For IMGs: Tell me how to RECOGNIZE a pre match offer!!!!

[res-2007]

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1. If the PD is the first to mention the mystical magical P word, does that automatically mean they are offering?

2. What would be the most appropriate response?

One PD said "you know we give 3 or 4 prematches per year"
Another said "How would you feel about a pre match"? This one is at a program that does not have a single IMG.

3. Are those prematch offers or was I supposed to say something to get them to make an offer.

4. How should I proceed with those 2 PDs?

Help. I really want a pre match. I don't want to chance going to match day.

 

[Adam_K]

1. If the PD is the first to mention the mystical magical P word, does that automatically mean they are offering?

2. What would be the most appropriate response?

One PD said "you know we give 3 or 4 prematches per year"
Another said "How would you feel about a pre match"? This one is at a program that does not have a single IMG.

3. Are those prematch offers or was I supposed to say something to get them to make an offer.

4. How should I proceed with those 2 PDs?

Help. I really want a pre match. I don't want to chance going to match day.

Congrats.

Neither are formal prematch offers, but the PDs were trying to gauge your interest. Something along the lines of: "Yes, I might be interested" would probably have moved the conversation along.

If you still are, get in touch with the PD. Say something like: "During my interview, you mentioned the possibility of a prematch. If that's still an option, I would be interested."

Oh, and don't forget: Be sure to get the contract in writing from someone authorized to offer it. Otherwise, it is meaningless. And once it is signed, formally withdraw from ERAS, the match and contact the residency coordinators at places you've been invited to interview to let them know that you have accepted a position elsewhere.

 

[GatorMedMan]

I've seen two "prematch" threads on this forum, both regarding IMG's. Can U.S. MD's prematch? If not, why not? Thanks in advance for any replies.

 

[Adam_K]

I've seen two "prematch" threads on this forum, both regarding IMG's. Can U.S. MD's prematch? If not, why not? Thanks in advance for any replies.

Not if you are a current US senior allopathic student going for a PGY1 position. You are bound by the match agreement.

http://www.nrmp.org/res_match/faq/us_seniors_faq.html#16


I'm a US senior in an allopathic medical school and I've been offered a position outside the Match. What should I do?

If any of a teaching hospital's graduate medical education programs participates in the NRMP's Main Match, all of the hospital's programs may accept US seniors in allopathic medical schools only through the NRMP or another national matching plan. Offering a contract outside the Match is a violation of the Match Participation Agreement. US allopathic seniors who obtain PGY-2 positions through another national matching plan must obtain their PGY-1 preliminary positions through the NRMP's Main Match.

 

[Braingames]

Why would any decent program offer a pre-match slot to an IMG? I mean wouldnt only the really poor programs do that in fear that no decent cadidates, or no candidates for that matter here in the US, or even the better quality IMGs will rank them?

What other point would there be-seems a bit silly. WHy not offer pre match slots to american grads who are highly sought after or something?

 

[res-2007]

Why would any decent program offer a pre-match slot to an IMG? I mean wouldnt only the really poor programs do that in fear that no decent cadidates, or no candidates for that matter here in the US, or even the better quality IMGs will rank them?

What other point would there be-seems a bit silly. WHy not offer pre match slots to american grads who are highly sought after or something?

Your name maybe "Braingames" but you obviously lack brains. Change your name to "Brainless".

Why would they offer: because they can do whatever they want, idiot.

Why not offer AMGs: because it's FORBIDDEN.

 

[Braingames]

Huh? I was simply asking what is the benefit to a school-maybe you do not understand simple laws of economics which apply here-simple supply and demand, competition and increasing quality and decreasing prices etc-Why would programs not take the best bunch of applicants possible and in all honesty the only way to do that is by interviewing every single person and then ranking them. The more compeittion, the better quality of applicants they end up with-and that is only done by ranking. I was seriously asking-what is one benefit to offering someone a pre-match slot-AMG or IMG?

I think it is well excepted that nobody chooses an IMG over an AMG especially with all things held equally-so I just am not understand the beneft to a school unless they struggle to get people to go there-Why are you so angry-why not just list some benefts and help us understand. Think of it as your business that you own-and you are looking for 3 employees. You offer 50 interviews-now if you are a reputable company with good pay and benefits than you will attract quality applicants and your best interest is to interview them all and take the top 3-now contrast that to you being a top quality company and instead of taking the top 3-offering 2/3 spots to the less qualified applicants in fear that none of the applicants will actually accept the position-does that make sense? No it does not. However if your company is up and coming, cannot offer compeetitive pay or benefits then you are much more likely to offer spots to almost anyone who agrees to come and work for you.

Now if I am way off base than call me an idiot-but if that makes sense than just tell me why psych programs do it-maybe I am wrong. I want to be wrong. But if you can name one reputable place that offers these pre-match spots than Ill give 500 bucks of my own money to anyone who can tell me one-who can pass that up!

 

[res-2007]

Now if I am way off base than call me an idiot-but if that makes sense than just tell me why psych programs do it-maybe I am wrong. I want to be wrong. But if you can name one reputable place that offers these pre-match spots than Ill give 500 bucks of my own money to anyone who can tell me one-who can pass that up!

I'll tell you after I sign my contract.

Good night Tin Man.

 

[soulsearchin]

Now if I am way off base than call me an idiot-but if that makes sense than just tell me why psych programs do it-maybe I am wrong. I want to be wrong. But if you can name one reputable place that offers these pre-match spots than Ill give 500 bucks of my own money to anyone who can tell me one-who can pass that up!

well i dont know of psych programs but i know of at least 2 very highly reputed Im programs which offered prematch to FMGs last year.university programs and good ones,but then those FMGs were really exceptional too.
howeveri think that both reasons are correct when u look at why the prematch was offered to so and so IMG n not AMG.programs cannot offer prematches to AMGs or most AMGs would be offered prematches.as for the IMGs most of the prematches are offered by community programs who if dont offer prematches may get a spot or two unmatched .these are the programs that most AMgs dont even apply to.
and yes one more thing...the FMGs that ive seen who got prematch offers and rejected them n decided to go into the match got better match spots at better places than the ones who accepted prematches in general.
so most IMGs who just wana match somewhere take a prematch accept it while the ones who want to get a good training institution go into the match.but recently,especially this year the IMGs are having a really tough time.ppl with scores of 240 plus i n both steps have got lessthan 10 intviews on the average(i may be wrong about it)....so the prematch seems a very realistic option for them.

 

[prominence]

1. If the PD is the first to mention the mystical magical P word, does that automatically mean they are offering?

2. What would be the most appropriate response?

One PD said "you know we give 3 or 4 prematches per year"
Another said "How would you feel about a pre match"? This one is at a program that does not have a single IMG.

3. Are those prematch offers or was I supposed to say something to get them to make an offer.

4. How should I proceed with those 2 PDs?

Help. I really want a pre match. I don't want to chance going to match day.

dude, what a *****ic post. if you can't figure out whether or not to say "yes" or "no" when a pre-match is offered to u, then you are a ******.

 

[Solideliquid]

dude, what a *****ic post. if you can't figure out whether or not to say "yes" or "no" when a pre-match is offered to u, then you are a ******.

niiiiiice.

 

[res-2007]

dude, what a *****ic post. if you can't figure out whether or not to say "yes" or "no" when a pre-match is offered to u, then you are a ******.

Maybe you are the ****** since you don't understand the question.

But I already have my answer from some of the more knowledgeable and intelligent members.

So, don't injure yourself!

 

[i61164]

niiiiiice.

Res-2007 is the one that started the name calling on this thread.

 

[Psychintern2006]

Res-2007 is the one that started the name calling on this thread.

Be very upfront and direct as it is not a very uncommon policy, keep it towards the end of the interview with the PD ( also residents will have an idea). I remember Kansas City asking me this question- reason was they had ranked people who had signed prematch somewhere else. They did not give any prematches though!
But I will not assume anything unless I have it in written in front of me as program directors make you feel you are the best and only one. Yale (neurology) program wrote to me, hand signed by chairman that they are very interested -a few days before the rank order submit date. And they had one spot unmatched! Be careful and all the best!

 

[res-2007]

Res-2007 is the one that started the name calling on this thread.

No I did not start the insults.
Read the insulting post by Brainless, I mean Braingames! I've quoted some excerpts below.

Do you think because I'm IMG, I'm a free target.
Think again.

.........contrast that to you being a top quality company and instead of taking the top 3-offering 2/3 spots to the less qualified applicants in fear that none of the applicants will actually accept the position-does that make sense? No it does not. However if your company is up and coming, cannot offer compeetitive pay or benefits then you are much more likely to offer spots to almost anyone who agrees to come and work for you.

Now if I am way off base than call me an idiot-but if that makes sense than just tell me why psych programs do it-maybe I am wrong. I want to be wrong. But if you can name one reputable place that offers these pre-match spots than Ill give 500 bucks of my own money to anyone who can tell me one-who can pass that up!

Why would any decent program offer a pre-match slot to an IMG? I mean wouldnt only the really poor programs do that in fear that no decent cadidates, or no candidates for that matter here in the US, or even the better quality IMGs will rank them?

What other point would there be-seems a bit silly. WHy not offer pre match slots to american grads who are highly sought after or something?

I didn't go to med school here, you brainless fool, but I'm as qualified as you.
I passed the USMLE just like AMGs have to.
AMGs take USMLE over their 4 year school period.
This IMG took Step 1, 2CK and 2 CS over a THREE month period and passed all of them FIRST TIME with scores that merit my invitations.
Did you just have the nerve to talk about LESS QUALIFIED???

 

[Anasazi23]

Easy fellas...
Let's all try and be mature.

 

[Braingames]

I really dont see how anything I said was insulting-it was more a case of you being ultra-sensitive. I was asking in terms of what is BEST for a program-and to me it did not add up that taking prematch IMG's was in the best interest of any program since it is the general concensus that IMG's are less desirable than AMG's and passing your steps is one thing and to be honest it is actually easier to take all of them in a row since they basically cover the same material so it is easier than studying for it all over again.But passing is one thing-there is a huge variablity in what a score means-high v. low.

Why do you think it is harder to get into american schools-and easier to go IMG-now maybe you are qualitfied and you are the exception but in general if you generalize about IMG's-you cannot say they are usually as qualified as amg's-some schools dont even require an MCAT, have no standards etc-so unless you specified what school you attended than its hard to rank you-anyway in my eyes, a good program would take the best cadidate possible and giving a slot to an IMG unless super exceptional would not be the way to do that.

 

[i61164]

No I did not start the insults.

Ummm, yeah. You started with the personal insults. Braingames merely asked why a program would want to prematch an IMG (which is a reasonable question since the match is designed to benefit both applicants and programs). The rest of what you quoted was said after you verbally insulted him/her. Based on your original post you are worried about not matching and so the treatment of IMG's in the match process is understandably a sensitive topic with you...

 

[res-2007]

You are without doubt the dumbest, most narrow minded individual on this forum.

some schools dont even require an MCAT

Since MCAT applies to schools on one continent (American & Canadian schools) and IMGs can graduate from schools on all 6 continents, and schools on the other 5 continents do not use MCAT then "some schools do not require MCAT".

-so unless you specified what school you attended than its hard to rank you-

You rank me?
The programs I applied to have already judged and ranked me as worthy/meriting of interviews thank you.
Don't need you.

So Long
Good Bye
Have a miserable life.

 

[Solideliquid]

In before the lock!

 

[OBfan]

Huh? I was simply asking what is the benefit to a school-maybe you do not understand simple laws of economics which apply here-simple supply and demand, competition and increasing quality and decreasing prices etc-Why would programs not take the best bunch of applicants possible and in all honesty the only way to do that is by interviewing every single person and then ranking them. The more compeittion, the better quality of applicants they end up with-and that is only done by ranking. I was seriously asking-what is one benefit to offering someone a pre-match slot-AMG or IMG?

I think it is well excepted that nobody chooses an IMG over an AMG especially with all things held equally-so I just am not understand the beneft to a school unless they struggle to get people to go there-Why are you so angry-why not just list some benefts and help us understand. Think of it as your business that you own-and you are looking for 3 employees. You offer 50 interviews-now if you are a reputable company with good pay and benefits than you will attract quality applicants and your best interest is to interview them all and take the top 3-now contrast that to you being a top quality company and instead of taking the top 3-offering 2/3 spots to the less qualified applicants in fear that none of the applicants will actually accept the position-does that make sense? No it does not. However if your company is up and coming, cannot offer compeetitive pay or benefits then you are much more likely to offer spots to almost anyone who agrees to come and work for you.

Now if I am way off base than call me an idiot-but if that makes sense than just tell me why psych programs do it-maybe I am wrong. I want to be wrong. But if you can name one reputable place that offers these pre-match spots than Ill give 500 bucks of my own money to anyone who can tell me one-who can pass that up!

Just another one of those post that claim AMG's are better than IMG's. If you read through this post you'll see that its just a lot of fluff and hot air. Please post something that is of benefit to others.

 

[Braingames]

If you are such a good applicant than why did you not go to an american school and chose to travel way far away to go to a school that you know that would make it harder to come back to the US?? Let me guess you wanted to and you could have gotten in here-so why would you equate yourself as being as good as an AMG-maybe you are specifically-there are exceptions to every rule but in geneal-speaking of US students who go to International schools-obviously I am not talk about people born in those foreign countries and go to school there-then of course they are no worse than us-I am speaking about american kids who dont get in here and go overseas-and then expect that they are equal-well if you were equal or better buddy boy you would have gotten in here-

HOnestly without arguing-give me one reason how an american IMG is supposed to be considered as good as an AMG? if they are-why did they not go to an american school? if you can answer that I will believe you

 

[Braingames]

If you are such a good applicant than why did you not go to an american school and chose to travel way far away to go to a school that you know that would make it harder to come back to the US?? Let me guess you wanted to and you could have gotten in here-so why would you equate yourself as being as good as an AMG-maybe you are specifically-there are exceptions to every rule but in geneal-speaking of US students who go to International schools-obviously I am not talk about people born in those foreign countries and go to school there-then of course they are no worse than us-I am speaking about american kids who dont get in here and go overseas-and then expect that they are equal-well if you were equal or better buddy boy you would have gotten in here-

HOnestly without arguing-give me one reason how an american IMG is supposed to be considered as good as an AMG? if they are-why did they not go to an american school? if you can answer that I will believe you

 

[Braingames]

If you are such a good applicant than why did you not go to an american school and chose to travel way far away to go to a school that you know that would make it harder to come back to the US?? Let me guess you wanted to and you could have gotten in here-so why would you equate yourself as being as good as an AMG-maybe you are specifically-there are exceptions to every rule but in geneal-speaking of US students who go to International schools-obviously I am not talk about people born in those foreign countries and go to school there-then of course they are no worse than us-I am speaking about american kids who dont get in here and go overseas-and then expect that they are equal-well if you were equal or better buddy boy you would have gotten in here-

HOnestly without arguing-give me one reason how an american IMG is supposed to be considered as good as an AMG? if they are-why did they not go to an american school? if you can answer that I will believe you

 

[DebDynamite]

AMGs take USMLE over their 4 year school period.

Disclaimer: It's an accomplishment to pass USMLE for sure, regardless of where one goes to school......

Shame on me for even posting in a thread that has come to this. But, I want to state that for the record, the majority of AMG's take step I & II within about 14 months of each other, everyone knows this. Our last year we surf and sharpen skills. As for step 2 CK....uuuhhhggg. I don't even know anyone who truly studies to pass this at my school.

Anyway, I was recently told by a visiting student that in fact an AMG can match outside of NRMP, but if they choose to do so they forefit NRMP for life- including fellowships. Don't know the veracity of this statement.

If I were an IMG/FMG I would state that I am open to prematching, how could it hurt?