing to pursue. I actually bounce a lot between applying to solely DO schools because of their philosophy alone. But at the same time there are some MD programs that I have always dreamed of going to. What should I aim for for my next MCAT (besides much higher than 23)?

As others have already stated, you need to look at a MSAR.

But also keep in mind that as of right now your application is weak in areas other than your MCAT. Your extra curricular activities are very weak for some if not all of the schools you listed and even getting a much higher MCAT (33+) probably won't be enough. Your GPA is also too low for some MD schools.

Your best bet is to slow down and take the MCAT again when you're really prepared and feel like scoring the absolute best you're capable of. After that, you can apply next year to lower tier MD schools if you do exceptionally well (assuming you also improve your ECs) as well as many DO schools (which you'll likely be much more competitive for). Some of the med schools you may have dreamed about (such as Mayo) are likely just an impossibility at this point as they already have an oversupply of applicants with incredible GPAs/MCATs/ECs.

Best of luck!

 

[Goro]

100% agree. Invest in MSAR Online; it's your friend for MD applications. Start making good choices and do your homework on this process. For example, go look up the avg MCAT score and cGPA at Northwestern.

Your chances for this cycle are virtually zero, given the low MCAT, virtually zero clinical hours, and zero shadowing. Plan to apply next year and spend the next year racking up humanitarian volunteer hours, shadowing hours, and boosting that MCAT score. You should also do everything you can to get straight A's the next two semesters.

 

[InthatHickTown]

Thanks for everyone's advice and input!

I reworked my lists quite a bit.
MD:
Rush
George Washington
Albany
Drexel
Wayne State
Marshall University
Meharry
Toledo
Mayo
Iowa (Dream School)
Baylor (wasn't planning on applying, but am currently doing research here over the summer, and my PI still told me I should apply)

DO:
ACOM
KCOM
CCOM
DMU
KCUMB
MSU
OSU
RVU

I think these are a bit more realistic, but if anyone has any insights or naysays against any of these schools, I thought SDN would be the best place to find out. Thanks again for everyone's help!

 

[lmn]

I think essentially your entire MD list is a donation list with your mcat score. As others said, even DO is going to be a real struggle.

 

[candbgirl]

Have you used the MSAR in the development of this list? Have you checked what the bottom 10 percentile is for all of these schools? I'm betting MCAT is well below the 10 th % for everyone of theses schools. Slow down. You really don't want to be a reapplicant and that is most likely the path you are following

 

[Pattycake25]

Thanks for everyone's advice and input!

I reworked my lists quite a bit.
MD:
Rush
George Washington
Albany
Drexel
Wayne State
Marshall University
Meharry
Toledo
Mayo
Iowa (Dream School)
Baylor (wasn't planning on applying, but am currently doing research here over the summer, and my PI still told me I should apply)

DO:
ACOM
KCOM
CCOM
DMU
KCUMB
MSU
OSU
RVU

I think these are a bit more realistic, but if anyone has any insights or naysays against any of these schools, I thought SDN would be the best place to find out. Thanks again for everyone's help!

We can all appreciate the passion to get into medical school and start learning this stuff ASAP. However, you have to be more prudent than your posts reflect. I feel as though you are translating "zero chance at MD" in your head to "really tough, but you can do it!", when in reality, these posters have meant "absolutely no chance at all". And again, DO is nearly as bleak a prospect for you. Please, for the sake of your expenses (which you've already expressed concern about), take a look at normal applicant/matriculant statistics, and how much money it costs to apply to medical schools. Your MCAT is way, way too low to be salvaged even with a 4.0, let alone a 3.5x.

Could you tell us more about your experience with the test? In the run-up to the first exam, how much did you study, how many practice tests did you take, and how did you perform on them? On test day, how did you feel you were performing, and did you hit any out-of-the-ordinary roadblocks like an upset stomach?

I would like you to also talk more about your battle plan for the MCAT retake. Unless I missed something, your plan is a total of 2 months of study, with some distractions. If you're looking to break 30 (and with <3.6 you are absolutely desperate to break 30, at the very least, for MD), that is a 7 point improvement in 2 months, which is very ambitious. In fact, depending on the nature of your difficulties with the test, it may be impossible. Also understand that each attempt at the MCAT will be visible to medical schools, unless you void it at the end of the test day. Some schools will only care about the most recent attempt, while others will even mix-and-match subsections to give you the most favorable score, but the majority of them will be paying attention to your ENTIRE test history. You do NOT want to take the MCAT until you are good and ready (consistently scoring 32+ on practice exams), because you CANNOT afford a second offical low score.

Also keep in mind that even if you submitted your primary TODAY, you are still behind several hundred applicants. The most universal piece of advice we give students, especially underdogs like you, is to submit early, so that you're one of the first ones they look at. If your application is held up til August by an MCAT retake, you will forfeit that crucial advantage, and if you submit today with the 23, your chances don't matter either way. Finally, also understand that reapplicants are stigmatized to some extent versus first-timers, and are implicitly held to higher standards. If you apply and fail to get in, a second attempt is going to be made even harder than the first.

Really, this is extremely straightforward from our objective perspective - you need to take another year. This year, you should be trying to improve your GPA, and especially study hard for an MCAT retake in January. Continue to work on your ECs when you can, especially volunteering, but you're already on a decent trajectory with that - you just have to maintain it. Finally, once you've brought up that MCAT with a prudent strategy, and ideally beefed up your GPA and ECs as well, you have a fighting chance, made better by submitting the day the primary opens next cycle.

You are obviously extremely impatient to get into school, but you REALLY need to hear us out when we tell you you need to slow down. You are not ready yet, and applying now will just waste hundreds if not thousands of dollars.

 

[basketcase0a0]

Adding in the average MCAT and gpa to make a point

I reworked my lists quite a bit.
MD:
Rush (31.3/3.7)
George Washington (30.6/3.69)
Albany (31.9/3.6)
Drexel (30.3/3.58)
Wayne State (29.9/3.66)*
Marshall University (29.1/3.5) *
Meharry (HBCU, 25/3.4)
Toledo (30.4/ 3.7)*
Mayo (33/3.8)
Iowa (Dream School) (32/3.77)
Baylor (wasn't planning on applying, but am currently doing research here over the summer, and my PI still told me I should apply) (33/ 3.81)


I think these are a bit more realistic, but if anyone has any insights or naysays against any of these schools, I thought SDN would be the best place to find out. Thanks again for everyone's help!

I bolded the word "realistic" because you are not being realistic. Even with an increase of 5 points on your mcat (no small feat) you are looking at below average in both categories with below average EC's for all except Meharry, which is a Historically Black college and therefore will be way more picky with you as a white applicant than if you fit their mission statement. Additionally I put asterisks by schools that are heavily in-state biased towards a state you don't live in. Further, schools like Drexel, GW, and Albany all get a lot (like 7000 for Albany, and 13000 for Drexel and GW) of applications because many pre-meds view them as a safety, meaning even getting an interview at one of these schools is a crapshoot to say the least.

I did nothing with the DO schools because I know nothing about DO schools.

tl;dr: You need to calm down, retake your MCAT, beef up your EC's, and then apply very very strategically. You can get an MD acceptance somewhere in the future, but it won't be this cycle.

 

[CSqueed]

The only thing the MDs will like about you is your Secondary Fee, solemnly because of your MCAT score.

The DOs on the other hand will give you some love. Most likely ACOM, the other DOs youre applying to are too high for your MCAT.

I would suggest ACOM, KYCOM, Liberty, ATSU (both campuses), and Marian.

 

[DK2014]

No chance anywhere with a 23 mcat.

 

[CSqueed]

No chance anywhere with a 23 mcat.

Not true. The list I provided will give him love.

 

[InthatHickTown]

Wow. Thank you everyone, especially Pattycake25 for putting that into perspective. I think I was wistfully hoping for a better MCAT score, and while I was thinking about doing a gap year, my pre-med friends kept trying to get me to apply this cycle...It probably doesn't help that I am trying to get this figured out with a 101 temp.

So my next question is what exactly is my timeline with a gap year? I continue to go through my summer of ECs, try to do as many things as possible my senior year, study my butt off for the new MCAT, take it when I am ready, get a much improved score, and then apply at the end of my senior year, while getting A's in all of my classes? And do a scribe job, or something awesome during my gap year?

Or do I wait until two cycles, when I have the experience of the gap year as well?

Sorry, this is all a bit confusing for me, but something I clearly need to do, as you have all pointed out thankfully.

This is the sad time where I realize being superly involved in undergrad has been a bit of a downfall in regards to ECs 🙁

I have been looking towards an MD/MPH program, so perhaps that is something I could pursue during a gap year as well.

 

[candbgirl]

You are missing the BIG point. You ECs are okay- not great but okay as are your GPAs. It is your MCAT that is lethal.
Go rest, get better and come back when you are well and thinking clearly. Don't listen to your friends who are encouraging you to apply.
A GAP year(s) is a year between when you graduate and when you start school. I don't think anyone here can tell you how many GAP years to take. You should only apply when you are ready, when you have all your ducks in a row, when you have the BEST application package possible. You really don't want to apply again.
Feel better soon.

Sent from my KFOT using Tapatalk 2

 

[InthatHickTown]

Sorry, I do understand what everyone is saying about the MCAT, I guess I am just not expressing it. I will definitely take the time to study, and set tentatively for January of next year, or sooner if I feel I am ready. I don't believe I have the ability/time to make drastic improvements on my MCAT in a month, so the main goal of a gap year is to prepare for the MCAT, but in the meantime, I don't see how a little extra ECs would hurt. 🙂 I apologize for not putting emphasis on the MCAT, but I do understand what everyone is saying! Finally!

 

[el_duderino]

Your weaknesses are:
MCAT. This is the absolute killer.
Shadowing. You have no shadowing, so you don't have a good idea how physicians spend their time all day.
Clinical. You have no experience with patients.

Your next year+ should be centered around fixing these issues, especially the MCAT. Studying effectively for the MCAT while full-time in school can be difficult. But if you can devote the entire summer to intense MCAT studying you can bring that 23 up to a 28-32. You already have a 9 in verbal, which suggests to me that your 7's in the sciences indicates lack of content knowledge as opposed to simple poor test-taking ability.

Your strengths are:
Leadership.
Non-clinical volunteering.
Awards/honors.

So here's the timeline to fix what ails you:

Summer 2014:
Spend the entire summer studying for the MCAT. 6-8 hours a day. I think the SN2ED plan is probably a good one. Take it late in August before your fall semester starts.
Do your children's hospital volunteering.
Do your 20 hours of shadowing.

Fall 2014:
Get a bunch of A's.
Continue volunteering.
Shadow the DO you talked about, and consider finding another physician to shadow as well in a different specialty.

Spring 2015:
Get a bunch of A's.
Continue volunteering.
More shadowing.

June 2015:
Submit AMCAS and AACOMAS with a ~3.65 GPA and 30 MCAT, along with your killer leadership, 50 hours of shadowing, 150 hours of clinical experience, 300 hours non-clinical volunteering.

July, August, and September 2015:
Travel to interviews, because you will have them.
Spend the gap year working in a research lab or clinic.

August 2016:
Start MS1.