xplayer2885

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Nov 13, 2006
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Pre-Dental
Ok so im getting ready to reapply for the 2012 cycle. I applied for the 2010 cycle last year and didnt get in. Im completing my first semester of a masters and probally will have between a 3.5 and 3.7. I have a 19DAT, 1200 hours volunteer time, I also have been working in a research lab for over a year, and proposed a research project/paper and am now working on my second project. A recieved a couple awards from the white house for volunteering. Im also TAing next fall. How does this look compaired with my previous stats listed below?

2.6 undergrad gpa
16DAT both times
Had no research and no volunteer time. Just work in a couple dentist offices
 

hoylematt

10+ Year Member
Nov 23, 2008
420
3
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Pre-Dental
The real question is, what is your overall GPA going to be? It's going to be a tough road getting in anywhere without pulling up the overall and Science GPA to 3.0+.

Those that have done Master's degrees should chime in with their experience, I am just going by what I have seen on these forums.

You need to do some research on the schools that will give you the best shot and those that really emphasize master's degrees and your recent education. It's sad to say but in my opinion the usual weight Dschools give is:

oGPA> sGPA> DAT> Post Grad GPA trend > Dental experience > Research/E.C stuff
 
Oct 22, 2010
34
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Pre-Dental
Wow!! I think you did an amazing job improving your GPA!! :idea: That's great. With reserach, shadowing, GPA, now all you have to do is get that DAT up and you will be a great applicant for the 2012 cycle! They love to see that upwars trend:D

PM me if you want some DAT tips...

Best of :luck:
 

hoylematt

10+ Year Member
Nov 23, 2008
420
3
Status
Pre-Dental
Wow!! I think you did an amazing job improving your GPA!! :idea: That's great. With reserach, shadowing, GPA, now all you have to do is get that DAT up and you will be a great applicant for the 2012 cycle! They love to see that upwars trend:D

PM me if you want some DAT tips...

Best of :luck:
I think the OP has taken the DAT 3 times already...
 
OP
X

xplayer2885

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Nov 13, 2006
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Pre-Dental
The real question is, what is your overall GPA going to be? It's going to be a tough road getting in anywhere without pulling up the overall and Science GPA to 3.0+.

Those that have done Master's degrees should chime in with their experience, I am just going by what I have seen on these forums.

You need to do some research on the schools that will give you the best shot and those that really emphasize master's degrees and your recent education. It's sad to say but in my opinion the usual weight Dschools give is:

oGPA> sGPA> DAT> Post Grad GPA trend > Dental experience > Research/E.C stuff
Why would I have to pull my science GPA up when im doing a masters to make up for bad undergrad GPA?? That means I would have to take post bac classes on top of my masters. Doesnt really make any sense.
 

amalgamgrillz

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Why would I have to pull my science GPA up when im doing a masters to make up for bad undergrad GPA?? That means I would have to take post bac classes on top of my masters. Doesnt really make any sense.
I'm also doing my Master's because of a low undergrad sGPA (2.9). I have never gotten a straight answer about whether or not schools look at your graduate sGPA or cumulative sGPA. AADSAS does separate your GPAs (undergrad, grad, and cumulative)..I really think it depends on what the school wants to look at.

I'm willing to bet bitter betties who just did Post-baccs will tell you that you need to do post-bacc work to raise your cumulative sGPA, but they don't ACTUALLY know. Schools may very well see your graduate GPA and say you're fine. But in all likelihood, they probably have a cGPA cut off for you to meet. To be on the safe side, I would personally make sure your cumulative sGPA is at least a 3.0.
 
OP
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xplayer2885

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Not to sound cocky, but I truley do not see how I wouldnt get any interviews after digging myself out of such a massive hole, considering how much I have built up my application...Im not looking to apply to all state schools. Ill go to any private school along the east coast.
 

DrEBA

Member
Dec 15, 2010
3
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Pre-Dental
Not to sound cocky, but I truley do not see how I wouldnt get any interviews after digging myself out of such a massive hole, considering how much I have built up my application...Im not looking to apply to all state schools. Ill go to any private school along the east coast.

You have improved everything alot! Great job on the DAT in your 3rd score! Much improved! I think your shot is much greater. Alot of dental school love seeing these stories like you, where you try and try and eventually will be picked up by someone. Good luck!
 

ALLDAYYY

5+ Year Member
Aug 3, 2010
40
0
Status
Dental Student
The real question is, what is your overall GPA going to be? It's going to be a tough road getting in anywhere without pulling up the overall and Science GPA to 3.0+.

Those that have done Master's degrees should chime in with their experience, I am just going by what I have seen on these forums.

You need to do some research on the schools that will give you the best shot and those that really emphasize master's degrees and your recent education. It's sad to say but in my opinion the usual weight Dschools give is:

oGPA> sGPA> DAT> Post Grad GPA trend > Dental experience > Research/E.C stuff
Masters degree helps your application. From my experience i applied this year after finishing my Masters in Biochem/ Molecular Bio from UCR in Cali (Grad GPA 3.81) DAT 20/20/20. and i had one interview at IUSD and a bunch of rejections and a bunch of no replies.

I ended up on the alternate list on dec 1st. I then talked to the Dean of Admissions at IUSD and he told me that i ended up on the alternate list because although I got full points in my interview and my DAT and my Grad GPA were good my overall rank amongst the other applicants was not high enough to get in. (due to my sci GPA/ogpa)

So either way you will HAVE to go back and do enough post bacc work until ur science GPA is where you want it to be however long that takes. because at the end of the day a masters degree is good but it is NOTTTTTTTTTT a pre requisite for dental school. Hope this helps
 

Maygyver

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Jun 14, 2008
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Not to sound cocky, but I truley do not see how I wouldnt get any interviews after digging myself out of such a massive hole, considering how much I have built up my application...Im not looking to apply to all state schools. Ill go to any private school along the east coast.
Because schools can't completely disregard your previous performance. I would think they would give preference to students who have been solid students since they entered college over students who slipped up and weren't as focused. Probably not what you want to hear, but just my opinion. Either way, the only thing you can really do that this point is improve your GPA because taking your DAT for a fourth time probably wouldn't make a very strong application. Good luck with your masters; work hard and hopefully schools will give you a shot.
 

dentalWorks

Nights Watchmen
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Jun 25, 2009
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Ok so im getting ready to reapply for the 2012 cycle. I applied for the 2010 cycle last year and didnt get in. Im completing my first semester of a masters and probally will have between a 3.5 and 3.7. I have a 19DAT, 1200 hours volunteer time, I also have been working in a research lab for over a year, and proposed a research project/paper and am now working on my second project. A recieved a couple awards from the white house for volunteering. Im also TAing next fall. How does this look compaired with my previous stats listed below?

2.6 undergrad gpa
16DAT both times
Had no research and no volunteer time. Just work in a couple dentist offices
you see, this whole dental application process is really turning into a "numbers" game. Yes your masters performance is strong, and in reality, its better than your undergrad... HOWEVER, dental schools still favor the undergrad GPAs cause thats the one they use mostly to compare applicants.

This is why I always suggest to do post-bacc BEFORE masters.

Good luck with whatever you decide, if this is me with a 2.6 and a 3.7 masters right now, I wouldn't apply thsi cycle, I would take 25-35 credits of undergrad post-bacc and 4.0 every course.
 
OP
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xplayer2885

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Nov 13, 2006
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Pre-Dental
you see, this whole dental application process is really turning into a "numbers" game. Yes your masters performance is strong, and in reality, its better than your undergrad... HOWEVER, dental schools still favor the undergrad GPAs cause thats the one they use mostly to compare applicants.

This is why I always suggest to do post-bacc BEFORE masters.

Good luck with whatever you decide, if this is me with a 2.6 and a 3.7 masters right now, I wouldn't apply thsi cycle, I would take 25-35 credits of undergrad post-bacc and 4.0 every course.
So basically I should spend 4 more years in school before I apply?? If thats the case id quit now and go do somethings else...Its amazing how I can never get any positive feed back on hear. But when I asked dental students who were in a similar situation they tell me ill be just fine.
 
Oct 14, 2009
177
1
Status
So basically I should spend 4 more years in school before I apply?? If thats the case id quit now and go do somethings else...Its amazing how I can never get any positive feed back on hear. But when I asked dental students who were in a similar situation they tell me ill be just fine.
No, its just that 1 year of good schooling won't erase 4 years of a 2.6. GPA's are looked towards to see one's ability to do well in dental school and one's consistency. What good is a 2.5 and a 25 DAT? It shows that you're smart enough for dental school; however, it shows a lack of commitment to any work ethic. Dental schools can't have students that may drop out, because A)its a business and they lose money if you stay back a year, and B)that slot can easily be filled by another student. Therefore, they want to assure themselves that the student in the program will stick with it and do well. A 3.0-3.5 or so will validate that. If you can raise your GPA to a 3.0, I'm sure it will look great, because it shows that you REALLY want it. (Raising a 2.6 of 4 years to a 3.0 is quite a feat and admissions will most likely take note) Fact of the matter is that numbers matter, and if you don't meet the "hypothetical" 3.0 cutoff, things look really really slim. You seem to have some great ECs, but once again, numbers matter alot. Theres a under 3.0 thread around here that has alot of success stories. It can definitely be done. Its up to you whether you want it.
 

K Niner

7+ Year Member
Jul 11, 2009
174
4
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Dentist
So basically I should spend 4 more years in school before I apply?? If thats the case id quit now and go do somethings else...Its amazing how I can never get any positive feed back on hear. But when I asked dental students who were in a similar situation they tell me ill be just fine.
Call a few schools if you want to know how they calculate the gpa, but I would assume most would average it with your undergrad giving you a total gpa. So even though you get, say, a 3.7, when you average that with your 2.6 it comes out as a cum. Gpa of like 2.89. So you have to bring your total cumulative gpa up. Schools also like the upward trend as well. But it comes down to simple numbers. Is it fair to let someone in with a 2.9 over someone with a 3.4? They are not going to punish other applicants (by not letting them in) who did not mess up, thus didn't take a masters and have a large improvement in gpa over you. The masters and gpa help a lot, but for you to get in you would be taking a spot from another applicant that could have it, so from the adcom's standpoint, it comes down to who is the better candidate.
 

dentalWorks

Nights Watchmen
7+ Year Member
Jun 25, 2009
5,646
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Sterling Hts, Mi
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So basically I should spend 4 more years in school before I apply?? If thats the case id quit now and go do somethings else...Its amazing how I can never get any positive feed back on hear. But when I asked dental students who were in a similar situation they tell me ill be just fine.
4 more years? 25-35 credits can be accomplished in about 2-3 good full time semesters (about 1 year).

You don't have to do the post-bacc, its just my opinion (and not the holly Bible's) that you should lol

If you REALLY don't wanna do more schooling, take your chance and apply this upcoming cycle to 20+ schools. I would call each of the schools and see what they recommend, try to gauge if they favor upwards trends more than mathematical holes (like the 2.6 you have)..... However I think this is VERY risky, cause 20+ schools will cost you (just addsas + 2ndary fees about $4000). Sprinkle a few interviews here and there and you got yourself total of $5000-6000 out of your pocket.

I am tell you right now with 90% confidence, to avoid applying to case western reserve, they REALLY like to see numbers (overall, science, and non science), so thats 1 down and 57 to go lol, some schools flat out only (or mostly) accept in-state, so thats another 20 down. 37 to go !!
 

dentalWorks

Nights Watchmen
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Jun 25, 2009
5,646
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Sterling Hts, Mi
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So basically I should spend 4 more years in school before I apply?? If thats the case id quit now and go do somethings else...Its amazing how I can never get any positive feed back on hear. But when I asked dental students who were in a similar situation they tell me ill be just fine.
well, you are asking a bunch of pre-dents who most of them either just recently got accepted, or didn't. Many of us (if not all) don't exactly know wtf is going on when it comes to admissions. So we are going to tell you things on personal basis (for example, post-bacc did the trick with me, so thats what I recommend to people almost always)

There are general themes, that even an Eskimo knows by now, GPAs are a huge contributor for landing interviews.... You on the other hand lack this, so we give you advice to best prepare yourself. It DOESN'T MEAN YOU HAVE TO LISTEN TO US, its just our honest opinion.
 

aelian

7+ Year Member
Jul 4, 2010
257
1
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Pre-Dental
Not to sound cocky, but I truley do not see how I wouldnt get any interviews after digging myself out of such a massive hole, considering how much I have built up my application...Im not looking to apply to all state schools. Ill go to any private school along the east coast.
Not to sound mean, but that doesn't seem like a massive hole. You're still attached to the anchor called academic underachievement. You will need to ace your master's program (and hopefully it's a relevant master's program-biomedically related that will help in dental school). Getting a 3.5 for a master's will not really help. You can look around SDN and see there are a lot of people getting 4.0's and 3.8's on their masters because a lot of master's are kind of inflated. Maybe yours isn't but, predominately, the dental schools will look more at your uGPA. Now, maybe there is a person here that can call BS on what I'm saying because I'm not an adcom and I like thinking I know stuff when I don't. But take some summer courses and boost that 2.6 to at least a 3.0. Shouldn't be hard. And take some toughies. Anatomy, histology. Don't sissy out.
And if all else fails...1, grow a beard, 2, become a URM, and 3, move to Texas.

And listen to the advice that these guys are giving you, even if it isn't what you want to hear.
 

IronJeff

5+ Year Member
Feb 13, 2010
108
0
Status
Pre-Dental
Not to sound cocky, but I truley do not see how I wouldnt get any interviews after digging myself out of such a massive hole, considering how much I have built up my application...Im not looking to apply to all state schools. Ill go to any private school along the east coast.
So basically I should spend 4 more years in school before I apply?? If thats the case id quit now and go do somethings else...Its amazing how I can never get any positive feed back on hear. But when I asked dental students who were in a similar situation they tell me ill be just fine.
Oh my God. You come on this forum asking for advice and you berate those who tell you that perhaps doing ONE good year of work won't undo FOUR years of 2.6 work? ARE YOU KIDDING ME??? Everyone here has been extremely respectful (as they should be) of your situation. I love SDN for the great deal of advice offered to people in all situations. But DO NOT come on here asking for advice expecting that everyone is going to tell you to apply right away and that private schools will jump out of their shoes to accept you because they won't. I feel like I see one of these forums every week. If you ask for advice, I hope all of it will be constructive, but NOT ALL OF IT WILL NECESSARILY MAKE YOU HAPPY. And if you can't handle constructive advice then do not ask for it.
 
Sep 4, 2010
64
0
Status
Pre-Health (Field Undecided)
[
Not to sound cocky, but I truley do not see how I wouldnt get any interviews after digging myself out of such a massive hole, considering how much I have built up my application...Im not looking to apply to all state schools. Ill go to any private school along the east coast.
So basically I should spend 4 more years in school before I apply?? If thats the case id quit now and go do somethings else...Its amazing how I can never get any positive feed back on hear. But when I asked dental students who were in a similar situation they tell me ill be just fine.

You will be just fine. I don't even think you need to finish your masters, you should take a 6 month vacation and just send in your application in June. Your stats are amazing and your DAT is out of this world. You're right, I don't see how any school can reject you at this point considering how you've improved in the past 6 months compared to the previous 4 years. You're a shoe in. I hear dental school admissions is just like sports, its a "what have you done for me recently" world.


I hope that was what you wanted to hear.
 
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xplayer2885

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Nov 13, 2006
157
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[



You will be just fine. I don't even think you need to finish your masters, you should take a 6 month vacation and just send in your application in June. Your stats are amazing and your DAT is out of this world. You're right, I don't see how any school can reject you at this point considering how you've improved in the past 6 months compared to the previous 4 years. You're a shoe in. I hear dental school admissions is just like sports, its a "what have you done for me recently" world.


I hope that was what you wanted to hear.
Thanks for the sarcasim gunner......Now know why I was advised to keep away from this site....Its filled with gunners...Amazing how when I talk with friends who have gotten in they tell me otherwise.
 
Sep 4, 2010
64
0
Status
Pre-Health (Field Undecided)
Thanks for the sarcasim gunner......Now know why I was advised to keep away from this site....Its filled with gunners...Amazing how when I talk with friends who have gotten in they tell me otherwise.

I don't know what youre talking about.

I told you what you wanted to hear... you get all cranky.

Other people told you what you didn't want to hear... you get all cranky.

Is there something that you specifically want?


If your "friends" tell you anything of the sort, then you need new friends. You're not "guaranteed" an interview at any dental school. Your "improved" stats are not even "omg we have to invite this guy in for an interview ASAP" worthy. You're the cockiest 3.5 one semester-GPA / 19 DAT student I've ever met. You had a 2.6 GPA and scored a 16 TWICE for the DAT. If you wanted a surefire interview, you would've worked your butt off and gotten a 4.0 Masters and a 24 DAT, and then you would have a good chance and I wouldn't have had a problem with your "i'm not trying to be cocky but i dont see how i can't get an interview" comment. A 3.5 GPA with a 19 is about average for dental school admissions, a 3.5 MASTERS with a 19 (3rd try) after a 2.6 undergrad with a 16 DAT means your already BELOW AVERAGE and does not make you a "MUST INTERVIEW" candidate.

Everyone has given you GREAT constructive feedback in this thread, you just want to be consoled that your below average stats will guarantee you a spot in next year's dental class when that is FAR from the truth. You can improve from a 2.6 GPA and get in; its not impossible, but it takes time and effort and you barely finished your FIRST semester of your masters and youre already declaring yourself as the next best thing since slice bread. I guess there really is no hope for you until you go through the next cycle 0 for 50 in interviews and realize you shoudlve listened to the people trying to help you rather than your "friends" who will tell you anything you wanted to hear.

As for MY advice, keep doing what you're doing and keep working on improving your GPA. One semester of 3.5 masters GPA will NOT override your undergrad gpa, but maybe 1-2 years will allow some schools to take a chance on you. Do NOT go into it with your current arrogant "there's no way they can reject me at this point" attitude because you WILL be disappointed. It may even take you 2-3 more cycles to get accepted, but it only takes one school to give you a chance and that may be enough. Good luck, and get your head out of your @ss.
 
Last edited:
Jul 21, 2010
152
0
Status
Pre-Dental
Did you not study those first two times that you took the DAT or do you have difficulty with standardized tests?

Either way, if you keep improving your application the way you have been you will get in somewhere eventually. Wishing all the best of luck to you for next cycle.
 
Jul 18, 2010
95
0
Status
Pre-Dental
Thanks for the sarcasim gunner......Now know why I was advised to keep away from this site....Its filled with gunners...Amazing how when I talk with friends who have gotten in they tell me otherwise.
Dude.. don't get all butt hurt about the advise everyone is giving you. You asked for advise and that is exactly what your getting. If you don't like the advise on sdn, call up some dental schools and ask for their opinions.
 

IronJeff

5+ Year Member
Feb 13, 2010
108
0
Status
Pre-Dental
[



You will be just fine. I don't even think you need to finish your masters, you should take a 6 month vacation and just send in your application in June. Your stats are amazing and your DAT is out of this world. You're right, I don't see how any school can reject you at this point considering how you've improved in the past 6 months compared to the previous 4 years. You're a shoe in. I hear dental school admissions is just like sports, its a "what have you done for me recently" world.


I hope that was what you wanted to hear.

:claps:
 
Oct 14, 2009
177
1
Status
Thanks for the sarcasim gunner......Now know why I was advised to keep away from this site....Its filled with gunners...Amazing how when I talk with friends who have gotten in they tell me otherwise.
Most people drop their pre-dental gunner attitude when they get accepted/matriculate into dental school. Why? Because they got in. I know my stress went down 500x notches. If you asked your friends during interview season- they would of said the same exact thing we've said.

That being said...You'll be fine don't worry.
 

doc toothache

10+ Year Member
Jan 17, 2006
8,150
2,284
Status
Dentist
Im completing my first semester of a masters and probally will have between a 3.5 and 3.7. I have a 19DAT, 1200 hours volunteer time, I also have been working in a research lab for over a year, and proposed a research project/paper and am now working on my second project. A recieved a couple awards from the white house for volunteering. Im also TAing next fall. How does this look compaired with my previous stats listed below?
2.6 undergrad gpa 16DAT both times
Had no research and no volunteer time.
You could spend less time on volunteering, especially now that you have a coupe of awards from the White House that you can flash, and spend more time on your "expected" 3.5 and 3.7.
 

dentalWorks

Nights Watchmen
7+ Year Member
Jun 25, 2009
5,646
158
Sterling Hts, Mi
Status
Dentist
You could spend less time on volunteering, especially now that you have a coupe of awards from the White House that you can flash, and spend more time on your "expected" 3.5 and 3.7.
:laugh: I was so waiting for this
 

jj007

10+ Year Member
Oct 31, 2008
130
0
Status
Dental Student
Why don't you just apply and see what will happen. All I can tell you that it is not going to be easy but it's not impossible. Yes, you can search through this forum and find success cases for people with similar situation, but I don't believe that this is the norm.

What is amazing to me is seeing some many "guarantees" in this forum. There is no guarantees in life beside paying taxes and death.

Good luck!

Thanks for the sarcasim gunner......Now know why I was advised to keep away from this site....Its filled with gunners...Amazing how when I talk with friends who have gotten in they tell me otherwise.