Foreign docs getting board-certified jobs

[trkd]

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So I have a question about a friend who is doing his EM residency in Australia (American whose wife is an Aussie, he went to an Aussie med school). He wants to eventually work in the US as an EM doc. He mentioned how he could not get board certification by ABEM without doing a US residency. Does that mean he can't get a job and can only work EM jobs rurally where FP and IM folks run the ED? Anyone know about this?

I find this silly because, due to the British system, he will have done about 7 years postgrad (after doing 4 years of college and 4 years of med school) and will probably be much more qualified than someone straight out of 3/4 years EM training here in the US.

 

[Apollyon]

The only way around it (as I know) is to be sponsored by a university and work in their program (my n=1 is for a guy from Nigeria that trained in the UK that did anesthesia at Duke - as long as he worked at Duke hospitals, he didn't need more training; had he wanted to moonlight elsewhere, he would have been out of luck).

 

[southerndoc]

I think he has to either do a US residency or petition ABEM stating that his training was equivalent.

 

[trkd]

I think he has to either do a US residency or petition ABEM stating that his training was equivalent.

Petitioning... sounds scary. Based on what both of you are saying, doesn't sound good. That's too bad. About the sponsoring part you mentioned Apollyon, I am curious to know how often that is done. I don't expect you to know the answer, just thinking out loud. I suppose it would be more likely for a old-school EM doc of 20 yrs to be sponsored rather than my friend.

Thanks.

 

[Apollyon]

Petitioning... sounds scary. Based on what both of you are saying, doesn't sound good. That's too bad. About the sponsoring part you mentioned Apollyon, I am curious to know how often that is done. I don't expect you to know the answer, just thinking out loud. I suppose it would be more likely for a old-school EM doc of 20 yrs to be sponsored rather than my friend.

Thanks.

This guy was a young dude (comparatively) - he certainly wasn't a "lifer" in the UK.

The worst that can happen is that it can't happen - I don't know where to start, but "medical staff services" or "credentialing" at a hospital I think is the best place.

 

[BKN]

So I have a question about a friend who is doing his EM residency in Australia (American whose wife is an Aussie, he went to an Aussie med school). He wants to eventually work in the US as an EM doc. He mentioned how he could not get board certification by ABEM without doing a US residency. Does that mean he can't get a job and can only work EM jobs rurally where FP and IM folks run the ED? Anyone know about this?

I find this silly because, due to the British system, he will have done about 7 years postgrad (after doing 4 years of college and 4 years of med school) and will probably be much more qualified than someone straight out of 3/4 years EM training here in the US.

Turk,

In the US, board certification is not required for licensure. Rather a certain number of years of ACGME accredited training are required. The amount varies by state and by US vs foreign training. For example in Texas right now (I think) you must pass the mles and have 1 year of training if US grad or 3 years of training if IMG. There also is a pathway for asst professor or higher to be have restricted licenses for 1 year renewable for practice only in academic settings.

Once licensed, the hospitals may require board elgibility or certification for staff privileges. As of now, since there is still a shortage of EM trained folks, only the most desirable hospitals can get away with this.

I understand why you feel this is all pretty strange, but note that many countries will not give american docs licensure without training in their system as well.

 

[Apollyon]

There also is a pathway for asst professor or higher to be have restricted licenses for 1 year renewable for practice only in academic settings.

That's what I was referring to, although BKN's post has more information.

 

[Roadie9]

Does that mean he can't get a job and can only work EM jobs rurally where FP and IM folks run the ED? Anyone know about this?

Honestly, it probably means that he can't work in the US period. Why would he be able to work as an FP if not as an EP?

My N is also one. This is a European trained orthopedic surgeon who just walked into a job without any US training. So it's possible; but think of the thousands of IMGs who come in every year with loads of training. They almost invariably have to repeat their training.

Your friend could probably get into a really strong residency program, though.

 

[BKN]

Your friend could probably get into a really strong residency program, though.

Maybe, I can tell you that there are tons of very well-trained Docs coming from every specialty, from 1st and 2nd world countries who would love to train in the US in EM. PDs could use up a very significant fraction of the EM training slots if we wanted to.

How's that for raising applicant paranoia?😱


But we probably won't.

Oh, and if I were trained in EM in a british style program (UK, Australia, New Zealand) and wanted to do US non-academic EM, I would:

1.Try for an US EM program and if unsuccessful;
2. Try for an obtainable useful US program such as IM, FM, Surgery prelim etc; meet the licensure requirements for the states I was interested in, then find a place to practice EM.

 

[trkd]

All very interesting. BKN, as for Aus, you are correct. US grads can't just set up shop. There is a huge process to go that way as well.

Thanks for the thoughts folks.