foul language = lost of credibility

[rapshi]

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I'm very turned off by doctors/meds who cuss a lot. Does anyone feel the same one.

I agree. Not professional.

 

[Dr. Josh]

Id rather hear **** as a patient then "OOPS" (esp in the OR).....

But I'd rather be asleep and not hear either.

 

[tigress]

just wondering if those of you who are very turned off by cursing lost enough respect for Dick Cheney after he dropped the f-bomb on the Senate Floor to stop voting Republican? um, somehow I didn't think so.. bet lots of people burned their collection of U2 albums after Bono let one slip on TV.. 🙄

um...I'm turned off by cursing and I'm about as strong a Democrat as you'll find, and extremely politically liberal. I'm not sure why you would equate a dislike for cursing with being a Republican, but you really ought to re-evaluate this assumption.

(btw, I love Bono. I think he's a great guy, maybe even in line for the Nobel Peace Prize someday. That doesn't mean I appreciate hearing him curse.)

 

[shahalam]

get over it people. the doctors you see are more probably more stressed than you are so give them a break. I totally agree that swearing is a good, fast, and effective method to let off some steam.

 

[SitraAchra]

I love occasionally weaving a vulgar tapestry - I think that one can express themselves very well and also use curses at opportune moments. It's quite cathartic when you're in a stressful situation to just let fly a "$HIT, I JUST MISSED THE EXIT" or something.

 

[NPursuit]

I would be very surprised if someone here could give me a GOOD reason for using vulgar language.

I think cursing has its utility when you're one of those people who never cusses. When your language is usually articulate, precise, and thoughtful. The moment someone like this drops an F-bomb, the room goes quiet, and everyone listens.

I think the Cheney example was perfect. A man who usually appears so collected, calculatng, and calm. A man of authority. You don't expect him to drop the f-bomb. But there was Leahy, running a circus with the tired old Halliburton-is-evil crowd, trying to impugn his integrity and suggest that he was a traitor and a sell-out, and Cheney ripped him a new one.

Here's a great piece on cursing properly 😉 :

http://www.benadorassociates.com/article/5602

IN DEFENSE OF THE F-WORD
by Charles Krauthammer
Washington Post
July 2, 2004
I am sure there is a special place in heaven reserved for those who have never used the F-word. I will never get near that place. Nor, apparently, will Dick Cheney.

Washington is abuzz with the latest political contretemps. Cheney, taking offense at Sen. Pat Leahy's imputation of improper vice presidential conduct regarding Halliburton contracts in Iraq, let the senator know as much during a picture-taking ceremony on the floor of the Senate. The F-word was used. Washington is scandalized.

The newspapers were full of it. Lamentations were heard about the decline of civility. The Post gave special gravitas to the occasion, spelling out the full four letters (something that it had done only three times previously). Democrats, feeling darned outraged, demanded apologies. The vice president remained defiant, offering but the coyest concession -- that he "probably" cursed -- coupled with satisfaction: "I expressed myself rather forcefully, felt better after I had done it."

The Federal Communications Commission just last year decreed that the F-word could be used as an adjective, but not as a verb. Alas, this Solomonic verdict, fodder for a dozen PhD dissertations, was recently overturned. It would not get Cheney off the hook anyway. By all accounts, he deployed the pungent verb form, in effect a suggestion as to how the good senator from Vermont might amuse himself.

Flood-the-zone coverage by investigative reporters has not, however, quite resolved the issue of which of the two preferred forms passed Cheney's lips: the priceless two-worder -- "[verb] you" -- or the more expansive three-worder, a directive that begins with "go."

Though I myself am partial to the longer version, I admit that each formulation has its virtues. The deuce is the preferred usage when time is short and concision is of the essence. Enjoying the benefits of economy, it is especially useful in emergencies. This is why it is a favorite of major league managers going nose to nose with umpires. They know that they have only a few seconds before getting tossed out of the game, and as a result television viewers have for years delighted in the moment the two-worder is hurled, right on camera. No need for sound. The deuce was made for lip reading.

Which makes it excellent for drive-by information conveyance. When some jerk tailgater rides my bumper in heavy traffic, honking his horn before passing and cutting me off, I do a turn-to-the-left, eyeball-to-eyeball, through-the-driver's-window two-worder -- mouthed slowly and with exaggerated lip movements. No interlocutor has yet missed my meaning.

Nonetheless, while the two-worder has the directness of the dagger, the three-worder has the elegance of the wide-arced saber slice. It is more musical and, being more clearly spelled out, more comprehensible to the non-English speaker (a boon in major urban areas). It consists of a straightforward directive containing both a subject and an object -- charmingly, the same person.

According to The Post, the local authority on such matters, Cheney went for a variant of the short form, employing the more formal "yourself." And given the location, the floor of the Senate, it seems a reasonable choice: Time was short, and he undoubtedly reserves the right to revise and extend his remarks.

Ah, but the earnest chin-pullers are not amused. Cheney's demonstration of earthy authenticity in a chamber in which authenticity of any kind is to be valued has occasioned anguished meditations on the loss of civility in American politics. Liberals in particular have expressed deep concern about this breach of decorum.

Odd. The day before first reports of Cheney's alleged indiscretion, his Democratic predecessor, Al Gore, delivered a public speech in which he spoke of the administration's establishing a "Bush gulag" around the world and using "digital brown shirts" to intimidate the media. The former vice president of the United States compared the current president to both Hitler and Stalin in the same speech -- a first not just in hyperbole but in calumny -- and nary a complaint is heard about a breach of civility.

If you suspect that this selective indignation may be partisan, you guessed right. But here's an even more important question. In the face of Gore's real breach of civil political discourse, which of the following is the right corrective: (a) offer a reasoned refutation of the charge that George Bush is both Stalinist and Hitlerian; (b) suggest an increase in Gore's medication; or (c) do a Cheney.

The correct answer is "C." And given the circumstances, go for the deuce.

I think there is just something very masculine, very testosterone-laden about dropping the f-bomb at the right moment. Something John Waynesque. Very "Hasta la vista, baby."

I don't verbally curse. At all. I think it reflects a lack of class, civility, and respect. But if I do drop the f-bomb, people know to step back a step or two. I don't anger easily, but if f-bomb falls, something has pretty seriously set me off.

 

[A.D.O.R.]

I once saw a quote that read, "Cursing is a feeble mind's way of speaking forcefully." My immediate response, " I don't have a f*cking feeble mind."


Anyway, I really do need to curb my cursing. I cuss when it is definitely inappropriate.

 

[deleted50541]

Great quotes from a hilarious article:
"The deuce is the preferred usage when time is short and concision is of the essence."

"...the three-worder has the elegance of the wide-arced saber slice."

Nice post NPursuit. 👍

 

[A.D.O.R.]

Here is an article on the issue of cursing and society. Enjoy.

Does Swearing Corrode Society by Erik Strand

From Ozzy and his f-word to Tony Soprano’s profane tirades, the dirty words on cable TV these days would make a longshoreman blush—and the networks aren’t much different. A recent survey by the Parents Television Council (PTC), a conservative watchdog group, showed that offensive language on network TV between 8 p.m. and 9 p.m.—the “family hour” time slot—nearly doubled between 1998 and 2002. According to the PTC, foul language on TV contributes to a general decline in civility and an erosion of moral values. Moreover, they say, it’s harmful to youngsters. But do young minds—not to mention civil society—really crumble so easily?

“There’s no social-science evidence that it’s true,” says Timothy Jay, a dirty-word expert at the Massachusetts College of Liberal Arts in North Adams. “And the harm that befalls children is never specified [by groups like the PTC]. There’s no evidence that a word in and of itself has a negative effect on anyone.” Cussing on TV may make naughty words more acceptable in everyday life, says Barry Sapolsky, who studies offensive language on TV at Florida State University in Tallahassee. Nevertheless, he is “very hesitant to draw any conclusion that this influences behavior.”

The PTC acknowledges that the specific harm caused by four-letter words is hard to pin down, but “the position seems fairly obvious,” says Melissa Caldwell, director of research for the PTC. “Foul language is the language of aggression: It can lead to violent acts. And it impoverishes the English language.”

Jay disagrees on both counts. “Swearing is basically a way to relieve anger and frustration in a nonphysical way,” he explains. Because they’re so uniquely expressive, he says, curse words play an important—even privileged—role in our language and minds. They have a deep emotional tie-in that other words don’t have, and they persist through the final stages of dementia and Alzheimer’s disease, long after the rest of our vocabulary is gone.

The PTC's heart is in the right place, says Sapolsky, but he cautions that protecting children shouldn’t prevent adults from being able to enjoy grittier entertainment: “We’d be left with the programming on the PAX network—Little House on the Prairie for everyone.”

http://cms.psychologytoday.com/articles/pto-20040413-000003.html

 

[Psycho Doctor]

Swearing makes one look (lack of a better word) stupid. Why degrade oneself to appear this way? There is a guy in our med school class that swears for everything. He even uses F'in in place of the word very. He thinks he is cool and funny. He just looks PATHETIC. Other students were irritated with this. He has even been spoken to by one faculty member.

your post is probably the best one here! 👍

 

[Shredder]

I'm very turned off by doctors/meds who cuss a lot. Does anyone feel the same one.

im turned off by anyone who swears a lot. im a little turned off by people who dont speak english very well. kidding.

 

[jackets5]

There just words. Although they should be kept to a minimum in a prefessional setting with people you are not freindly with. For example i shadow and ortho doc, and in the office with patients there is no cursing. One day after office hours i went with him to cover a NHL game for which he is the team doctor and during dinner and in the locker room we were cursing like it was going out of style (what else would you expect from 2 italian guys who were/are college football players)

 

[MoosePilot]

Swearing makes one look (lack of a better word) stupid. Why degrade oneself to appear this way? There is a guy in our med school class that swears for everything. He even uses F'in in place of the word very. He thinks he is cool and funny. He just looks PATHETIC. Other students were irritated with this. He has even been spoken to by one faculty member.

Yes, because the word "very" indicates such a higher level of vocabulary than the word "f'in".

The vocabulary argument is stupid. I have a great vocabulary, but also have the tendency to curse too much. It's very prevalent in my line of work. I try to regulate it, because I don't want to offend anyone, but they're just words.

 

[kenmc3]

One day after office hours i went with him to cover a NHL game for which he is the team doctor

Guess you wont be going to an NHL game any time soon...

 

[uclacrewdude]

Thank you. This guy really does look ridiculous. The other day we were getting ready to leave a clinic when he said this: "I wish I was assigned to that preceptor instead. He is f'in smart." We didn't want to encourage him any further so we left.

 

[MoosePilot]

Choice of words can make you look ignoramus. If you want to look stupid, continue on. You just embarrass yourself.

Ignoring my argument and insisting on only recognizing your own limited viewpoint in a argument about opinion can make you look like *an* ignoramus. If you want to look stupid, continue on. You just embarass yourself.

 

[45408]

I have read arguments here about how foul language is not preferred as a means of communicating, but i still haven't seen any reason why foul language can be equated with a loss of credibility. What is it about using a four letter word that makes someone's opinion or advice not credible?

"F*ck, man, that **** is f*ckin' large!"

or

"Yes, that abcess is large."


You tell me.

I'm not above using the occasional obscenity, and it doesn't faze me at all when someone says something like "I gotta clean all that **** out of my garage this afternoon," but when people say something like "I <blanked> the <blanking> <blank> out of that <blank> for two <blanking> hours while I <blanked> that <blank>" it gets on my nerves.

When the obscenities just don't stop, it shows very little variety in your vocabulary, and it just gets repetitive and annoying. I know some people who append "and ****" to the most random things. "So I was picking up my kids and **** from school, when I noticed this guy's car had all these stickers and **** all over his bumper and ****." I'm not even exaggerating. That's annoying and low-class.

 

[USCtrainer]

They say that character is developed in private and displayed in public, and I guess with the luxury of hiding behind a computer screen, we're seeing future doc's true colors. 🙁 It's a sad day to see how little true character is rewarded and cherished anymore 😳

I suppose cheating on tests doesn't hurt anybody either...where is the line drawn?

 

[Nutmeg]

I'm very turned off by doctors/meds who cuss a lot. Does anyone feel the same one.

I'm very turned off by posters that don't know how to use punctuation marks. Why did you add the word "one" randomly to the end of your question one.

 

[tank you]

I'm very turned off by posters that don't know how to use punctuation marks. Why did you add the word "one" randomly to the end of your question one.

haha. why did he put the "one" there?

 

[it.]

two

 

[Nutmeg]

it makes one appear immature, unprofessional and cheap. one often resorts to cursing when they have nothing meaningful to say. Anything can be explained without cursing and there's no reason the english language can't explain anything without resorting to cursing.

I completely disagree. in all honesty, I reached the ripe old age of 20 by the first time I deliberately used the word "****," and I didn't use the word regularly untill I was 22. I was 22 before I said "the eff word" for the first time. I know very well what the extents of a non-swearing vocabulary are.

There is no equivalent in clean dialogue for "f*ck you," although there are several equitable statements that involve other swear words. If you don't cuss at all, and there's someone you want to tell to f*ck off, no matter how vast your vocabulary is, you will end up feeling unsatisfied by whatever term you settle on.

There are other words that have their own meanings not adequately represented by any "acceptable" word. The idea that no one ever needs to call a bitch a bitch or call a d|ckehead a d|ckhead is interesting, but that 1984 brand of shaping language by getting rid of such terms does not make the phenomena cease to exist. Not all copulation is equal, and hence, we have different words to represent different things. Even if you don't engage in certain acts, that doesn't mean that you will never have occasion to discuss such a matter, even if only to distinguish what is and isn't acceptable from one another.

But also, what's wrong with comedy? I could better make an argument for not swearing when I'm angry then I could for not swearing to get a quick laugh. Stress kills, and swearing in joking can be a good way to get yourself and others to not take life or themselves too seriously. When I sppent all those years not swearing, I eventually came to wonder why I put those words on such a sacred pedastal. No word, in my opinion, deserves that much respect. people deserve respect, of course, so when relevant a person should seek to avoid swearing in any context that might offend a person not deserving of such insult. But respecting people does not justify putting a word on a pedastal, and treating the "eff word" like a sacred name of a diety, never to be spoken aloud. It's just a f*cking word.

 

[kenmc3]

I completely disagree. in all honesty, I reached the ripe old age of 20 by the first time I deliberately used the word "****," and I didn't use the word regularly untill I was 22. I was 22 before I said "the eff word" for the first time. I know very well what the extents of a non-swearing vocabulary are.

There is no equivalent in clean dialogue for "f*ck you," although there are several equitable statements that involve other swear words. If you don't cuss at all, and there's someone you want to tell to f*ck off, no matter how vast your vocabulary is, you will end up feeling unsatisfied by whatever term you settle on.

There are other words that have their own meanings not adequately represented by any "acceptable" word. The idea that no one ever needs to call a bitch a bitch or call a d|ckehead a d|ckhead is interesting, but that 1984 brand of shaping language by getting rid of such terms does not make the phenomena cease to exist. Not all copulation is equal, and hence, we have different words to represent different things. Even if you don't engage in certain acts, that doesn't mean that you will never have occasion to discuss such a matter, even if only to distinguish what is and isn't acceptable from one another.

But also, what's wrong with comedy? I could better make an argument for not swearing when I'm angry then I could for not swearing to get a quick laugh. Stress kills, and swearing in joking can be a good way to get yourself and others to not take life or themselves too seriously. When I sppent all those years not swearing, I eventually came to wonder why I put those words on such a sacred pedastal. No word, in my opinion, deserves that much respect. people deserve respect, of course, so when relevant a person should seek to avoid swearing in any context that might offend a person not deserving of such insult. But respecting people does not justify putting a word on a pedastal, and treating the "eff word" like a sacred name of a diety, never to be spoken aloud. It's just a f*cking word.

This post sounds just like a drug addict trying to justify their behavior.

Anyone who goes to this length to justify their behavior is obviously addicted to it; I don’t care if it is swearing, using cocaine, or eating cookies. I will be the first to admit that I swear occasionally but I am not so attached to it that I need to defend it. In fact, I would be able to give it up if need be.

 

[it.]

I completely disagree. in all honesty, I reached the ripe old age of 20 by the first time I deliberately used the word "****," and I didn't use the word regularly untill I was 22. I was 22 before I said "the eff word" for the first time. QUOTE]

😱 unbefcukingleivable. never said **** before 22? i find it so hard to believe. if that is the case, i'm guessing you have a rather extensive vocabulary. i've always been a bit of a potty mouth, and the thing about cuss words, particularly ****, is that they are so versatile! never really had to learn any other words...

 

[Fenrezz]

Lord, you people are anal about bad language. I cuss. So what?

Don't like it? Go f*ck yourself! That's right, go ahead and shake your head at the uneducated neanderthal. 👍

 

[reggae girl]

Lord, you people are anal about bad language. I cuss. So what?

Don't like it? Go f*ck yourself! That's right, go ahead and shake your head at the uneducated neanderthal. 👍

Fenrezz 👍 .

I can't believe this thread is still going on. If you think people who "cuss" are loutish and crude then so be it. You're entitled to your own opinion. But making the inference that all people who curse are inarticulate and unintelligent is a bit far fetched. I know tons of people who cuss like sailors, who are more articulate and probably a lot more intelligent than some of you pious snobs.

 

[hardy]

I can't believe this thread is still going on. If you think people who "cuss" are loutish and crude then so be it. You're entitled to your own opinion. But making the inference that all people who curse are inarticulate and unintelligent is a bit far fetched. I know tons of people who cuss like sailors, who are more articulate and probably a lot more intelligent than some of you pious snobs.

I work with a world-renowned professor at my school... he is a freaking genius. But if you wouldn't know who he is you would think he is a construction worker, he swears about everything and everybody. Cool guy 👍

 

[wareagle]

Fenrezz 👍 .

I can't believe this thread is still going on. If you think people who "cuss" are loutish and crude then so be it. You're entitled to your own opinion. But making the inference that all people who curse are inarticulate and unintelligent is a bit far fetched. I know tons of people who cuss like sailors, who are more articulate and probably a lot more intelligent than some of you pious snobs.

No kidding. I've seen the word "loose" when they mean "lose" about 5 times on this thread, and that is much more inarticulate than saying a f*cking cuss word every now and then.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

I completely disagree. in all honesty, I reached the ripe old age of 20 by the first time I deliberately used the word "****," and I didn't use the word regularly untill I was 22. I was 22 before I said "the eff word" for the first time. I know very well what the extents of a non-swearing vocabulary are.

There is no equivalent in clean dialogue for "f*ck you," although there are several equitable statements that involve other swear words. If you don't cuss at all, and there's someone you want to tell to f*ck off, no matter how vast your vocabulary is, you will end up feeling unsatisfied by whatever term you settle on.

There are other words that have their own meanings not adequately represented by any "acceptable" word. The idea that no one ever needs to call a bitch a bitch or call a d|ckehead a d|ckhead is interesting, but that 1984 brand of shaping language by getting rid of such terms does not make the phenomena cease to exist. Not all copulation is equal, and hence, we have different words to represent different things. Even if you don't engage in certain acts, that doesn't mean that you will never have occasion to discuss such a matter, even if only to distinguish what is and isn't acceptable from one another.

But also, what's wrong with comedy? I could better make an argument for not swearing when I'm angry then I could for not swearing to get a quick laugh. Stress kills, and swearing in joking can be a good way to get yourself and others to not take life or themselves too seriously. When I sppent all those years not swearing, I eventually came to wonder why I put those words on such a sacred pedastal. No word, in my opinion, deserves that much respect. people deserve respect, of course, so when relevant a person should seek to avoid swearing in any context that might offend a person not deserving of such insult. But respecting people does not justify putting a word on a pedastal, and treating the "eff word" like a sacred name of a diety, never to be spoken aloud. It's just a f*cking word.

...depends on your audience, not everyone things cursing is funny. despite what you think, many think it is immature, crude and makes you look like an idiot. If not, why wouldn't it be ok to curse in front of patients and other professionals?

 

[Psycho Doctor]

This post sounds just like a drug addict trying to justify their behavior.

Anyone who goes to this length to justify their behavior is obviously addicted to it; I don’t care if it is swearing, using cocaine, or eating cookies. I will be the first to admit that I swear occasionally but I am not so attached to it that I need to defend it. In fact, I would be able to give it up if need be.

lol, you make an excellent point 👍

 

[fpr85]

my favorite phrase is "goddamnit to fvcking hell"

 

[Nutmeg]

This post sounds just like a drug addict trying to justify their behavior.

Anyone who goes to this length to justify their behavior is obviously addicted to it; I don't care if it is swearing, using cocaine, or eating cookies. I will be the first to admit that I swear occasionally but I am not so attached to it that I need to defend it. In fact, I would be able to give it up if need be.

You're projecting. I always write long-winded posts. Two days ago, someone asked if anyone thought that alternative rock was all influenced by punk and new wave stuff from the late '70s. I wrote a response about as long as the one above, plus I did about 45 minutes of fact checking. That's just the way I do things.

I know I could give it up if "need be," and I don't swear in situtaions where such would be unacceptable. Of course, "need be" is a fantasy, and I took far more crap for the years I spent not swearing than I have since I started.

 

[Nutmeg]

...depends on your audience, not everyone things cursing is funny. despite what you think, many think it is immature, crude and makes you look like an idiot. If not, why wouldn't it be ok to curse in front of patients and other professionals?

It's unprofessional, that's why. I wouldn't crack jokes on any level if I'm in a professional environment, especially in such a situation where it's important to convey to patients that you are competent and taking them seriously.

It matters what people think in your professional life for a lot of reasons. You need people to take you seriously, you need people to understand that you mean business and that they don't have to second guess whether or not you were kidding, joking wastes time, is potentially dangerous, it is distracting when there is something that needs to be dealt with, etc. But if outside a professional setting, if I'm off the clock and enjoying life and you think I'm an idiot because I'm cursing a blue streak, then you're just trying to justify a needless stereotype. I'm smart and I swear--get over it. If that can't mesh with your paradigm, it's a problem with your paradigm, not with my habits. In a professional setting, it isn't my business to tell you to fix your paradigm and accept the cognitive dissonance you might experience when trying to fit me somewhere in your false dichotomy of smart or crude.

 

[MoosePilot]

...depends on your audience, not everyone things cursing is funny. despite what you think, many think it is immature, crude and makes you look like an idiot. If not, why wouldn't it be ok to curse in front of patients and other professionals?

Everyone has an opinion. There have been people on this forum that have expressed that your religion makes you look like an idiot to them. Do you care? I'm not implying language is as important as religion, but the fact is that there will be people who think I'm an idiot because I prefer the middle of the country to the coasts, that I drink beer instead of wine, that I listen to classic rock instead of classical. I don't care. I do my thing, they can do their thing.

If shorts are ever ok, why wouldn't they be ok at a formal dinner?

 

[Nutmeg]

Everyone has an opinion. There have been people on this forum that have expressed that your religion makes you look like an idiot to them. Do you care? I'm not implying language is as important as religion, but the fact is that there will be people who think I'm an idiot because I prefer the middle of the country to the coasts, that I drink beer instead of wine, that I listen to classic rock instead of classical. I don't care. I do my thing, they can do their thing.

If shorts are ever ok, why wouldn't they be ok at a formal dinner?

Well done. 👍 👍 👍

 

[Psycho Doctor]

Everyone has an opinion. There have been people on this forum that have expressed that your religion makes you look like an idiot to them. Do you care? I'm not implying language is as important as religion, but the fact is that there will be people who think I'm an idiot because I prefer the middle of the country to the coasts, that I drink beer instead of wine, that I listen to classic rock instead of classical. I don't care. I do my thing, they can do their thing.

If shorts are ever ok, why wouldn't they be ok at a formal dinner?

whatever. i don't really care...people can suffer the consequences of their own actions and people's perceptions of them, as it does carry over from personal into professional life. When it's time to send someone on an important professional conference or to meet with important researchers of clinicians, one's boss can worry about whether the doctor he has seen curse and act totally unprofessional at a party will carry over those actions when they had a few too many over dinner....asnd he can deciude to send someone he trusts under all circumstances instead.

 

[Nutmeg]

whatever. i don't really care...people can suffer the consequences of their own actions and people's perceptions of them, as it does carry over from personal into professional life. When it's time to send someone on an important professional conference or to meet with important researchers of clinicians, one's boss can worry about whether the doctor he has seen curse and act totally unprofessional at a party will carry over those actions when they had a few too many over dinner....asnd he can deciude to send someone he trusts under all circumstances instead.

Nice. Blame the inability to drink moderately and/or control yourself under the influence on swearing. 👍 🙄

 

[Psycho Doctor]

Nice. Blame the inability to drink moderately and/or control yourself under the influence on swearing. 👍 🙄

it's just an example, ok change it to being in a social environment where swearing is commonplace and "acceptable"

 

[Nutmeg]

it's just an example, ok change it to being in a social environment where swearing is commonplace and "acceptable"

The is kind of silly regardless. For one, you are seeming to work to justify stereotyping. The idea that swearing and credibility are related is hogwash. But what amuses me more is that if you go to an extreme of never swearing, I think that that makes people feel they can't trust you, because you're principled in a non-standard way, which is generally regarded as a sort of unpredictablity--and I speak from experience in this matter. In my experience, bosses seem to place the greatest trust in the people they go drinking with or whatever. In my own system of ethics, I think loyalty should fall pretty low, because a principled person would obey their principles over all other things, and if sticking up for a friend/coworker/boss ends up being a liability to ones principles, then principles should trump loyalty. This places me at odds with about 99.9% of all humanity, who generally regard loyalty as the greatest virtue and treachery/duplicity/"being a rat" is generally regarded as the greatest sin on the planet. That's the entire point of things like hazing, wherein you make a person submit their principles to the single principle of loyalty to the group. Most people value trust more than they value strict adherence to a moral code. By that reasoning, if your only motive is to get the good will of your boss and your peers or whatever, then the optimal thing is not to commit yourself to never swearing, but rather commit yourself to blending with a crowd--ergo, swear only as much (not more or less) than the standard for the social context.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

The is kind of silly regardless. For one, you are seeming to work to justify stereotyping. The idea that swearing and credibility are related is hogwash. But what amuses me more is that if you go to an extreme of never swearing, I think that that makes people feel they can't trust you, because you're principled in a non-standard way, which is generally regarded as a sort of unpredictablity--and I speak from experience in this matter. In my experience, bosses seem to place the greatest trust in the people they go drinking with or whatever. In my own system of ethics, I think loyalty should fall pretty low, because a principled person would obey their principles over all other things, and if sticking up for a friend/coworker/boss ends up being a liability to ones principles, then principles should trump loyalty. This places me at odds with about 99.9% of all humanity, who generally regard loyalty as the greatest virtue and treachery/duplicity/"being a rat" is generally regarded as the greatest sin on the planet. That's the entire point of things like hazing, wherein you make a person submit their principles to the single principle of loyalty to the group. Most people value trust more than they value strict adherence to a moral code. By that reasoning, if your only motive is to get the good will of your boss and your peers or whatever, then the optimal thing is not to commit yourself to never swearing, but rather commit yourself to blending with a crowd--ergo, swear only as much (not more or less) than the standard for the social context.

oh my gosh...you know nothing about me to make such blenket statements. and it's obvious that you're groveling to find something to substantiate your argument. People don't drink for various reasons: could be a medical problem, could be a family history of alcoholism, could be religious beliefs. To make a stereotype that one who doesn't drink is sucking up to their boss is ludicrous. Just because people have higher standards than you (which you seem to feel guilty about, thus you are making efforts to compensate by putting others down) does not mean it's for unethical reasons. Can't you just accept that people have different moral standards and guidelines for living regardless of what dictates them?

 

[Nutmeg]

oh my gosh...you know nothing about me to make such blenket statements. and it's obvious that you're groveling to find something to substantiate your argument. People don't drink for various reasons: could be a medical problem, could be a family history of alcoholism, could be religious beliefs. To make a stereotype that one who doesn't drink is sucking up to their boss is ludicrous. Just because people have higher standards than you (which you seem to feel guilty about, thus you are making efforts to compensate by putting others down) does not mean it's for unethical reasons. Can't you just accept that people have different moral standards and guidelines for living regardless of what dictates them?

What the hell are you talking about? Where did I make any statement--much less a blanket one--about you? YOU were the one who made the argument that not curbing ones language might lead to your boss not trusting you. I wasn't even talking about drinking, which is beside the fact that you had no idea what my argument was as well.

And then you use it all as an excuse to try and get on my case for not sharing the standards other people have. Nice work, slick. No guilt here, bro. I neither swore nor drank until I was 22, and I took plenty of crap for both. I didn't drink caffeine from the ages of 10-20. And I have a whole slew of other habits of abstinence for which I take plenty of crap, both socially (try being the only vegetarian in your work place, as I currently am) and academically (my GPA suffered severely because I was the one chump in the ChemE dept that didn't use other people's answers on my homework, and my GPA suffered in the MCB dept for being the one person who didn't gripe about grades to the teacher and ask for changes in grading).

I don't feel the need to look for someone to give me a cookie for whatever standards I hold for myself. I hold my standards for my own reasons. I'm not the one who started a thread saying that some random standard I hold gives me credibility over someone else whho fails to hold that standard. This thread seemed to me to attempt to put people down by saying that the habit of swearing can be inferred to indicate the completely unrelated trait of having no credibility, which was later expanded to also indicate a lack of vocabulary or lack of verbal acuity.

Seems to me like you're just trying to justify your lack of credibilty. (Wow, see how easy it is to flip around that lame-ass argument of yours?) 🙄

 

[patzan]

What the hell are you talking about? Where did I make any statement--much less a blanket one--about you? YOU were the one who made the argument that not curbing ones language might lead to your boss not trusting you. I wasn't even talking about drinking, which is beside the fact that you had no idea what my argument was as well.

And then you use it all as an excuse to try and get on my case for not sharing the standards other people have. Nice work, slick. No guilt here, bro. I neither swore nor drank until I was 22, and I took plenty of crap for both. I didn't drink caffeine from the ages of 10-20. And I have a whole slew of other habits of abstinence for which I take plenty of crap, both socially (try being the only vegetarian in your work place, as I currently am) and academically (my GPA suffered severely because I was the one chump in the ChemE dept that didn't use other people's answers on my homework, and my GPA suffered in the MCB dept for being the one person who didn't gripe about grades to the teacher and ask for changes in grading).

I don't feel the need to look for someone to give me a cookie for whatever standards I hold for myself. I hold my standards for my own reasons. I'm not the one who started a thread saying that some random standard I hold gives me credibility over someone else whho fails to hold that standard. This thread seemed to me to attempt to put people down by saying that the habit of swearing can be inferred to indicate the completely unrelated trait of having no credibility, which was later expanded to also indicate a lack of vocabulary or lack of verbal acuity.

Seems to me like you're just trying to justify your lack of credibilty. (Wow, see how easy it is to flip around that lame-ass argument of yours?) 🙄

Your replies are so long I don't bother reading them. Sorry if that sounds mean, but I get bored with all the blah blah blah. I need succinct and witty.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

Your replies are so long I don't bother reading them. Sorry if that sounds mean, but I get bored with all the blah blah blah. I need succinct and witty.

i sorta agree even when he's responding to me... 😛

 

[Psycho Doctor]

I don't feel the need to look for someone to give me a cookie for whatever standards I hold for myself. I hold my standards for my own reasons. :

That's the best statement you've made and I agree with you and therefore will not try to justify myself to you.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

I think someone already mentioned this: Habits do actually cross over from one setting to another. Habits are hard to control and one can be so used to of swearing that it comes out in a professional setting. This has happened.

People are mentioning that they need to swear to get out their anger. But, there are so many other ways of releasing anger.

👍 you're absolutely right, but some people will have an excuse for that that they will try to justify.

 

[MoosePilot]

whatever. i don't really care...people can suffer the consequences of their own actions and people's perceptions of them, as it does carry over from personal into professional life. When it's time to send someone on an important professional conference or to meet with important researchers of clinicians, one's boss can worry about whether the doctor he has seen curse and act totally unprofessional at a party will carry over those actions when they had a few too many over dinner....asnd he can deciude to send someone he trusts under all circumstances instead.

He might also decide not to send the stuck up priss that everyone in the office hates for being self righteous and "holier than thou". Don't seek to pluck the splinter out of your brother's eye when you've got a beam in your own...

 

[wareagle]

👍 you're absolutely right, but some people will have an excuse for that that they will try to justify.

Exactly. I'm sure we all agree that breaking the law is wrong, yet 99% or us drive over the speed limit. People will behave the way they want to, and find justifications for it later. Is that necessarily a bad thing?

 

[Psycho Doctor]

He might also decide not to send the stuck up priss that everyone in the office hates for being self righteous and "holier than thou". Don't seek to pluck the splinter out of your brother's eye when you've got a beam in your own...

considering i am very willing to admit my own inadequacies, which are many, i am certainly not "holier than thou".

i could turn around and say the same thing to you.

 

[45408]

cliff notes on Nutmeg's posts?

 

[SitraAchra]

i like the f-word. and by f-word i mean *******