fMRI and Neuropsychology

[HeftyLefty]

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Hello All,

I'm a second year clinical psych student with a neuropsych focus and my institution recently got their new scanner up and running. I have a great opportunity to learn about imaging and my research interests/future dissertation projects would greatly benefit from imaging data. It is a huge commitment time wise to learn.

I was wondering if any neuropsychologists here had imaging training and if it was useful for them down the line. In the long run I would like to focus more on research and be at an AMA for my post-doc. Thanks for any input!

 

[NeuroWise]

Hello All,

I'm a second year clinical psych student with a neuropsych focus and my institution recently got their new scanner up and running. I have a great opportunity to learn about imaging and my research interests/future dissertation projects would greatly benefit from imaging data. It is a huge commitment time wise to learn.

I was wondering if any neuropsychologists here had imaging training and if it was useful for them down the line. In the long run I would like to focus more on research and be at an AMA for my post-doc. Thanks for any input!

While I am not finished with my training (4th year student), I can tell you what I think in response to your post. Like you, I'm a neuropsychology-focused grad and my research is primarily in fMRI. Also like you said, it is a huge time commitment to learn. There are ways to mitigate the steep learning curve (e.g., use SPM instead of AFNI in fMRI) but imaging certainly takes longer than other techniques. My own experience has been that a fMRI manuscript takes approximately twice as long as a non-imaging manuscript from start to publication. But there is no denying that imaging is a super hot area and those with the skills to do analyses independently will have excellent job prospects. Even on the clinical training side neuroimaging has helped me. Most of my patients at my practicum sites have imaging and these data are considered in the assessment and diagnosis process. Being able to navigate through the medical MRI has been very helpful.

 

[PsyDr]

From a research perspective it is highly desirable due to NIH's multidisciplinary grant structure. Publishing is sometimes complicated by some reputable journals requiring fees to publish images.

From a clinical perspective, it is significantly limited. CMS, and therefore almost all commercial insurances, will not accept a psychologist's order for imaging. CMS does reimburse psychologist for behavioral testing during fMRI. IME, fMRI is limited to presurgical language mapping for things like 2/3rds resection for epilepsy or temporal tumors.

Both Columbia and Harvard have fMRI training programs. The former is more clinically oriented while the latter is more technically oriented, IME.

 

[szymk1sm]

Hello All,

I'm a second year clinical psych student with a neuropsych focus and my institution recently got their new scanner up and running. I have a great opportunity to learn about imaging and my research interests/future dissertation projects would greatly benefit from imaging data. It is a huge commitment time wise to learn.

I was wondering if any neuropsychologists here had imaging training and if it was useful for them down the line. In the long run I would like to focus more on research and be at an AMA for my post-doc. Thanks for any input!

I'm a neuro graduate student who is using fMRI in my dissertation. I'm a 5th year and probably my 2nd or 3rd year is when I really started learning the technique. I feel like I'm nowhere near being an expert and often question whether I want to use this particular tool in my research going forward.

Please make sure you have an expert neuroimager that is training you, especially with fMRI. It's super easy to put stuff into the program and have it spit out pretty blobs that we then interpret as meaningful. Really understanding your paradigm, regressors of interest, and analyses you'd like to do are paramount to getting "clean" results.

I think the most useful thing that I've gotten out of doing fMRI is that I feel more competent reading fMRI literature and can now better identify bad fMRI research.

Not sure if that helps or even answers your question 🙂 .

 

[WisNeuro]

I came up through an imaging lab. I'd say it helped quite a bit with my neuroanatomy knowledge. I don't currently engage in any imaging research, but I can navigate through MRI sequences like a beast. Also, as szysmsmndkjkj noted, it has helped in being able to see just how much bad imaging research is actually out there.

 

[szymk1sm]

I came up through an imaging lab. I'd say it helped quite a bit with my neuroanatomy knowledge. I don't currently engage in any imaging research, but I can navigate through MRI sequences like a beast. Also, as szysmsmndkjkj noted, it has helped in being able to see just how much bad imaging research is actually out there.

Hahah -- my screenname isn't even my whole last name. I often get "szymsmndkjkj" and other alphabet soups 🙂

 

[WisNeuro]

I used to work in a hospital with a substantial polish population. Going out to find my patients in a busy waiting room made me feel dyslexic.

 

[Kadhir]

Imaging is a great tool for research neuropsychologists, and if there is interest, I would absolutely encourage you to get the experience. But don't expect to be a methodologist (not that you can't be- but it isn't our training). In addition to what others have mentioned, it is helpful to work in a team and have access to physicists and MRI techs who can help you carry out sound investigations. Much of the "bad" in neuroimaging happens even before the study design and analysis levels. It's the data acquisition and preprocessing that still, painfully, often has no gold standard (and many will argue it can't, because it should change for every study!). Interdisciplinary input is critical.

 

[psych.meout]

What about the reverse? Does not having imaging experience in clinical work and/or research make students less competitive for neuropsych compared to those that do have these experiences?

Is neuropsych-related research and clinical experience (e.g. assessment hours) sufficient to make one competitive without imaging?

E.g. If I'm interested in research into the intersection of health psychology and biopsychosocial issues with neuropsych from a more traditional assessment and cognitive functioning paradigm, would that put me at a disadvantage compared to students with backgrounds in imaging?

 

[Kadhir]

What about the reverse? Does not having imaging experience in clinical work and/or research make students less competitive for neuropsych compared to those that do have these experiences?

Is neuropsych-related research and clinical experience (e.g. assessment hours) sufficient to make one competitive without imaging?

E.g. If I'm interested in research into the intersection of health psychology and biopsychosocial issues with neuropsych from a more traditional assessment and cognitive functioning paradigm, would that put me at a disadvantage compared to students with backgrounds in imaging?

Depends. Are you applying to an imaging position? Then yes. Otherwise, probably not. Sure, imaging is sexy, but if it doesn't answer your questions as well as something else, then you shouldn't feel compelled to go out of your way to do it. Quality sites should be able to know a good researcher when they see one and recognize the value of someone's work (provided the individual markets it well). If they're indiscriminately enticed by blobs, you probably don't want to go there. As someone who started off in imaging and is now swinging more towards cognitive experimental research, there is so much richness in the latter that I wish I had been exposed to previously.